Kashmir

[BDawg]

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: athithi

Originally posted by: BDawg
I support Kashmir's desire to be independant, just as they wanted to be when England split up the territory. The Indians promised to allow Kashmir to vote for their independance, but somehow, that was swept under the rug.

Both India and Pakistan need to keep their thug hands off of Kashmir.

BDawg:
What do you think about Palestine? And I would appreciate it if you wouldn't call my motherland a thug nation :frown: The Indian Govt. is the representative of 1.1 Billion people and irrespective of which party is in power, the Indian people freely choose their destiny. We don't even let our Supreme Court decide who the Prime Minister is going to be 😉 To call India's actions as thuggery is akin to calling all 1.1 Billion of us thugs...and I don't take very kindly to being called a thug.

he is obviously misinformed. There is plenty of that around ATOT! He didnt even know India recently had FAIR elections for the people of Kashmir. Fair, as reported by independent, 3rd party observers.

They had elections in October, but as far as I've known, there was no vote on independance.

When there are more Mexicans living in Texas in the year 2030 should they get a vote to see if Texas should become a part of Mexico?

We didn't promise Texas an independance election in 1947.

BTW, I added to my previous post.

On a side note, I do think Texas' constitution allows it to be an independant republic.

 

[SherEPunjab]

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: athithi

Originally posted by: BDawg
I support Kashmir's desire to be independant, just as they wanted to be when England split up the territory. The Indians promised to allow Kashmir to vote for their independance, but somehow, that was swept under the rug.

Both India and Pakistan need to keep their thug hands off of Kashmir.

BDawg:
What do you think about Palestine? And I would appreciate it if you wouldn't call my motherland a thug nation :frown: The Indian Govt. is the representative of 1.1 Billion people and irrespective of which party is in power, the Indian people freely choose their destiny. We don't even let our Supreme Court decide who the Prime Minister is going to be 😉 To call India's actions as thuggery is akin to calling all 1.1 Billion of us thugs...and I don't take very kindly to being called a thug.

Both India and Pakistan want Kashmir for their own selfish ends. IMHO, that makes them both thugs.

My opinion of thugs is furthered by India and Pakistan constantly threatening each other with nuclear weapons.

I'm not saying my country is perfect. I didn't agree with the Supreme Courts election of Bush. The difference is, when my county does something that isn't right, I'm not scared to be on the disenting side.

Is my country a thug? Sometimes. I think we're bullying Iraq right now (not that I am pro-Hussein in any way). It's just that we're not threatening to nuke another country...but that could happen any day with Bush in charge.

EDIT: Also, India agreed to the plebiscite on the condition that all foreign forces would vacate all of Kashmir so the vote would be fair and not influenced by Pakistani elements. Let Pakistan withdraw its forces from the LoC and India WILL hold the Plebiscite. BTW, India is not obligated to withdraw her forces from Kashmir - why? because India would be holding a plebiscite in its own territory (even if the end result means Kashmir might not longer remain Indian territory). What are your sources for information on the Kashmir issue anyway?!!!

India wants Kashmir to be a part of India. They will always make enough excuses so a vote will not take place. And according to the agreement with the Maharaja, India should be holding a plebiscite.

Wants? See this? it IS India and will ALWAYS be. If it was to be independent it would be nothing more than a nation with even more fanatics and what little indigenous Hindu/Buddhist population that exists there today would be completely wiped out. Besides, Pakistan will then push for it to become a part of Pakistan. that will be step #2. Become a part of Pakistan, or, face the 'wrath' of the big neighbor to the south.

 

[SherEPunjab]

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: athithi

Originally posted by: BDawg
I support Kashmir's desire to be independant, just as they wanted to be when England split up the territory. The Indians promised to allow Kashmir to vote for their independance, but somehow, that was swept under the rug.

Both India and Pakistan need to keep their thug hands off of Kashmir.

BDawg:
What do you think about Palestine? And I would appreciate it if you wouldn't call my motherland a thug nation :frown: The Indian Govt. is the representative of 1.1 Billion people and irrespective of which party is in power, the Indian people freely choose their destiny. We don't even let our Supreme Court decide who the Prime Minister is going to be 😉 To call India's actions as thuggery is akin to calling all 1.1 Billion of us thugs...and I don't take very kindly to being called a thug.

he is obviously misinformed. There is plenty of that around ATOT! He didnt even know India recently had FAIR elections for the people of Kashmir. Fair, as reported by independent, 3rd party observers.

They had elections in October, but as far as I've known, there was no vote on independance.

When there are more Mexicans living in Texas in the year 2030 should they get a vote to see if Texas should become a part of Mexico?

We didn't promise Texas an independance election in 1947.

BTW, I added to my previous post.

On a side note, I do think Texas' constitution allows it to be an independant republic.

Just like in Kashmir, there are factions that wish Texas WAS independent. In fact there was a shootout a few years back in texas by some 'militant' Texans. Texas is already a republic. link

 

[BDawg]

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: athithi

Originally posted by: BDawg
I support Kashmir's desire to be independant, just as they wanted to be when England split up the territory. The Indians promised to allow Kashmir to vote for their independance, but somehow, that was swept under the rug.

Both India and Pakistan need to keep their thug hands off of Kashmir.

BDawg:
What do you think about Palestine? And I would appreciate it if you wouldn't call my motherland a thug nation :frown: The Indian Govt. is the representative of 1.1 Billion people and irrespective of which party is in power, the Indian people freely choose their destiny. We don't even let our Supreme Court decide who the Prime Minister is going to be 😉 To call India's actions as thuggery is akin to calling all 1.1 Billion of us thugs...and I don't take very kindly to being called a thug.

Both India and Pakistan want Kashmir for their own selfish ends. IMHO, that makes them both thugs.

My opinion of thugs is furthered by India and Pakistan constantly threatening each other with nuclear weapons.

I'm not saying my country is perfect. I didn't agree with the Supreme Courts election of Bush. The difference is, when my county does something that isn't right, I'm not scared to be on the disenting side.

Is my country a thug? Sometimes. I think we're bullying Iraq right now (not that I am pro-Hussein in any way). It's just that we're not threatening to nuke another country...but that could happen any day with Bush in charge.

EDIT: Also, India agreed to the plebiscite on the condition that all foreign forces would vacate all of Kashmir so the vote would be fair and not influenced by Pakistani elements. Let Pakistan withdraw its forces from the LoC and India WILL hold the Plebiscite. BTW, India is not obligated to withdraw her forces from Kashmir - why? because India would be holding a plebiscite in its own territory (even if the end result means Kashmir might not longer remain Indian territory). What are your sources for information on the Kashmir issue anyway?!!!

India wants Kashmir to be a part of India. They will always make enough excuses so a vote will not take place. And according to the agreement with the Maharaja, India should be holding a plebiscite.

Wants? See this? it IS India and will ALWAYS be. If it was to be independent it would be nothing more than a nation with even more fanatics and what little indigenous Hindu/Buddhist population that exists there today would be completely wiped out. Besides, Pakistan will then push for it to become a part of Pakistan. that will be step #2. Become a part of Pakistan, or, face the 'wrath' of the big neighbor to the south.

Kashmir wouldn't be a part of India if India held up their end of the bargain.

Israel's an independant country surrounded by enemies wanting annex it. I'm sure that the world can keep the Pakistanis out of Kashmir if they were independant and asked for help.

Nation of fanatics? When there are muslim/hindu conflicts in India, the hindus are just as fanatical as the muslims. Setting busses on fire? Destroying mosques? That's sick stuff.

 

[SherEPunjab]

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: athithi

Originally posted by: BDawg
I support Kashmir's desire to be independant, just as they wanted to be when England split up the territory. The Indians promised to allow Kashmir to vote for their independance, but somehow, that was swept under the rug.

Both India and Pakistan need to keep their thug hands off of Kashmir.

BDawg:
What do you think about Palestine? And I would appreciate it if you wouldn't call my motherland a thug nation :frown: The Indian Govt. is the representative of 1.1 Billion people and irrespective of which party is in power, the Indian people freely choose their destiny. We don't even let our Supreme Court decide who the Prime Minister is going to be 😉 To call India's actions as thuggery is akin to calling all 1.1 Billion of us thugs...and I don't take very kindly to being called a thug.

he is obviously misinformed. There is plenty of that around ATOT! He didnt even know India recently had FAIR elections for the people of Kashmir. Fair, as reported by independent, 3rd party observers.

They had elections in October, but as far as I've known, there was no vote on independance.

Oh, and you mentioned "FAIR" elections?

BBC Link

Were the polls free and fair?

The elections were conducted fairly, but not freely, according to an independent team of observers.

Your own link undermines what you said BDawg.

"The elections were conducted fairly, but not freely, according to an independent team of observers.

Security was a key concern

They said the fear of attacks by separatist militants did not prevent large numbers of people from turning out to vote in some areas.

But even where good security was provided, turnout was not always high, suggesting many people stayed away for ideological reasons."

IT WAS FAIR. If it wasn't freely conducted it was because people were either scared or stayed away for ideological reasons. Whatever case you wish to believe, the opportunity was given.

 

[BDawg]

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: athithi

Originally posted by: BDawg
I support Kashmir's desire to be independant, just as they wanted to be when England split up the territory. The Indians promised to allow Kashmir to vote for their independance, but somehow, that was swept under the rug.

Both India and Pakistan need to keep their thug hands off of Kashmir.

BDawg:
What do you think about Palestine? And I would appreciate it if you wouldn't call my motherland a thug nation :frown: The Indian Govt. is the representative of 1.1 Billion people and irrespective of which party is in power, the Indian people freely choose their destiny. We don't even let our Supreme Court decide who the Prime Minister is going to be 😉 To call India's actions as thuggery is akin to calling all 1.1 Billion of us thugs...and I don't take very kindly to being called a thug.

he is obviously misinformed. There is plenty of that around ATOT! He didnt even know India recently had FAIR elections for the people of Kashmir. Fair, as reported by independent, 3rd party observers.

They had elections in October, but as far as I've known, there was no vote on independance.

When there are more Mexicans living in Texas in the year 2030 should they get a vote to see if Texas should become a part of Mexico?

We didn't promise Texas an independance election in 1947.

BTW, I added to my previous post.

On a side note, I do think Texas' constitution allows it to be an independant republic.

Just like in Kashmir, there are factions that wish Texas WAS independent. In fact there was a shootout a few years back in texas by some 'militant' Texans. Texas is already a republic. link

And they're whackos. They weren't promised an election like the ruler of Kashmir, the Maharaja of Jammu was.

Besides, I'm not sure I would care if Texas left the union. Just as long as they take the Dallas Cowboys with them.

 

[BDawg]

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: athithi

Originally posted by: BDawg
I support Kashmir's desire to be independant, just as they wanted to be when England split up the territory. The Indians promised to allow Kashmir to vote for their independance, but somehow, that was swept under the rug.

Both India and Pakistan need to keep their thug hands off of Kashmir.

BDawg:
What do you think about Palestine? And I would appreciate it if you wouldn't call my motherland a thug nation :frown: The Indian Govt. is the representative of 1.1 Billion people and irrespective of which party is in power, the Indian people freely choose their destiny. We don't even let our Supreme Court decide who the Prime Minister is going to be 😉 To call India's actions as thuggery is akin to calling all 1.1 Billion of us thugs...and I don't take very kindly to being called a thug.

he is obviously misinformed. There is plenty of that around ATOT! He didnt even know India recently had FAIR elections for the people of Kashmir. Fair, as reported by independent, 3rd party observers.

They had elections in October, but as far as I've known, there was no vote on independance.

Oh, and you mentioned "FAIR" elections?

BBC Link

Were the polls free and fair?

The elections were conducted fairly, but not freely, according to an independent team of observers.

Your own link undermines what you said BDawg.

"The elections were conducted fairly, but not freely, according to an independent team of observers.

Security was a key concern

They said the fear of attacks by separatist militants did not prevent large numbers of people from turning out to vote in some areas.

But even where good security was provided, turnout was not always high, suggesting many people stayed away for ideological reasons."

IT WAS FAIR. If it wasn't freely conducted it was because people were either scared or stayed away for ideological reasons. Whatever case you wish to believe, the opportunity was given.

And southern elections were fair when the KKK hung (no pun intended) out by the polls.

I'm going to bed now. There's no way to argue an independant, educated view with blinded, ideological individuals. Maybe if India and Pakistan just nuked each other back to the stone age, there wouldn't be this problem.

 

[SherEPunjab]

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: athithi

Originally posted by: BDawg
I support Kashmir's desire to be independant, just as they wanted to be when England split up the territory. The Indians promised to allow Kashmir to vote for their independance, but somehow, that was swept under the rug.

Both India and Pakistan need to keep their thug hands off of Kashmir.

BDawg:
What do you think about Palestine? And I would appreciate it if you wouldn't call my motherland a thug nation :frown: The Indian Govt. is the representative of 1.1 Billion people and irrespective of which party is in power, the Indian people freely choose their destiny. We don't even let our Supreme Court decide who the Prime Minister is going to be 😉 To call India's actions as thuggery is akin to calling all 1.1 Billion of us thugs...and I don't take very kindly to being called a thug.

Both India and Pakistan want Kashmir for their own selfish ends. IMHO, that makes them both thugs.

My opinion of thugs is furthered by India and Pakistan constantly threatening each other with nuclear weapons.

I'm not saying my country is perfect. I didn't agree with the Supreme Courts election of Bush. The difference is, when my county does something that isn't right, I'm not scared to be on the disenting side.

Is my country a thug? Sometimes. I think we're bullying Iraq right now (not that I am pro-Hussein in any way). It's just that we're not threatening to nuke another country...but that could happen any day with Bush in charge.

EDIT: Also, India agreed to the plebiscite on the condition that all foreign forces would vacate all of Kashmir so the vote would be fair and not influenced by Pakistani elements. Let Pakistan withdraw its forces from the LoC and India WILL hold the Plebiscite. BTW, India is not obligated to withdraw her forces from Kashmir - why? because India would be holding a plebiscite in its own territory (even if the end result means Kashmir might not longer remain Indian territory). What are your sources for information on the Kashmir issue anyway?!!!

India wants Kashmir to be a part of India. They will always make enough excuses so a vote will not take place. And according to the agreement with the Maharaja, India should be holding a plebiscite.

BDawg: your lack of knowledge considering the strong beliefs you seem to have are really surprisng. India HAS NOT threatened Pakistan. It is ONLY Pakistan that has made threatening gestures. In fact, India made a no first strike policy regarding the nukes, and even signed it officially. They asked Pakistan to sign such an agreement, and they refused. Everyone knows that Pakistan will need to use Nukes b/c their conventional military will not hold up for more than a week if India attacks. For this reason, Pakistan has always given an implied threat to ward off an attack by India, even though, day in and day out that country harbors and supports and sends in terrorists into Kashmir and other parts (Gujurat, delhi) to attack.

 

[SherEPunjab]

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: athithi

Originally posted by: BDawg
I support Kashmir's desire to be independant, just as they wanted to be when England split up the territory. The Indians promised to allow Kashmir to vote for their independance, but somehow, that was swept under the rug.

Both India and Pakistan need to keep their thug hands off of Kashmir.

BDawg:
What do you think about Palestine? And I would appreciate it if you wouldn't call my motherland a thug nation :frown: The Indian Govt. is the representative of 1.1 Billion people and irrespective of which party is in power, the Indian people freely choose their destiny. We don't even let our Supreme Court decide who the Prime Minister is going to be 😉 To call India's actions as thuggery is akin to calling all 1.1 Billion of us thugs...and I don't take very kindly to being called a thug.

Both India and Pakistan want Kashmir for their own selfish ends. IMHO, that makes them both thugs.

My opinion of thugs is furthered by India and Pakistan constantly threatening each other with nuclear weapons.

I'm not saying my country is perfect. I didn't agree with the Supreme Courts election of Bush. The difference is, when my county does something that isn't right, I'm not scared to be on the disenting side.

Is my country a thug? Sometimes. I think we're bullying Iraq right now (not that I am pro-Hussein in any way). It's just that we're not threatening to nuke another country...but that could happen any day with Bush in charge.

EDIT: Also, India agreed to the plebiscite on the condition that all foreign forces would vacate all of Kashmir so the vote would be fair and not influenced by Pakistani elements. Let Pakistan withdraw its forces from the LoC and India WILL hold the Plebiscite. BTW, India is not obligated to withdraw her forces from Kashmir - why? because India would be holding a plebiscite in its own territory (even if the end result means Kashmir might not longer remain Indian territory). What are your sources for information on the Kashmir issue anyway?!!!

India wants Kashmir to be a part of India. They will always make enough excuses so a vote will not take place. And according to the agreement with the Maharaja, India should be holding a plebiscite.

Wants? See this? it IS India and will ALWAYS be. If it was to be independent it would be nothing more than a nation with even more fanatics and what little indigenous Hindu/Buddhist population that exists there today would be completely wiped out. Besides, Pakistan will then push for it to become a part of Pakistan. that will be step #2. Become a part of Pakistan, or, face the 'wrath' of the big neighbor to the south.

Kashmir wouldn't be a part of India if India held up their end of the bargain.

Israel's an independant country surrounded by enemies wanting annex it. I'm sure that the world can keep the Pakistanis out of Kashmir if they were independant and asked for help.

Nation of fanatics? When there are muslim/hindu conflicts in India, the hindus are just as fanatical as the muslims. Setting busses on fire? Destroying mosques? That's sick stuff.

It IS sick stuff. But when you have a country that is as diverse as india, with different races, religions, and hundreds of distinct languages, and 1.1-1.2 Billion people, what is 1,000 dead people? I'm not saying their lives were not valuable, but India's situation can never really be compared to any other. IF America had an 18 percent Muslim population, THEN you can say they were wrong or that America would have handled the situation differently. I'd like to see how Americans would react if 56 of their Baptist priests were slaughtered by some fanactical Muslims. Don't you think there would be a lot of dead muslims in the U.S. if that happened? Multiply the number dead by 4, and then see. It is very difficult to control 1.2 billion people that are as diverse as that found in India.

 

[SherEPunjab]

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: athithi

Originally posted by: BDawg
I support Kashmir's desire to be independant, just as they wanted to be when England split up the territory. The Indians promised to allow Kashmir to vote for their independance, but somehow, that was swept under the rug.

Both India and Pakistan need to keep their thug hands off of Kashmir.

BDawg:
What do you think about Palestine? And I would appreciate it if you wouldn't call my motherland a thug nation :frown: The Indian Govt. is the representative of 1.1 Billion people and irrespective of which party is in power, the Indian people freely choose their destiny. We don't even let our Supreme Court decide who the Prime Minister is going to be 😉 To call India's actions as thuggery is akin to calling all 1.1 Billion of us thugs...and I don't take very kindly to being called a thug.

he is obviously misinformed. There is plenty of that around ATOT! He didnt even know India recently had FAIR elections for the people of Kashmir. Fair, as reported by independent, 3rd party observers.

They had elections in October, but as far as I've known, there was no vote on independance.

When there are more Mexicans living in Texas in the year 2030 should they get a vote to see if Texas should become a part of Mexico?

We didn't promise Texas an independance election in 1947.

BTW, I added to my previous post.

On a side note, I do think Texas' constitution allows it to be an independant republic.

Just like in Kashmir, there are factions that wish Texas WAS independent. In fact there was a shootout a few years back in texas by some 'militant' Texans. Texas is already a republic. link

And they're whackos. They weren't promised an election like the ruler of Kashmir, the Maharaja of Jammu was.

Besides, I'm not sure I would care if Texas left the union. Just as long as they take the Dallas Cowboys with them.

What election was the Maharaja of Jammu promised? and by whom?

 

[SherEPunjab]

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: athithi

Originally posted by: BDawg
I support Kashmir's desire to be independant, just as they wanted to be when England split up the territory. The Indians promised to allow Kashmir to vote for their independance, but somehow, that was swept under the rug.

Both India and Pakistan need to keep their thug hands off of Kashmir.

BDawg:
What do you think about Palestine? And I would appreciate it if you wouldn't call my motherland a thug nation :frown: The Indian Govt. is the representative of 1.1 Billion people and irrespective of which party is in power, the Indian people freely choose their destiny. We don't even let our Supreme Court decide who the Prime Minister is going to be 😉 To call India's actions as thuggery is akin to calling all 1.1 Billion of us thugs...and I don't take very kindly to being called a thug.

he is obviously misinformed. There is plenty of that around ATOT! He didnt even know India recently had FAIR elections for the people of Kashmir. Fair, as reported by independent, 3rd party observers.

They had elections in October, but as far as I've known, there was no vote on independance.

Oh, and you mentioned "FAIR" elections?

BBC Link

Were the polls free and fair?

The elections were conducted fairly, but not freely, according to an independent team of observers.

Your own link undermines what you said BDawg.

"The elections were conducted fairly, but not freely, according to an independent team of observers.

Security was a key concern

They said the fear of attacks by separatist militants did not prevent large numbers of people from turning out to vote in some areas.

But even where good security was provided, turnout was not always high, suggesting many people stayed away for ideological reasons."

IT WAS FAIR. If it wasn't freely conducted it was because people were either scared or stayed away for ideological reasons. Whatever case you wish to believe, the opportunity was given.

And southern elections were fair when the KKK hung (no pun intended) out by the polls.

I'm going to bed now. There's no way to argue an independant, educated view with blinded, ideological individuals. Maybe if India and Pakistan just nuked each other back to the stone age, there wouldn't be this problem.

You probably should go to bed. You make no sense. Even your own 'support' for your argument undermines what you are trying to say... which is exactly what again?

the Link you provided said it was conducted Freely, it clearly says that. Here is the link you provided us with your link Then you go on to imply with your little rolly eyes that it wasn't fair, comparing it to the KKK? So was it fair or not? Your link said it was, and now you are saying it is not....

confuzed? yeah, i think we all are with you. Good night dude. get some sleep.

 

[BDawg]

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: athithi

Originally posted by: BDawg
I support Kashmir's desire to be independant, just as they wanted to be when England split up the territory. The Indians promised to allow Kashmir to vote for their independance, but somehow, that was swept under the rug.

Both India and Pakistan need to keep their thug hands off of Kashmir.

BDawg:
What do you think about Palestine? And I would appreciate it if you wouldn't call my motherland a thug nation :frown: The Indian Govt. is the representative of 1.1 Billion people and irrespective of which party is in power, the Indian people freely choose their destiny. We don't even let our Supreme Court decide who the Prime Minister is going to be 😉 To call India's actions as thuggery is akin to calling all 1.1 Billion of us thugs...and I don't take very kindly to being called a thug.

Both India and Pakistan want Kashmir for their own selfish ends. IMHO, that makes them both thugs.

My opinion of thugs is furthered by India and Pakistan constantly threatening each other with nuclear weapons.

I'm not saying my country is perfect. I didn't agree with the Supreme Courts election of Bush. The difference is, when my county does something that isn't right, I'm not scared to be on the disenting side.

Is my country a thug? Sometimes. I think we're bullying Iraq right now (not that I am pro-Hussein in any way). It's just that we're not threatening to nuke another country...but that could happen any day with Bush in charge.

EDIT: Also, India agreed to the plebiscite on the condition that all foreign forces would vacate all of Kashmir so the vote would be fair and not influenced by Pakistani elements. Let Pakistan withdraw its forces from the LoC and India WILL hold the Plebiscite. BTW, India is not obligated to withdraw her forces from Kashmir - why? because India would be holding a plebiscite in its own territory (even if the end result means Kashmir might not longer remain Indian territory). What are your sources for information on the Kashmir issue anyway?!!!

India wants Kashmir to be a part of India. They will always make enough excuses so a vote will not take place. And according to the agreement with the Maharaja, India should be holding a plebiscite.

BDawg: your lack of knowledge considering the strong beliefs you seem to have are really surprisng. India HAS NOT threatened Pakistan. It is ONLY Pakistan that has made threatening gestures. In fact, India made a no first strike policy regarding the nukes, and even signed it officially. They asked Pakistan to sign such an agreement, and they refused. Everyone knows that Pakistan will need to use Nukes b/c their conventional military will not hold up for more than a week if India attacks. For this reason, Pakistan has always given an implied threat to ward off an attack by India, even though, day in and day out that country harbors and supports and sends in terrorists into Kashmir and other parts (Gujurat, delhi) to attack.

Bullsh!t. India started the nuclear threat in SE asia when they began testing nukes. They have the luxury of taking the no first strike policy. If the situations were reversed, so would be the policies.

You have yet to prove a single area where my knowledge is lacking.

I'm going to bed...now.

 

[SherEPunjab]

So BDawg, you contradict yourself. Were the elections free or not? You seem to imply they were not, but your link clearly says they were. REad the above post again. Come back tommorow when you have an explanation for yourself.

 

[athithi]

BDawg:
Your ignorance on the subject is mind-boggling. Call your own nation a thug if you want to - I still think the US is the closest you can find to an ideal nation in this day and age, considering its size and diversity - inspite of Bush and Co

However, I take strong offense to your calling my nation - and myself, indirectly - a thug. Holding the plebiscite is a simple issue - Pakistan vacates occupied Kashmir, India holds the plebiscite, in all probability Kashmir becomes independent. You are talking about the muslim majority - the result of Mughal invasions - wanting independence. But there is a Hindu and Buddhist minority which India cannot wash its hands off. You can wish as much as you want for India and Pakistan to go back to the stone age - fact remains that your nation and your Democrat President are the only ones to have ever used Nuclear Weapons against another nation till date - and last I checked, they became the two largest economies in the world. It truly distresses me to argue with a Liberal like you - India is far more left-wing, in general, than the U.S. You still do not see the point and insist on clubbing a Military Dictatorship and the world's largest Democracy in the same category. You seem to be genuinely interested in the subject. Don't take my word for it. Study the backgrounds of the two countries, take the geo-political situation into consideration and *then* make a judgement. And stop calling my nation a thug.

 

[SherEPunjab]

Originally posted by: athithi
BDawg:
Your ignorance on the subject is mind-boggling. Call your own nation a thug if you want to - I still think the US is the closest you can find to an ideal nation in this day and age, considering its size and diversity - inspite of Bush and Co

However, I take strong offense to your calling my nation - and myself, indirectly - a thug. Holding the plebiscite is a simple issue - Pakistan vacates occupied Kashmir, India holds the plebiscite, in all probability Kashmir becomes independent. You are talking about the muslim majority - the result of Mughal invasions - wanting independence. But there is a Hindu and Buddhist minority which India cannot wash its hands off. You can wish as much as you want for India and Pakistan to go back to the stone age - fact remains that your nation and your Democrat President are the only ones to have ever used Nuclear Weapons against another nation till date - and last I checked, they became the two largest economies in the world. It truly distresses me to argue with a Liberal like you - India is far more left-wing, in general, than the U.S. You still do not see the point and insist on clubbing a Military Dictatorship and the world's largest Democracy in the same category. You seem to be genuinely interested in the subject. Don't take my word for it. Study the backgrounds of the two countries, take the geo-political situation into consideration and *then* make a judgement. And stop calling my nation a thug.

Atithi:

it is quite clear he is either an ill informed South asian, or an ill informed non south asian. I don't really care what he is as long as he makes some valid points, and can back up what he says. He has failed in all respects. I think he is probably a non south asian that took a course on world history in college and they 'touched base' on the Kashmir issue. They probably studied it for like 1 day to max 2 days, and cannot really relate to what is happening there. Nor do they realize the sheer magnitude or the irony of the situation. The Irony being, the so called 'freedom fighters' are taking away peoples freedoms by, as he himself proved (with his link to the BBC) scaring people, and by killing them. These are no freedoms. At least the Indian army is a recognized presence that can be held accountable. The militants are not. For whatever mistakes the Indian army has made, it is far better to have them around for if they were not there, there would a LOT more beheadings, eye gougings, bomb blasts, and temple attacks, without a doubt. BDawg does'nt take any of this into consideration, nor did he at once mention the fact that many Hindus and Buddhists have fled the valley due to islamic fundamentalists. They have a much more right to voice their opinion than say, a Pakistani that crossed the border and is now living in the valley, or a muslim from another state in India that settled there. He is nothing more than a troll just trying to rile people up without having any facts and just making baseless claims. He even screwed up and gave a link that undermined his own argument...