It seems to me that LCD TV's make more sense

[desura]

LED/LCD televisions have improved enough in picture quality compared to plasma's, they probably are

-- at least like 85% of a plasma' PQ

-- better 3d if you care about it. Can support passive 3d glasses instead of active 3d

-- significantly better reliability

-- significantly lower power consumption and heat.

 

[Wingznut]

they probably are

-- at least like 85% of a plasma' PQ

This is supposed to convince me that LED is a better purchase?

 

[olds]

You should always buy what suits you better.
For me, at this time, it's plasma.

 

[tential]

LED/LCD televisions have improved enough in picture quality compared to plasma's, they probably are

-- at least like 85% of a plasma' PQ

-- better 3d if you care about it. Can support passive 3d glasses instead of active 3d

-- significantly better reliability

-- significantly lower power consumption and heat.

To YOU it's 85% PQ. I'm a proud owner of an LED HDTV. I LOVE my 70 inch Sharp display. But there is no denying that the PQ of the plasma's destroy it. It's not even a contest, it's night and day.

I'm not sure what the point of the thread is. People who want the best PQ will pick plasma. Those who want bright displays, large displays, will pick LED. I wanted BIG over best PQ so I chose my 70 inch LED.

I recently looked at plasma's vs LEDs in bestbuy (which is a bad setting to even look at displays in the first place) and still will never get over how good Plasma's looked and the great black levels. The average consumer? Will be happy with LED HDTV. A PQ enthusiast though? They'll take Plasma everyday and rightfully so.

Like the above poster said, buy what suits you. When Plasma (Well I guess it's done so now OLED), gets to 70+ inches at reasonable prices then count me in. For now though, I just can't go below 70+ inches as my display size.

 

[Pacfanweb]

^Good points.

However, I think that many people aren't satisfied with just "my LCD look good enough for me".

These people want to go post and ask and get reassurance that they got a good TV.

But it doesn't matter.....get the one YOU like, I tell folks.

The answer right now for "Best picture quality, period (that is actually available)" is, Plasma. Period, end of story.

There are a few LCD's that get close now. Real close. But they cost a lot more.

OLED is "the" best...but AFAIK, you can't actually buy one right now....and the price is ridiculous, as any new tech is.

If you are happy with a 1500 dollar 70" Vizio, that's great, folks. You don't need to go on forums and ask people if your TV is a good one. If you like it, that's all the matters.

Now if you want to know what 70" LCD between 1500-2000 bucks is the best, now THEN we can start doing some comparing.

 

[ImpulsE69]

I think the biggest problem is most have never seen a properly calibrated plasma. I know I never have. I've yet to see one that remotely looked as good as the good LCDS although lots of internet people tell me otherwise. When dropping that kind of cash, I prefer to see what I'm getting before...not buy it then pay someone 300 to come make it look right...which is something I've NEVER understood regarding a digital display(both plasma and LCD).

Too bad our showrooms are dwindling...although given the above, then whats the point of them if apparently they aren't doing their jobs anyway? Eventually it will all be a "guess and pray"

 

[poofyhairguy]

First of all OP, I don't get the reliability thing. Many people have Kuro's to this day, and Panasonic Plasmas had long lives and high dependability ratings. I think, just like LCD/LED, it depends on manufacturer.

Secondly I take issue with your 85% of picture quality.

Sure, the nicest LEDs have 85%+ the picture quality of a mid-level plasma. But so what, that is like twice the price. It is about value.

A LED that is the same cost as a plasma is more like 70% of the quality or worse especially during nighttime viewing. Why get less value if you are a mid-range customer (plasma's sweet spot)?

I purchased a mid-range 60 inch Panasonic Plasma a few months ago before they went away, and for what I paid it will be YEARS until anyone can offer that kind of picture quality at that price point. Especially if LG and Samsung give up on plasma before they reach Panasonic's black-levels at comparable tiers.

Sad time to be a TV consumer. OLED can't drop in price fast enough....

 

[Wingznut]

I think the biggest problem is most have never seen a properly calibrated plasma.

I have had my Panny plasma for nearly a year now, prior to that I had a budget Samsung plasma (which wasn't all that impressive.) Until a few months ago, I just use the auto THX calibration feature on my Panny, and was very happy with that.

I found some threads on AVForums with their custom calibrations and figured I'd give it a shot. I copied a few that I found, found one I really liked, and then made a couple small tweaks of my own. It's like having a new TV! Even my wife and son could tell the difference, and that's really saying something.

So yeah, you're right. Properly calibrated at home looks exponentially different than what you see in the stores.

 

[alcoholbob]

Aren't plasmas quite a bit heavier than LCDs? Also I think people have an impression that plasmas have image retention issues, true or untrue. Also all the large plasmas I've seen in big box stores had noisy fans, and I want as little ambient noise as possible from my screen, as I use it primarily for web browsing

 

[lamedude]

Now that Panasonic ship has sailed are Sammy/LG plasma's any good?

 

[Railgun]

Panasonic's plasma has nothing to do with Samsung's or LG's. They're the same quality with or without them.

Also, you can take the crappiest plasma compared to the best LCD and LCD will win. It all depends on the panels used.

As other's have said, I too am waiting for OLED to get its act together. As far as upcoming tech, that will wipe the floor with LCD.

That said, the best plasma will handily beat the best LCD, IMHO of course.

 

[MongGrel]

personally I've a couple very nice LCD's that are large, but I've seen Plasmas that look even better.

I still wouldn't sell em myself though, if my main large one ever goes in the future I'll go to a HTPC projector myself.

As far a weight he he my 47 inch LCD weighs a touch over 145 lbs, but it a tier3 big boy

 

[hans030390]

Aren't plasmas quite a bit heavier than LCDs? Also I think people have an impression that plasmas have image retention issues, true or untrue. Also all the large plasmas I've seen in big box stores had noisy fans, and I want as little ambient noise as possible from my screen, as I use it primarily for web browsing

Heavier, generally. I wouldn't want to move my 50" plasma around by myself. My 42" LED, on the other hand, is super light in comparison.

Image retention issues are largely minimized in modern plasma displays, it seems, but it's still a factor to consider over LCD depending on how you use the display (i.e. general usage not worth worrying about, but constant, static images might be different). The worst I've noticed is static UI elements in games that are retained for a very brief moment when transitioning to a black screen after a couple hours with those elements on the screen originally. Not an issue at all.

Plasmas I've had experience with tend to "buzz" but don't have much in the way of fan noises. A lot of people exchange out units until they get near silent ones (i.e. not able to hear in a normal sitting/viewing location). My Panasonic buzzes and can be heard from a few feet away, but it gets completely covered by ANY noise and seems to be getting quieter as time passes. I also mounted some cheap/simple material behind the display to diffuse and absorb sound waves.

My main complaint is that plasma displays look noisy/grainy up close compared to LCD, but it's not a factor from a normal viewing position. Power consumption is pretty poor...I've seen the TV draw ~150-200 watts.

But, calibrate the display, pop in a good Blu-Ray movie, and turn down the lights, and the overall picture quality is too good to worry about such minor negatives/differences relative to LCD.

 

[desura]

Well, my Panasonic plasma seems to have deteriorated pretty quickly, and worse it is out of the 1 year warranty period. The black levels aren't impressive at all anymore (or. Are they the same as they were?), there are random static-like pixels that pop up, like scattered red pixels against a blue sky, and I've spent a bit of time trying to troubleshoot it. Looking at the best buy showroom (can't locate a real showroom in area), yes, several lcds appear to have better blacks than the plasmas, and the plasmas appear to have the same black levels as my (damaged? Can't be sure) plasma tv.

 

[Zivic]

I think the biggest problem is most have never seen a properly calibrated plasma. I know I never have. I've yet to see one that remotely looked as good as the good LCDS although lots of internet people tell me otherwise. When dropping that kind of cash, I prefer to see what I'm getting before...not buy it then pay someone 300 to come make it look right...which is something I've NEVER understood regarding a digital display(both plasma and LCD).

With that mindset, go to the store, take the salesman's advice, buy whatever 'LED flat screen' fits your budget and looks the best at that given moment to your novice eyes.

for those of us that care about the PQ, we will get them calibrated and likely own pioneer or panasonic plasma displays

 

[Midwayman]

I seen LCDs that are good, but nothing approaching plasma's 'reach out and touch it real' level of picture. Even non believers would probably change their minds if they got a chance to see one side by side with a LCD with both calibrated and in a home like environment. Unfortunately in stores you get the worst environment possible for plasma and many times the stock calibration can be pretty bad (They try and match the bright, cool display of LCD)

 

[poofyhairguy]

Looking at the best buy showroom (can't locate a real showroom in area), yes, several lcds appear to have better blacks than the plasmas, and the plasmas appear to have the same black levels as my (damaged? Can't be sure) plasma tv.

Well yeah, that is because the show room is as bright as a golf course at noon if not brighter.

Unless you have the top models of plasma with AR coating the blacks don't always hold in bright viewing conditions. LED wins (well and one Samsung plasma) in some open concept bright room, I don't think anyone disagree there.

Of course when it comes to TVs, bright room viewing is ALWAYS nonoptimal. LED can do better but neither is prefered if you are serious about the content. With plasma though you are correct you really don't have a choice- its either curtains, always watch at night, or enjoy the washed out picture. I don't see that as a clear advantage to LEDs though, some of us like darker residences. I personally watch stuff mostly at night anyway.

In regards to issue with your plasma, take some pictures of the issues and post them here. It could be normal (plasmas look noisy up close) or it could be an issue. Google says you need to check/adjust your power supply voltages if you see red, green or blue dots showing up on the blacks.

If the blacks seem off even in dark room settings, you probably have some picture-destroying vibrant mode on. Find the CNET review for your model and plug in the settings given.

Darkroom viewing of blacks is the one place (along with motion resolution) where plasma clearly wins. If yours looks lighter than all but the BEST LEDs in a dark room (like the Sharp Elite) then the settings might be wrong.

 

[poofyhairguy]

Now that Panasonic ship has sailed are Sammy/LG plasma's any good?

Sammy's aren't bad. The top model is pretty good in a bright room.

 

[Pacfanweb]

Aren't plasmas quite a bit heavier than LCDs? Also I think people have an impression that plasmas have image retention issues, true or untrue. Also all the large plasmas I've seen in big box stores had noisy fans, and I want as little ambient noise as possible from my screen, as I use it primarily for web browsing

If 20-30lbs more is "quite a bit heavier", then yeah, I guess they are.

As far as "noisy fans in big box stores"...first off, if you can hear a fan in Best Buy, then it's bad.

Also remember that those TV's pretty much are on all day until closing. No telling how many hours they have.

 

[Pacfanweb]

Sammy's aren't bad. The top model is pretty good in a bright room.

The top Sammy last year was almost dead-even with the Panasonic.

Really, only the reviewers were putting the Panny on top, because of the slightly better black levels, and those guys are obsessed with blacks.

I can tell you that the Samsung F8500 won last year's Value Electronics Shootout over Panasonic.

CNET was there, and they said people liked the brightness and whiter whites of the Samsun, and better contrast, over the blacks of the ZT60, even though CNET and the other "experts" themselves still chose the Panasonic.

Now this was after seeing them in a controlled lighting environment, side-by-side, which pretty much nobody gets the chance to do.

So regardless of which one was "best"....they were basically too close to call it.

 

[DownTheSky]

Really, only the reviewers were putting the Panny on top, because of the slightly better black levels, and those guys are obsessed with blacks.

I can tell you that the Samsung F8500 won last year's Value Electronics Shootout over Panasonic.

I saw them side by side and liked the brighter picture of the Samsung better too.

On another note:
I have the opportunity to buy a Panasonic TX-32X60B very cheap ~350euro. Should I go for it? I wasn't overly impressed from viewing it in the showroom.

 

[olds]

Aren't plasmas quite a bit heavier than LCDs? ...

I solved the weight problem by putting my 60" plasma on a stand instead of my lap.

 

[ImpulsE69]

I solved the weight problem by putting my 60" plasma on a stand instead of my lap.

Don't you lose the immersion factor when you do that?

 

[alcoholbob]

If 20-30lbs more is "quite a bit heavier", then yeah, I guess they are.

As far as "noisy fans in big box stores"...first off, if you can hear a fan in Best Buy, then it's bad.

Also remember that those TV's pretty much are on all day until closing. No telling how many hours they have.

Seeing as I use a 70" screen, I'm betting it's more then 20-30lbs more...if there's even a 70" plasma on the market right now.

 

[alcoholbob]

I solved the weight problem by putting my 60" plasma on a stand instead of my lap.

Well aren't a you a strong lad. I needed help with my 70" LCD, can't imagine what it's like to strong-arm a 60" plasma by yourself. Do you do 1 finger pushups as well?