Is Thief (2014) worth $5.99?
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StinkyPinky
Diamond Member
- Jul 6, 2002
- 6,969
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I paid $50 for this game and it was $51 too much. The game is junk. The biggest problem with it is that it's just boring with boring characters and boring maps with boring missions and boring art work.
^ This (and then some). It's one of the worst and most dumbed down sequels in recent history. Everything that was wrong with Thief 3 has been amplified, whilst everything right with Thief 1&2 dumped in the trash. I got as far as the first two levels on a friends rig before giving up out of disbelief at the "direction" the franchise was steered in. Example "Mission requirement" from Mission 1 : "Get 4 headshots". Headshots. In Thief...
Thief 1&2 had huge sprawling single-piece levels and run in less than 512MB RAM. Thief 3 had to badly nerf them down by 80% to fit into the original XBox's 64MB RAM. Amazingly, Thief 4's level zones are just as small despite being given 64-256x more memory to play with on modern PC's. Every few minutes there's a silly "mash button to open window" QTE that attempts to hide the fact the "window" straddles a level zone loading boundary. Even after you opened it, you have to mash buttons to re-open it again. The light gem has been dumbed down from 11 states to 3, "contextual" use replaces the original's freedom of action. Garret (who used to be a sneaky bad*ss "Keeper" has now been "reinvented" into a 30-something sexually confused Italian cross-dressing emo complete with a corset, mascara & eye shadow) now can't even jump over a 6 inch rock on his own if it isn't pre-scripted.
Master voice actor Stephen Russell got replaced by "guy doing bad impression of puss from Shrek" (something I bet he's quietly delighted about given how it turned out). Even patched there's still iffy sound balancing (sounds at varying distances are often the same volume even after passing between an object) - in a franchise where the number one thing they got right even on the first 1998 Dark Engine game was accurate sound propagation...The worst of all though are the one-way level checkpoints that cut you off from previous areas without warning (again, in an "exploration with backtracking" series = epic fail) pretty much destroying most of the freedom of movement of originals and leaves you spending most of the game playing "guess where the checkpoints of no-return are", often making 100% loot achievements impossible unless you save every 30 seconds and essentially sticking the game on "rails". Throw in over-scripted micro-cutscenes on every... single... minor action (takedown / pickpocket / swipe), and a game that's only half the length of original (8-11hrs vs 18-25hrs). Even the plot is essentially a huge rip off of Dishonoured (Gloomers = Weepers, Queen of Beggers = Granny Rags, etc).
I wouldn't even play it for $0.00. If you want a decent stealth game, go replay Dishonored (or the HD-modded 'Tafferpatched' originals) instead.
It's cross platform with PS3/360, so it was never gonna take advantage of RAM like that.
^ This (and then some). It's one of the worst and most dumbed down sequels in recent history. Everything that was wrong with Thief 3 has been amplified, whilst everything right with Thief 1&2 dumped in the trash. I got as far as the first two levels on a friends rig before giving up out of disbelief at the "direction" the franchise was steered in. Example "Mission requirement" from Mission 1 : "Get 4 headshots". Headshots. In Thief...
Thief 1&2 had huge sprawling single-piece levels and run in less than 512MB RAM. Thief 3 had to badly nerf them down by 80% to fit into the original XBox's 64MB RAM. Amazingly, Thief 4's level zones are just as small despite being given 64-256x more memory to play with on modern PC's. Every few minutes there's a silly "mash button to open window" QTE that attempts to hide the fact the "window" straddles a level zone loading boundary. Even after you opened it, you have to mash buttons to re-open it again. The light gem has been dumbed down from 11 states to 3, "contextual" use replaces the original's freedom of action. Garret (who used to be a sneaky bad*ss "Keeper" has now been "reinvented" into a 30-something sexually confused Italian cross-dressing emo complete with a corset, mascara & eye shadow) now can't even jump over a 6 inch rock on his own if it isn't pre-scripted.
The worst of all though are the one-way level checkpoints that cut you off from previous areas without warning (again, in an "exploration with backtracking" series = epic fail) pretty much destroying most of the freedom of movement of originals and leaves you spending most of the game playing "guess where the checkpoints of no-return are", often making 100% loot achievements impossible unless you save every 30 seconds and essentially sticking the game on "rails". Throw in over-scripted micro-cutscenes on every... single... minor action (takedown / pickpocket / swipe), and a game that's only half the length of original (8-11hrs vs 18-25hrs). Even the plot is essentially a huge rip off of Dishonoured (Gloomers = Weepers, Queen of Beggers = Granny Rags, etc).
I wouldn't even play it for $0.00. If you want a decent stealth game, go replay Dishonored (or the HD-modded 'Tafferpatched' originals) instead.
Soooo.... You didn't like it then?
Still haven't played the originals and I have all 4 now lol.
TheSlamma
Diamond Member
- Sep 6, 2005
- 7,625
- 5
- 81
Great post. Couldn't agree more about the new game.^ This (and then some). It's one of the worst and most dumbed down sequels in recent history. Everything that was wrong with Thief 3 has been amplified, whilst everything right with Thief 1&2 dumped in the trash. I got as far as the first two levels on a friends rig before giving up out of disbelief at the "direction" the franchise was steered in. Example "Mission requirement" from Mission 1 : "Get 4 headshots". Headshots. In Thief...
Thief 1&2 had huge sprawling single-piece levels and run in less than 512MB RAM. Thief 3 had to badly nerf them down by 80% to fit into the original XBox's 64MB RAM. Amazingly, Thief 4's level zones are just as small despite being given 64-256x more memory to play with on modern PC's. Every few minutes there's a silly "mash button to open window" QTE that attempts to hide the fact the "window" straddles a level zone loading boundary. Even after you opened it, you have to mash buttons to re-open it again. The light gem has been dumbed down from 11 states to 3, "contextual" use replaces the original's freedom of action. Garret (who used to be a sneaky bad*ss "Keeper" has now been "reinvented" into a 30-something sexually confused Italian cross-dressing emo complete with a corset, mascara & eye shadow) now can't even jump over a 6 inch rock on his own if it isn't pre-scripted.
The worst of all though are the one-way level checkpoints that cut you off from previous areas without warning (again, in an "exploration with backtracking" series = epic fail) pretty much destroying most of the freedom of movement of originals and leaves you spending most of the game playing "guess where the checkpoints of no-return are", often making 100% loot achievements impossible unless you save every 30 seconds and essentially sticking the game on "rails". Throw in over-scripted micro-cutscenes on every... single... minor action (takedown / pickpocket / swipe), and a game that's only half the length of original (8-11hrs vs 18-25hrs). Even the plot is essentially a huge rip off of Dishonoured (Gloomers = Weepers, Queen of Beggers = Granny Rags, etc).
I wouldn't even play it for $0.00. If you want a decent stealth game, go replay Dishonored (or the HD-modded 'Tafferpatched' originals) instead.
T1 and T2 were great games, especially T2. I didn't mind a couple of the levels in T3 like Museum, the Captains house and the Hammers cathedral, but other than that, it was consolized crap.
It's really sad given that looking glass went out of business after basically being the inventor of the FPS (First Person SNEAKER) and now this is what is done with that groundwork they laid.
Dishonored is a great game and actually accomplishes the Thief essence even better than this new game which again is sad. They even pay homage to Thief in a few spots (Guy named Basso and a Thief easter egg in mission 7)
TheSlamma
Diamond Member
- Sep 6, 2005
- 7,625
- 5
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There are some good mods out for 1 and 2 that help out the very very dated Dark Engine.Soooo.... You didn't like it then?
Still haven't played the originals and I have all 4 now lol.
BFG10K
Lifer
- Aug 14, 2000
- 22,709
- 3,003
- 126
I just finished it and enjoyed the game as much as the first two, though I still think the third one is the best. It's definitely worth it for such a cheap price.
I got 31 hours from the game which easily puts it on par with the first three games. And no, I didn't replay any missions to inflate that figure.
Now this is simply untrue:
I got 31 hours from the game which easily puts it on par with the first three games. And no, I didn't replay any missions to inflate that figure.
I never played the first games and it sounds like most of the negative bias comes from peoples expectations of this game as a sequel. Sounds like it's not half bad if you judge it on it's own merits. I picked up the bundle for $8.99 that has all the games and dlc.
Subyman
Moderator <br> VC&G Forum
- Mar 18, 2005
- 7,876
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I didn't have any attachment to the previous games, I really dislike cliched characters and story devices though. So I didn't get that far without moving on to something more stimulating. If you only come to the game for the mechanics then it may be worth the time. I couldn't recommend it though. I'd rather play Dishonored (still didn't care much for it though.)
Agreed. Thief 3 wasn't a bad game other than consolized loading zones and dumb "we've run out of console memory so here's immersion destroying blue fog instead" every 30m. The Cradle, the Captain's mansion, etc, were great levels.
They definitely have some of the best modders out there. Hard to believe what they've done with a 1998 game engine that was never easily moddable the same way Oblivion / Skyrim are.
In fact, modders have done an epic job with "Thief 3 Gold" - a massive undertaking that essentially rewrites the entire game to have single piece missions instead of stupid small "level hubs":-
http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=143659
That's true of all franchises though where the devs take a distinct style of gameplay and try to "reinvent it for a more 'casual audience'" mid-series.
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Sulaco
Diamond Member
- Mar 28, 2003
- 3,825
- 46
- 91
You got the game, and all its DLC, a year after it was released. For $8.99.
Ask yourself why. And no, it's not because there is an army of Thief fans rivaling CoD numbers that just hates it "cuz it's new".
^ This. There's a reason why it's so cheap already - no-one's buying or playing it! As of last week, they've literally sold only 100k copies on the PC. It never showed up on the Steam stats "most played" at any point during release week. As Sulaco said, it isn't just a hardcore group of fanboys "talking it down" out of early franchise nostalgia. Even on the consoles, no single platform has reached 1m sales (PS4 = 720k / XB1 = 370k / PS3 = 340k / XB360 = 260k). That's bad enough for any modern AAA title, but it's a spectacular flop for one that's 5-years in the making! :thumbsdown:
The entire development process was a train wreck too. Devs ended up split into competing "clans", some wanted a return to a "smarter" feel of the original, others wanted "more accessible action cinematic adventure" (ie, dumbed down & overly-scripted for console teenies). Departures of key personnel (including Lead Game Designer Dominic Fleury) were rife, their replacements ended up reinventing the wheel in the process of being brought up to scratch. They ran well over budget and had to turn to a German investment firm for additional funds. A far cry from the earlier Looking Glass Studio's "made with just 19 people on a $3m budget" classics.
http://www.polygon.com/2013/4/26/42...eded-by-office-politics-high-level-departures
Lessons learned : You can't force every franchise to be everything to everyone. Thief had a very unique feel and distinctive style of play to it (as do a few other games like Styx: Master of Shadows). Trying to turn it into a "male Tomb Raider" was an epic fail of a design choice, and the overall low sales reflect that.
If you're a fan of the originals or you like clever and in depth mechanics and sprawling non-linear levels full of choice that makes you think, then no. Don't ever touch this game.
If you want a linear experience that resembles a roller coaster ride more than a game, then it's probably worth 5 bux.
For Thief fans this is one of the biggest f***ups in gaming, Thief 3 was really bad but this is world aparts worse, if you're a fan of Thief to any degree just avoid the game it'll make you more mad than you'll enjoy it.
No, it's all bad. Thief 1&2 are amazing games because they made an objectively good Thief game, where sneaking and stealing were dynamic, fun and rewarding. They literally hit every note with the games based on getting really fantastic gameplay.
Thief the reboot is an objectively bad Thief game, you can't even jump or use rope arrows FFS, how do you hope to scale around in a city, explore and mantle over roofs and sneak in windows if you can't even f-ing jump, it's a total and utter joke. They replaced that stuff with press X to initiate pre-canned cut scene, and they dumped them into linear pathways.
If none of the prior Thief games existed at all and this was brand new, it would still be an objectively bad game, it's just that Thief fans of the original happen to know better, and have experienced just how utterly enjoyable a sneaking game is when it's executed well.
If you want a linear experience that resembles a roller coaster ride more than a game, then it's probably worth 5 bux.
For Thief fans this is one of the biggest f***ups in gaming, Thief 3 was really bad but this is world aparts worse, if you're a fan of Thief to any degree just avoid the game it'll make you more mad than you'll enjoy it.
No, it's all bad. Thief 1&2 are amazing games because they made an objectively good Thief game, where sneaking and stealing were dynamic, fun and rewarding. They literally hit every note with the games based on getting really fantastic gameplay.
Thief the reboot is an objectively bad Thief game, you can't even jump or use rope arrows FFS, how do you hope to scale around in a city, explore and mantle over roofs and sneak in windows if you can't even f-ing jump, it's a total and utter joke. They replaced that stuff with press X to initiate pre-canned cut scene, and they dumped them into linear pathways.
If none of the prior Thief games existed at all and this was brand new, it would still be an objectively bad game, it's just that Thief fans of the original happen to know better, and have experienced just how utterly enjoyable a sneaking game is when it's executed well.
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Puppies04
Diamond Member
- Apr 25, 2011
- 5,909
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I preordered the game and listened to 6 months of the hardcore thief 1 + 2 fanboys saying how it was going to be a dumbed down mess aimed at console players wwitht he attention span of a gnat. I laughed at them, surely it wasn't going to be that bad.....
It is. I stuck with it for 3 or 4 hours. Complete waste of time and money IMHO.
It is. I stuck with it for 3 or 4 hours. Complete waste of time and money IMHO.
gorcorps
aka Brandon
- Jul 18, 2004
- 30,739
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Well, to be fair the same type of stuff was said about the latest Deus Ex game and that turned out pretty well... so the fanboys can't always be trusted.
I got it for free and didn't really enjoyed it, I didn't see a reason to keep playing it; gameplay, story and visuals were not interesting enough.
Subyman
Moderator <br> VC&G Forum
- Mar 18, 2005
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Ventanni
Golden Member
- Jul 25, 2011
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I've put 23 hours into the game, and it's fantastic. I am a die-hard Thief 1/2 fan, so my position is if you're going to play any of the Thief games, play the first two. But Thief (2014) is an excellent game.
There is a lot more content than just smaller levels. The levels themselves aren't as large as Thief 1/2, but there is a tremendous amount of content and smaller quests in the city that will keep you occupied and intrigued. I thought the voice acting was fantastic, and the cut-scenes were great.
Generally, I find that the people who don't like Thief (2014) are the ones expecting it to be like Thief 1 & 2, and that's just not fair to the game. It's its own game, its own story, its own style, its own artwork, and its own franchise. If you play the game and separate that, you'll probably find you really enjoy it.
There is a lot more content than just smaller levels. The levels themselves aren't as large as Thief 1/2, but there is a tremendous amount of content and smaller quests in the city that will keep you occupied and intrigued. I thought the voice acting was fantastic, and the cut-scenes were great.
Generally, I find that the people who don't like Thief (2014) are the ones expecting it to be like Thief 1 & 2, and that's just not fair to the game. It's its own game, its own story, its own style, its own artwork, and its own franchise. If you play the game and separate that, you'll probably find you really enjoy it.
The game is incredibly well optimized, just started playing it. Runs like a dream on my 7950. Some really nice texture and lighting work here.
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