Jane Fonda - Poll - Forgive or Traitor

[TastesLikeChicken]

Originally posted by: kage69

I take it your subscription to the whiner's club has been renewed for the year?

You come into a Jane Fonda thread whining about Kerry and his past and I'm whining? :laugh: Another Passions in the making I see...

Since they both have similariies in traitorous behaviour, and were known to be buddies during the Vietnam war it was more than appropriate to discuss Kerry as well. No whining was required at all. It was a natural follow-on.

Of course, the slanted ones who predominate this particular forum will undoubtedly not see it that way. Fortunately, I really don't GaS whether they do or not.

 

[Harvey]

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
So is it Jane's buddy Kerry's turn to admit he was wrong too?

About what? He was right about Viet Nam. Our leaders lied to us about why we were there and what we were doing, and some of our troops were the bad guys.

Are you even old enough to really know, let alone remember what happened?

Originally posted by: jjones
Treason. Although charges were never brought against her, the interpretation of "giving aid and comfort to the enemy" could have easily been used in a case against her.

Speaking the truth is not treason. You're so full of sh8, my ass is jealous.

Same question I asked TastesLikeChicken -- Are you even old enough to really know, let alone remember what happened?

Originally posted by: Gravity
Once a feminist.....

She can stand and remain proud of it. 😎

 

[TastesLikeChicken]

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
So is it Jane's buddy Kerry's turn to admit he was wrong too?

About what? He was right about Viet Nam. Our leaders lied to us about why we were there and what we were doing, and some of our troops were the bad guys.

Are you even old enough to really know, let alone remember what happened?

As a matter of fact, yes, I am old enough, which gives me an advantage over a lot of the posters in here who weren't even alive during the period of the Vietnam war and some who weren't even around in the 70s. So much of what's going on today is an exact mirror image of what went on then, when I was on the other side of the idealistic coin that I am now. Time changes things and you learn some things along the way. I learned that the liberal idealism of the 60s was nothing more than that in reality. It was purely ideals and little else and that neither side behaves any better than the other when you get right down to it.

How about you?

 

[kage69]

Of course, the slanted ones who predominate this particular forum will undoubtedly not see it that way. Fortunately, I really don't GaS whether they do or not.

Speaking of sh!t, no one gives a sh!t about the axe you have to grind with Kerry. The threads topic is Jane Fonda, not John Kerry. If you really feel the need, go start your own thread ripping on him. I'm sure it will be loaded up with other PassionateChickens in minutes and you can all feel important and smart casting scorn upon a person who no longer matters on the political playing field.

and that neither side behaves any better than the other when you get right down to it.

I used to think this as well, but the recent Terri Schaivo debacle has me reconsidering that position (as if the unscrupulous behavior of this admin wasn't enough).

 

[TastesLikeChicken]

Originally posted by: kage69

Of course, the slanted ones who predominate this particular forum will undoubtedly not see it that way. Fortunately, I really don't GaS whether they do or not.

Speaking of sh!t, no one gives a sh!t about the axe you have to grind with Kerry. The threads topic is Jane Fonda, not John Kerry. If you really feel the need, go start your own thread ripping on him. I'm sure it will be loaded up with other PassionateChickens in minutes and you can all feel important and smart casting scorn upon a person who no longer matters on the political playing field.

This thread also has to do with traitorous behavior as well as Jane Fonda, so Kerry is directly relevant to it, like it or not. If you don't like me ripping on him, then ignore my responses.

and that neither side behaves any better than the other when you get right down to it.

I used to think this as well, but the recent Terri Schaivo debacle has me reconsidering that position (as if the unscrupulous behavior of this admin wasn't enough).

Erm, this thread is about Jane Fonda, not Terry Shaivo. Right?

😛

 

[kage69]

This thread also has to do with traitorous behavior as well as Jane Fonda, so Kerry is directly relevant to it, like it or not. If you don't like me ripping on him, then ignore my responses.

No, despite the insinuating title, the "traitorous behavior" is in contention (hence the choice, 'She did not do anything wrong,' and the fact she hasn't been convicted of anything). Kerry is not mentioned at all, and shouldn't even enter into the discussion concerning Fonda's actions as he is not responsible in any way for her behavior. You may think the two are closely linked and feel the need to espouse on it, fine, go start a thread on it. I do ignore responses I don't like, but I don't think it's an unreasonable expectation to keep on topic.

Erm, this thread is about Jane Fonda, not Terry Shaivo. Right?

Correct, I couldn't help myself on this one, felt it was noteworthy as I kinda agreed with you but had to provide why my position has changed. I suppose it's no more thread-worthy than

So you admit their behaviour is sour grapes over Clinton?

This thread is about Jane Fonda, not Bill Clinton. Right? 😉

 

[Harvey]

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
So is it Jane's buddy Kerry's turn to admit he was wrong too?

About what? He was right about Viet Nam. Our leaders lied to us about why we were there and what we were doing, and some of our troops were the bad guys.

Are you even old enough to really know, let alone remember what happened?

As a matter of fact, yes, I am old enough, which gives me an advantage over a lot of the posters in here who weren't even alive during the period of the Vietnam war and some who weren't even around in the 70s. So much of what's going on today is an exact mirror image of what went on then, when I was on the other side of the idealistic coin that I am now. Time changes things and you learn some things along the way. I learned that the liberal idealism of the 60s was nothing more than that in reality. It was purely ideals and little else and that neither side behaves any better than the other when you get right down to it.

How about you?

Yep. I'm 63, and my six year commitment to my Army Reserve Signal Corps unit was up a few months before the unit called up for 'Nam. Lucky me. 😎

I was a younger idealist, then, and I celebrated the day Nixon resigned. As you said, what's going on, today, is an exact mirror of what went on, then. The entire administration, from the President on down, lied to the American people about why we were engaged in a bloody, costly war. They've also lied to us about how they've sold out the American economy to the highest bidders.

I'm an older idealist, now. That doesn't mean I'm stupid. It just means that I still have some threadbare hope we can find a peaceful way to get rid of the criminals in the the Whitehouse and pull this nation out of the economic and moral pit of stupidity they have created. 🙁

 

[TastesLikeChicken]

Originally posted by: kage69

This thread also has to do with traitorous behavior as well as Jane Fonda, so Kerry is directly relevant to it, like it or not. If you don't like me ripping on him, then ignore my responses.

No, despite the insinuating title, the "traitorous behavior" is in contention (hence the choice, 'She did not do anything wrong,' and the fact she hasn't been convicted of anything). Kerry is not mentioned at all, and shouldn't even enter into the discussion concerning Fonda's actions as he is not responsible in any way for her behavior. You may think the two are closely linked and feel the need to espouse on it, fine, go start a thread on it. I do ignore responses I don't like, but I don't think it's an unreasonable expectation to keep on topic.

So I assume after berating me for straying from the "topic" even though it was tangental, you'll next be focusing your apparent lividness on the folks in this thread who brought up Ted Turner, Roger Vadim, Sean Hannity, Roger McNamara, Lyndon Johnson, and John O'Neil?

Or is it just me you seem to have a problem with?

Erm, this thread is about Jane Fonda, not Terry Shaivo. Right?

Correct, I couldn't help myself on this one, felt it was noteworthy as I kinda agreed with you but had to provide why my position has changed. I suppose it's no more thread-worthy than

So you admit their behaviour is sour grapes over Clinton?

This thread is about Jane Fonda, not Bill Clinton. Right? 😉

Why should I care? I'm not the one bitching about one speciic person supposedly being off-topic, am I? 😉

 

[murban135]

From Snopes:

During a 1972 trip to North Vietnam, Jane Fonda propagandized on behalf of the North Vietnamese government, declared that American POWs were being treated humanely and condemned U.S. soldiers as "war criminals" and later denounced them as liars for claiming they had been tortured: True.


She has not apologized for any of this, only for sitting on the anti-aircraft gun. She betrayed our solders during a time of war. That makes her a traitor in my book. Not forgiven.

 

[Steeplerot]

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
So is it Jane's buddy Kerry's turn to admit he was wrong too?

About what? He was right about Viet Nam. Our leaders lied to us about why we were there and what we were doing, and some of our troops were the bad guys.

Are you even old enough to really know, let alone remember what happened?

As a matter of fact, yes, I am old enough, which gives me an advantage over a lot of the posters in here who weren't even alive during the period of the Vietnam war and some who weren't even around in the 70s. So much of what's going on today is an exact mirror image of what went on then, when I was on the other side of the idealistic coin that I am now. Time changes things and you learn some things along the way. I learned that the liberal idealism of the 60s was nothing more than that in reality. It was purely ideals and little else and that neither side behaves any better than the other when you get right down to it.

How about you?

In other words he was a fair weather lefty becasue it was a fad back then.
I still hear the stories of these people that overran san francisco in '68 before getting crabs and going home to mommy in the 'burbs to later become yuppies and other disgruntled sorts who went on to worship raygun, money, and themselves becasue the hot hippie chick told them they were square or something. -in other words the earliest neocons.

 

[Proletariat]

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
So is it Jane's buddy Kerry's turn to admit he was wrong too?

About what? He was right about Viet Nam. Our leaders lied to us about why we were there and what we were doing, and some of our troops were the bad guys.

Are you even old enough to really know, let alone remember what happened?

As a matter of fact, yes, I am old enough, which gives me an advantage over a lot of the posters in here who weren't even alive during the period of the Vietnam war and some who weren't even around in the 70s. So much of what's going on today is an exact mirror image of what went on then, when I was on the other side of the idealistic coin that I am now. Time changes things and you learn some things along the way. I learned that the liberal idealism of the 60s was nothing more than that in reality. It was purely ideals and little else and that neither side behaves any better than the other when you get right down to it.

How about you?

So the 60's changed nothing? What kind of warped world are you living in man. What is wrong with you?

Don't you remember JFK, RFK, Malcolm X or MLK? Don't you remember the Civil Rights movement? Selma? Chicago? I mean it was an amazing time to be alive.

Did some fine hippy chick deny you sex or something?

 

[jjones]

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: jjones
Treason. Although charges were never brought against her, the interpretation of "giving aid and comfort to the enemy" could have easily been used in a case against her.

Speaking the truth is not treason. You're so full of sh8, my ass is jealous.

You asked for facts and I gave you a fact. Speaking the truth is a protected right, but not aiding the enemy in propaganda you ignorant fsck.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: jjones

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: jjones
Treason. Although charges were never brought against her, the interpretation of "giving aid and comfort to the enemy" could have easily been used in a case against her.

Speaking the truth is not treason. You're so full of sh8, my ass is jealous.

You asked for facts and I gave you a fact. Speaking the truth is a protected right, but not aiding the enemy in propoganda you ignorant fsck.

Well if it had actually been a legal and just war she might have been prosecuted. But then if it had been a just war she might not have felt the need to go there in the first place.

Personally I think it was wrong of her as it hurt the soldiers more than it did the assholes that sent them over there to die. Hell if Ike (or was it Truman) had played his cards right and not backed the Imperialist French, Ho Chi Minh probably would have aligned himself with us instead of the Soviets.

 

[kage69]

Why should I care? I'm not the one bitching about one speciic person supposedly being off-topic, am I?

Because me responding to your post is no different than you responding to his. The specific person in this case just happened to be the first one in the thread to bring up something irrelevent, it ain't my fault 😉

 

[Proletariat]

Jane Fonda also did a lot of good things.

1) She backed the Native American and African American Civil Rights movement.

2) She exposed the American strategy of bombing dykes.

3) She started a campaign against female genital mutilation.

She sounds like a fine woman to me. She has apologized for the AA gun incident, and thats good enough for me.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Originally posted by: jjones

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: jjones
Treason. Although charges were never brought against her, the interpretation of "giving aid and comfort to the enemy" could have easily been used in a case against her.

Speaking the truth is not treason. You're so full of sh8, my ass is jealous.

You asked for facts and I gave you a fact. Speaking the truth is a protected right, but not aiding the enemy in propaganda you ignorant fsck.

:thumbsup:

There are statements from the NV leaders indicating that the negatvie propaganda that she and others like her were spewing gave them hope that they could win politically when they new that they could not win militarily.

 

[Steeplerot]

Originally posted by: EagleKeeper

Originally posted by: jjones

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: jjones
Treason. Although charges were never brought against her, the interpretation of "giving aid and comfort to the enemy" could have easily been used in a case against her.

Speaking the truth is not treason. You're so full of sh8, my ass is jealous.

You asked for facts and I gave you a fact. Speaking the truth is a protected right, but not aiding the enemy in propaganda you ignorant fsck.

:thumbsup:

There aerrstatements from the NV leaders indicating that the negatvie propaganda that she and others like her were spewing gave them hope that they could win politically when they new that they could not win militarily.

or so says the same liars who sent all those men off to die in southeast asia......... :roll:

 

[MCWAR]

posted by Steeplerot
Quote:
In other words he was a fair weather lefty becasue it was a fad back then
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

probably just grew up and became a little wiser to the lefty propaganda.

 

[Steeplerot]

Originally posted by: MCWAR
posted by Steeplerot
Quote:
In other words he was a fair weather lefty becasue it was a fad back then
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

probably just grew up and became a little wiser to the lefty propaganda.

not quite, more like another shill, just like a modern right winger.
they had a name back then for tight-assed boring people rushing to be old and sell out.
s-q-u-a-r-e

 

[daniel1113]

I thought Hanoi Jane had gone away forever, but it looks like we'll have to put up with her for a while more. Sigh.

When will the idiots of the world come to realize that the best coarse of action for their lives is to merely sit down and shut up?

 

[Steeplerot]

Originally posted by: daniel1113

When will the idiots of the world come to realize that the best coarse of action for their lives is to merely sit down and shut up?

spoken like a true fascist. you do the flag proud son. /sarcasm

 

[daniel1113]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot

Originally posted by: daniel1113

When will the idiots of the world come to realize that the best coarse of action for their lives is to merely sit down and shut up?

spoken like a true fascist. you do the flag proud son. /sarcasm

?

I never said she couldn't keep opening her mouth, but she is just hurting herself. It's the same with every idiot out there.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: daniel1113
I thought Hanoi Jane had gone away forever, but it looks like we'll have to put up with her for a while more. Sigh.

When will the idiots of the world come to realize that the best coarse of action for their lives is to merely sit down and shut up?

Yeah especially her. There are those who hate her just for the sake of hating her and by coming out publicly all she is doing is giving those wankers a reason to start spouting off again.

The only ones who have a legitimate reason to spout hatred towards her are those who were affected

 

[Steeplerot]

hurting who? you?
how did she hurt herself? She was brave to go and try to make a point.
the only thing she is hurting is your warped view of the war.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: daniel1113
I thought Hanoi Jane had gone away forever, but it looks like we'll have to put up with her for a while more. Sigh.

When will the idiots of the world come to realize that the best coarse of action for their lives is to merely sit down and shut up?

Yeah especially her. There are those who hate her just for the sake of hating her and by coming out publicly all she is doing is giving those wankers a reason to start spouting off again.

The only ones who have a legitimate reason to spout hatred towards her are those who were affected

Amd the lefty libby communists will state that she did not affect anyone, only spouting the truth.

"POWs were being treated properly and no torture existed." = Oceanfront property in AZ w/ the Golden Gate in free. (as the song goes)