is there a successor to the D5000 on the horizon?

[ElFenix]

As for Canon, all of the bodies have focus motors.

you mean the lenses. none of the bodies have ever had focus motors. there was an EF body back in the day that didn't have autofocus. i bet it was cosina built.


and i'll head this one off at the pass: a common claim in favor of the nikon system is that the basic mount has been in use since the 1950s and so there is a large number of used lenses to pick from. while this is true, nikon celebrated 50 million F-mount lenses late last year, while canon celebrated 50 million EF-mount lenses early this year. so there are about the same number of lenses out there for each system (though, undoubtedly a larger portion of those canon lenses are crappy cheap plastic zooms). moreover, nikon lenses before the 1988 release of the AI-P series are more usable on all current canon cameras than on most of the nikon cameras sold (this is because the canon will meter the scene and set the exposure for you, while a D3000, D5000, or a D90 won't turn on the meter and you'll have to chimp).

 

[PurdueRy]

huh?

the 7D cant stand it, doesnt feel good in the hands, button placement is stupid and the controls suck

also IDK why the F that copy and paste of soydios name did that, i blame the fact that i have to use IE6 at work

Perfect example of why I tell people no matter what brand they think they may like to go and try it out in stores. While a 50D was the most comfortable in my hands, others may prefer Sony, Nikon, Pentax, etc.

All are so good that being comfortable with the handling of a camera is probably more important.

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

you mean the lenses. none of the bodies have ever had focus motors. there was an EF body back in the day that didn't have autofocus. i bet it was cosina built.

Heh, thanks, that's what I get for typing too late at night. D:

 

[BlahBlahYouToo]

Heh, I should have explained my point about the Nikon's AF more precisely. Nikon makes an ample # of lenses - some of them reputedly quite excellent - that have the AF motor necessary to work fully with the D5000. In fact, there's more of these AF-S lenses than I had realized, so IMHO the D5000's lack of a built-in focus motor is not as crippling as it used to be back when the D40 was released. And, of course, Sigma and Tamron have also released lenses with built-in focus motors.

As for Canon, all of the lenses have focus motors.

ok, let me see if i understand (bear with the noob).

regarding any DSLR brand, the body needs to have a focus motor in order to be able to use any AF lens.
if it doesn't, then the lens will need a motor.
if neither body or lens has a motor, then MF is the only option.

did i get that right?

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

ok, let me see if i understand (bear with the noob).

regarding any DSLR brand, the body needs to have a focus motor in order to be able to use any AF lens.
if it doesn't, then the lens will need a motor.
if neither body or lens has a motor, then MF is the only option.

did i get that right?

Yeah, pretty much.

Canon uses the EF-S mount now, so all of their modern lenses have motors. 3rd party lenses for Canon will also have focus motors.

Nikon has both motorized lenses and non-motorized lenses. Since the D40, whenever Nikon introduced an entry-level DSLR that did not include a focus motor, there would be rending of clothes and gnashing of teeth. Funny thing is, Nikon now has a whole bunch of fine lenses with focus motors. http://imaging.nikon.com/products/imaging/lineup/lens/af/index.htm#dx

And yes, if neither the body nor the lens has a focus motor, you are stuck with MF. I'll make a little point about this: say you have a Nikon D5000, and you decide to splurge on one of the "great" portrait or wide-angle lenses that 996GT2 mentioned. Well, if you're taking a wide-angle landscape or a portrait shot, you'll have a few seconds to MF. I do this on my Pentax with a MF 50mm f/1.7 w/o any problems.

Anyhoo, more and more lenses are being made with lens motors, as this is reputedly a tad faster and quieter than relying on the body.

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

@OP: Go to a store and pick up both cameras. Handle them, take pictures with them, etc. They are both equivalent in picture quality. The Canon is one generation ahead of Nikon in video usefulness, though both are still more gimmicky than not (more like an oversized point-and-shoot than a real camcorder).

I really agree with this. When I bought my 1st DSLR a few years ago, I handled a Canon Rebel XT and a Nikon D40. The Nikon way outclassed the Canon in terms of fit & finish, and "feel". I bought (online) the Pentax K100D, and it was a half-step up from the Nikon D40 - the K100D was really put together, a real "machine" in comparison. Canon's stepped up since then.

Finding a camera that feels good to use is very important, IMHO. Some people are more sensitive to this than others.

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

Maybe Uncle Jack shouldn't be buying a DSLR then?

DSLRs, just like their film SLR counterparts a decade ago, were designed for the person with an interest in photography, not just for people who want to take family snapshots. DSLRs are designed to give more creative control to the user, and in turn requires more effort to use than a P&S. To be able to fully use any DSLR (even a cheap D40), the user needs to have some level of photographic competence.

Sure, a complete photography newbie would just stick the camera in Auto mode and snap away, but for that kind of use a DSLR is nothing more than a glorified P&S. For taking snapshots and vacation videos, a normal P&S and cheap camcorder do the job perfectly well. I realize that there are a lot of inexperienced DSLR users out there taking family snapshots with their D40s and Rebels, but those people aren't using their cameras to nearly their full potential.

It's not meaningful to call something a gimmick just because the average joe doesn't know how to use it fully. If that was the case, most of the features found on a modern DSLR could be called gimmicks. That, however, is not the case, since there are still many of us who DO use all of the features on our cameras, regardless of whether we own a D40 or a top of the line professional camera.

Unfortunately that's not how things are. When Rebels first came out, it was like $1000 right? Now it's slipped into the $600-$700 range for the top end T2i. Go body only or pick up an older model like the XSI or T1i, and you'll be saving even more big bucks. People were picking up the XS for like $300 - $400 earlier.

Get used to it. I shoot a Rebel. I pack a flash, a 17-55mm IS, stuff Uncle Jack will never be using. I love how when I go places I see people I know with a Rebel. The best they swap out to is a Nifty Fifty. Of course when we all upload pictures, it's pretty clear which one is mine and which one is your typical kit lens shooter, or the one who uses a popup flash 😀 Yeah at times I feel like I'm just blending in with the rest of the photo noobs, but in the end your pictures will deliver, and people will know who the photographer is.



@OP: Also, ask yourself. are you taking video seriously? I think a lot of people just use the video feature because it's there. I shoot pictures seriously, but the video feature? I just use it when I can instead of my cameraphone because I'll get .... higher quality videos. To me it's not much of a killer option. It's nice to have.

About the screen? 920k resolution on the T1i is INSANE. You notice it night and day. All my friends with XSIs and 40Ds and lower go WHOAH when they see the screen. It's nice. You'll be able to preview your pictures better. Trust me, this is something that once you get, you can't go back.

The articulating screen is nice on the D5000, and moreso if you're into video. I think that it's also nice to have when you need to shoot Live View. Why would you shoot live view if you can put your eye to the camera? Obviously because it's not convenient to crawl on the floor at certain times or to boost yourself that high if you're holding your camera above your head. This is where the articulating screen comes in handy. However, given how slow AF is on live view, I usually just shoot and hope my composition is good enough without having my eye there (typically in crowd situations). I usually have enough time to adjust my composition a bit with a quick preview if I'm not shooting right blindly. That said, I'd like for Canon to implement an articulating screen someday. I miss it from my G3 at times. But if its about 920k resolution vs articulating screen, you would appreciate high res more on an every-photo basis.

Simply pointing out that the Nikon sensor being 1 year old is nothing to scoff at.

Correct. That sensor is a very high quality one just like the D40 sensor. It took Canon several iterations to catch up. If the D90 can still fight the T2i so well in terms of sample images, I see no reason to call Nikon "behind" because they're still stuck at 12MP or whatever unless you REALLY need to make poster sized prints.

 

[ElFenix]

Yeah, pretty much.

Canon uses the EF-S mount now, so all of their modern lenses have motors. 3rd party lenses for Canon will also have focus motors.

the TS-E and MP-E lenses do not have focus motors 😀

*jab*

:awe:

()🙂

 

[996GT2]

Canon uses the EF-S mount now

This is not entirely correct.

Canon uses the EF mount and the EF-S mount. The EF-S mount is only found on their APS-C (crop-sensor) DSLRs made after the original Digital Rebel (20D, 30D, 40D, 50D, 7D, Rebel, XT, XTi, XSi, T1i, T2i, XS)

The EF mount is found on all of their full-frame and 1.3x APS-H digital SLRs, as well as all EOS film cameras and a select few older 1.6x APS-C digital SLRs (EOS D30, D60, 10D).

EF lenses can be used on full-frame, 1.3x APS-H, as well as 1.6x APS-C.

EF-S lenses can ONLY be used on 1.6x APS-C and will not physically mount on a full-frame or APS-H camera with an EF mount.

Except for a few specialized lenses (TS-E, MP-E), ALL Canon EF lenses made since the introduction of the EF mount in 1987 have a built-in focus motor. All Canon EF-S lenses also have a built-in focus motor. Many of Canon's midrange and high-end lenses have very fast and silent ring-ultrasonic focus motors that allow for quick focusing and instant manual overrides.

In fact, there's more of these AF-S lenses than I had realized, so IMHO the D5000's lack of a built-in focus motor is not as crippling as it used to be back when the D40 was released.

There are still a few notable omissions, though. The following are some of them:

10.5mm f/2.8 Fisheye, 24mm f/2.8, 28mm f/2.8, 50mm f/1.8, 85mm f/1.8, 85mm f/1.4, 105mm f/2, 135mm f/2, 180mm f/2.8, 80-200mm f/2.8, 80-400mm f/4-5.6.

Nikon has pretty much caught up on their zoom lenses in terms of implementing focus motors, but they still have a lot to do on their fixed-focal length primes.

The lack of a built in focus motor precludes the use of older lenses that can be found very inexpensively on the used market. A couple of notable ones are the Tamron 17-50mm f/2.8 (first version) and Tokina 80-200 f/2.8 (which can be found for as low as $300 these days)

By the way, while it is fully possible to manual focus these lenses, it is not exactly the easiest thing to do, especially with the small pentamirror viewfinder on a D5000. Also, for fast primes (which represent most of the lenses lacking focus motors), the camera's focusing screen can't even show DoF past f/2.5, so you're basically guesstimating focus or waiting on the focus confirmation dot. This can be useful if you have a very static subject, but is a lot more cumbersome than using AF when your subject is moving (even slowly moving).

I've used a D300 at work exclusively with a manual focus lens (an 8mm fisheye), but an 8mm fisheye has so much depth of field that it doesn't require focusing once set to the hyperfocal distance. A lens like an 85mm f/1.8, however, would be a much harder beast to deal with if you were forced to manually focus it on a DSLR with a focusing screen not optimized for manual focus.

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

This is not entirely correct.

Canon uses the EF mount and the EF-S mount. The EF-S mount is only found on their APS-C (crop-sensor) DSLRs made after the original Digital Rebel (20D, 30D, 40D, 50D, 7D, Rebel, XT, XTi, XSi, T1i, T2i, XS)

The EF mount is found on all of their full-frame and 1.3x APS-H digital SLRs, as well as all EOS film cameras and a select few older 1.6x APS-C digital SLRs (EOS D30, D60, 10D).

EF lenses can be used on full-frame, 1.3x APS-H, as well as 1.6x APS-C.

EF-S lenses can ONLY be used on 1.6x APS-C and will not physically mount on a full-frame or APS-H camera with an EF mount.

Since, in this thread, we are speaking about APS-C cameras, there's no reason to bring up non-APS-C mounts. 😉 Just adds unnecessary verbage to the discussion, and is not relevant to the context of the thread.

There are still a few notable omissions, though. The following are some of them:

10.5mm f/2.8 Fisheye, 24mm f/2.8, 28mm f/2.8, 50mm f/1.8, 85mm f/1.8, 85mm f/1.4, 105mm f/2, 135mm f/2, 180mm f/2.8, 80-200mm f/2.8, 80-400mm f/4-5.6.

Nikon has pretty much caught up on their zoom lenses in terms of implementing focus motors, but they still have a lot to do on their fixed-focal length primes.

The lack of a built in focus motor precludes the use of older lenses that can be found very inexpensively on the used market. A couple of notable ones are the Tamron 17-50mm f/2.8 (first version) and Tokina 80-200 f/2.8 (which can be found for as low as $300 these days)

By the way, while it is fully possible to manual focus these lenses, it is not exactly the easiest thing to do, especially with the small pentamirror viewfinder on a D5000. Also, for fast primes (which represent most of the lenses lacking focus motors), the camera's focusing screen can't even show DoF past f/2.5, so you're basically guesstimating focus or waiting on the focus confirmation dot. This can be useful if you have a very static subject, but is a lot more cumbersome than using AF when your subject is moving (even slowly moving).

I've used a D300 at work exclusively with a manual focus lens (an 8mm fisheye), but an 8mm fisheye has so much depth of field that it doesn't require focusing once set to the hyperfocal distance. A lens like an 85mm f/1.8, however, would be a much harder beast to deal with if you were forced to manually focus it on a DSLR with a focusing screen not optimized for manual focus.

I can MF just fine on the "small" pentamirror of my Pentax K2000. And that's wide open on my 50 f/1.7. Don't need no stinkin' confirmation from the camera... let your eyes do the work. 😉

Again, in context, the AF-S lens selection in quite good for the D5000's demographic. I'm not saying there aren't holes in the lineup, but they are fairly minor unless there is a specific need for a specific lens.