Is today's marijuana 25x more dangerous than in 1970?

[TruePaige]

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: TruePaige
Did you even READ the article?

...

Cannabis is linked to a large number of bipolar patients as a form of SELF MEDICATION.

Did you? I linked The Lancet for a reason, and I know you didn't read it because there's no way you could have in the time between when I posted and when you replied.

Cannabis use and risk of psychosis in later life

The most important problems in studying the relation between cannabis use and psychosis are reverse causality and the transitory intoxication effect.

If individuals with imminent psychotic disorder start to use cannabis to alleviate symptoms, the psychosis could be causing the cannabis use, rather than the other way around. In most of the studies included in the present meta-analysis, Theresa Moore and colleagues were able to adjust for the effect of psychotic or imminent psychotic symptoms and they were able to ensure that psychotic outcomes were not due to the transitory effect of intoxication. In observational studies, even the
most thorough analysis cannot definitely rule out the possibility that confounding or bias can be responsible for the association between cannabis exposure and psychotic symptoms.

However, in the present paper, the assessment of adjustment for confounding factors and transitory effects of cannabis intoxication is done more thoroughly than in previous reviews, and the odds ratio results for psychosis are more reliable and also more modest than seen in previous publications.

We therefore agree with the authors? conclusion that there is now sufficient evidence to warn young people that cannabis use will increase their risk of psychosis later in life.

This is from the same medical journal that said in 1995, "The smoking of cannabis, even long term, is not harmful to health."

Quit polluting this thread with your reactionary crap and try to look at the issue from both sides.

And I'm telling YOU that it's still crap.

They give no reason other than to say "And uh..in studying it more..you know it just might be that it will increase your risk of psychosis."

Didn't people want facts at one point in time? I like facts, this article lacks facts.

I'm not trying to be argumentative, just to say that this article seems (to me) like it lacks facts, and is just trying to make something that is pretty safe (as safe as any of the legalized drugs of the world) seem bad.

 

[preslove]

People smoke less material to get the same high nowadays. In my dad's day they would roll up big joints for themselves. Nowadays if you get a bag of nice high grade, you smoke less of it in a pipe or bong. If you roll a joint, it will be smaller than the olden days and you will share it.

Considering that smoked marijuana contains a couple of carcinogens, smoking less plant material is better for your health.

 

[mesthead21]

*grabs popcorn*

I love the drug threads!

 

[jlee]

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: TruePaige
Did you even READ the article?

...

Cannabis is linked to a large number of bipolar patients as a form of SELF MEDICATION.

Did you? I linked The Lancet for a reason, and I know you didn't read it because there's no way you could have in the time between when I posted and when you replied.

Cannabis use and risk of psychosis in later life

The most important problems in studying the relation between cannabis use and psychosis are reverse causality and the transitory intoxication effect.

If individuals with imminent psychotic disorder start to use cannabis to alleviate symptoms, the psychosis could be causing the cannabis use, rather than the other way around. In most of the studies included in the present meta-analysis, Theresa Moore and colleagues were able to adjust for the effect of psychotic or imminent psychotic symptoms and they were able to ensure that psychotic outcomes were not due to the transitory effect of intoxication. In observational studies, even the
most thorough analysis cannot definitely rule out the possibility that confounding or bias can be responsible for the association between cannabis exposure and psychotic symptoms.

However, in the present paper, the assessment of adjustment for confounding factors and transitory effects of cannabis intoxication is done more thoroughly than in previous reviews, and the odds ratio results for psychosis are more reliable and also more modest than seen in previous publications.

We therefore agree with the authors? conclusion that there is now sufficient evidence to warn young people that cannabis use will increase their risk of psychosis later in life.

This is from the same medical journal that said in 1995, "The smoking of cannabis, even long term, is not harmful to health."

Quit polluting this thread with your reactionary crap and try to look at the issue from both sides.

And I'm telling YOU that it's still crap.

They give no reason other than to say "And uh..in studying it more..you know it just might be that it will increase your risk of psychosis."

Didn't people want facts at one point in time? I like facts, this article lacks facts.

I'm not trying to be argumentative, just to say that this article seems (to me) like it lacks facts, and is just trying to make something that is pretty safe (as safe as any of the legalized drugs of the world) seem bad.

Then why don't you come up with facts that contradict the article?

 

[meltdown75]

Originally posted by: Demon-Xanth
I'm really on the fence with it. On one hand I think it should be similar to alcohol in the "don't drive or operate machinery", but on the other hand one of my friends in high school really did change when he decided to become a drunk pothead because it took so much of his drive away. So I consider it somewhere between cigarettes and alcohol. Not quite as cancer causing as tobacco, but not quite as inebriating as alcohol.

Anything is bad when not used in moderation. Absolutely anything. That said, pot can suck the motivation and dreams right out of your life if you let it. If you use it responsibly it is a very enjoyable substance. Not everyone likes it though. I would place it above cigarettes though... at least with a doobie you are catching a buzz. I can't see anything positive about smoking a cig, and it is addictive as hell to boot.

 

[yllus]

Originally posted by: TruePaige
And I'm telling YOU that it's still crap.

They give no reason other than to say "And uh..in studying it more..you know it just might be that it will increase your risk of psychosis."

Didn't people want facts at one point in time? I like facts, this article lacks facts.

I'm not trying to be argumentative, just to say that this article seems (to me) like it lacks facts, and is just trying to make something that is pretty safe (as safe as any of the legalized drugs of the world) seem bad.

Yeah, I suppose I should take your word as fact and dismiss what a distinguished medical journal says.

It's not that the article lacks facts, it's that you're too lazy/stubborn to click a few times and look at them. The editorial is just providing a summary and a stance on one side of the issue to provoke debate. The summary of the study, which is helpfully linked, is neutral on the subject and does come to a factual conclusion.

 

[yours truly]

well, i'll tell you this as a fact

after smoking copious amounts of skunk, i had an 'episode', which i was informed later was a drug induced pyschosis

i have known many people who have been sent to the funny farm due to cannabis

with new strains of super skunk coming out eveyday, the side effects are starting to be noticed

everything in moderation

 

[nakedfrog]

In March 2007, The Lancet, Britain's leading medical journal, declared cannabis to be more dangerous and addictive than LSD and Ecstasy.

I find this highly suspect, as from what I understand, MDMA has actually been indicated as a factor in deaths in the past.

 

[ApexCS]

Originally posted by: hopeless74
well, i'll tell you this as a fact

after smoking copious amounts of skunk, i had an 'episode', which i was informed later was a drug induced pyschosis

i have known many people who have been sent to the funny farm due to cannabis

with new strains of super skunk coming out eveyday, the side effects are starting to be noticed

everything in moderation

Wow, looking at your avatar its no wonder you're posting bogus info like this, super skunk is a strain of cannabis not the new uber class lol.

 

[TruePaige]

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: TruePaige
And I'm telling YOU that it's still crap.

They give no reason other than to say "And uh..in studying it more..you know it just might be that it will increase your risk of psychosis."

Didn't people want facts at one point in time? I like facts, this article lacks facts.

I'm not trying to be argumentative, just to say that this article seems (to me) like it lacks facts, and is just trying to make something that is pretty safe (as safe as any of the legalized drugs of the world) seem bad.

Yeah, I suppose I should take your word as fact and dismiss what a distinguished medical journal says.

It's not that the article lacks facts, it's that you're too lazy/stubborn to click a few times and look at them. The editorial is just providing a summary and a stance on one side of the issue to provoke debate. The summary of the study, which is helpfully linked, is neutral on the subject and does come to a factual conclusion.

It started off with a big fabrication...and from there everything else I read was a half truth of a lie.

"In March 2007, The Lancet, Britain's leading medical journal, declared cannabis to be more dangerous and addictive than LSD and Ecstasy."

LSD compared to Cannabis for danger? Come on. Get real.

 

[yours truly]

Originally posted by: ApexCS

Originally posted by: hopeless74
well, i'll tell you this as a fact

after smoking copious amounts of skunk, i had an 'episode', which i was informed later was a drug induced pyschosis

i have known many people who have been sent to the funny farm due to cannabis

with new strains of super skunk coming out eveyday, the side effects are starting to be noticed

everything in moderation

Wow, looking at your avatar its no wonder you're posting bogus info like this, super skunk is a strain of cannabis not the new uber class lol.

wtf are you banging on about, whats an avatar got do with this. bogus info, plz stfu. ive been there, done that. i dont need a report to tell me whats what

so again stfu

 

[yllus]

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: TruePaige
And I'm telling YOU that it's still crap.

They give no reason other than to say "And uh..in studying it more..you know it just might be that it will increase your risk of psychosis."

Didn't people want facts at one point in time? I like facts, this article lacks facts.

I'm not trying to be argumentative, just to say that this article seems (to me) like it lacks facts, and is just trying to make something that is pretty safe (as safe as any of the legalized drugs of the world) seem bad.

Yeah, I suppose I should take your word as fact and dismiss what a distinguished medical journal says.

It's not that the article lacks facts, it's that you're too lazy/stubborn to click a few times and look at them. The editorial is just providing a summary and a stance on one side of the issue to provoke debate. The summary of the study, which is helpfully linked, is neutral on the subject and does come to a factual conclusion.

It started off with a big fabrication...and from there everything else I read was a half truth of a lie.

"In March 2007, The Lancet, Britain's leading medical journal, declared cannabis to be more dangerous and addictive than LSD and Ecstasy."

LSD compared to Cannabis for danger? Come on. Get real.

*rolls his eyes* You know what, forget it. You clearly have made your mind up and no presentation of actual scientific evidence is going to make you budge. Keep harping over that first line of an editorial as your diversionary tactic.

 

[meltdown75]

Originally posted by: hopeless74
well, i'll tell you this as a fact

after smoking copious amounts of skunk, i had an 'episode', which i was informed later was a drug induced pyschosis

i have known many people who have been sent to the funny farm due to cannabis

with new strains of super skunk coming out eveyday, the side effects are starting to be noticed

everything in moderation

so basically you took the words "drug-induced psychosis" from some quack and ran with it. gotcha.

 

[ApexCS]

Okay avatar aside your post is exactly the kind of propaganda that mainstream media regurgitates to scare people about cannabis.

Also, the only reason more people are in rehab because of cannabis is because they have a choice in most cases, drug treatment or jail, tough call.

 

[jlee]

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: TruePaige
And I'm telling YOU that it's still crap.

They give no reason other than to say "And uh..in studying it more..you know it just might be that it will increase your risk of psychosis."

Didn't people want facts at one point in time? I like facts, this article lacks facts.

I'm not trying to be argumentative, just to say that this article seems (to me) like it lacks facts, and is just trying to make something that is pretty safe (as safe as any of the legalized drugs of the world) seem bad.

Yeah, I suppose I should take your word as fact and dismiss what a distinguished medical journal says.

It's not that the article lacks facts, it's that you're too lazy/stubborn to click a few times and look at them. The editorial is just providing a summary and a stance on one side of the issue to provoke debate. The summary of the study, which is helpfully linked, is neutral on the subject and does come to a factual conclusion.

It started off with a big fabrication...and from there everything else I read was a half truth of a lie.

"In March 2007, The Lancet, Britain's leading medical journal, declared cannabis to be more dangerous and addictive than LSD and Ecstasy."

LSD compared to Cannabis for danger? Come on. Get real.

*rolls his eyes* You know what, forget it. You clearly have made your mind up and no presentation of actual scientific evidence is going to make you budge. Keep harping over that first line of an editorial as your diversionary tactic.

Proof that excessive drug use causes brain damage? 😉

 

[yours truly]

Originally posted by: meltdown75

Originally posted by: hopeless74
well, i'll tell you this as a fact

after smoking copious amounts of skunk, i had an 'episode', which i was informed later was a drug induced pyschosis

i have known many people who have been sent to the funny farm due to cannabis

with new strains of super skunk coming out eveyday, the side effects are starting to be noticed

everything in moderation

so basically you took the words "drug-induced psychosis" from some quack and ran with it. gotcha.

no thats what they said, i couldnt give a shit what a 'quack' says, but thats their official response

 

[meltdown75]

Originally posted by: hopeless74

Originally posted by: meltdown75

Originally posted by: hopeless74
well, i'll tell you this as a fact

after smoking copious amounts of skunk, i had an 'episode', which i was informed later was a drug induced pyschosis

i have known many people who have been sent to the funny farm due to cannabis

with new strains of super skunk coming out eveyday, the side effects are starting to be noticed

everything in moderation

so basically you took the words "drug-induced psychosis" from some quack and ran with it. gotcha.

no thats what they said, i couldnt give a shit what a 'quack' says, but thats their official response

fair enough, it just sounds like something they would say if they didn't know the actual cause of your episode. maybe they didn't want to tell you that you are crazy, and would just rather blame the evil weed to keep you from having a meltdown.

 

[yours truly]

Originally posted by: ApexCS
Okay avatar aside your post is exactly the kind of propaganda that mainstream media regurgitates to scare people about cannabis.

Also, the only reason more people are in rehab because of cannabis is because they have a choice in most cases, drug treatment or jail, tough call.

propoganda, yeah ok. im telling you my personal experience. brush it off, good for you

 

[buck]

I certainly hope its 25x more potent, seeing how I am paying 25x more $ than they did in the 70's. 😀

 

[yours truly]

Originally posted by: meltdown75

Originally posted by: hopeless74

Originally posted by: meltdown75

Originally posted by: hopeless74
well, i'll tell you this as a fact

after smoking copious amounts of skunk, i had an 'episode', which i was informed later was a drug induced pyschosis

i have known many people who have been sent to the funny farm due to cannabis

with new strains of super skunk coming out eveyday, the side effects are starting to be noticed

everything in moderation

so basically you took the words "drug-induced psychosis" from some quack and ran with it. gotcha.

no thats what they said, i couldnt give a shit what a 'quack' says, but thats their official response

fair enough, it just sounds like something they would say if they didn't know the actual cause of your episode. maybe they didn't want to tell you that you are crazy, and would just rather blame the evil weed to keep you from having a meltdown.

you're right, psychosis is an umbrella term, it can mean anything

but like another poster said, and my belief is, everything in moderation

 

[TruePaige]

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: TruePaige
And I'm telling YOU that it's still crap.

They give no reason other than to say "And uh..in studying it more..you know it just might be that it will increase your risk of psychosis."

Didn't people want facts at one point in time? I like facts, this article lacks facts.

I'm not trying to be argumentative, just to say that this article seems (to me) like it lacks facts, and is just trying to make something that is pretty safe (as safe as any of the legalized drugs of the world) seem bad.

Yeah, I suppose I should take your word as fact and dismiss what a distinguished medical journal says.

It's not that the article lacks facts, it's that you're too lazy/stubborn to click a few times and look at them. The editorial is just providing a summary and a stance on one side of the issue to provoke debate. The summary of the study, which is helpfully linked, is neutral on the subject and does come to a factual conclusion.

It started off with a big fabrication...and from there everything else I read was a half truth of a lie.

"In March 2007, The Lancet, Britain's leading medical journal, declared cannabis to be more dangerous and addictive than LSD and Ecstasy."

LSD compared to Cannabis for danger? Come on. Get real.

*rolls his eyes* You know what, forget it. You clearly have made your mind up and no presentation of actual scientific evidence is going to make you budge. Keep harping over that first line of an editorial as your diversionary tactic.

If by "Actual Scientific Evidence" you mean "Crappy study that proves nothing".

You know lots of studies take place every year that have results not in line with the truth.

Just because you picked one whacko study doesn't make it true.

 

[scott916]

hopeless74, I hope you're not even considering trying to take the stance that you know "many" people who were sent to the "funny farm" from simply smoking pot. That's not only ludicrous, it's simply not supported by fact.

There's no way that the average bud from 2008 is 20x more potent than in 1970. For one, THC is only one of the many different compounds in marijuana that are responsible for its effect. I'd say there is much more ultra high quality indoor-grown bud available on the market that MAY contain 20x more THC than shit brick weed from 1970, but to say that you couldn't go down the Haight and get some decent nugs until 2008 because they simply didn't exist is simply a smear against weed and an effort to demonize it and label it a dangerous drug.

 

[yours truly]

Originally posted by: scott916
hopeless74, I hope you're not even considering trying to take the stance that you know "many" people who were sent to the "funny farm" from simply smoking pot. That's not only ludicrous, it's simply not supported by fact.

do you want their telephone numbers and ask them yourself

its a shame cos i did get a section2 for 28dys. half the people i met in there, were just saying what i had been through

funny how they stopped smoking dope and their mental health issues disappeared and started living 'normal' lives again

 

[preslove]

Originally posted by: yllus


*rolls his eyes* You know what, forget it. You clearly have made your mind up and no presentation of actual scientific evidence is going to make you budge. Keep harping over that first line of an editorial as your diversionary tactic.

The scientific literature is hardly clear. CORRELATION IS NOT CAUSATION, ya moron.

Text

Does Cannabis Cause Psychosis?
There are several distinct types of "causes": necessary, sufficient, and component. A necessary cause is one that must be present before the result can occur. A sufficient cause is one that is, by itself, enough to cause the result. A component cause is one that is part of a "constellation" of causes that work together to bring about a result.

All of the recent research into this issue has found that cannabis is neither necessary nor sufficient to cause schizophrenia by itself.5 Rather, it is most likely a component factor when combined with a variety of other potential issues such as genetic pre-disposition or difficult childhood. Cannabis use, along with its attendant lifestyle and subculture, probably worsens symptoms in some of those vulnerable to psychotic disorders. The same is commonly said of the psychedelics such as LSD or psilocybin. As we don't know what causes schizophrenia, determining how important a factor cannabis use is cannot be determined.

Cannabis use could be a precipitating component in several ways. Heavy cannabis use may worsen certain coping mechanisms and weaken familial or social support through social disapproval. Fear of legal problems could cause anxiety and paranoid feelings; actual legal problems could damage self-esteem, damage hopes for life goals, or cause serious life problems. Cannabis intoxication can lower inhibitions and self control, worsen some symptoms to the point of dysfunction, or be part of a lifestyle that involves irregular sleep or other instability. It is easy to imagine that the effects of frequent or high dose cannabis intoxication could exacerbate these underlying instabilities and lead to increased paranoia and delusions.

Hundreds of papers have been published in the last few years looking at the very popular issue of whether cannabis causes psychosis. This issue has received the international attention of media, governments, researchers, and the general public, all looking for answers. Yet we are still sorting through cluttered fields of data. The main anchor point in the noise is that there is a near consensus that cannabis use and psychotic disorders are correlated, but the nature of the relationship is still far from clear.

 

[scott916]

I believe they had an episode in which they believed they were in danger, maybe they felt they needed to go to the hospital, but nobody goes crazy from pot. It doesn't happen.