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Judicial Watch study: voter id laws increase minority turnout

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Jhhnn said:
Gawd. The whole "voter fraud is a problem we need to address" song and dance is purely speculative, a variant on conspiracy theory.
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This whole "voter id will drive minorities away" is a song and dance by the liberal left.

Get over it all ready.
 
Texashiker said:
Don't you all-caps me young man.

Maybe you are not old enough to realize this, but not everyone waits until the last minute to take action.
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What does that even mean? Are you saying parts of the state have implemented voter ID early in violation of the law?
 
Jhhnn said:
Voter fraud has not been shown to be a statistically significant problem. period.

That simple fact indicates that voter ID advocates have delusions or ulterior motives.

The rest is shamanistic dancing around the truth.
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Let's try a thought experiment. For sake of argument let's say the study is true and Voter ID does increase minority turnout. Would you, Eskimospy, and others who currently oppose Voter ID change your position on the issue? How about if overall turnout increased but increases in minority turnout lagged behind while still going up?
 
Jhhnn said:
Gawd. The whole "voter fraud is a problem we need to address" song and dance is purely speculative, a variant on conspiracy theory.

Show me the fraud. If you can't do that, you might as well argue that we desperately need a system to defend ourselves against bigfoot or demons from the underworld.
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You could easily add "manmade climate change" to the list but your side still supports turning our economy upside down to fix that at vastly higher expense and effort.
 
glenn1 said:
You could easily add "manmade climate change" to the list but your side still supports turning our economy upside down to fix that at vastly higher expense and effort.
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Regarding climate change a near total consensus of those studies say it's happening and man is a contributing factor. While no studies regarding voter fraud have shown in person voter fraud to occur except in extremely rare circumstances. And in fact more studies have shown implementing voter IDs will hurt voters than have shown in person voter fraud occurs. Yet you think we SHOULD implement voter ID and SHOULD NOT do anything about climate change. This is why the right is stupid. I would support revoking the right to vote to anyone this stupid.
 
thraashman said:
Regarding climate change a near total consensus of those studies say it's happening and man is a contributing factor. While no studies regarding voter fraud have shown in person voter fraud to occur except in extremely rare circumstances. And in fact more studies have shown implementing voter IDs will hurt voters than have shown in person voter fraud occurs. Yet you think we SHOULD implement voter ID and SHOULD NOT do anything about climate change. This is why the right is stupid. I would support revoking the right to vote to anyone this stupid.
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I have no idea what rate voter fraud occurs at, but even once is too many. I've repeatedly said voter ID should be one of an entire suite of fixes to voting laws addressing the concerns of both sides. Everything should be on the table; from simplifying voter registration, offering new channels and timeframes for voters to cast ballots, to more robust voting counting and auditing systems.
 
eskimospy said:
What does that even mean? Are you saying parts of the state have implemented voter ID early in violation of the law?
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Here is something for you to think about.

Lets say you set something next to the road in front of your house, apartment, duplex,,, whatever you live in. You put a sign on that object saying "free." For example lets use a stair stepper.

Chances are nobody is going to stop and pick that stair stepper up.

If you put a sign on that stair stepper saying $10, someone will pick it up and steal it.

If you put a value on something people will want it more.

Lets apply that to voting, if you put no value on voting, no hurdles to jump, maybe less people are inclined to vote.

Maybe if voting is made a goal to reach, something people have to work for, such as a voter id card, people will take a little more pride in voting.
 
glenn1 said:
Let's try a thought experiment. For sake of argument let's say the study is true and Voter ID does increase minority turnout. Would you, Eskimospy, and others who currently oppose Voter ID change your position on the issue? How about if overall turnout increased but increases in minority turnout lagged behind while still going up?
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It would depend on the causal mechanism, what do you think it would be?

If it were because minorities were reacting to the fact that their voting rights were under attack with greater engagement, of course I wouldn't support voter ID. Saying that attacking someone's rights is a good thing because they fought back is ridiculous.

If it were because the state's efforts to give everyone the necessary documentation to vote were so successful that more people happened to vote anyway, that would lessen my opposition.

To be clear though, my opposition is not based in minority turnout levels. The primary (and only) argument you need against voter ID is that it is based on an irrational premise: it attempts to solve a problem that does not exist. It is never a good idea to promote irrational laws.
 
glenn1 said:
Let's try a thought experiment. For sake of argument let's say the study is true and Voter ID does increase minority turnout. Would you, Eskimospy, and others who currently oppose Voter ID change your position on the issue? How about if overall turnout increased but increases in minority turnout lagged behind while still going up?
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Let's say that if pigs had wings...
 
Texashiker said:
You are delusional. Your argument is based off nothing more than speculation.

Has it occurred to you that the news talking about voter id laws and voting in general has motivated people to vote?
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The bolded is rich considering your argument is a study of a law that hasn't gone into effect yet.
 
eskimospy said:
It would depend on the causal mechanism, what do you think it would be?

If it were because minorities were reacting to the fact that their voting rights were under attack with greater engagement, of course I wouldn't support voter ID. Saying that attacking someone's rights is a good thing because they fought back is ridiculous.

If it were because the state's efforts to give everyone the necessary documentation to vote were so successful that more people happened to vote anyway, that would lessen my opposition.

To be clear though, my opposition is not based in minority turnout levels. The primary (and only) argument you need against voter ID is that it is based on an irrational premise: it attempts to solve a problem that does not exist. It is never a good idea to promote irrational laws.
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+1 to this.

If the reason we do see a spike in minority turn out because they are fearing the loss of their rights, then it would likely be a short term trend.
 
Out of curiosity,

Have Brazil, Canada, Germany, Netherlands or Switzerland had many problems with voter suppression? All of these countries have some sort of Voter ID law in place.

Well, I know in Brazil it shouldn't since voting three is compulsory.
 
Griffinhart said:
Out of curiosity,

Have Brazil, Canada, Germany, Netherlands or Switzerland had many problems with voter suppression? All of these countries have some sort of Voter ID law in place.

Well, I know in Brazil it shouldn't since voting three is compulsory.
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As a Canadian, one of the things I always admired about the US was it's Liberty and Freedom.
I used to think it was a right wing thing, but it seems now the left wing is the go to for that
 
Orignal Earl said:
As a Canadian, one of the things I always admired about the US was it's Liberty and Freedom.
I used to think it was a right wing thing, but it seems now the left wing is the go to for that
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Bwahahahahahaha! Thanks for the good laugh, I needed that. 😀
 
Voter IDs also prevent autism from happening to immunization and vaccine recipients. They also stop women from getting abortions. Voter IDs even convert Muslims to Christians!

Unfortunately, Voter IDs do not convert liberals to mindless fear mongering morons who are scared of anyone with a darker skin tone than themselves. Voter ID makers hope to solve for this sometime in the near future.
 
Orignal Earl said:
I used to think it was a right wing thing, but it seems now the left wing is the go to for that
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One of the main differences between right and left here in the states, conservatives want structure. We want things spelled out, we want guidelines, we want laws.

Liberals on the other hand, they want chaos and anarchy.

Once voter id laws are abolished, the left will claim having to register to vote is a hindrance to the poor and minorities. The ultimate goal of the left is for anyone to walk up to a polling place, say they are there to vote and that person should be allowed to vote.

No proof of citizenship, no id, not even having to register required. Just walk up there and vote.

That goes against the structure conservatives want. We want guidelines, we want rules and we want laws.

To be part of society we all have to follow certain rules and laws. Presenting a photo id to vote is no different than presenting a photo id to apply for a job, open a bank account, buy a gun,,,, or any of the other luxuries we as a civilized nation enjoy.
 
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In order to vote you need to prove who you are anyways. What is liberal reason for wanting to avoid voter id?
 
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