Israeli firm says costs too high on Iran strike

[Lemon law]

I can understand why EK thinks an Israeli strike against Iran would be pain free for Israel.
If your rose colored glasses are tinted a deep enough shade of red, one cannot see a single downside.

But here is what the rest of the world is saying, take for example---------

http://www.jpost.com/IranianThreat/News/Article.aspx?id=245549

Because in the grand scheme of things in the larger world, Iran is not very important and no one gives a damn about Israel. And when Israel already has nuclear weapons on the sneak, and Iran is still working with IAEA supervision, its exactly that thgreat of sending the entire mid-east into a downward spiral, that will shoot oil prices up through the roof, that terrifies the rest of the world.

And if Israel attacks Iran with the phony reason that they want to keep exploiting Palestinians forever, Israel will not be either popular or allowed to sustain itself if oil prices stay up more than a week.

Meanwhile all the big boys, the US, the EU, Russia, China, and India all have to get along.

So when the USA beats the sanctions button against Iran, they will all go partly along, pretend to be worried about Iran acquiring a nuke, but still nations like China and Russia will prevent the Iranian sanctions becoming too crushing. Especially China which is a major customer of Iranian oil.

But the world nightmare lies more in having Iran quit co-operating with the IAEA. And having Israel upsetting the apple cart in the mid-east. As the major risk of any Israeli attack, along with a sharp and sustained increase in oil prices, would be in the large risk of sending Iraq and Saudi Arabia into political revolution.

 

[Nebor]

You are in just in your own little world LL. Do you sit in a hookah smile filled room screaming about the Jews while a small TV is tuned to Al Jazeera, you hammer out these delusions on your keyboard and your pet monkey dances in the background? I bet you're the kind of guy that tells people there's no such thing as Israel when you meet them in real life. You just say it's still "Palestine."

I knew a guy like that. His family owned a tire store and they were all radical "Palestinians." He ended up going out to a ranch in South Texas and shooting an AK-47. The FBI video taped him doing this and charged him with a pile of weapon possession (he wasn't a US citizen) and terrorism related crimes. He's still in jail.

 

[Lemon law]

You are in just in your own little world LL. Do you sit in a hookah smile filled room screaming about the Jews while a small TV is tuned to Al Jazeera, you hammer out these delusions on your keyboard and your pet monkey dances in the background? I bet you're the kind of guy that tells people there's no such thing as Israel when you meet them in real life. You just say it's still "Palestine."

I knew a guy like that. His family owned a tire store and they were all radical "Palestinians." He ended up going out to a ranch in South Texas and shooting an AK-47. The FBI video taped him doing this and charged him with a pile of weapon possession (he wasn't a US citizen) and terrorism related crimes. He's still in jail.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Or we can talk about you Nebor, in your own little world in Afghanistan, you may not be in jail, you get all the guns you can shoot, but you are still making negative progress in Afghanistan. Which of you are more dangerous and delusional?

Or for that matter, a bigger drag on the US treasury. Nebor your type stinking thinking has cost to USA over 4 trillion so far and counting.

Maybe Nebor, you should start asking yourself some self worth questions. And ask why you are played for a sucker by war profiteers. The longer the war goes on, the more money they make.

 

[Nebor]

If you think anyone in the US military feels ashamed of the failure of Afghanistan, think again. We couldn't make cavemen into renaissance men. Oh well. You might as well mock me for being unable to lift a 3000lb boulder.

Also, I'm heavily invested in defense stocks. That was part of the initial discussion here on AT years ago when I first decided to join the Army.

 

[EagleKeeper]

I can understand why EK thinks an Israeli strike against Iran would be pain free for Israel.
If your rose colored glasses are tinted a deep enough shade of red, one cannot see a single downside.

But here is what the rest of the world is saying, take for example---------

http://www.jpost.com/IranianThreat/News/Article.aspx?id=245549

Because in the grand scheme of things in the larger world, Iran is not very important and no one gives a damn about Israel. And when Israel already has nuclear weapons on the sneak, and Iran is still working with IAEA supervision, its exactly that thgreat of sending the entire mid-east into a downward spiral, that will shoot oil prices up through the roof, that terrifies the rest of the world.

And if Israel attacks Iran with the phony reason that they want to keep exploiting Palestinians forever, Israel will not be either popular or allowed to sustain itself if oil prices stay up more than a week.

Meanwhile all the big boys, the US, the EU, Russia, China, and India all have to get along.

So when the USA beats the sanctions button against Iran, they will all go partly along, pretend to be worried about Iran acquiring a nuke, but still nations like China and Russia will prevent the Iranian sanctions becoming too crushing. Especially China which is a major customer of Iranian oil.

But the world nightmare lies more in having Iran quit co-operating with the IAEA. And having Israel upsetting the apple cart in the mid-east. As the major risk of any Israeli attack, along with a sharp and sustained increase in oil prices, would be in the large risk of sending Iraq and Saudi Arabia into political revolution.

Only you can tie Iranian nukes into the Palestinian issue:\

Iraq is already in a revolution - have you not paid attention over the past couple of years.

How is Saudi going to revolt if Israel strikes Iran; Iran is a threat to Saudi right now.

 

[EagleKeeper]

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Or we can talk about you Nebor, in your own little world in Afghanistan, you may not be in jail, you get all the guns you can shoot, but you are still making negative progress in Afghanistan. Which of you are more dangerous and delusional?

Or for that matter, a bigger drag on the US treasury. Nebor your type stinking thinking has cost to USA over 4 trillion so far and counting.

Maybe Nebor, you should start asking yourself some self worth questions. And ask why you are played for a sucker by war profiteers. The longer the war goes on, the more money they make.

Where does that money go? Purchase goods and labor - majority is US based. It is not printed and handed out to the company to bank.

No different than the liberal method of taxing people and handing out money to the lower 50% of taxpayers.

This time, the money is going to the upper 50% and they will pay taxes on it.

 

[airdata]

Anybody find it funny that they would hold off based on the cost of the operation? lol

 

[EagleKeeper]

Anybody find it funny that they would hold off based on the cost of the operation? lol

I think the article is about the after effects to the world, not the implementation of the strike itself.

The overall impact tot he economy may force the world to pursue other options an attempt to appease Israel. <dream on>

 

[Dari]

In one of the other threads, we went over what the attack capability Iran has against Israel.

There is no neighboring Arab nation state that wants to take on Israel.
There are terror groups that keep getting their asses handed to them by the IDF.

If you can find details on what attack capability that Iran has that would deter Israel, please identify it.

I can't discuss it in a public arena because of my background. But I will say this, Israel caught Iraq and Syria early and smashed their projects. In Iran's case, they're pleading for Western help. If you can't understand that then you simply don't understand how far Iran has gone and how much more powerful they are compared to the other Muslim states in the region. Israel cannot afford to attack Iran and that's the end of the story. For this they need the help of the big boys and those boys don't want to do it either because it could destabilize their economies. That Straight of Hormuz can be planted with so many bombs as to cause oil prices to skyrocket to $300-$400 dollars a barrel. They won't do it. The global economy is in the shitter and nobody has the heart to come to Israel's aid for Israel's local problem. One reason is because Israel is sooooooooooooooooo stubborn when it comes to the peace process. They want everything and want to give up nothing. So America and Europe says to Israel "Fuck you and your Iranian problem".

In short, Israel is going to have to live with an Iranian bomb. They can slow it down by sabotage and killing scientists but they cannot stop it. It's too late.

 

[Whiskey16]

I can't discuss it in a public arena because of my background. But I will say this, Israel caught Iraq and Syria early and smashed their projects. In Iran's case, they're pleading for Western help. If you can't understand that then you simply don't understand how far Iran has gone and how much more powerful they are compared to the other Muslim states in the region. Israel cannot afford to attack Iran and that's the end of the story. For this they need the help of the big boys and those boys don't want to do it either because it could destabilize their economies. That Straight of Hormuz can be planted with so many bombs as to cause oil prices to skyrocket to $300-$400 dollars a barrel. They won't do it. The global economy is in the shitter and nobody has the heart to come to Israel's aid for Israel's local problem. One reason is because Israel is sooooooooooooooooo stubborn when it comes to the peace process. They want everything and want to give up nothing. So America and Europe says to Israel "Fuck you and your Iranian problem".

In short, Israel is going to have to live with an Iranian bomb. They can slow it down by sabotage and killing scientists but they cannot stop it. It's too late.

This. Thank you.

In geographical distance and middling countries alone -- Iran ain't Iraq nor Syria. Nor is there a single target as with those past and proximal targets. Anyone such as JEDIYoda who believe Israel is some &#252;berwarrior capable of anything with a will behind it is totally nutters. Besides, desiring warfare and "violence" as JEDIYoda does, is nutters.

Israel is on its own -- out of its own ostracising making. Israel is now realising this more than ever. Its aggressive policies upon Gaza, the West Bank, East Jerusalem, and misguided bloody nose in Lebanon are cause. The Iran bluster is yet another smokescreen as a propaganda enabler to maintain a warfooting mindset among a sufficient portion of Israelis and foster continued avoidance of suitably settling its ongoing annexation of Palestine. Israel is digging its hole, and its relatively failing economy cannot affordably maintain this warfare minded status much longer. Time is running out for the aggravating illegal land grabs and Israel knows this.

 

[Nebor]

Everyone assumes that the Iranians can make it happen, when we have no proof that North Korea's bombs even work. All their tests have registered so small on measuring devices that they're considered a failure by every standard.

The concept is on wikipedia, but the manufacturing and assembly required to actually create a nuclear weapon may be well beyond the Iranians' capability.

 

[SamurAchzar]

Israel is digging its hole, and its relatively failing economy cannot affordably maintain this warfare minded status much longer

What failing economy are you talking about? 4.6&#37; growth in 2011, $32k GDP per capita (factoring in 25% of Arab citizens which drag the GDP down), one of the single countries with real estate getting stronger during the global recession years... you just pulled that out of your ass, right?

To me it sounds like you want your Palestinian buddies to win and the way to that goes through an Iranian nuke. What your tiny, minuscule mind will not grasp is that if Iran gets a nuke, suddenly 5 other Sunni states will get nukes and before you know it the Muslims are armed with WMDs they will wage against your children, if you will be so rude to pass your idiot genes down humanity.

 

[soundforbjt]

If repubs get back into the WH, will there be a war with Iran?

Here's Pat buchanan's take:

[FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]Is a vote for the Republican Party in 2012 a vote for war? [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]Is a vote for Mitt Romney or Newt Gingrich a vote for yet another unfunded war of choice, this time with a nation, Iran, three times as large and populous as Iraq?[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]Mitt says that if elected he will move carriers into the Persian Gulf and "prepare for war." Newt is even more hawkish. America should continue "taking out" Iran's nuclear scientists &#8211; i.e., assassinating them &#8211; but military action will probably be needed.[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]Newt is talking up uber-hawk John Bolton for secretary of state. [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]Rick Santorum has already called for U.S.-Israeli strikes: "Either we're going to stop them ... or take the long term consequences of having a nuclear Iran trying to wipe out the state of Israel."[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]But if Iran represents, as Bibi Netanyahu is forever reminding us, an "existential threat," why does not Israel itself, with hundreds of nuclear weapons, deal with it? [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]Bibi's inaction speaks louder than Bibi's words.

[/FONT]

 

[SamurAchzar]

Is Pat Buchanan suggesting Israel preemptively strike Iran with nukes?

 

[senseamp]

I think a lot of countries may be secretly looking forward to a major war in the middle east to jump start their defense spending and get some Keynesian stimulus into their economies.

 

[EagleKeeper]

I think a lot of countries may be secretly looking forward to a major war in the middle east to jump start their defense spending and get some Keynesian stimulus into their economies.

The only downside to that thinking would be the speculation of oil. If the supply was assured; many will root for ME problems to be solved.

The problem with a major war is who may become involved.
Are we thinking an Iraq or Libya scenario.
Iran or Syria?

 

[JEDIYoda]

I can't discuss it in a public arena because of my background. -- hehehe yeah right! Guys like you are a dime a dozen....I can`t discuss this in public.....rofl....niether can I due to my role as a secret Mossad liason attached to these forums........... but I do anyways...lol

But I will say this, Israel caught Iraq and Syria early and smashed their projects. In Iran's case, they're pleading for Western help. --- If anybody is crying it`s Iran because they realize Israel has the capabilities to launch a successful limited pinpoint attack on Iran`s non-peaceful Nuke program!

If you can't understand that then you simply don't understand how far Iran has gone and how much more powerful they are compared to the other Muslim states in the region. --- powerful...you mean dangerous due to the overwhelming presence of the radical Muslim elements.

Israel cannot afford to attack Iran and that's the end of the story. For this they need the help of the big boys and those boys don't want to do it either because it could destabilize their economies. -- Again you must be sharing shrooms with LL. Lets look at this from this angle -- Survival of the nation of Israel verses Iran having nuclear weapon. Israel will attack Iran with pinpoint accuracy to taKe out Iran`s offensive nuke program.
Under the table Israel will have the help from other middle east nations that are also concerned with Iran`s nukes.

That Straight of Hormuz can be planted with so many bombs as to cause oil prices to skyrocket to $300-$400 dollars a barrel. They won't do it. The global economy is in the shitter and nobody has the heart to come to Israel's aid for Israel's local problem. --- When it comes to survival the strait of Hormuz will be deemed a necessary casualty of Survival of the nation of Israel.Israel already has assurances from Arab countries that they will get aid under the table. Most Arab countries would rather have Israel around than have a nuclear Iran!

One reason is because Israel is sooooooooooooooooo stubborn when it comes to the peace process. They want everything and want to give up nothing.
Oh really -- Israel keeps getting attaked, then israel gives the land back after a time. Israel exchanges 1,000 prisoners for 1 Israeli.....you have no clue do you? I guess this is all Israel`s fault??
The Palestinians are blameless....lol

So America and Europe says to Israel "Fuck you and your Iranian problem". -- in your dreams. The Europeans don`t want Iran to have nuclear weapons iether. Iran already has the ability to launch conventional weapons at and hit European targets.

In short, Israel is going to have to live with an Iranian bomb. They can slow it down by sabotage and killing scientists but they cannot stop it. It's too late.

You must be very proud that Iran will possess a bomb? With Iran possessing a bomb that means that the possibility is even greater that one morning you will wake up to no job, contaminated food supply...etc...why? Because Iran iether set of a nuke or a radical Muslim group managed to get Iran to give them the bomb...hmmmmm........OK peeps let us live with Iran having a nuke. After all the Palestinians are blameless.....

 

[Whiskey16]

What your tiny, minuscule mind will not grasp
.. if you will be so rude to pass your idiot genes down humanity.

:thumbsdown: Keep your personal insults to yourself. If you cannot, then I suggest you to keep your hands off a submit button.

The AnandTech forums have long held a poor reputation due to the likes of your behaviour.

And yes, the Israeli economy is failing. The basis of its quite low GDP per capita and high cost of living are a clear demonstration of a economy that is unsustainable and of a populous that will not take much more of the path their governments have chose. The state propoganda of being the regional victim while committing costly aggression will not play favourably out much longer.

 

[JEDIYoda]

:thumbsdown: Keep your personal insults to yourself. If you cannot, then I suggest you to keep your hands off a submit button.

The AnandTech forums have long held a poor reputation due to the likes of your behaviour.

And yes, the Israeli economy is failing. The basis of its quite low GDP per capita and high cost of living are a clear demonstration of a economy that is unsustainable and of a populous that will not take much more of the path their governments have chose. The state propoganda of being the regional victim while committing costly aggression will not play favourably out much longer.

If you consider what SasmurAchzar said to be insulting then perhaps you need to grow a thicker skin....
I did not find anything wrong with SamurAchzar calling things as he sees them. Strong the truth is in SamurAchzar!!

 

[Lemon law]

The failed assumption is that Iran IS ONLY committed to developing nuclear weapons.

When the Iranian claim is that they only want nuclear energy for peace time electrical power.

At this point in time, Iran is partly on its way to developing a peace time electrical generating program. And the other thing for sure, Iran will will implement peace time electrical power generation first. And any nuclear weapons as an after thought.

Meanwhile, how do we tell if Iran also has nuclear weapons ambitions? And the short answer is that either way, no one can tell, because either way, Iranian behavior would be the same.

But it makes a big difference in the end, with only peace time electrical power generation, Iran is not a greater military threat. But with nuclear weapons, Iran becomes a small offensive military threat proportional to the number of nukes Iran can make by refining enough U238 in to 96&#37; pure U235. Which means Iran could never achieve nuclear parity with Israel's 120 plus existing nukes. Not to mention a far larger world stockpile of nukes that would be sent at Iran if Iran ever used its nukes offensively. But even a few defensive nukes would make any nation think hard if they think they can invade Iran.

But still two more things to say. (1) the Iranian go no go decision point to go on to developing nukes is three years into the future. If Iran does not perceive a threat of invasion three years into the future, they will be far less likely to choose to develop nuclear weapons. (2) Saudi Arabia and Iran have lived side by side for some 1300 years without military hostilities or mutually perceived threats. Its only when the USA upset the apple cart and caused the government of Iraq do become majority ruled by Shia Muslims, that Sunni Saudi Arabia now feels isolated from the majority of Sunni ruled Muslims.

But if we listen to Israeli chicken little's, All 75 million Iranians are dedicated to committing suicide to wipe out Israel. Which is pure propaganda and bunk. And anyone with an iota of common sense knows it. Iran just wants to be able to have a foreign policy that is not Western controlled.

But its become a Dick Cheney styled snit to force the opposite back on Iran , and everything the USA has done in the past 30 years to accomplish it has badly backfired
on the USA.

In conclusion, the world's best choice is to keep Iran working under IAEA guidelines, and if we can prevent Iran from choosing and building Plutonium breeding type reactors, Iran can never become an offensive nuclear weapons state.

And another possibly better option would be to make the mid-east a nuclear weapons free zone. But lots of luck getting Israel to give up its nukes or its accident waiting to happen Chernable type breeder reactor.

 

[Nebor]

If Iran is as sane and on the level as some people here say, then they wouldn't use nuclear weapons even to fend off an invasion. They're going to nuke their own country, and subject their people to a lifetime of fallout & genetic disorders just to try to keep their government in place? Nevermind that the type of nuclear weapons they're likely to build wouldn't be anything like what we have, capable of destroying entire states in a flash.

 

[Lemon law]

If Iran is as sane and on the level as some people here say, then they wouldn't use nuclear weapons even to fend off an invasion. They're going to nuke their own country, and subject their people to a lifetime of fallout & genetic disorders just to try to keep their government in place? Nevermind that the type of nuclear weapons they're likely to build wouldn't be anything like what we have, capable of destroying entire states in a flash.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gee Nebor, maybe your right, but can't the same thing be said about Israel. And Israel being a much smaller country, just one nuke or nuclear accident at Desmona could make all of Israel uninhabitable for 10,000 years.

Will you join me in asking to make the entire mid-east into a nuclear weapons free zone?

 

[Nebor]

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gee Nebor, maybe your right, but can't the same thing be said about Israel. And Israel being a much smaller country, just one nuke or nuclear accident at Desmona could make all of Israel uninhabitable for 10,000 years.

Will you join me in asking to make the entire mid-east into a nuclear weapons free zone?

I think the difference is that Israel (and others) believe that if there is an invasion the populace will be brutalized and eradicated. Whereas if Iran is invaded (let's be honest, most likely by Westerners, it's what we do) it'll just be a standard regime change and nation build job. So the Israelis are better off dead than living under Arab rule, but the inverse isn't true.

I don't support the nuclear free zone, because in a ME nuclear arms race, Israel is going to come out on top. Their weapons are of advanced design and capable of producing blasts closer to US\Soviet nuclear weapons than Pakistan\India nuclear weapons. Meanwhile I'm not sure that the rest of the Arabs have the competency to produce anything better than North Korean grade weapons, which are essentially non-fission dirty bombs.

 

[EagleKeeper]

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gee Nebor, maybe your right, but can't the same thing be said about Israel. And Israel being a much smaller country, just one nuke or nuclear accident at Desmona could make all of Israel uninhabitable for 10,000 years.

Will you join me in asking to make the entire mid-east into a nuclear weapons free zone?

Get EVERY Muslim country that has spoken against Israel to join hands and sing Kumbaiyawith Israel. Only then would Israel consider removing her deterrent. If she can coung on the US to den her dnemies and not back her against those that call for her destruvtion...

 

[SamurAchzar]

:thumbsdown: Keep your personal insults to yourself. If you cannot, then I suggest you to keep your hands off a submit button.

The AnandTech forums have long held a poor reputation due to the likes of your behaviour.

And yes, the Israeli economy is failing. The basis of its quite low GDP per capita and high cost of living are a clear demonstration of a economy that is unsustainable and of a populous that will not take much more of the path their governments have chose. The state propoganda of being the regional victim while committing costly aggression will not play favourably out much longer.

Look, boy, your antisemitic stance isn't working here. Israel's GDP PPP, per capita is ranked about 27th in the world, and climbing. Israel's economy performance during the recent recession has been better than nearly any other country. If you're looking to realize your Nazi dreams, boy, it won't happen by Israel failing economically. Certainly not when it just discovered enough natural gas to take care of its energy needs well into the second half of the century. Failing economy my ass.

I want to email this thread to your mother so she can be properly ashamed. PM her email address or I'll tell your Stormfront buddies you're arguing with Jews in forums owned by an Indian.