Joe vs. Jose

[Red Dawn]

Joe Legal working in Construction is a Union member if he's worth a shit so he makes more than $25 an hour plus bennies. Jose Illegal probably can barely read a tape measure let alone cut a roof or stairs so if he's making $15 an hour he's over paid.

 

[bfdd]

Joe Legal working in Construction is a Union member if he's worth a shit so he makes more than $25 an hour plus bennies. Jose Illegal probably can barely read a tape measure let alone cut a roof or stairs so if he's making $15 an hour he's over paid.

Well it depends on the type of construction. A union millwright is probably getting work, but his brother the union carpenter isn't. Also, have you worked along side any of those illegals doing the work? I have and quite a few have taught me a thing or two. I learned how to properly work a shovel thanks to an illegal alien. Helped me a ton as I've done a lot of shoveling.

 

[chucky2]

The Constitution says "A", Chucky, no matter how badly you want it to be otherwise.

You and the bigoted OP can have Wahmbulances, however.

Really? Our US Constitution says that if illegals/"undocumented" workers had their kid not on US soil their kids would be US citizens?

Did now know that, learn something new every day I guess....

 

[soccerballtux]

Well it depends on the type of construction. A union millwright is probably getting work, but his brother the union carpenter isn't. Also, have you worked along side any of those illegals doing the work? I have and quite a few have taught me a thing or two. I learned how to properly work a shovel thanks to an illegal alien. Helped me a ton as I've done a lot of shoveling.

you mean the shoveling you do bringing your liberal ass shit to this forum??


sorry think I have you confused with someone else

 

[soccerballtux]

I don't disagree with that.

My point is that it is indeed costing us to have so much illegal immigration and that illegals benefit from welfare services... because their children do. They also tend to have plenty of children, just like other legal welfare queens... Just because one happens, doesn't mean we have to accept the other. We have enough problems.

but think of all the jobs we create with those government provided services. The taxes we reap from paying the workers for the services more than make up for the cost of the services in the first place due to the multiplier effect. If only we could expand their reach, we'd have enough to go around for everyone.

 

[bfdd]

you mean the shoveling you do bringing your liberal ass shit to this forum??


sorry think I have you confused with someone else

lol i was like "huh"

 

[WackyDan]

but think of all the jobs we create with those government provided services. The taxes we reap from paying the workers for the services more than make up for the cost of the services in the first place due to the multiplier effect. If only we could expand their reach, we'd have enough to go around for everyone.

WTF.... So I add one federal or state employee to administer how many welfare cases associated with illegal immigration... What would the ratio be?

Say I pay said administrator or clerical position $60K + benefits... and they can handle 300+ welfare cases.... or process that many per whatever... You think that is efficient? What the fuck are you smoking? The multiplier is reversed... the job created and any taxation of said job is moot compared to the cost of having all of those welfare cases...

Math was never your strong suit was it?

 

[Jhhnn]

Simple question: If the illegals/"undocumented" were where they were supposed to be when their baby was born, that is, in the country they're legally a part of (not the one they happen to drop the baby in), would these kids be a.) US citizens or b.) non-US citizens?

Really? Our US Constitution says that if illegals/"undocumented" workers had their kid not on US soil their kids would be US citizens?

Did now know that, learn something new every day I guess....

I apologize for misunderstanding your original loaded question.

It really doesn't matter where a child's parents are "supposed to be" when the child is born, all born under US jurisdiction are US citizens, other than the offspring of diplomats. Even John McCain, who was born in the Canal Zone.

Your original question is pointlessly absurd, in context of reality.

Or are you claiming that because their parents weren't supposed to be here invalidates the child's rights under the Constitution, or what?

Or just ranting & foaming at the mouth in the usual anti-immigrant fashion that's become so chic among delusional Righties?

Illegals aren't our enemies- they're even more exploited than the rest of us, contrary to the OP's raving and false attribution. His false comparison would lose all meaning if Jose's immigration status were legal. The problem with that is that the people who employ him would make less money, and we must give the Job Creators! their due, let them employ illegals as a way to improve profits. Your heroes have no intention of changing that- they just use it as a distraction to keep small minds busy looking in the wrong directions.

Anybody can work for peanuts under the table. You and the OP should try it for yourselves, report back, tell us what it's really like.

 

[Red Dawn]

Well it depends on the type of construction. A union millwright is probably getting work, but his brother the union carpenter isn't. Also, have you worked along side any of those illegals doing the work? I have and quite a few have taught me a thing or two. I learned how to properly work a shovel thanks to an illegal alien. Helped me a ton as I've done a lot of shoveling.

If you're a Teabagger I can see where handling a shovel would come in handy

All joking aside yes I've worked alongside Illegal Imigrants when I was a teenager working for my father in the Housing Industry before I went on to become a Union Carpenter. I'll say this about them, they worked their asses off. Those who could read and write english sometimes went on to become accomplished Union Carpenters but those were far and few between due to their lack of speaking and reading english let alone not being able to read Blueprints

 

[fskimospy]

It might help if you have evidence. These numbers are not insignificant and you're ignoring the fact that they tend to be concentrated in certain school districts. It's not really surprising California schools barely have any money, for example. And regardless of the impact, it's not really relevant to the OP. What's relevant is that if you're an illegal you get more from the government in this country than you contribute. Do you have any evidence that would dispute that? (Hint: you'd want to show that they are generating enough taxes to pay for even their children's education.)


LOL. You're the one attacking motives and suggesting I need to read up on things instead of addressing the actual issues. I'm going to take the higher ground here and not respond except to say you should try to focus on rational arguments.

I already provided you with evidence, you dismissed it for bullshit reasons. (people often do this with inconvenient facts) As for the impact it's absolutely relevant. That's how you decide what things are important... the amount that they affect your life.

The nativist crowd in here is yet another aspect of this board that is simply mind blowing. I feel like a lot of this board would be well served by living some of the places that I've lived in the US. They might learn the reality of immigration as opposed to a forwarded chain email.

 

[Mr. Lennon]

So why not grant citizenship to all current illegal immigrants so that they can start paying taxes?

 

[rpanic]

I already provided you with evidence, you dismissed it for bullshit reasons. (people often do this with inconvenient facts) As for the impact it's absolutely relevant. That's how you decide what things are important... the amount that they affect your life.

The nativist crowd in here is yet another aspect of this board that is simply mind blowing. I feel like a lot of this board would be well served by living some of the places that I've lived in the US. They might learn the reality of immigration as opposed to a forwarded chain email.

You have said before you lived by the beach in San Diego and I'm sure your gardener was nice, try living in LA county raising a family and you'll find out how much of a fantasy world you are living in. All you do is puke that same crap on this board and I bet you never have live by or deal with any real problems caused by Illegals.

 

[fskimospy]

You have said before you lived by the beach in San Diego and I'm sure your gardener was nice, try living in LA county raising a family and you'll find out how much of a fantasy world you are living in. All you do is puke that same crap on this board and I bet you never have live by or deal with any real problems caused by Illegals.

My gardner? I lived in Ocean Beach, and anyone who has ever spent time in San Diego knows that's not the sort of neighborhood where people have gardeners. I have a number of friends who are customs agents at San Ysidro, I used to live in National City, and I'm personal friends with a family of illegal immigrants from Vietnam (they aren't all from Messico you know!). I bet you I know way more of them than you do, but please keep it up with the REAL TALK.

San Diego county has about 3 million people in it, and they have about 200,000 illegal immigrants there. LA county has about 10 million with about 750,000 illegal immigrants. Proportionally the difference isn't very large, and straight numbers wise San Diego has one of the highest concentrations in the state. (and therefore the country) Not only that, but now I live in Brooklyn where there are large numbers of illegal immigrants. I live near them, and I see them every day.

Man, you're really good at arguing when you just make shit up. But hey, there's no intelligence test to post here.

 

[randomrogue]

Um. I'm not going to even bother reading beyond the OP in this thread. It's blatantly wrong.

 

[shortylickens]

I still feel certain ways about certain things, but got tired of complaining about it.
Mostly because the guilty white libtards immediately fight me when I speak out against illegals.

Nothings going to change, people. Obama flat out stated they are here to stay. We need to learn how to deal with them, not how to kick them out.
I once considered rounding up a hundred of them, throwing them on a bus, and driving down to the Rio Grande. I'd need to make thousands of such trips to put even a tiny dent in the problem.
Its so huge no one can fix it now. Better to look to the future.

 

[fskimospy]

I still feel certain ways about certain things, but got tired of complaining about it.
Mostly because the guilty white libtards immediately fight me when I speak out against illegals.

Nothings going to change, people. Obama flat out stated they are here to stay. We need to learn how to deal with them, not how to kick them out.
I once considered rounding up a hundred of them, throwing them on a bus, and driving down to the Rio Grande. I'd need to make thousands of such trips to put even a tiny dent in the problem.
Its so huge no one can fix it now. Better to look to the future.

If the scope of the problem is the only thing that prevented you from engaging in mass kidnapping you need to see a mental health professional.

Every president for thirty years has realized that we aren't going to engage in some sort of mass pogrom against immigrants. I don't know why it's taking so long to sink in.

 

[shortylickens]

If the scope of the problem is the only thing that prevented you from engaging in mass kidnapping you need to see a mental health professional.

Every president for thirty years has realized that we aren't going to engage in some sort of mass pogrom against immigrants. I don't know why it's taking so long to sink in.

You're cute when you try to sound tough and smart. It turns me on.

 

[fskimospy]

You're cute when you try to sound tough and smart. It turns me on.

You're cute when you talk about engaging in sociopathic kidnapping sprees. What can I say though? I tend to attract the crazies.

 

[1prophet]

The sad thing is most people including the so called anti illegal crowd won't think twice about hiring a Jose instead of a Joe when they have to reach into their own pocket to pay for the services rendered.

 

[chucky2]

blah blah

And now you can't answer the simple, non-loaded, question either. Or more accurately, won't.

Talk about wahbulance <snicker>....

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

Every president for thirty years has realized that we aren't going to engage in some sort of mass pogrom against immigrants. I don't know why it's taking so long to sink in.

Hoover, Truman and Eisenhower thought differently...and were successful. But I suspect you knew this all along by the way you qualified your statement.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

The sad thing is most people including the so called anti illegal crowd won't think twice about hiring a Jose instead of a Joe when they have to reach into their own pocket to pay for the services rendered.

No....the sad thing here is that these people are being exploited and the pro-illegal crowd doesn't think twice about looking the other way.

In the scheme of things, there's really not that much difference between chattel slavery and wage slavery.

 

[chucky2]

The pro-illegal/"undocumented" crowd is half business/people who want their work performed for slave wages, and half Bleeding Heart/White Guilt/DownWith"The Man"! types who want illegals here due to their own mental issues; either side will use any excuse and/or "study" to justify getting their way.

Neither of those groups is helping the US out long term by keeping the political landscape such that the Politicians, whose base on either side happens to be from those groups, won't take meaningful action to at least lockdown the southern border so more problems won't get in.

The 50&#37; (25% of either side of middle) that want - at the minimum - the border locked down get F'd in that deal...too bad for US I guess...

 

[bfdd]

If you're a Teabagger I can see where handling a shovel would come in handy

All joking aside yes I've worked alongside Illegal Imigrants when I was a teenager working for my father in the Housing Industry before I went on to become a Union Carpenter. I'll say this about them, they worked their asses off. Those who could read and write english sometimes went on to become accomplished Union Carpenters but those were far and few between due to their lack of speaking and reading english let alone not being able to read Blueprints

lols yea, shovel came in handy when i had to do conveyor systems that went underground or into structures and what not. a roller would break, we'd have to go down to fix it and have like 4 - 5 hrs of shoveling to do before we could even get down the tunnel to the roller. lols.

there are those kind of guys Red Dawn from all back rounds, but yeah i hear you there. the non-English speaking thing doesn't fly especially when you're working in a dangerous environment. those are the guys who have always blown my mind on being so stubborn to learn English. Where you work is extremely dangerous, wouldn't you want to be able to communicate well with the people around you?