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Is there really a False Flag coming to Justify War on Iran?
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Watch those videos.
I saw him in one of them. Not sure if he was in the one I posted, but I searched mccain on youtube when I posted it.
Plus he has Libeirman (spl?) following him around all the time. They attend these things together. Liberman (spl?) always attends when he has time.
Lemon law
Lifer
Well at least non Prof John throws a defined gauntlet down with---I'd call that a crazy anti-Bush type rant.
1. "We know that the Bush regime wants to attack Iran. "
We know this based on what? ( If nothing else from the reporting of Seymour Hersch. Who is a excellent journalist with a long list of sources in our State department and CIA dating back to the Vietnam war. And was in fact the journalist who broke the Mei Li story. Even if these sources are more deep background personally unquote able, he reports that Dick Cheney has been whispering to GWB that he will be a failed President if he does not attack Iran. And goes on to explain that the Israeli incursions into Israel were in fact a Dick Cheney inspired dress rehearsal for an Invasion of Iraq because the terrain is similar. And also documents a sharp ramp of CIA staffing at the Iranian desks, can we ignore the carrier task forces moved to Iranian waters, or reject reports that our real Shadow President, Dick Cheney has a hard on to invade Iran. Nor can we ignore O'Neil who reported that even before the Bush election, GWB&co planned to invade Iraq. )
2. "Despite the NIE report that Iran abandoned its nuclear weapons program several years ago"
The same NIE that many people questioned and many others say is flat out wrong. Of course we all know Iran doesn't want nuclear weapons which is why they have never got in the way of inspectors right??? ( The mere facts that the reports can't be proved, automatically means PJ is right even though these reports fit the facts. And GWB&co. did not miss an opportunity? )
3. "Their politicized military commander in Iraq, Gen. Petraeus"
Cheap shot at the general who by most accounts is doing an amazing job. ( The mere fact that average chimpanzee would look brilliant compared to Dumsfeld is not any tribute to Patraeus. But fair is fair, Patraeus is perhaps the best the US army has in terms of a anti insurgency expert. However and pointed out in numerous threads, the recent multi month decline in Iraqi violence has little to do with the "surge", and then there is that little minor detail and triviality that Patraeus himself has given his strategy about a 25% of success. And recent events in Basra and other Iraqi cities came dangerously close to igniting a total Iraqi civil war, right now a uneasy cease fire holds, but Iraq still teeters close to the abyss. And meanwhile back at the ranch, the Iraqi insurgencies powers are not broken or even dented. Political progress has not occurred. I for one will not take cheap shots at Petraeus, but you PJ, have fallen far short of making the case for ga ga Petraeus amazing job genius. And meanwhile at the Washington ranch house, Patraeus is scheduled to give Petraeus report 2 to the US congress on April 8..
4. "We know for a fact that the Bush regime created false evidence, lied, and deceived in order to attack Iraq."
If this is a fact then where is the evidence to prove it? Five years into the war and the left can't 'prove' anything. ( Ah lets give credit where credit is due, GWB refuse to divulve information or even testimony to the US congress. The courts and the Justice departments have not been effective either. Call that one a draw for now, it sure does not prove GWB guilty, but it falls short of proving them innocent either. )
5. "Yet, five years later the traitors in high office who deceived Americans into a war in behalf of a hidden agenda have not been held accountable. " ( Call the jury out on that
that point. It took over two years to force Nixon to resign, Regan sold arms to terrorists admittedly and did not pay the price, and GWB and Chenety may well end up in the Hague for international war crimes. And they never did catch Jack the Ripper. I am not saying GWB will end up paying the price, but it could not happen to a more morally degenerate person. )
Sounds like a few of our anti-Bush posters. ( is the PJ parting shot---and my re joiner is sounds like Bill Clinton swiftboaters )
I can't say that this thread subject may be over hyped, but the PJ defense five point defense of GWB is even more absurd.
1. "We know that the Bush regime wants to attack Iran. "
We know this based on what? ( If nothing else from the reporting of Seymour Hersch. Who is a excellent journalist with a long list of sources in our State department and CIA dating back to the Vietnam war. And was in fact the journalist who broke the Mei Li story. Even if these sources are more deep background personally unquote able, he reports that Dick Cheney has been whispering to GWB that he will be a failed President if he does not attack Iran. And goes on to explain that the Israeli incursions into Israel were in fact a Dick Cheney inspired dress rehearsal for an Invasion of Iraq because the terrain is similar. And also documents a sharp ramp of CIA staffing at the Iranian desks, can we ignore the carrier task forces moved to Iranian waters, or reject reports that our real Shadow President, Dick Cheney has a hard on to invade Iran. Nor can we ignore O'Neil who reported that even before the Bush election, GWB&co planned to invade Iraq. )
2. "Despite the NIE report that Iran abandoned its nuclear weapons program several years ago"
The same NIE that many people questioned and many others say is flat out wrong. Of course we all know Iran doesn't want nuclear weapons which is why they have never got in the way of inspectors right??? ( The mere facts that the reports can't be proved, automatically means PJ is right even though these reports fit the facts. And GWB&co. did not miss an opportunity? )
3. "Their politicized military commander in Iraq, Gen. Petraeus"
Cheap shot at the general who by most accounts is doing an amazing job. ( The mere fact that average chimpanzee would look brilliant compared to Dumsfeld is not any tribute to Patraeus. But fair is fair, Patraeus is perhaps the best the US army has in terms of a anti insurgency expert. However and pointed out in numerous threads, the recent multi month decline in Iraqi violence has little to do with the "surge", and then there is that little minor detail and triviality that Patraeus himself has given his strategy about a 25% of success. And recent events in Basra and other Iraqi cities came dangerously close to igniting a total Iraqi civil war, right now a uneasy cease fire holds, but Iraq still teeters close to the abyss. And meanwhile back at the ranch, the Iraqi insurgencies powers are not broken or even dented. Political progress has not occurred. I for one will not take cheap shots at Petraeus, but you PJ, have fallen far short of making the case for ga ga Petraeus amazing job genius. And meanwhile at the Washington ranch house, Patraeus is scheduled to give Petraeus report 2 to the US congress on April 8..
4. "We know for a fact that the Bush regime created false evidence, lied, and deceived in order to attack Iraq."
If this is a fact then where is the evidence to prove it? Five years into the war and the left can't 'prove' anything. ( Ah lets give credit where credit is due, GWB refuse to divulve information or even testimony to the US congress. The courts and the Justice departments have not been effective either. Call that one a draw for now, it sure does not prove GWB guilty, but it falls short of proving them innocent either. )
5. "Yet, five years later the traitors in high office who deceived Americans into a war in behalf of a hidden agenda have not been held accountable. " ( Call the jury out on that
that point. It took over two years to force Nixon to resign, Regan sold arms to terrorists admittedly and did not pay the price, and GWB and Chenety may well end up in the Hague for international war crimes. And they never did catch Jack the Ripper. I am not saying GWB will end up paying the price, but it could not happen to a more morally degenerate person. )
Sounds like a few of our anti-Bush posters. ( is the PJ parting shot---and my re joiner is sounds like Bill Clinton swiftboaters )
I can't say that this thread subject may be over hyped, but the PJ defense five point defense of GWB is even more absurd.
child of wonder
Diamond Member
As opposed to a Pro-Bush crazy? 😕
TastesLikeChicken
Lifer
Exactly! Like Free-Republic.
Except anti-Bush crazies proliferate in this particular forum much like DU, DailyKos, and HuffPo.
ericlp
Diamond Member
-1
My take is... If Iran is any threat to Israel then then the US somehow has to go in and take it's side........ so... where does that leave us?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_nS6brC1bE
just goes to show how crazy these people are... If you are voting for "R" this is what your gonna get.
Lemon law
Lifer
If nothing else, the general ineptness and total bungling of the GWB administration has one positive benefit because it does reduce the probability that they can attack Iran. Sadly that is somewhat a rational and logical argument when logic and rationality are debased currencies in the GWB administration.
manowar821
Diamond Member
I'd like to hear the explanations as to how exactly being "anti-bush" (which we're not so much as we are just plain "anti-prick") is crazy? LOLZ ALL OVER THE PLACE.
Weren't you ass-holes the same people saying Iran was going to "get what they deserved" only a year ago and further back to the beginning of the Iraq "war"? What exactly has changed? Oh yeah, the sorry excuse for a president is a laughing stock, and now you're saving face like the cowards you are. What happened to "staying the course"? :laugh: :thumbsdown: :laugh: :thumbsdown:
Weren't you ass-holes the same people saying Iran was going to "get what they deserved" only a year ago and further back to the beginning of the Iraq "war"? What exactly has changed? Oh yeah, the sorry excuse for a president is a laughing stock, and now you're saving face like the cowards you are. What happened to "staying the course"? :laugh: :thumbsdown: :laugh: :thumbsdown:
ProfJohn
Lifer
BMW540I6speed
Golden Member
When the "Israel Lobby" started taking heat for cheerleading the invasion of Iraq, Abe Foxman gave a speech at Barnes & Noble/NYC in which he said that, in the 2002-early-2003 run-up to the invasion of Iraq the ADL and other Jewish groups tried to make the case to the administration that Iran, not Iraq, was the problem.
In 2003 Ahmadinejad was mayor of Tehran. According to Yossi Melman, neither Mossad nor CIA nor MI5 had Ahmadinejad in their radar; they knew little about him when he won a surprise bid for the presidency in 2005.
Getting the propagandists to move past the "wipe Israel off the map" schtick is probably not possible, and Ahmadinejad's provocative statements, even when correctly translated, don't make it any easier to refute the organized and systematic demonization campaign that US groups sympathetic to Bibi Netanyahu have financed and rolled out.
But Americans who are not ideologically blinded should try to shut out or shut down the propaganda and understand that the Iranian people, 70 million of them, are young, educated, sophisticated, and could be the best friends the US has in the Middle East.
Iran is geographically positioned to thrive in the next 30 years; the US can either share the wealth and progress by investing with and in Iran, or the US and its ideologues can shoot itself in the foot by venting its spleen on Iran.
The US administration and the ideologically blinded propagandists seem determined to take the latter course.
The major grievance the Netanyahu acolytes lodge against Iran after the weak claims that "Iran is killing US soldiers in Iraq" and "Iran intends to destroy Israel" are swept into the dustbin is that Iran finances Hamas and Hezbollah which is true, and is unacceptable and must stop. Israel & the USA could help solve those problems by stopping the human rights abuses against Palestinian Arabs, stop settlement expansion, help broker a "reasonable" solution to a Palestinian state that is positive for both sides and starting to behave like a serious and just player in the world.
In 2003 Ahmadinejad was mayor of Tehran. According to Yossi Melman, neither Mossad nor CIA nor MI5 had Ahmadinejad in their radar; they knew little about him when he won a surprise bid for the presidency in 2005.
Getting the propagandists to move past the "wipe Israel off the map" schtick is probably not possible, and Ahmadinejad's provocative statements, even when correctly translated, don't make it any easier to refute the organized and systematic demonization campaign that US groups sympathetic to Bibi Netanyahu have financed and rolled out.
But Americans who are not ideologically blinded should try to shut out or shut down the propaganda and understand that the Iranian people, 70 million of them, are young, educated, sophisticated, and could be the best friends the US has in the Middle East.
Iran is geographically positioned to thrive in the next 30 years; the US can either share the wealth and progress by investing with and in Iran, or the US and its ideologues can shoot itself in the foot by venting its spleen on Iran.
The US administration and the ideologically blinded propagandists seem determined to take the latter course.
The major grievance the Netanyahu acolytes lodge against Iran after the weak claims that "Iran is killing US soldiers in Iraq" and "Iran intends to destroy Israel" are swept into the dustbin is that Iran finances Hamas and Hezbollah which is true, and is unacceptable and must stop. Israel & the USA could help solve those problems by stopping the human rights abuses against Palestinian Arabs, stop settlement expansion, help broker a "reasonable" solution to a Palestinian state that is positive for both sides and starting to behave like a serious and just player in the world.
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