Discussion ITT: We predict how low the price floor on 120GB/128GB SSD drops

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cbn

cbn

Lifer
Mar 27, 2009
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SimplyComplex said:
I really think Patriot is the most random ssd seller I've ever seen. Some of their drives are complete crap(and always have been, dating back to 2011 or longer). Some of them are pretty solid mid-range that are both a good value, and highly reliable. They're not Plextor or Intel(consistently HQ), but not OCZ and Corsair(consistently buggy and unreliable).

I guess Patriot is how you play the lottery with ssds.
Click to expand...

I thought Corsair always used the (good quality) Phison reference design for their SSDs?
 
hojnikb

hojnikb

Senior member
Sep 18, 2014
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Almost everyone uses reference designs, but that doesn't help you if firmware is bugged from the manufactuer to begin with.
 
cbn

cbn

Lifer
Mar 27, 2009
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Now the 3D TLC version is on sale for $19.99 Free shipping:

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820331047

20-331-047_R01.jpg
 
cbn

cbn

Lifer
Mar 27, 2009
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VirtualLarry said:
Edit: And I know that this thread is specifically about 120GB-class drives, but they do offer the 240GB version for $37.99, seems like a better price/GB, and probably offers better performance as well.

I've largely stopped buying 120GB drives. They're small enough, that most people want a HDD besides, to store a little data on. Stepping up to the 240GB size, well, that's nearly big enough to fit downloads, and a game or two on, so there's far less need for most people (enthusiasts with a big Steam catalog excluded here) to also need a HDD installed.
Click to expand...

We should probably have a thread specifically for 240/256GB SSD as well.....especially as this is the limit for AMD StoreMI (without buying the FuzeDrive Pro licence which expands fast tier to 1TB)

Also something further to think about for both 120/128GB and 240/256GB is the impact of NVDIMM-P (which likely carry smaller amounts of more premium based NANDs* such as Toshiba XL NAND. The lower latency of DIMM form factor will allow these more premium NANDs* to perform faster than they would if limited to NVMe).

*And 3DXpoint
 
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cbn

cbn

Lifer
Mar 27, 2009
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The 240GB version of the Team Group L5 3D LITE (posted here at 120GB capacity for $19.99 FS) is $34.99 FS and according to this review has the SM2258G controller with DRAM buffer.

I wonder if the $19.99 FS 120GB Team Group L5 3D LITE also has DRAM buffer?

P.S. Speaking of 120/128GB vs. 240/256GB, I wonder how much difference between the two capacities when used as fast tier with StoreMI?
 
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cbn

cbn

Lifer
Mar 27, 2009
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SimplyComplex

SimplyComplex

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Jul 4, 2009
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cbn said:
I thought Corsair always used the (good quality) Phison reference design for their SSDs?
Click to expand...
During the whole 2011-2012 Sandforce fiasco, Corsair had the second worst problems after OCZ. Mushkin was using the exact same base Sandforce controller, but they requested a slightly modified SF, and put some custom controls in place and had by far the lowest failure rate of any of the companies selling Sandforce ssds. Corsair's solution was... nothing. Just use stock Sandforce and RMA all of the failures. Even a year into that mess Corsair was just like "What problems? This is completely fine!".

Maybe Corsair fixed things after that, but I lost all interest in Corsair ssds when they had something like a 25% failure rate and did nothing about it.
 
cbn

cbn

Lifer
Mar 27, 2009
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HP M700 (dram-less, planar MLC) 120GB SATA 2.5" SSD is $20.99 free shipping on Newegg ebay store:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/HP-M700-2-...e:g:aKQAAOSwUn9aHW8O:rk:1:pf:1&frcectupt=true

This one peaks my interest because it has a 5 year warranty and a 70TB TBW rating (which is 30TB better TBW than the 120GB Crucial BX500 which uses 3D TLC NAND).

The 4K QD1 read looks good according to this review as well:

https://techplayboy.com/47822/hp-ssd-m700-solid-state-drive-review/6/

CrystalDiskMark-HP-SSD-M700-240GB.png


P.S. 240GB version of the drive (with 145TB TBW) is available for $30.99 free shipping on Newegg ebay store---> https://www.ebay.com/itm/HP-M700-2-...b:g:yTwAAOSwa3BaFDNg:rk:4:pf:1&frcectupt=true
 
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cbn

cbn

Lifer
Mar 27, 2009
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With a single ONFI 4.0 channel capable of 800 MB/s (and ONFI 4.1 even higher) I wonder if we might see an upcoming dram-less SATA controller that is single channel?

Perhaps such a controller could even be used for USB sticks? And SSHD?

With this noted, I also hope we see an evolution of the Phison S11 (ie, dual channel design with generous SRAM).
 
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VirtualLarry

VirtualLarry

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Aug 25, 2001
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Now that the effectively-$20 barrier has been broken, how low will they plunge? Will we see $15.99 for some? $14.99? For a 120GB? At what point, will they simply phase them out, like 8GB flash drives these days? I think that point is close, but with one caveat. There are older (BIOS) desktop PCs, that are limited to less than 128GB worth of HDD, either via BIOS or OS limitations. For them, the 120/128GB sizes are more-or-less perfect. (Using a SATA-to-IDE converter, perhaps.) For that reason, they might linger longer.

But there's no excuse for building budget rigs, and not throwing in a 120GB SSD for an OS drive, at least for browser boxes.

I look forward to "the plunge".

(Next up, 240/256GB SATA SSDs, for less than $29.99? Do I hear $28.99, then $26.99, then $25.99, then $24.99?)
 
VirtualLarry

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
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cbn said:
That is the cheapest SSD with the Phison S11 (a very good DRAM-less SATA controller).

TBW is 40TB......not bad!
Click to expand...

For way of comparison, my CDI for my Adata SP550 240GB, total host read/writes, 7755/9175GB, total NAND writes 7310GB (less NAND writes than host writes, interesting), and 2048 POH. (Which doesn't make much sense, the companion HDD in the system has 4x that.) Says approx. 85 days POH.

So, my TBW is around 7.3TB, after 85 days. So 21TBW / year? So that A400 120GB would last me only two years? Hmm. But I need more than 120GB of space anyways, so maybe double that TBW for the 240GB? So four years of usage?
 
cbn

cbn

Lifer
Mar 27, 2009
12,968
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VirtualLarry said:
For way of comparison, my CDI for my Adata SP550 240GB, total host read/writes, 7755/9175GB, total NAND writes 7310GB (less NAND writes than host writes, interesting), and 2048 POH. (Which doesn't make much sense, the companion HDD in the system has 4x that.) Says approx. 85 days POH.

So, my TBW is around 7.3TB, after 85 days. So 21TBW / year? So that A400 120GB would last me only two years? Hmm. But I need more than 120GB of space anyways, so maybe double that TBW for the 240GB? So four years of usage?
Click to expand...

You are averaging 86GB writes per day.....so if you keep that up an SSD focused more on endurance would be a good idea!

With that mentioned, I am impressed that the 120GB Kingston A400 (Phison S11 with 15nm Toshiba TLC) has the same TBW as the 120GB Crucial BX500 (SM2258XT with Micron 3D TLC).
 
cbn

cbn

Lifer
Mar 27, 2009
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VirtualLarry said:
Now that the effectively-$20 barrier has been broken, how low will they plunge? Will we see $15.99 for some? $14.99? For a 120GB? At what point, will they simply phase them out, like 8GB flash drives these days?

(Next up, 240/256GB SATA SSDs, for less than $29.99? Do I hear $28.99, then $26.99, then $25.99, then $24.99?)
Click to expand...

I think prices for 120GB could drop as low as you have written (edit: Or maybe close to it) because the Patriot Flare 60GB (phison S11 with planar MLC) was on sale for $16.99 $17.99 FS off and on again before Newegg stopped stocking it.

Then after this will probably see the prices drop on the 240GB/250GB/256GB drives to where the 120GB is now (and will be in the future).


VirtualLarry said:
I think that point is close, but with one caveat. There are older (BIOS) desktop PCs, that are limited to less than 128GB worth of HDD, either via BIOS or OS limitations. For them, the 120/128GB sizes are more-or-less perfect. (Using a SATA-to-IDE converter, perhaps.) For that reason, they might linger longer.

But there's no excuse for building budget rigs, and not throwing in a 120GB SSD for an OS drive, at least for browser boxes.

I look forward to "the plunge".
Click to expand...

Another place where 120GB (and 240GB) is useful is AMD StoreMI.

Maybe in order to facilitate this QLC (or TLC) SSDs could be operated in a locked MLC or SLC mode? In this way a price floor 240GB QLC could be made into either a 120GB MLC drive or a 60GB SLC drive. Then a 240GB TLC drive could be made into a 80GB SLC drive, etc.

With this mentioned, there are already 3D TLC drives that more or less operate as small 3D SLC drives......but they don't yet offer a locked mode:

https://www.anandtech.com/show/13421/the-mushkin-source-sata-ssd-review/5

seq-fill-source-500.png


The Mushkin Source lasts a very long time before its SLC cache is filled. While the Toshiba TR200's write speed ends up in the gutter very quickly, it will be almost impossible for a real-world consumer workload to fill the cache of the Source unless the drive starts out nearly full. From an empty drive, the apparent initial SLC cache size is well over 150GB—essentially the entire drive operating as SLC until free space runs out.
Click to expand...
 
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cbn

cbn

Lifer
Mar 27, 2009
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1.) Silicon Power S55 240GB is now $28.99 FS:

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820301366

It has Phison S10 and 15nm Toshiba TLC:

http://www.madshrimps.be/articles/article/1000872/Silicon-Power-S55-TLC-120GB-and-240GB-SSD-Review/3

(This is the lowest I have seen 240GB so far. Originally posted by Virtual Larry here)

2.) MydigitalSSD has a new 128GB NVMe SSD called SBXe coming:


https://mydigitalssd.com/pcie-m2-ngff-ssd.php

270x270-80mm-sbxe-pcie.png


It uses Phison E8T (ie, the dram-less version of Phison E8) with TLC NAND. I think it might be planar because it doesn't say 3D TLC like SBX and BPX Pro do.

SBXe 120GB model has 80 TBW vs. SBX 128GB model with 120 TBW.

(So this will be lower cost compared to the 128GB SBX (which has the Phison S8 with dram- buffer).
 
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Glaring_Mistake

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Mar 2, 2015
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cbn said:
1.) Silicon Power S55 240GB is now $28.99 FS:

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820301366

It has Phison S10 and 15nm Toshiba TLC:

http://www.madshrimps.be/articles/article/1000872/Silicon-Power-S55-TLC-120GB-and-240GB-SSD-Review/3

(This is the lowest I have seen 240GB so far. Originally posted by Virtual Larry here)
Click to expand...

Know it's a bit late but Silicon Power uses whatever controller/NAND that is cheapest so you can't really be sure of what's going to be inside the drive short of opening it up.
A bit unusual to go with Phison S10 though even if it does seem well suited for use with 15nm TLC NAND.
 
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mopardude87

mopardude87

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Oct 22, 2018
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Just maybe i could get my buddy who refuses to replace his 2009 based 80gb boot drive with a 120gb ssd.The guy went from a barely usable C2D with 2gb of ram to a gaming desktop with a i5 4460/8gb with a gtx660. He should have the ssd too.

He only plays GTA V and yeah load times on the 160gb spare drive are wow.A $22 120gb Kingston A400 looks perfect for a boot up drive+ GTA V. I cringe when i think i paid $250 for a 60gb ssd years ago.

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?reviews=all&item=0D9-001B-00164 Wow look how cheap this 960gb is $123.75! We should have a 900-1tb price watch thread given how cheap this one is.Is this even the cheapest?
 
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