• Guest, The rules for the P & N subforum have been updated to prohibit "ad hominem" or personal attacks against other posters. See the full details in the post "Politics and News Rules & Guidelines."

Just bought an I5, need some install help

Carmen813

Diamond Member
May 18, 2007
3,189
0
76
I decided to upgrade my X2 5400+ system with a new i5 750, Asus P7P55 motherboard, and 4GB of DDR3 1600 Gskill memory.

I haven't built an Intel based system in a very long time and wanted someone to let me know any upgrade tips I might need. I also wanted to know if anyone knows what Turbo Boost is and how I will enable it. I imagine there is a bios option, but are there also Windows 7 settings or drivers I need to install?

Thanks in advance.
 

jiffylube1024

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2002
7,430
0
71
Overclocking on the P7P55 series is easy, but you should do a bunch of reading on it.

I've got the P7P55D, and it seems to disable turbo mode automatically when you start to overclock, which is good if you're going for a large overclock.
 

ekoostik

Senior member
Sep 10, 2009
202
0
0
jiffy,
I ran into the same thing with my Gigabyte board. As soon as I upped my memory (by turning on XMP or setting multiplier to 12x) to run it at 1600 I 'lost' Turbo. A number of board settings for "Auto" mean Enabled if you don't tweak other settings but are translated as Disabled if you do tweak certain other settings.

If you're not doing a large OC and want to turn Turbo back on, there's probably just a few settings that need changed. Obviously Asus BIOS options will be different than Gigabyte, but they may be similar enough. The changes I made to enable Turbo while OCed were in the BIOS on the Advanced CPU Core Features page:
Intel Turbo Boost Tech. - changed from Auto to Enabled
CPU Cores Enabled - left as All
CPU Multi-Threading - left as Enabled
CPU Enhanced Halt (C1E) - changed from Auto to Enabled
C3/C6/C7 State Support - changed from Auto to Enabled
CPU Thermal Monitor - changed from Auto to Enabled
CPU EIST Function - changed from Auto to Enabled
Bi-Directional PROCHOT - changed from Auto to Enabled
 

lopri

Elite Member
Jul 27, 2002
12,842
325
126
Interesting. I always leave EIST and C1E "disabled"
You should leave those enabled for a 24/7 system. Those are some of the most cherished developments in modern processor technology and the benefit is immediate to end-user via reduced system heat and system longevity.
 

aigomorla

Cases and Cooling Mod PC Gaming Mod Elite Member
Super Moderator
Sep 28, 2005
19,226
1,614
126
You should leave those enabled for a 24/7 system. Those are some of the most cherished developments in modern processor technology and the benefit is immediate to end-user via reduced system heat and system longevity.
depends on what the machine is used for.

Example, my machines never see it. :rolleyes:
 

Phanuel

Platinum Member
Apr 25, 2008
2,304
2
0
You should leave those enabled for a 24/7 system. Those are some of the most cherished developments in modern processor technology and the benefit is immediate to end-user via reduced system heat and system longevity.
Depends. Stock CPU speeds? Enable them, heck I think it needs EIST enable to do the Turbo and the C3/C6 (1 and 2 core active Turbos). But overclocked? Can lead to potential instability when voltage and CPU speed drop but not enough voltage is going through it for the new higher low speed setting. I had them enabled for a bit, but I'd bluescreen once I stopped Priming and the system stepped down.
 

Carmen813

Diamond Member
May 18, 2007
3,189
0
76
Make sure your RAM can run on the 1156 platform - needs to be 1.65V or LESS. Turbo will be on by default. Read these articles:
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=3634
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=3641
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=3640
This is the memory I bought, Gskill DDR3 1600, 1.6v

The motherboard showed up today. It says I should enable DOCP (DRAM OC profile) for an i5 to run the memory at 1600 mhz. The manual says "Overclocks DRAM frequency by adjusting bclk frequency". Someone care to explain? I assume blck is related to CPU frequency somehow.

I don't think it will disable turbo mode by doing this. If it does, I'll just run it at 1333...I don't really care :p
 
Last edited:

ekoostik

Senior member
Sep 10, 2009
202
0
0
See my eariler post (post #4) in this thread. This is what I was describing.

Your CPU runs at one multiplier of bclk. Your RAM runs at a second multiplier of bclk. By default, blck is 133, and the memory multiplier is 10x, and for the i5 750 your CPU multiplier is 20x. So RAM runs at 10x133 = 1333MHz while CPU runs at 20x133 = 2660 i.e. 2.66GHz. (approximately.)

Because the multiplier for the i5 750 maxes out at 10x, to get the RAM to run at 1600 it changes the bclk to 1600/10 = 160. (Other combinations of bclk x memory multiplier that = 1600 can be used as well, such as 200 and 8x.)

When the motherboard changes your bclk to 160, it changes your system multiplier as well to prevent a large accidental overclock. It will probably set it somewhere around 17x, because 17x160 = 2720. Or maybe 16 as 16 x 160 = 2560.

Once the board changes these settings, turbo usually is turned off by default. This is because turbo is a function of increasing the cpu multiplier. So with bclk turned up, any increase in the cpu multiplier will have a larger than intended increase in CPU speed, and thus possibly increase other things more than intended such as temperature and voltage. It can be turned on and tested by hand, but by default most motherboards play it safe and disable turbo.
 

Carmen813

Diamond Member
May 18, 2007
3,189
0
76
See my eariler post (post #4) in this thread. This is what I was describing.

Your CPU runs at one multiplier of bclk. Your RAM runs at a second multiplier of bclk. By default, blck is 133, and the memory multiplier is 10x, and for the i5 750 your CPU multiplier is 20x. So RAM runs at 10x133 = 1333MHz while CPU runs at 20x133 = 2660 i.e. 2.66GHz. (approximately.)

Because the multiplier for the i5 750 maxes out at 10x, to get the RAM to run at 1600 it changes the bclk to 1600/10 = 160. (Other combinations of bclk x memory multiplier that = 1600 can be used as well, such as 200 and 8x.)

When the motherboard changes your bclk to 160, it changes your system multiplier as well to prevent a large accidental overclock. It will probably set it somewhere around 17x, because 17x160 = 2720. Or maybe 16 as 16 x 160 = 2560.

Once the board changes these settings, turbo usually is turned off by default. This is because turbo is a function of increasing the cpu multiplier. So with bclk turned up, any increase in the cpu multiplier will have a larger than intended increase in CPU speed, and thus possibly increase other things more than intended such as temperature and voltage. It can be turned on and tested by hand, but by default most motherboards play it safe and disable turbo.
I decided to grab a CM Hyper 212+ and go for a small OC. Are i5s multiplier unlocked? Will I be able to set it at 160x20? I'm thinking of going for a relatively small OC, 3.2-3.6.

Also, is it safe to plug in this 120mm fan into the motherboard header, or will that overdraw it and cause bad things?
 
Last edited:

Phanuel

Platinum Member
Apr 25, 2008
2,304
2
0
I decided to grab a CM Hyper 212+ and go for a small OC. Are i5s multiplier unlocked? Will I be able to set it at 160x20? I'm thinking of going for a relatively small OC, 3.2-3.6.

Also, is it safe to plug in this 120mm fan into the motherboard header, or will that overdraw it and cause bad things?
Unlocked as far as default multi and down are available, yes. 20 should work fine, 21 might actually work if your board can force a fake turbo mode on outside of the default configuration. Heck, if you have an MSI or an Asus board, you can just use the auto overclock feature and get mild overclocks without much issue.

The 120 will be fine off of the motherboard header, it's a 4 pin PWM fan designed to be plugged into your motherboard.
 

Carmen813

Diamond Member
May 18, 2007
3,189
0
76
Unlocked as far as default multi and down are available, yes. 20 should work fine, 21 might actually work if your board can force a fake turbo mode on outside of the default configuration. Heck, if you have an MSI or an Asus board, you can just use the auto overclock feature and get mild overclocks without much issue.

The 120 will be fine off of the motherboard header, it's a 4 pin PWM fan designed to be plugged into your motherboard.
So basically I could probably do a 20x160 fairly easily since I have DDR1600 memory right? Think I'd even need tweak voltage much at that speed?

It does have the auto OC feature, I've just been out of the OC game for so long (we're talking Athlon 1.2 ghz days) that I'm a bit nervous.

I think I'm gonna build system tonight to get it up and running and make sure components function. The new HSF will be here next week and I'll install it then.
 

Carmen813

Diamond Member
May 18, 2007
3,189
0
76
If you haven't read the 1156 introduction article yet it's a good read: http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=3634

Anand was able to get the i5 750 to run at 160x20 with Turbo still enabled. You can see this in the overclocking section of that article. Another good, and shorter, read is:
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=3640
Systems up and running. Whenever I change settings away from "Auto" in the Asus bios, the turbo option disappears. I can choose multipliers up to 21. ARe there any Windows 7 power options I need to set for turbo to be enabled (if its on in the bios?).

I'd like to do 160x17 with turbo enabled if I can figure out how to do it in the bios...gonna play with it some more later.

I'm running my memory at 1333 for the time being. There are like 40 memory settings, and I have no idea which I am supposed to set to 7-8-7-24...so help if you can :)

Update:
Okay, I enabled X.M.P. which I assume means extreme memory profile, and that basically set everything right for the memory. I adjusted CPU multiplier to 17, so I'm running at a slight OC (2.72 ghz). Don't know if turbo mode is on or not, but I suspect it isn't. I'm assuming that for the time being, running the memory at 1333 and proper timings (with turbo mode on) would result in better performance than running the CPU at 2.72 with turbo mode off (but memory at 1600). Is that right?
 
Last edited:

ekoostik

Senior member
Sep 10, 2009
202
0
0
I'm assuming that for the time being, running the memory at 1333 and proper timings (with turbo mode on) would result in better performance than running the CPU at 2.72 with turbo mode off (but memory at 1600). Is that right?
Running at stock with Turbo enabled means your CPU can run at 2.66 - 2.80GHz with 3 or 4 cores active, and up to 3.20GHz with 1 or 2 cores active. So I'd say yes, that's better than locking it at 2.72 just to get slightly faster RAM.

Systems up and running. Whenever I change settings away from "Auto" in the Asus bios, the turbo option disappears. I can choose multipliers up to 21. ARe there any Windows 7 power options I need to set for turbo to be enabled (if its on in the bios?).
I'm not familiar with the Asus bios to understand what you are saying. When you say the Turbo option disappears, you mean they don't even list it in the Bios? Also when you say you "change settings away from 'Auto'" - exactly what settings are you chaning, and what are you setting them to? There's nothing in Windows 7 that controls Turbo.
 

Phanuel

Platinum Member
Apr 25, 2008
2,304
2
0
Unless he's updated the BIOS, C-STATE is disabled by default. That's the core shut down and 1 or 2 core active speed up. He'd have to enable that in the Advanced menu -> CPU Configuration -> Intel (R) C-STATE tech. I'd say just go to XMP if you want to run the memory at 1600 and the motherboard should leave most things at default. But I could be wrong as I'm not sure if there is a 12x memory strap.

However, doing any overclocking with this enabled is asking for stability issues down the road if you aren't supplying enough voltage when a processor steps up. For example if you overclock the baseclock (BCLK) from 133 to 160 your default speed becomes 3.2ghz (160x20, might need a bit more voltage), turbo engaged becomes 3.36ghz (160x21) and the 1 or 2 core C-STATE becomes 3.84ghz (160x24, definitely need more voltage)! Trying to tune this with a dynamic Vcore becomes nearly impossible as you either overvolt 4cores active at a low max speed for each or you potentially undervolt the 1 and 2 core maximums.

You also can run into the problem I did on my P7P55D which is trying to use the step down features and the Vcore offset bios feature where at 100% load on all 4 cores I was stable at 3.5ghz but when the processor was no longer under load and the Vcore stepped down, it would become very very unstable and bluescreen because it was no longer getting a correct amount of juice to idle at 2.6-3.6ghz.

Just try the XMP profile option in the BIOS and enable the C-STATE function if it's not on by default (the latest BIOSes from Asus actually re-enable this by default, but I bet the shipping BIOS version on your board does not).
 

Carmen813

Diamond Member
May 18, 2007
3,189
0
76
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/mainboards/display/asus-p7p55d-deluxe.html

This is the same bios I use, my motherboard just has a few less hardware features. Settings seem identical. Basically if you change the CPU Ratio (this is Asus speak for multiplier) from auto the speedstep and turbomode settings disappear.

I enabled C-State, thanks for the heads up. One question, if opens up a new option menu with auto/c1/c3/c6...I set it to c6 , does that sound right?

I think I'm going to end up trying to do 3.2ghz (160x20) with turbo mode disabled once I get a better HSF. That way I'm getting my memory performing where it should be, and hopefully it will only take a small voltage bump.
I'm running memory at 1333 and have CPU with turbo mode on right now.
 

Phanuel

Platinum Member
Apr 25, 2008
2,304
2
0
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/mainboards/display/asus-p7p55d-deluxe.html

This is the same bios I use, my motherboard just has a few less hardware features. Settings seem identical. Basically if you change the CPU Ratio (this is Asus speak for multiplier) from auto the speedstep and turbomode settings disappear.

I enabled C-State, thanks for the heads up. One question, if opens up a new option menu with auto/c1/c3/c6...I set it to c6 , does that sound right?

I think I'm going to end up trying to do 3.2ghz (160x20) with turbo mode disabled once I get a better HSF. That way I'm getting my memory performing where it should be, and hopefully it will only take a small voltage bump.
I'm running memory at 1333 and have CPU with turbo mode on right now.
You can leave the second C-State option menu at [Auto] and since I don't know what the individual C-States are, I'd recommend [Auto]. My i7 860 would use the 24 and 26x multipliers when 2 and 1 core were stressed with auto.

Oh, yeah, if you adjust the multi, then yeah the turbo boost will disable itself. They're assuming that you're either underclocking (no idea why you'd do that on i7) or that you've upped the BCLK and are now running higher overall mhz than the base 133x20.

Regarding memory, what happens when you go from [Auto] to [X.M.P.] in the Ai Teaker menu? Otherwise, unless you actually want to overclock and disable the power saving features, the difference between 1333mhz and 1600mhz memory is basically 0.5% performance maximum. Higher speed memory is useful in 2 situations, both overclocking;
1) Benchmarking since they tend to read memory speed and core speed above all else and
2) Overclocking, not to necessarily get to that speed, but because they provide lots of BCLK headroom when you can drop the memory multiplier.

Bit of an explanation, memory strap or multipliers tend to run in ratios of 2:3 (6x), 2:4 (8x), 2:5 (10x) of BCLK to RAM speed.

It we run at the maximum memory strap of 2:5 (10x133 BCLK, 1333mhz speed memory) when you get to a BCLK of like 180 your stock 1333mhz memory is now running at 1800mhz and is overclocked quite a bit. If you had purchased 1333 max speed memory you'd be unstable, if you even managed to get into Windows.

Now, if we drop the strap to say 2:4 at this 180 BLCK (8x180 BCLK) we're at 1440mhz, we're still over our stock 1333 memory. So we need to drop down to 2:3 (6x180 BCLK) we're now at 1080mhz and now within the rated spec for our memory.

If you buy 1600mhz rated memory then you can run the 2:4 memory strap (1440) without any issues using the X.M.P. profiles to get the timings they're rated at for 1600mhz without any worry about stability since they can handle faster speeds. And if you want to spend the time to actually overclock your memory you might be able to run the 1800mhz but memory overclocking and testing is a bit more involving than just the CPU.

So please, don't make the 1600mhz memory speed your end all be all target to get to on a default CPU. Use higher speed memory as a way of providing yourself some BCLK headroom without any worries for the RAM on the OC'ing side of things. Personally, the price difference between 1333 and 1600 makes it worth it to buy the 1600mhz speed stuff since it's practically the same cost. The price difference between 1600 and 1800 and 2000mhz gets to be astronomical and the performance is just not there with the integrated memory controllers on these CPUs. Overal performance between 1333mhz and 2000mhz is on the range of maybe 5% max in anything anybody will do in the real world outside of artificial benchmarks. I'm running my i7 860 (kind of a dud chip) at 3.75ghz with a 187.5 BCLK so my memory is only at 1500mhz compared to the 1600mhz it's rated for. I actually compared 198x19 (3.76ghz) and 187.5x20 (3.75ghz) and got nearly the same GFLOPS in a LinX stress test (variance was +/- .5 gflop between the two and even in the same 20x runs for each configuration the variance was +/- .5 gflop).
 
Last edited:

Carmen813

Diamond Member
May 18, 2007
3,189
0
76
Phan,
Thank you very much for the input. I hadn't been able to find many good benchmarks comparing 1333 to 1600 so I wasn't sure how large a difference it was.

Some were confused so to clarify: If I use the DOCP option, both speedstep and turbo mode options disappear. That is because it auto adjust the multiplier down to 17 (while boosting the blck to 160).

Once I get my new HSF I am going to go for 160x20, with speedstep enabled, but turbo mode off. I think this is the best way to go, it will put me at 3.2 GHz for all the cores but allow me to keep power saving options.
 

ASK THE COMMUNITY