Jobs lays the smack down on Adobe [Press Release]

[Kaido]

http://www.engadget.com/2010/04/29/steve-jobs-publishes-some-thoughts-on-flash-many-many-thou/

😱 :awe: :thumbsup:

I originally thought that lack of Flash would be a real downside to the iPad, but in my experience it has not been. You miss out on a few games, a lot of ads, and a few crappy websites (ever go to those websites where the ENTIRE MENU is in Flash, and when you click on a page it reloads the whole thing, or if you have to go back to the page, you have to dig through a huge menu and wait for it to load? haha). Vimeo does surprisingly awesome on the iPad, which was one of my big concerns as an amateur filmmaker (I love wasting time on that site, haha). As far as games go, there's plenty of freebies in the App Store, so it's not too horrible.

But I think Stevie is right for the most part - Flash is the #1 thing that makes my Mac crash. I do a lot of stuff in Flash (Youtube, Vimeo, etc.) so that's kind of a big deal. What do you think?

 

[Pliablemoose]

Flash is the #1 thing that crashes my PC.

I don't miss it on the iPad nor my phones, it's actually nice to be able to browse websites without those damn ads.

 

[alfa147x]

This sums it up quite well:

Flash was created during the PC era – for PCs and mice. Flash is a successful business for Adobe, and we can understand why they want to push it beyond PCs. But the mobile era is about low power devices, touch interfaces and open web standards – all areas where Flash falls short.

Apple Link

 

[Hail The Brain Slug]

Flash is the #1 thing that crashes my PC.

I don't miss it on the iPad nor my phones, it's actually nice to be able to browse websites without those damn ads.

I have to agree. I also disagree with the argument that apple is denying flash compatibility because they want to dominate the app store by keeping it closed. I can't say that's not true, but I would love to see anyone link ANY flash applications or games that come close to the quality of any of the popular ones on the app store. Now compare that number to the thousands of high quality useful apps the app store has.

Why do you want flash again?

 

[Turin39789]

lol at jobs hating on a closed platform

 

[theeedude]

"Flash was created during the PC era – for PCs and mice."
So were apps, we live in web based cloud computing era, and Flash is a key part of it that Apple doesn't have. Flash 10.1 is going to have hardware acceleration to run fast and efficient on mobile devices, which is going to make the iPPP crew look severely lacking. And developers can write a program in Flash once to run on Android, WebOS, RIM, (WP7?) but it won't run in any way shape or form on an Apple mobile device. If you don't like Flash on Android, you can block it, or selectively enable only apps you want to run, there is NOTHING you will be able to do to get ANY Flash apps to run on an Apple device, even the ones you want.

 

[ciproxr]

I actually agree with him 100% and if i could use the same video player on my mac that the ipod and iphone use for youtube, i would use it.

Tiered of flash and their crap.

 

[Kaido]

lol at jobs hating on a closed platform

haha, that IS pretty ironic 😀

 

[Kmax82]

Here's the other reason. Android, which is completely open still doesn't have Flash. So even if Apple said, "Yes".. would we even see Flash since it's Adobe holding it back right now.

We have routinely asked Adobe to show us Flash performing well on a mobile device, any mobile device, for a few years now. We have never seen it. Adobe publicly said that Flash would ship on a smartphone in early 2009, then the second half of 2009, then the first half of 2010, and now they say the second half of 2010. We think it will eventually ship, but we're glad we didn't hold our breath. Who knows how it will perform?

 

[alfa147x]

Adobe's CEO responds: Link

In response to Steve's assertion that "...Flash is the number one reason Macs crash," Narayen said that, if Adobe does crash a Mac, it's probably got something "to do with the Apple operating system."

So millions of applications are developed for OS X but his company can't? BWahahahahahaaaaaa

Also he says

Mr. Narayen calls accusations about Flash draining battery power "patently false."

which I don't understand, Apple's press release gives reasons for this but he doesn't really have anything to support his statement.

 

[theeedude]

Adobe's CEO responds: Link


So millions of applications are developed for OS X but his company can't? BWahahahahahaaaaaa

So millions of Windows PCs run Flash fine, but Apple's computers can't?
BWahahahahahaaaaaa

 

[Kmax82]

So millions of Windows PCs run Flash fine, but Apple's computers can't?
BWahahahahahaaaaaa

Theoretically they could have put more (and better) development time into Windows than they have into OS X, and that could be why it crashes more in OS X. I do experience browser crashes, but I haven't since Snow Leopard has come out... overall, I think it's more poor web coding than it is solely the fault of Flash on OS X.

 

[episodic]

You know, I 've never had any problems using flash on my mac. Not one. Wonder what junk other ppl put on their systems to mess them up?

 

[ultimatebob]

Sorry, but the iPad's lack of Flash is a deal killer for me. There are just too many online video sites out there (like Hulu, and about a billion porn sites) that require Flash to run, not to mention all of the greeting card sites and Facebook games that also require Flash.

I'm sure that Steve will eventually break down and support Flash in the distant future (Like he did with Cut and Paste, MMS, finally releasing a multi-button mouse for the Mac, etc) but I'll stick with a netbook or perhaps a tablet from another vendor until then.

 

[alfa147x]

You know, I 've never had any problems using flash on my mac. Not one. Wonder what junk other ppl put on their systems to mess them up?

Nothing much really. I'v had flash probably crash in safari 6 - 10 all last year

 

[KeypoX]

Nothing much really. I'v had flash probably crash in safari 6 - 10 all last year

and how doyou know its flash's fault for a crash in safari?

As far as jobs laying a smack down. He is trying to protect his product, nothing more nothing less. Flash would destroy the app store. Maybe right now there are not a ton of quality flash apps for the iphone, or any for that matter, doesnt mean there wouldnt be if flash was on the iphone.

Droid is gaining marketshare, and I for one hope they start to keep apple honest. So far they have, IE now the iphone gets features it would have never had like multitasking. Remember when jobs put the smack down on multitasking?

The only thing that appealed to me about the iphone was the community, not the community of apple fanboys, but community of developers. iphone had the best apps, that is no longer true and I certainty have no loyalty to apple and i bet millions of people feel the same way. Many people use iphone because it was the most popular, its slowly fading away now.

Once not having flash hurts the bottom line, jobs will tell you how great it is.

Also im pretty sure some maemo nokia phones have had flash since 2007.

 

[silverpig]

I have to agree. I also disagree with the argument that apple is denying flash compatibility because they want to dominate the app store by keeping it closed. I can't say that's not true, but I would love to see anyone link ANY flash applications or games that come close to the quality of any of the popular ones on the app store. Now compare that number to the thousands of high quality useful apps the app store has.

Why do you want flash again?

Ever been to armorgames.com? There's some fantastic timewasters on there that are free.

 

[silverpig]

html5 rocks anyways.

 

[silverpig]

and how doyou know its flash's fault for a crash in safari?

Chrome usually gives me the "the flash plugin crashed 🙁" message a few times a week. Chrome stays up, OSX stays up, but the flash plugin crashes fairly often.

 

[Kaido]

Flash crashes my Apple browsers, but on my PC's it usually just chokes the system. Sometimes it crashes but not as much as on Mac. CPU killah.

 

[Hail The Brain Slug]

Ever been to armorgames.com? There's some fantastic timewasters on there that are free.

You, sir, are correct. I have spent lots of time on Armor Games (Woo bubble tanks). But when you compare the quantity of quality flash content to the quantity of quality apps for the iPhone, there's no comparison. Whether or not that would change if iPhone supported flash, we'll never know.

 

[alfa147x]

and how doyou know its flash's fault for a crash in safari?

Well one you check the logs and it only when a flash intensive website is launched. Also I'v been having the same problems with chrome which points out that flash is at fault.


Honestly Adobe can't say shit till they have something out for the android market, ATM they don't have shit to back ANY of their statements. I for DO NOT want flash on anything. I'm getting to the point where I would be glad to uninstall flash. I don't need it. HTML5 works well enough if not better.

Adobe doesn't have a case when it comes to mobile.

 

[alfa147x]

You, sir, are correct. I have spent lots of time on Armor Games (Woo bubble tanks). But when you compare the quantity of quality flash content to the quantity of quality apps for the iPhone, there's no comparison. Whether or not that would change if iPhone supported flash, we'll never know.

The thing I don't understand is that a lot of flash based games use the keyboard, how do you get that to work on a touch based device like the droid, iphone, ect. ?

Adobe is clearly loosing this battle

 

[alfa147x]

Sorry, but the iPad's lack of Flash is a deal killer for me. There are just too many online video sites out there (like Hulu, and about a billion porn sites) that require Flash to run, not to mention all of the greeting card sites and Facebook games that also require Flash.

I'm sure that Steve will eventually break down and support Flash in the distant future (Like he did with Cut and Paste, MMS, finally releasing a multi-button mouse for the Mac, etc) but I'll stick with a netbook or perhaps a tablet from another vendor until then.

haha that's sad that your are comparing a closed system (flash) to cut and past. I hope flash never takes off in any sort of mobile market, forcing people to use more open standards such as HTML5.

 

[Hail The Brain Slug]

haha that's sad that your are comparing a closed system (flash) to cut and past. I hope flash never takes off in any sort of mobile market, forcing people to use more open standards such as HTML5.

Three things could happen.

1) Flash is released on Android phones, everyone realizes it sucks, is slow, drains battery life, and doesn't offer anything worthwhile beyond what the app store already offers.

2) Flash is released on Android phones, is implemented well, but just serves to "complete" the web experience and never really offers anything more than it currently does

3) Flash is released on Android phones, is praised as the second coming of Jesus, never slows down, doesn't affect battery life, and suddenly everyone realizes they were all wrong about the app store model.

Which one do you think is more likely?