Is this as foolish as I'm thinking it is? 2002 M3 *UPDATE PURCHASED*

[PricklyPete]

THIS.

In fact, insist on a full BMW dealer stamped service history or walk away. Ensure all TSB's have been applied and that the 1200 mile service has been performed and on time. If the 1200 mile service has not been done or was done late, run away as fast as you can.

So the E46 M3 has a specific 1200 mile service? Did it have a special oil or something for the break-in period?

 

[PhoKingGuy]

So the E46 M3 has a specific 1200 mile service? Did it have a special oil or something for the break-in period?

Yes theres a special oil change at that point, and I think a valve check?

 

[DivideBYZero]

So the E46 M3 has a specific 1200 mile service? Did it have a special oil or something for the break-in period?

Yep, special oil, special 1200 mile service to replace it with the Castrol TWS 10w-60 oil. Check with any owner what oil they use. If it's not Castrol TWS Motorsport 10w-60, be wary.

 

[PricklyPete]

Yep, special oil, special 1200 mile service to replace it with the Castrol TWS 10w-60 oil. Check with any owner what oil they use. If it's not Castrol TWS Motorsport 10w-60, be wary.

Well I called the guy selling it today. It's been serviced the whole time by one of the local BMW dealerships and he has the whole service record printed out...so I'll go take a look when I test drive it today. I'll also run a CarFax if I'm interested after the test drive and setup a time for a local mechanic to take a look. I'm hoping the body is in good condition and the mechanicals are sound. The guy sounds like he's taken pretty good care of it...so I'm definitely interested if everything checks out.

 

[DivideBYZero]

Sweet! Keep us posted!

open the drivers door and rock the car from the roof. Listen for creaks from the back end as this could indicate Broken rear springs. It's very common, so ask if they have ever been replaced, if so there is no need to worry as the new ones will be the revised type. On the flip side if there are no creaks then don't worry either.

Ask if the coil packs have been replaced. Bremi packs are the same shite that VW used in the 1.8T motor. When one or many Bremi go all need to be replaced with the Bosch replacement units and this can cost ~$300 in parts alone (6 packs).

Check the service indicator on the MFD display in the centre middle of the dash(odo essentially). Insert the key and turn to ignition but don't start. It will display the amount of miles till the next service. Note at the same if the display says 'oil service' or 'Inspection', then reference the service record to see if you need a Inspection 1 or 2. You can use this to determine short term servicing costs and as a bargaining tool if it has 2k left before a major service. Also, if the MFD has a small clock icon in it then the Brake fluid is due for changing, the period is every two years.

Check the flashlight is in the glove box and the tool kit in the trunk is complete, shows a well looked after car.

 

[PricklyPete]

Sweet! Keep us posted!

open the drivers door and rock the car from the roof. Listen for creaks from the back end as this could indicate Broken rear springs. It's very common, so ask if they have ever been replaced, if so there is no need to worry as the new ones will be the revised type. On the flip side if there are no creaks then don't worry either.

Ask if the coil packs have been replaced. Bremi packs are the same shite that VW used in the 1.8T motor. When one or many Bremi go all need to be replaced with the Bosch replacement units and this can cost ~$300 in parts alone (6 packs).

Check the service indicator on the MFD display in the centre middle of the dash(odo essentially). Insert the key and turn to ignition but don't start. It will display the amount of miles till the next service. Note at the same if the display says 'oil service' or 'Inspection', then reference the service record to see if you need a Inspection 1 or 2. You can use this to determine short term servicing costs and as a bargaining tool if it has 2k left before a major service. Also, if the MFD has a small clock icon in it then the Brake fluid is due for changing, the period is every two years.

Check the flashlight is in the glove box and the tool kit in the trunk is complete, shows a well looked after car.

Thanks for all the input/advice. He stated that the just had the oil changed at the BMW dealership in April and has put less than 1K miles on it since. He said he had it inspected and all smog checks done at the same time. AS for the care of the car, he said that flashlight is still in the glove box and mentioned that the "flat fix" items were still in the trunk, but that he also purchased a spare wheel/tire that he had a cloth bag made to enclose. He also added the necessary tools for changing the flat. All comes with it. He also has a Thule bike rack (which I would have bought anyway) that is attached using the appropriate BMW connections on the roof. Seems like the car has been well taken care of...but we'll see when I do the test drive. I'll try to remember to take some pics when I check it out.

 

[DivideBYZero]

Sounds pretty good. Would love to see the pics. 🙂

Check the expiry of the "M Mobilty" kit, as they only last three years or so. It's a free refill from BMW, AFAIK, but you need to check. I got a free one, but it was in year one of a CPO car.

 

[ayabe]

You're not crazy I looked at a 2005 C55 AMG and a 2006 M3 Competition with an SMG in the last two weeks.

40K on the ODO for each but the M3 was close to 30K.

Couldn't pull the trigger on either on them. Pretty sure if the M3 had a clutch pedal I would have bought it though.

Back to hunting for a 2009 CPO 335i for me! I think the WRX is starting to feel like I'm cheating on her.

 

[exdeath]

15-18K is not alot? I really did pick the wrong career.....

For a E46 M3? No that's not much at all considering a new base model Camry costs more than that these days. 15k would be *stealing* it if it's perfectly maintained.

 

[exdeath]

DbZ and exdeath...what is the rear-subframe issue? I'm sure it is all over M3 forums which I plan on searching later today...but what is the general issue?

DBZ would know more about it than I, but it's not just the bushings prone to failure (the replacement ones from BMW have *much* thicker webs and crush sleeves). Bushings are rubber inserts, they break, are easily replaced, and are no big deal.

The much bigger concern is cracking/tearing sheet metal at the unibody where the rear subframe bolts into the car; basically the suspension attachment points at the frame rails tearing away from the car. I don't know how common it is compared to previous generations, but I know for sure the E46 has been afflicted by it as well, and it's a much bigger fix than just a couple bushings. In involves dropping the suspension, grinding and cutting down the affected areas on the underside of the car, and welding reinforcement plates throughout. Not really as bad as it sounds, esp when the fix leaves it better and stronger than factory, just something to be aware of so as not to get caught with your pants down.

Best to get it inspected by someone experienced with the problem, as some rear end clunk is normal and expected on a car of this nature (as with most high performance RWD cars) and it could cause misdiagnoses and paranoia.

 

[SSSnail]

As for the subframe, I posted a thread a while back about a class-action suit that consumers won for the e46 bodies. So if it's a problem, it's free to inspect and fix. Take it to a BMW dealer, ask for a free subframe inspection, and if the service adviser say anything else but free kindly remind him of the law suit.

 

[exdeath]

^ Sweet!

 

[AMCRambler]

Do it Pete.

As long as you can afford it and it won't be impractical for what you need in a vehicle why not?

I was on the fence about getting my GTO for a good 2 years. Now that I've got it, I'd do it again every time. Life is too damn short to not enjoy things like this. We're all here today and gone tomorrow. Might as well enjoy the ride then.

Hope you get a good price and of course once you buy it it's pics or ban!

 

[PricklyPete]

As for the subframe, I posted a thread a while back about a class-action suit that consumers won for the e46 bodies. So if it's a problem, it's free to inspect and fix. Take it to a BMW dealer, ask for a free subframe inspection, and if the service adviser say anything else but free kindly remind him of the law suit.

Thanks SSSnail, Exdeath, and DbZ...definitely helpful information. He said he had a full inspection in April and all was good. I will definitely have it inspected by an experienced mechanic to make sure things look good. I'm about to post my test drive update...I looked under the car for obvious issues/rust and things looked REALLY good. I honestly didn't see any rust on anything other than some of the brake components. I'll post my test drive thoughts in a separate post with pics.

 

[PricklyPete]

So I went and test drove the car. The exterior is in great condition. I went over the exterior pretty carefully and no noticeable chips and only a few small dings...really good for a 8 year old car (much better than my truck). The car has been garage kept. The guy is moving to Holland for work. He is actually there now (I had to call him there at lunch today to setup the test drive with his wife). I met his wife at their house here for the test drive. She explained to me how much the car was his "baby" and that he didn't want to sell. That tire cover I talked about earlier...he literally had his mom sew the thing...and she even put a M badge on it...crazy. The interior isn't in quite as good condition as the outside...but it is still good. The leather has been kept very well, but the trim is scratched in a few places and scuff marks in some places...but again...pretty good condition for an 8 year old car with 76K miles on it. It didn't help that I drove our 2010 Audi over there which has a fantastic interior (IMHO), so it wasn't a fair comparison to walk out of it and into the 8 year old BMW. The interior in the BMW was much better than my truck condition wise and quality wise...so that is a more fair comparison.

Ok..enough about the things that really aren't important to me...what I am wanting is something exciting/fun to drive... so I was really looking forward to the drive. Starting the car up was great as it sounded terrific. As soon as I started getting going...I forgot all about the scuff marks on the door and the hard plastics. That engine is just sublime...revving it is just amazing. The car still felt very tight and had a great ride. The shifter was a little meatier/mechanical feeling than some recent BMW's (newer models) that I've driven...but it still felt like heaven compared to my truck...this is an 8 year old car after all. The only thing that irritated me little...but not enough to car was the driver side rear passenger glass panel seemed to squeak a small bit on some bad pavement. That isn't enough to put me off from buying it...especially considering my truck makes all kinds of squeaks. Heck my friend's 2008 Cayman S does the same thing...so I can forgive it in an 8 year old car.

The car appears to have been maintained very well. I checked the print out from the BMW service department and it looks like everything was done on time. The 1200 mile service was done at mile 1206. I didn't want to take his copy of the print out, but if I end up taking it to a mechanic, I'll make a copy of it myself to do a final run down.

I've talked to my wife (who is home in SC right now) to see what she thought. She thinks I'm crazy and of course doesn't understand why I need to go through the hassle of selling my truck and buying a different car...but I wasn't expecting her to. She takes a second to warm up to things...so I'm going to talk to the guy tomorrow about taking the car for a day for a mechanic check...and by then I'm sure she wont care. If the mechanic check goes well and my wife is cool with it...I'll definitely bite if the price is right.

Ok enough of my blabbering...here are the pics I took:

 

[JulesMaximus]

Looks good, does it come with the roof rack?

I guess your wife has gotten over the stigma associated with driving and owning fine German cars? 😉

 

[PricklyPete]

Looks good, does it come with the roof rack?

I guess your wife has gotten over the stigma associated with driving and owning fine German cars? 😉

No...actually she hasn't. Her first remark was "now we'll have two luxury cars...ughhh". I'm hoping that will pass 🙂

Yes, it does come with the roof rack which I definitely want as 90% of my truck usage these days is driving myself to a bike trail somewhere.

 

[exdeath]

Another thing, I've been told the wheels are $$$$$$$ to refinish (diamond cut) when they start peeling, which they will. Don't know if those are the ones or not, or a specific option/size. They don't look like it. It's the 19" alloys if I remember correctly.

Anyhow looks like a steal, esp if you get away with a 15-16k offer :awe:

 

[PricklyPete]

I was on the fence about getting my GTO for a good 2 years. Now that I've got it, I'd do it again every time. Life is too damn short to not enjoy things like this. We're all here today and gone tomorrow. Might as well enjoy the ride then.

This is my thought. I just want something fun and I really think this would do it. We'll see what the mechanic says...need to get that setup tomorrow.

 

[PricklyPete]

Another thing, I've been told the wheels are $$$$$$$ to refinish (diamond cut) when they start peeling, which they will. Don't know if those are the ones or not, or a specific option/size. They don't look like it. It's the 19" alloys if I remember correctly.

Anyhow looks like a steal, esp if you get away with a 15-16k offer :awe:

Thanks for the heads up on the wheels...I'll do a little more research on those. yeah...I'm hoping to get the car for close to 16K...we'll see.

 

[DivideBYZero]

Another thing, I've been told the wheels are $$$$$$$ to refinish (diamond cut) when they start peeling, which they will. Don't know if those are the ones or not, or a specific option/size. They don't look like it. It's the 19" alloys if I remember correctly.

Anyhow looks like a steal, esp if you get away with a 15-16k offer :awe:

This is true. My Diamond cut 19's need a refurb and I keep putting it off. However, that car is on the standard 18's. They're not as bling, but they have some clear advantages:

- You can car geek it up by stating they are better due to lower unsprung weight
- Ride quality is better, see point above for reason why
- They are painted, not machined, so refurbs are cheap.

/0

 

[PricklyPete]

This is true. My Diamond cut 19's need a refurb and I keep putting it off. However, that car is on the standard 18's. They're not as bling, but they have some clear advantages:

- You can car geek it up by stating they are better due to lower unsprung weight
- Ride quality is better, see point above for reason why
- They are painted, not machined, so refurbs are cheap.

/0

It's only an inch right...girls don't care about an inch do they? Just kidding...while those 19" wheels that you guys are referring to are beautiful...honestly I don't care that much on this car and the cheaper the maintenance the better. I'm really just looking for something fun to drive that excites me...and the engine in this car does. I'm going to try and setup a mechanic today or tomorrow and go from there.

 

[PricklyPete]

Ok...It's been a while since I've bought a used car...but what is a reasonable amount to pay for an inspection? I'm in St. Louis right now and my "local mechanic" is back in SC...so I'm trying to find a good place to go here in St. Louis who would be qualified to test out an M3. One of the recommended places seems to be on top of things but are charging $185 to $465 for inspections depending on what you want done. I think the last time I had an "inspection done" it was $50. Another place i called just had a basic inspection (similar to the $185 deal at the other place). I'm sure I could find a local place, but I want a service department that would be familiar with M3's. So am I getting ripped off. I don't mind spending the money if I'm going to move forward with this...but it just seems like a lot...am I off base?

 

[DivideBYZero]

Get three quotes and take the middle one.

 

[PricklyPete]

Get three quotes and take the middle one.

You a purchasing manager somewhere? Just kidding. I'd rather be safe than sorry with this since this is a unique automobile and I'd like someone looking at it who has experience with them. I guess if I buy the car I should just get used to spending a bit more for items I don't do myself.