just like to commend a new policy.

[eakers]

me too. i have mentioned it in the past and was shot down as being "soft" or "too sensitive" by other members.

good work!

 

[Barnaby W. Füi]

I was very impressed to see the new rule. Anyone that goes around saying "that's gay" as an insult needs to grow up IMO.

 

[Triumph]

Well I'd like to see the issue opened up for debate, as it was before (see my previous links), but I know how the mods are around here, and the discussion would be locked in OT before 10 replies could be had.

 

[Barnaby W. Füi]

Originally posted by: Triumph
Well I'd like to see the issue opened up for debate, as it was before (see my previous links), but I know how the mods are around here, and the discussion would be locked in OT before 10 replies could be had.

Yeah, it is obvious that basically nothing is up for discussion around here, so the best we can do is hope that any changes are for the better.

 

[dpm]

Originally posted by: Triumph
You all voiced your supporting opinions, I would like to voice my opinion that I disagree with the new policy. The term "gay" is not owned by those of a homosexual persuasion. Many words will have multiple meanings attached to them, meanings that are completely unrelated to one another. Many other words have their roots in racist and bigotted practices, but have lost that meaning through the passage of time. The term "gay" simply has come to mean stupid or lame to the majority of people. To have one fraction of the population 'own' the term is frankly, too politically correct. We've also had this discussion before in OT. A mod decided that it was a bigotted term, and that it would not be allowed. Threads were creating complaining about this, the majority of the people disagreed with the mod, and the mod eventually rescinded his command. People were again allowed to use the term 'gay' to mean lame or stupid. So I simply cite precedence here: the case was already argued and decided earlier in OT's history. Now I agree with wanting to tone down the somewhat immature attitude of OT recently, but I disagree with the approach. Maybe leave the sticky, but remove the ban on "gay." On the other hand, a word like f*gs, I agree is a pretty strong word, and shouldn't be used. But my argument would be that 'f*g' does not have other meanings attached to it (besides meaning a bundle of sticks, but nobody uses that), the way that gay does. Let's be realistic here.

I can't agree with you. Yes, language is in a constant state of flux, and the meaning of words change. But we are not obliged to accept all changes as normal use, nor should we. The usage of the word gay has changed. We no longer refer to six year old girls as gay, as in "gaily dancing down the street". The word was adopted and became exclusively a noun for homosexuals.

Over the past 3 to 4 years (in my experience), a new usage has cropped up, this using gay as a pejorative term. I've watched this usage spread, and it *does* come from bigoted and small minded people, who do equate gay with bad, and use the term as such. And I've seen this usage spread, to people who aren't as bigoted, but use the term because their friends do etc. What I don't see, however, is how they can be blind to the obviously pejorative meaning of the term, used this way. This is no different to the use of a certain derivation of the word negro. - It was used to discribe other things too. It was used as a synonym for bad, and for the same reasons, and I find this sort of thing extremely distasteful.

This decision was obviously not taken without considering the context - we haven't just seen an increase in the use of the word gay, we've seen an increase in anti-homosexual sentiment. Perhaps this sort of thing is inevitable - this is an internet forum dedicated to computers, after all, and thus probably mostly populated by 14 year old boys, but it doesn't mean we have to accept and condone it.

P.s. about f@gs. Where I come from, if you say f@g you mean cigarette. Thats pretty much it. That and its use for fuel really are other meanings for the word. Fair enough. But I guess the point I'm trying to make (badly, I can see) is that the word gay here isn't really used as having another meaning. Its still used as meaning gay, as homosexual, and thus bad.

 

[Triumph]

You agree that language is always changing. And you agree that the definition of the word gay itself has changed and can change. Then I guess, since you also noted that the "stupid" usage has become more common, it will become more and more acceptable to use the term as such. Good for that, I say. This whole topic is about bowing to the will of political correctness, and I'm plain sick of it. AT didn't used to be so PC, but it's been slowly incringing upon us.

 

[Wag]

If "political correctness" means keeping bigoted, insensitive remarks, then I say "good riddance".

 

[dpm]

Originally posted by: Triumph
You agree that language is always changing. And you agree that the definition of the word gay itself has changed and can change. Then I guess, since you also noted that the "stupid" usage has become more common, it will become more and more acceptable to use the term as such. Good for that, I say. This whole topic is about bowing to the will of political correctness, and I'm plain sick of it. AT didn't used to be so PC, but it's been slowly incringing upon us.

Indeed, definitions do change. But the definition here is the same; gay to equal homosexual. Its just that now its being used as an insult/ pejorative term. I wouldn't say Good for that. And while it may be acceptable to some, its not for me. I'm not in charge of these forums, though - someone else is. I'm just glad they share the same values as me in this regard.

So you see this as an example of political correctness - personally I'd call it an issue of respect for others, but if this is about pc- so what? Its not like we are being forced to refer to micro-pcs as "vertically challenged". As far as I'm concerned you are free to use words as you like, until you start harassing others. And I see the use of gay like this as low-level harrasment.

However, I understand where you are coming from - we just have different views on the point where one's personal freedom stops.

 

[Barnaby W. Füi]

Originally posted by: Wag
If "political correctness" means keeping bigoted, insensitive remarks, then I say "good riddance".

No kidding. Pick any other demographic to associate with being bad, and they would take offense to it. But gay is supposed to be some exception? As if there is absolutely no link between "gay" [the insult] and "gay" [the sexuality]?

 

[Evadman]

The problem stemmed not only from the word being used, but how it was used. saying something was "gay" or "ghey" was saying that the item in question was stupid or wierd, or useless, or something else. It became a "Fad" word that people would use to nef. It created a situation where people who were homosexual would be offended that thw word that describes them in the slang is also describing this other stuff.

I disagree with it being a word worthy of a vacation because of what actually goes on on OT and other forums where personal attacks abound, with or without the aformentioned word. It is just a word, and I believe that the person reading a forum has to understand that not everyone on the planet is as well rounded intelectualy as they are, and that these words make their way into casual usage; and therefore ignore the person using it.

However, I believe what the Mods are doing here is notifying the members in OT that a new rule is being put into effect. That way they can disipline the users who use these words in an incorrect way. Without the Mods publicly saying what is not allowed, they have the members stand behind them when another member is given a vacation for breaking the rules.

I may not agree with what they are doing, but by continuing to post here, I accept their rules, including this one. I don't have to like it, but the Mods do a pretty good job at keeping the forums clean, so I believe it is worth not being able to say "ghey" for what I get in return; a cleaner forum.

To the best of my knowledge I never used any of these words in a post here in this fashion, but I still believe in what I said above.

 

[EXman]

I think just like the real world gays are getting special rights here now. I've seen intelligent religious threads hijacked and mean spirited threads grow into huge flame fests not as bad as it has been but still not up to par with this new anti anti gay issue. please make this fair.

TIA

 

[Wag]

Why you assume that anyone who's for less bigoted remarks is "gay" is beyond me. My statement was a general one.

I think a good criteria for my posts is if it were something I'd be OK with saying in public. I find it hard to believe that anyone would say half the things posted in OT.

 

[zodder]

This whole topic is about bowing to the will of political correctness, and I'm plain sick of it. AT didn't used to be so PC, but it's been slowly incringing upon us.

Amen. I posted my thoughts in the other Forum Issues thread, but I can sum it up it here by saying that I agree with Triumph 100%. Words evolve, meanings evolve. This has happened over the whole course of our language history. Did "gay" people get pissed when they suddenly became "homosexual" instead of "happy"? Of course not. Political correctness is going to bring this country down faster than any other outside influence could ever do. God help this country.