Is this what overclocking has become?

[VirtualLarry]

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813130695

Read the review from the guy that couldn't get over a 40x multi. The MSI rep essentially tells him, "working as designed".

I guess mobo makers are taking a cue from Intel's playbook. Now entry-level OC boards (but with the premium mainstream chipset, designed to support OC) are being BIOS-locked to limit OC levels, unless you "pay to play", with the higher-end OC boards, that support "unlimited" multis.

Guess CPUs and mobos are getting like broadband, with caps on how you can use them.






2 out of 5 eggsUnable to overclock well

Pros: The mother board works

Cons: I was unable to increase the CPU ratio above 40 and I was unable to change the CPU base clock at all. The system refuses to boot even if I lower the base clock. So I was only able to overclock to 4GHz on a CPU that normally over clocks to 4.6GHz.

Manufacturer Response:

Dear Valued Customer,

We apologize for the issues that you are having with this product.
This product is entry-level and can provide limited overclocking margin.

If you have any questions, then please kindly get in touch with our tech support team directly at 626.271.1004 for assistance during regular business hours from M to F, 6am to 6pm Pacific Time, or you can email us at usreview@msi.com, thank you.

Best Regards,
MSI Review Team | usreview@msi.com

---

Edit: Thankfully (as I was thinking of purchasing this board as part of a combo at Microcenter) it appears that my premise was wrong, and these boards are not limited to 40x multi in BIOS, as hitechlegion.com got theirs up to 46x in a review.

 

[blackened23]

I'm pretty sure you're misinterpreting things. I'm fairly certain this board does not limit multiplier - in fact, other reviews seem to indicate that they overclocked higher than a 40x multiplier. As well, how does the consumer know that his CPU overclocks at 46 multiplier? That definitely isn't "normal" for a Haswell CPU unless you're using an exorbitant amount of voltage. Really, anyone overclocking a Haswell with 1.25+ vcore should not be using a 100$ budget board, it's really that simple.

I think what they're getting at is that the board is entry level and therefore does not have the beefy VRMs and what not that higher end boards have - 100$ boards indirectly OC worse than 200$ boards because of the component quality, but that doesn't mean they have multiplier limits. So with that being the case I wouldn't read into things too much and spare the over dramatization. The way I see it, some newegg reviews are valuable, others feel like they're written by children who have no idea what they're doing. I really don't think this board or any other limits multi at 40.

 

[ShagglestheLion]

I like MSI for gaming Laps.

I'd prefer Gigabyte or possibly ASUS for motherboards.

Yes, Gigabyte.

Even though, we are in the Terabyte phase.

 

[blackened23]

I only buy Asus motherboards myself, but if i'm overclocking a CPU with a ton of voltage, i'm not using a 100$ motherboard. The issue at hand is probably a clueless end-user.

In fact, in that list of newegg reviews there's another user that was able to overclock higher than 40x multiplier. I really feel like you're mis-interpreting things here. It is most likely a clueless end-user, as i've never heard of any Z87 board that limits the multi - That would be completely and utterly pointless since 40x is around the stock turbo anyway. Why limit multi to 40 when the stock turbo is 39? As I said completely and utterly pointless; I do not believe the board limits the multi. I think the OC is artificially limited in terms of the components used on the board, which would not be surprising for a 100$ board. 100$ boards aren't adequate for vcore inreases which require a closed loop cooler - which, on average, a 4770k does require a closed loop for that level of vcore.

 

[Red Hawk]

That sucks. I use an entry level Z68 board by Gigabyte and I can still set the multiplier to whatever the heck I want -- well, whatever the heck I want up to Intel's hardware limit, which I think is something like 56? In any case, Intel's limit is way above what's actually achievable on air, and probably even on water cooling, with the chip so it makes no difference to me. A multiplier limit of 40, on the other hand, could quickly become a frustration.

Thanks for letting me know, I'll be sure not to buy an MSI entry level board if I'm ever in the market for a new mobo.

 

[Shmee]

I like my board, but it is a bit higher end then that one.

 

[zir_blazer]

Around 7 years ago, doing any sort of tweaking was much harder because you don't even had options to touch any value on many Motherboards and needed quite expensive ones to do it. Remember the famous ASUS A8N-VM and A8N-VM CSM, from the first generation Motherboards that used the nForce 4 IGP Chipset for Socket 939? Well, I had the latter, and its BIOS was almost void of options (Base Clock limited from 200 to 220 MHz, no Multiplier control, no Voltage). A better range of options has become more available in the mainstream and even some low end models in later generations.
I also recall that there was an Intel based DFI mITX Motherboard that initially allowed for very high Voltages, but DFI later severely limited it with a BIOS upgrade because it was extremely easy to blow it at those settings. I'm not against to limit such options if the Motherboard is rather weak, like for example, in an AM3 Motherboard supporting only 95W TDP Processors. What ridiculous annoys me is when you don't even have these options if you wanted to try undervolting, that wouldn't put extra stress on the Motherboard.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

http://www.hitechlegion.com/reviews/motherboards/36111-msi-z87-g41?showall=&start=3

4.6GHz on a i7-4770k

 

[blackened23]

http://www.hitechlegion.com/reviews/motherboards/36111-msi-z87-g41?showall=&start=3

4.6GHz on a i7-4770k

Well that answers the question then. Clueless end user (who posted the review on newegg), looks like the board can handle 46x multi just fine.

 

[Hero1711]

Cheaper boards have cheaper parts, "you pay what you get". Also, OC is always considered "extra", "at your own risk", there is no guarantee that this CPU can overclock as well as another same model CPU.

I personally favor Asrock boards.

 

[AnonymouseUser]

Why would anyone overclock on an MSI board anyway? They have a horrible failure rate.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

I wouldn't waste the time checking, but I imagine most of them are 4+1 phase design (with a good amount not even having mosfet cooling) AMD boards.

Ok I checked,

1 x78 board

3 x58 boards

2 C2Q boards

1 P67 board

1 P55 board


I'd say if you're rolling Intel, why wouldn't you get an MSI board?

 

[Haserath]

Well that answers the question then. Clueless end user (who posted the review on newegg), looks like the board can handle 46x multi just fine.

But his tech level is a 5.()

 

[Rvenger]

They have a horrible failure rate.

VRM issues have been fixed quite some time ago. They do not have a horrible failure rate post P67/890x. Ever since they introduced Military Class 3 with SFC chokes problems diminished. Balla's GD65 has a pretty robust VRM.

 

[aigomorla]

military class MSI and cheap MSI are two different things.

The military class boards are solid boards.
The low end boards... well what else did you honestly expect?

And i have seen many vendors do this.
Infact on many low end budget boards, increasing CPU Vcore is taboo and the bios wont let u do it at all.

 

[beginner99]

I wouldn't waste the time checking, but I imagine most of them are 4+1 phase design (with a good amount not even having mosfet cooling) AMD boards.


I'd say if you're rolling Intel, why wouldn't you get an MSI board?

Agree. But as a owner of an MSI board I'm obviously not fully objecttive. Have not had an issue so far also with OC but mien has 8 Phases plus extensive mosfet cooling.

 

[Grooveriding]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yeuJAOVRoA0

Good video about Haswell and motherboards. Low end board vs. the best z87 board. Summary: no difference in overclocking.

This newegg review was probably just a clueless guy.

 

[aigomorla]

why does haswell need high # VRMS on the board?

Did u guys forget why intel made u guys change boards?

http://hothardware.com/News/Haswell-Takes-A-Major-Step-Forward-Integrates-Voltage-Regulator/

^ a reminder incase u did.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

Indeed, my GD65 has a 16 phase design, and the ASUS boards have an 8... I didn't even care.

The only thing I cared about was 3 Gen3 PCIe slots and the bundled discount that was offered with the product.

Everything else is just marketing gimmicks imo, I was surprised by the audio of the board. I'm not an audiophile but this is the first board I've had where the audio stood out to me.

Anyways, since P67 buying a board for OC has been the wrong move. The only reason you should buy a board is for price and features, ever since Sandy Bridge the capabilities of a chip are basically set, unless the boards offer no voltage adjustments what so ever it will not make a difference.

My ram is another thing that benefited from the auto timings of the board over previous gens (p67 and p55) but that also had a lot to do with Haswells IMC which seems to be insanely strong at lower MHz.

In short it's all about the chip and has been since Sandy Bridge.

 

[Jaydip]

Indeed, my GD65 has a 16 phase design, and the ASUS boards have an 8... I didn't even care.

The only thing I cared about was 3 Gen3 PCIe slots and the bundled discount that was offered with the product.

Everything else is just marketing gimmicks imo, I was surprised by the audio of the board. I'm not an audiophile but this is the first board I've had where the audio stood out to me.

Anyways, since P67 buying a board for OC has been the wrong move. The only reason you should buy a board is for price and features, ever since Sandy Bridge the capabilities of a chip are basically set, unless the boards offer no voltage adjustments what so ever it will not make a difference.

My ram is another thing that benefited from the auto timings of the board over previous gens (p67 and p55) but that also had a lot to do with Haswells IMC which seems to be insanely strong at lower MHz.

In short it's all about the chip and has been since Sandy Bridge.

Balla you forgot about the KILLER chip :biggrin:

 

[JimmiG]

why does haswell need high # VRMS on the board?

Did u guys forget why intel made u guys change boards?

http://hothardware.com/News/Haswell-Takes-A-Major-Step-Forward-Integrates-Voltage-Regulator/

^ a reminder incase u did.

The Haswell voltage regulator still needs to be provided a voltage and current.. 1.8V by default, often increased to 1.9 - 2.1V by overclockers. You really didn't think those tiny surface-mount components next to the Haswell die could replace the large capacitors and MOSFETs with their own heatsinks that you find around the CPU socket, did you?

Personally I see nothing wrong with MSI's response. Your CPU/mobo are designed to work at 3.5 GHz and 100 MHz base clock.. Anything over that is a bonus. If it works at 3.5 GHz, it's working "as designed". Running the CPU beyond specifications is not supported by Intel or the motherboard manufacturer. I also don't think the board is to blame for his limited OC. You don't need super-beefy VRM's to run a Haswell at 4.2 - 4.4 GHz at 1.2V. Either he got a really, really bad chip, or he's doing something wrong.

 

[Idontcare]

This is ridiculous! Shame on MSI, and Intel too!

I want my mobo to cost no more than $40 despite having a BoM of $300...and I demand it to be so over-engineered that I am virtually guaranteed (not that I'm willing to pay for said guarantee) to be able to overclock my CPU to 7GHz.

Not only that, but when I do overclock my $60 CPU to 7GHz I expect the CPU manufacturer to send me a rebate check to cover the elevated electricity costs. After all it is my right to get absolutely everything I want, even if I don't pay for it, simply because I'm 'merican and its my gawd dern given right to do what's I like, whens I like, hows I like.

Freedom!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Maximilian]

MSI boards were crap for overclocking because they couldnt do an offset voltage. Dont know if the newer 8x series can but prior to that no offset.

So either deal with auto overvolting the chip or deal with a high idle voltage.

 

[Mushkins]

military class MSI and cheap MSI are two different things.

The military class boards are solid boards.
The low end boards... well what else did you honestly expect?

And i have seen many vendors do this.
Infact on many low end budget boards, increasing CPU Vcore is taboo and the bios wont let u do it at all.

I had two "military class" MSI GPUs fail on me in a row. 7870 HAWX editions to be precise. The first one literally fried itself after a week of light use, the replacement from the RMA had power issues and I returned it and demanded a refund before it could do the same also within a week. Troubleshooting, multiple systems with multiple known good PSUs, and all that jazz pointed to only one place: the cards. Newegg reviews after the fact pointed to other people having the exact same issues.

Bought a Gigabyte 7950 instead and never had a hiccup, the experience was enough to turn me off the MSI brand permanently, I definitely wouldn't trust their lower end stuff for any serious use. A 46x multiplier on this board sounds like its just asking for trouble in the first place.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Always ignore newegg "reviews".