Just curious as to why Europeans get better cars than we do

[BD2003]

Dont feel too bad - their cars and gas are taxed so heavily that when you take into account all of that, over time you could buy a much nicer car in the states.

 

[ed21x]

as one guy already mentioned, most European cities have VERY developed subways and massed transit systems, as well as dense cities (not US commuter cities) that are very walkable, so the people who have cars are just the ones that either really need it or really want it (ie. rich people). So the market is skewwed towards high-end cars.

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: raildogg
I think it is because since Honda and Toyota, and the American companies have to compete with companies like BMW, Mercedes, Audi/VW, they have to put out higher quality products. Since BMWs and others I mentioned are more common, the foreign carmakers must make good products in order to sell cars.

Here, since we have GM and Ford, not BMW, Mercedes, Audi/VW, companies like Honda and Toyota have decided to not put out their higher end models.

What do you guys think?

I don't know what you're talking about. I've actually been to Europe, and the cars they have there are usually much smaller and cheaper than what we have here. With gas being $5 a gallon, they just don't normally buy powerful, expensive cars the way we do.

 

[raildogg]

Originally posted by: 91TTZ

Originally posted by: raildogg
I think it is because since Honda and Toyota, and the American companies have to compete with companies like BMW, Mercedes, Audi/VW, they have to put out higher quality products. Since BMWs and others I mentioned are more common, the foreign carmakers must make good products in order to sell cars.

Here, since we have GM and Ford, not BMW, Mercedes, Audi/VW, companies like Honda and Toyota have decided to not put out their higher end models.

What do you guys think?

I don't know what you're talking about. I've actually been to Europe, and the cars they have there are usually much smaller and cheaper than what we have here. With gas being $5 a gallon, they just don't normally buy powerful, expensive cars the way we do.

I'm saying that the Europeans get the option to buy better cars. Look at the cars being offered there from Honda, Toyota, Nissan, VW and everyone else. Then look at American cars. I certainly believe that the options they have in Europe are better than in America.

There is a reason for everything.

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: raildogg

Originally posted by: 91TTZ

Originally posted by: raildogg
I think it is because since Honda and Toyota, and the American companies have to compete with companies like BMW, Mercedes, Audi/VW, they have to put out higher quality products. Since BMWs and others I mentioned are more common, the foreign carmakers must make good products in order to sell cars.

Here, since we have GM and Ford, not BMW, Mercedes, Audi/VW, companies like Honda and Toyota have decided to not put out their higher end models.

What do you guys think?

I don't know what you're talking about. I've actually been to Europe, and the cars they have there are usually much smaller and cheaper than what we have here. With gas being $5 a gallon, they just don't normally buy powerful, expensive cars the way we do.

I'm saying that the Europeans get the option to buy better cars. Look at the cars being offered there from Honda, Toyota, Nissan, VW and everyone else. Then look at American cars. I certainly believe that the options they have in Europe are better than in America.

There is a reason for everything.

Yeah, I don't know what it is about the US where they think we want to buy crap.

 

[Turkish]

Originally posted by: raildogg

Originally posted by: b0mbrman

Originally posted by: raildogg
I think it is because since Honda and Toyota, and the American companies have to compete with companies like BMW, Mercedes, Audi/VW, they have to put out higher quality products. Since BMWs and others I mentioned are more common, the foreign carmakers must make good products in order to sell cars.

Here, since we have GM and Ford, not BMW, Mercedes, Audi/VW, companies like Honda and Toyota have decided to not put out their higher end models.

What do you guys think?

It's because Americans wouldn't buy the "better cars," plain and simple. Look at the top-selling vehicles in America and you'll understand.

Accord, Camry, Corolla, Civic are better than similar American cars, assuming they are among the top selling cars.

The point I was making is that the European versions of the Accord, Camry, Corolla and especially the Civic are much better.

Acura TSX is what we get as Accord in Turkey 🙂 Its a nice car.

 

[canadageek]

big cars aren't any safer than small ones. you are more likely to die in a hummer crash than a volvo crash. why? because volvo's are better designed. its just like your "muscle cars" they aren't sophisticated in the least. when a demand for more power arrived, the engines were upsized, not redesigned. toyota can get as much horsepower out of a four cylinder as an american company can get out of a v-8.

 

[Evadman]

Originally posted by: canadageek
big cars aren't any safer than small ones. you are more likely to die in a hummer crash than a volvo crash. why? because volvo's are better designed. its just like your "muscle cars" they aren't sophisticated in the least. when a demand for more power arrived, the engines were upsized, not redesigned. toyota can get as much horsepower out of a four cylinder as an american company can get out of a v-8.

That is not entirely correct. Mass always wins. Where are you getting your statistics? Or are you basing this off of each companies advertizing and your gut instinct? Seriously, I'm curious.

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: canadageek
big cars aren't any safer than small ones. you are more likely to die in a hummer crash than a volvo crash. why? because volvo's are better designed. its just like your "muscle cars" they aren't sophisticated in the least. when a demand for more power arrived, the engines were upsized, not redesigned. toyota can get as much horsepower out of a four cylinder as an american company can get out of a v-8.

Show me a consumer N/A Toyota 4 cylinder that has 500+ hp like the Corvette Z06 has. You simply won't.


I see so much misinformation about engines being posted in this forum that I'm convinced it's comprised of 15 year old kids who have never worked on a car and don't know how an engine works.

 

[FallenHero]

Originally posted by: canadageek
big cars aren't any safer than small ones. you are more likely to die in a hummer crash than a volvo crash. why? because volvo's are better designed. its just like your "muscle cars" they aren't sophisticated in the least. when a demand for more power arrived, the engines were upsized, not redesigned. toyota can get as much horsepower out of a four cylinder as an american company can get out of a v-8.

No offense, but I have yet to see a 4 banger beat me or any other v-8.

 

[Evadman]

Originally posted by: 91TTZ
Show me a consumer N/A Toyota 4 cylinder that has 500+ hp like the Corvette Z06 has. You simply won't.

There is no replacement for displacement. What he is saying is that toyota makes more power for a given size. (I am reading into it, yes) You changed his argument into a bizare absolute with one of the most powerful US consumer engines so you could refute it.
Of course a N/A V8 engine that is 427 cubic inches is going to make more power than a 4 cyl. Is there an available 427 CI 4 cyl that you know of so we can compare apples to apples? Saying a LS7 makes more HP than a Toyota 4 cyl is the same as me saying the GE Diesel in a train makes more power than a LS7.

If you want to go closer to what canadageek is saying, he is still roughly correct if you talk in generalities and overlook the specifics of his post. Imports generally do make more power with a smaller engine than their US counterparts.

Originally posted by: 91TTZ
I see so much misinformation about engines being posted in this forum that I'm convinced it's comprised of 15 year old kids who have never worked on a car and don't know how an engine works.

Now that I agree with. It's not just engines. I am waiting for an AT member to get sued for bad advice when doing their brakes. Seriously, a member here said to make sure to soak your brake rotors in brake fluid to clean them. *sigh*

 

[thomsbrain]

WTF are you talking about?

A) we DO have the high-end euro companies here.

B) the euro companies make some of the least reliable cars on the planet

C) in america, many if not most vehicles sold are pickups or SUV's (the biggest sellers have been trucks for a long time). a big chunk of the rest of the vehicles sold are sh!tty buicks and other bloated land boats. that leaves a much smaller percentage of the market that is even interested in a quality car. take out another huge chunk that are only interested in comfort and reliabilty (therefore they bought a toyota), and that leaves an even smaller piece of the market who are interested in a car that doesn't suck and also isn't boring.

D) combine all of the above that with the fact that for the most part, we DO get the same cars as the europeans (though they are sometimes named differently), and i'm not sure why you'd ever ask this question.

 

[thomsbrain]

Originally posted by: ed21x
as one guy already mentioned, most European cities have VERY developed subways and massed transit systems, as well as dense cities (not US commuter cities) that are very walkable, so the people who have cars are just the ones that either really need it or really want it (ie. rich people). So the market is skewwed towards high-end cars.

no, actually most of the market is super-small subcompacts. that's the standard family vehicle there.

 

[thomsbrain]

Originally posted by: Evadman

Originally posted by: canadageek
big cars aren't any safer than small ones. you are more likely to die in a hummer crash than a volvo crash. why? because volvo's are better designed. its just like your "muscle cars" they aren't sophisticated in the least. when a demand for more power arrived, the engines were upsized, not redesigned. toyota can get as much horsepower out of a four cylinder as an american company can get out of a v-8.

That is not entirely correct. Mass always wins. Where are you getting your statistics? Or are you basing this off of each companies advertizing and your gut instinct? Seriously, I'm curious.

ever seen a video of a F-150 in a frontal impact test? practice with me:

"goodbye legs."

so much for mass always wins. and that's to say nothing of the roll-over issue. and the "don't get in an accident in the first place issue."

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: thomsbrain

ever seen a video of a F-150 in a frontal impact test? practice with me:

"goodbye legs."

so much for mass always wins. and that's to say nothing of the roll-over issue. and the "don't get in an accident in the first place issue."

the new F150 is five star.

the video you're probably refering to is the one with the mini and the old f150.

that test really only simulates running into a brick wall. the brick wall has more mass than the F150. run the F150 into a mini and see who wins.

and, of course, mass always wins only when you're dealing with hard objects, not soft ones like cars, which absorb force.