Justice Department investigating potential presidential pardon bribery scheme, court records reveal

[Amused]

Holy crap! While the Trump propaganda team is dazzling everyone with bullshit stories about CIA server raids in Germany ...

The admin itself was raided and multiple computers and tablets taken to investigate a pardon for bribery scheme...

You CANNOT make this shit up. You just can't.

Justice Department investigating potential presidential pardon bribery scheme, court records reveal

The Justice Department is investigating a potential crime related to funneling money to the White House or related political committee in exchange for a presidential pardon, according to court records unsealed Tuesday in federal court.

www.cnn.com

Justice Department investigating potential presidential pardon bribery scheme, court records reveal

(CNN)The Justice Department is investigating a potential crime related to funneling money to the White House or related political committee in exchange for a presidential pardon, according to court records unsealed Tuesday in federal court.
The case is the latest legal twist in the waning days of President Donald Trump's administration after several of his top advisers have been convicted of federal criminal charges and as the possibility rises of Trump giving pardons to those who've been loyal to him.

The disclosure is in 20 pages of partially redacted documents made public by the DC District Court on Tuesday afternoon. The records show Chief Judge Beryl Howell's review in August of a request from prosecutors to access documents obtained in a search as part of a bribery-for-pardon investigation.

The filings don't reveal a timeline of the alleged scheme, or any names of people potentially involved, except that communications between people including at least one lawyer were seized from an office that was raided sometime before the end of this summer.

No one appears to have been publicly charged with a related crime to date.

At the end of this summer, a filter team, used to make sure prosecutors don't receive tainted evidence that should have been kept from them because it was privileged, had more than 50 digital devices including iPhones, iPads, laptops, thumb drives and computer drives after investigators raided the unidentified offices.
...

 

[hal2kilo]

Holy crap! While the Trump propaganda team is dazzling everyone with bullshit stories about CIA server raids in Germany ...

The admin itself was raided and multiple computers and tablets taken to investigate a pardon for bribery scheme...

You CANNOT make the shit up. You just can't.

Justice Department investigating potential presidential pardon bribery scheme, court records reveal

The Justice Department is investigating a potential crime related to funneling money to the White House or related political committee in exchange for a presidential pardon, according to court records unsealed Tuesday in federal court.

www.cnn.com

Justice Department investigating potential presidential pardon bribery scheme, court records reveal

(CNN)The Justice Department is investigating a potential crime related to funneling money to the White House or related political committee in exchange for a presidential pardon, according to court records unsealed Tuesday in federal court.
The case is the latest legal twist in the waning days of President Donald Trump's administration after several of his top advisers have been convicted of federal criminal charges and as the possibility rises of Trump giving pardons to those who've been loyal to him.

The disclosure is in 20 pages of partially redacted documents made public by the DC District Court on Tuesday afternoon. The records show Chief Judge Beryl Howell's review in August of a request from prosecutors to access documents obtained in a search as part of a bribery-for-pardon investigation.

The filings don't reveal a timeline of the alleged scheme, or any names of people potentially involved, except that communications between people including at least one lawyer were seized from an office that was raided sometime before the end of this summer.

No one appears to have been publicly charged with a related crime to date.

At the end of this summer, a filter team, used to make sure prosecutors don't receive tainted evidence that should have been kept from them because it was privileged, had more than 50 digital devices including iPhones, iPads, laptops, thumb drives and computer drives after investigators raided the unidentified offices.
...

The transactional administration.

 

[fskimospy]

If this turns out to be accurate would literally a single person here be surprised, Trump supporters included?

 

[esquared]

If this turns out to be accurate would literally a single person here be surprised, Trump supporters included?

Is that a rhetorical question?

 

[dank69]

If this turns out to be accurate would literally a single person here be surprised, Trump supporters included?

Republicans will be along shortly to explain why these potential pardons are justified and the real problem is everyone trying to frame it as a crime.

 

[fskimospy]

Republicans will be along shortly to explain why these potential pardons are justified and the real problem is everyone trying to frame it as a crime.

My suspicion is that they would say the president's power to pardon is absolute and he can do it for any reason he wants so it's not a problem.

 

[K1052]

If this turns out to be accurate would literally a single person here be surprised, Trump supporters included?

I'd be absolutely flabbergasted if it was just the one.

I assume a line has formed.

 

[KMFJD]

Rudy!?

 

[Viper GTS]

Just a few hours ago, before this story hit CNN I had a conversation about this. Specifically in reference to Rudy seeking a pardon for himself, but more generally speaking - We probably need pardon reform. I'm not sure what that looks like. I don't think it should go away entirely, but clearly it needs work.

And now this bullshit.

If we play this right we could be grateful for this absolute disaster of an administration for pointing out all the weaknesses. We've been lucky in almost 250 years that nobody else has attempted to exploit them to this extent but if anyone was going to Trump would.

If we can repair the damage he's done while recognizing the flaws that allowed him to do it then maybe all of this will have been worth it.

Maybe.

Viper GTS

 

[pmv]

Trump is doing a great job at revealing how ramshackle the US system of government actually is. Turns out it's not a great idea to construct your system almost entirely out of 'norms', dependant on voluntary ethical behaviour, rather than laws.

 

[fskimospy]

Trump is doing a great job at revealing how ramshackle the US system of government actually is. Turns out it's not a great idea to construct your system almost entirely out of 'norms', dependant on voluntary ethical behaviour, rather than laws.

I think it matters less than you think. I mean the UK doesn’t even have a constitution.

In a lot of cases what Trump is doing is violating the law, it’s just that the people tasked with enforcing them won’t. IMO the thing that holds democracies together isn’t codified laws, it’s a belief in the system and a willingness to put it above your own personal preferences. Republicans no longer believe that, so the system is breaking.

 

[pmv]

I think it matters less than you think. I mean the UK doesn’t even have a constitution.

In a lot of cases what Trump is doing is violating the law, it’s just that the people tasked with enforcing them won’t. IMO the thing that holds democracies together isn’t codified laws, it’s a belief in the system and a willingness to put it above your own personal preferences. Republicans no longer believe that, so the system is breaking.

Well, I realise I'm already pushing it, bashing someone else's system, but I'm skeptical about constitutions, and the way I see it, having a Constitution seems to be part of the problem. It appears to be too hard to change with changing circumstances, and the nature of that ageing constitution seems to have formed a kind of synergy with the anti-democratic and, frankly bordering-on-corrupt, tendencies of the Republicans.

(I was wondering, in fact, whether there's some relationship between the way almost every written constitution turns out to be vulnerable to being subverted, and all that Godel stuff about formal systems.)

 

[Muse]

Rudy!?

They say that Rudy has requested to be pardoned in advance for potential litigations against him.

 

[Muse]

I think it matters less than you think. I mean the UK doesn’t even have a constitution.

In a lot of cases what Trump is doing is violating the law, it’s just that the people tasked with enforcing them won’t. IMO the thing that holds democracies together isn’t codified laws, it’s a belief in the system and a willingness to put it above your own personal preferences. Republicans no longer believe that, so the system is breaking.

You've got to codify these things into law, not depend on people to be willing to sustain the principles that sustain your enterprise, in this case, our nation. Good will is not enough, norms count for nothing if a person comes to power who delights in thumbing his nose at norms, which is what we have. It's clear we have to fortify our democracy with laws that prevent a would be tyrant from running ramshackle over our institutions.

The fact that the UK doesn't have a constitution (I suppose you're talking about England, the UK is sort of a conglomeration of at least semi-independent states, is my sense of it) doesn't mean we should or can emulate them. Tradition has more force in the UK than it will ever have in the USA and that's an understatement. And I'm not sure it's a good idea even there.

The 'United Kingdom' refers to a political union between, England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland. Although the UK is a fully independent sovereign state, the 4 nations that make it up are also countries in their own right and have a certain extent of autonomy.

 

[fskimospy]

Well, I realise I'm already pushing it, bashing someone else's system, but I'm skeptical about constitutions, and the way I see it, having a Constitution seems to be part of the problem. It appears to be too hard to change with changing circumstances, and the nature of that ageing constitution seems to have formed a kind of synergy with the anti-democratic and, frankly bordering-on-corrupt, tendencies of the Republicans.

(I was wondering, in fact, whether there's some relationship between the way almost every written constitution turns out to be vulnerable to being subverted, and all that Godel stuff about formal systems.)

Meh, bash away as far as I’m concerned, haha.

I think the issue is not the rigidity of the Constitution, if anything it was generally made vague to enable flexibility. I really think the issue is bad faith. Like I said, plenty of the things Trump did were already illegal but Trump declared he was immune from the law and nobody stopped him.

 

[fskimospy]

You've got to codify these things into law, not depend on people to be willing to sustain the principles that sustain your enterprise, in this case, our nation. Good will is not enough, norms count for nothing if a person comes to power who delights in thumbing his nose at norms, which is what we have. It's clear we have to fortify our democracy with laws that prevent a would be tyrant from running ramshackle over our institutions.

The fact that the UK doesn't have a constitution (I suppose you're talking about England, the UK is sort of a conglomeration of at least semi-independent states, is my sense of it) doesn't mean we should or can emulate them. Tradition has more force in the UK than it will ever have in the USA and that's an understatement. And I'm not sure it's a good idea even there.

I’m skeptical - for example the Soviet and North Korean constitutions have very strong civil rights protections codified into them. Stronger than ours in some cases.

Trump was required by law to release his tax returns to Congress, the purpose for their request being to make sure he wasn’t corrupt. He refused. What happened? Nothing. Not because it wasn’t codified into law but because there weren’t enough good people to enforce the laws we already have.

 

[Muse]

I’m skeptical - for example the Soviet and North Korean constitutions have very strong civil rights protections codified into them. Stronger than ours in some cases.

Trump was required by law to release his tax returns to Congress, the purpose for their request being to make sure he wasn’t corrupt. He refused. What happened? Nothing. Not because it wasn’t codified into law but because there weren’t enough good people to enforce the laws we already have.

Well, we can't allow people to be above the law, it's as simple as that, particularly people in power. The populace at large should feel that deeply and the laws should make it impossible. Some people may think that should be ignored for expediency, but they are mistaken.

 

[pmv]

I'm making this up as I go along here (watching Trump smash up the political furniture like the proverbial bull in a china shop...or a "Chyna" shop...has meant having to rapidly decide on one's attitude to political science/philosophy). But what I'm thinking is that while having a populace with the right democratic and intellectually-honest values in their heads is clearly desirable, you surely can't count on it always being so?

And in any case what would ensure that state, what actually determines those values, would be the year-on-year, day-to-day experience of life that people have in the country. And that is surely in good part determined by laws and systems? Not grand constitutions written in inspiring language centures ago, but day-to--day, constantly-evolving, legal systems and political institutions. I'd distinguish between laws and constitutions, and between both and values. Day-to-day law seems the most important of the three. But then it occurs to me that I _would_ think that, being a product of a country with an 'unwritten constitution'.

The US constitution seems to me to be simultaneously too vague (it doesn't even include a specific, positive, right-to-vote) and too hard to amend.

 

[fskimospy]

I'm making this up as I go along here (watching Trump smash up the political furniture like the proverbial bull in a china shop...or a "Chyna" shop...has meant having to rapidly decide on one's attitude to political science/philosophy). But what I'm thinking is that while having a populace with the right democratic and intellectually-honest values in their heads is clearly desirable, you surely can't count on it always being so?

And in any case what would ensure that state, what actually determines those values, would be the year-on-year, day-to-day experience of life that people have in the country. And that is surely in good part determined by laws and systems? Not grand constitutions written in inspiring language centures ago, but day-to--day, constantly-evolving, legal systems and political institutions. I'd distinguish between laws and constitutions, and between both and values. Day-to-day law seems the most important of the three. But then it occurs to me that I _would_ think that, being a product of a country with an 'unwritten constitution'.

The US constitution seems to me to be simultaneously too vague (it doesn't even include a specific, positive, right-to-vote) and too hard to amend.

Well, the lack of a right to vote part was on purpose. The people who wrote it affirmatively thought that only certain people should vote.

I agree it’s too hard to amend and the weird glorification of it has been really damaging to our society.

 

[sportage]

WTF??? Seems EVERYONE in this Whitehouse is looking for a pardon. What the hell have they done that they expect to come out once Donald Trump is over? Could it be that THEY were the ones conducting that alleged elite pedophile ring? Will the PEE-TAPE come out? Is Donald Trump a full fledged Soviet operative? Exactly what, WHAT... are they all so afraid of ??? No wonder they are scared shitless of losing the senate.

 

[nickqt]

From November 9th.

2016.

https://twitter.com/x/status/796524541950513153

 

[Puffnstuff]

I saw this last night on MSNBC and it didn't even surprise me.

 

[snoopy7548]

WTF??? Seems EVERYONE in this Whitehouse is looking for a pardon. What the hell have they done that they expect to come out once Donald Trump is over? Could it be that THEY were the ones conducting that alleged elite pedophile ring? Will the PEE-TAPE come out? Is Donald Trump a full fledged Soviet operative? Exactly what, WHAT... are they all so afraid of ??? No wonder they are scared shitless of losing the senate.

Not sure how true this is, but...

Trump Reportedly Considering Pardons For 3 Of His Children And Rudy Giuliani

The pardons could benefit Donald Trump Jr., Eric Trump and Ivanka Trump, as well as son-in-law Jared Kushner.

www.huffpost.com

President Donald Trump has discussed pardoning three of his children and his personal attorney Rudy Giuliani before he leaves office and before any of them have been charged with potential crimes, according to several reports on Tuesday evening.

Fox News host Sean Hannity said Monday that Trump “needs to pardon his whole family and himself” as he goes “out the door.”

 

[Dulanic]

Republicans will be along shortly to explain why these potential pardons are justified and the real problem is everyone trying to frame it as a crime.

Have to protect them from the deep state! The swamp must be filled drained!

 

[dawp]

I see he was taking pointers from Blagojevich.