Is There a SPY INSIDE yr HDD?

[Virgorising]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/02/16/nsa-computer-spying_n_6694736.html?ir=Technology

 

[shabby]

Crap they can see all my porn!

 

[Virgorising]

Crap they can see all my porn!

K, that was cute.....but seriously, this does not shock you? Storage Mfgs are in league with them and do this?

I find it shocking. U think I am sheltered?

U think they can do this with our SSDs too? Flash drives? How would that be even possible?

Edit: U think re SSDs it could be in firmware?

This don creep everyone out? I am my cryptologist friend from MIT are the only ones taking this seriously and being creeped out? I just sent him the link a hour ago....even he did not know about this re hardware.

 

[Virgorising]

Started delving, and just found THIS:

http://www.maximumpc.com/signs_point_nsa_embedding_spy_software_consumer_hard_drives_2015

See that? Says "FIRMWARE'!!!!! Says U bet, SSDs!

With SSDs.....how else could they do it, after all?

This means, while I doubt my WD Black backup drive which I bought used on ebay has one, it may be too old, but who knows?.....bet my Crucial SSD with up to date firmware does.

People! Seriously?????? In our HARDWARE????

Soon, they will lean on Intel and AMD and put them in all CPUs. WUT??? How can they do this???? In the dark?
*************************************************
Another link:
http://www.techtimes.com/articles/3...eapon-hard-drives-spy-computers-worldwide.htm

 

[Elixer]

Started delving, and just found THIS:

http://www.maximumpc.com/signs_point_nsa_embedding_spy_software_consumer_hard_drives_2015

See that? Says "FIRMWARE'!!!!! Says U bet, SSDs!

With SSDs.....how else could they do it, after all?

This means, while I doubt my WD Black backup drive which I bought used on ebay has one, it may be too old, but who knows?.....bet my Crucial SSD with up to date firmware does.

People! Seriously?????? In our HARDWARE????

Soon, they will lean on Intel and AMD and put them in all CPUs. WUT??? How can they do this???? In the dark?
*************************************************
Another link:
http://www.techtimes.com/articles/3...eapon-hard-drives-spy-computers-worldwide.htm

Why aren't you posting the actual source, instead of trash links that are just copying the original story ?
http://blog.kaspersky.com/equation-hdd-malware/

This particular "malware" is NOT in your hardware per se, it is in your software that is on the hardware. There is a difference.

All nations that have the knowledge on how to do this kind of stuff, do it. This isn't limited to only one US based agency.
The OEMs don't have to give permission to them either, this is all done in stealth.

Have you heard of wire taps ? This is the digital equivalent more or less, and is aimed at certain actors.

Here is a news flash for you, there is microcode that can make your CPU do other things instead of what was originally intended. This is nothing new, and is done all the time.

You can go back to your 'sky is falling' now.

 

[Red Squirrel]

Glad I use raid. They're only going to see raw chunks of data, at least at the individual drive level. This is still bad because they could just get the data from all drives and piece it back together if they wanted to. It might be time to start using encryption too but now that trucrypt is gone not sure what else is out there and what can even be trusted. Lot of this stuff ends up being developed by the NSA anyway. Selinux for example.

Maybe turning the whole house into a faraday cage does not sound as crazy anymore... it seems every device is spying on us these days. At least this is assuming these spy bugs are using RF and not somehow linking themselves to your nic and passing data through the same IP the OS has. I can't see how this would be possible at the hardware level but I'm far from an expert at this stuff.

We really need an open source hardware platform, where even the firmware is open source.

 

[shabby]

K, that was cute.....but seriously, this does not shock you? Storage Mfgs are in league with them and do this?

Shocking... maybe, mostly because im sure they're doing worse things that haven't been uncovered yet. How do you stop them though? Its almost like they're run by dr evil.

 

[crashtech]

A drive firmware update might fix this, but those aren't available for too many drives. Once awareness of this problem spreads, that might change.

 

[Virgorising]

Why aren't you posting the actual source, instead of trash links that are just copying the original story ?

Why didn't YOU bring this to light and in the only way you insist is proper?

This particular "malware" is NOT in your hardware per se, it is in your software that is on the hardware. There is a difference.

But all the hardware in question has firmware, and this phenomenon came about via the NSA leaning on hardware Mfgs. and it seems, demanding their collusion.

All nations that have the knowledge on how to do this kind of stuff, do it. This isn't limited to only one US based agency. The OEMs don't have to give permission to them either, this is all done in stealth.

Truly? All nations? I think not. Pls offer documentation. And, you are saying the collusion of the Mfgs is NOT NECESSARY? Really? How counter intuitive is that? U mean, some phantom infiltrates every drive at some point at the factory? In the shipping? Drugs or waterboards they who write the firmware?

Have you heard of wire taps ? This is the digital equivalent more or less, and is aimed at certain actors.

Forgive me, but the underpinnings of condescension (also self protective cynicism) are something I and mine find not worthy of respect.

Here is a news flash for you, there is microcode that can make your CPU do other things instead of what was originally intended. This is nothing new, and is done all the time.

Along with the underpinnings of condescension, I and mine also find those fueling know it all sensibility, a related phenomenon, compromising respect.

Objectively, this is a major story as of late. Course, you might email Reuters and mock THAT formidable entity as being ignorant, alarmist. Or, Kaspersky itself!:sneaky:

 

[Virgorising]

Shocking... maybe, mostly because im sure they're doing worse things that haven't been uncovered yet. How do you stop them though? Its almost like they're run by dr evil.

There is a time to fiddle while Rome burns---when we've given up....and there is a time to put down the fiddle. While what moved him remains in question, what Snowden did was a very big deal. Can't work to mitigate anything bad unless we know it exists.

It's always a battle; what worth achieving culturally for the collective isn't? But at least Constitutionally, this is still America.

 

[Virgorising]

A drive firmware update might fix this, but those aren't available for too many drives. Once awareness of this problem spreads, that might change.

But not if the syping firmware in question is a product of the collusion it appears to be to achieve access. In that event, all updates would bear the same.

 

[Virgorising]

Glad I use raid. They're only going to see raw chunks of data, at least at the individual drive level. This is still bad because they could just get the data from all drives and piece it back together if they wanted to. It might be time to start using encryption too but now that trucrypt is gone not sure what else is out there and what can even be trusted. Lot of this stuff ends up being developed by the NSA anyway. Selinux for example.

Maybe turning the whole house into a faraday cage does not sound as crazy anymore... it seems every device is spying on us these days. At least this is assuming these spy bugs are using RF and not somehow linking themselves to your nic and passing data through the same IP the OS has. I can't see how this would be possible at the hardware level but I'm far from an expert at this stuff.

We really need an open source hardware platform, where even the firmware is open source.

Thanks so much for this dense with viable data and so, helpful offering! Including the personal pathology free spirit marking all of it.:thumbsup:

 

[crashtech]

But not if the syping firmware in question is a product of the collusion it appears to be to achieve access. In that event, all updates would bear the same.

Yeah, but if the firmware is downloadable it can be taken apart to see if anything malicious is inside.

 

[Virgorising]

Yeah, but if the firmware is downloadable it can be taken apart to see if anything malicious is inside.

Well, that is entirely logical. BUT, also, nothing I, for one, would know how to do at all. Then, there is the possibility that doing it might disable the drive and render it useless.

 

[HOSED]

http://rt.com/news/232907-equation-group-hackers-nsa-tools/ related story here, Thanks for posting this Vigorising!

 

[Virgorising]

http://rt.com/news/232907-equation-group-hackers-nsa-tools/ related story here, Thanks for posting this Vigorising!

Interesting. As I recall it was postulated the that group was behind trying to mess up SONY showing The Interview....but the FBI said no. (I did not luv the film, but also did not hate it as I expected to.)

This tsunami of hacking, including the recent successful theft of BILLIONS from banks, wicked scary!

But, for me, there is still a difference in something which is inherent in a new drive to facilitate access.....and external hackers.

Before the sky actually falls, it is increasingly filled with ominous clouds; anyone making light of that....is simply craven.

And thank U for the thank U. I mean it.:thumbsup: Course, how could I not?
If not here.....where?

 

[hhhd1]

We really need an open source hardware platform, where even the firmware is open source.

If someone care enough, we do not need open source, reverse engineering the firmware should not be impossible for people who know how to do it.

 

[smangular]

Its a non issue as this appears to be an attack requiring massive funding to carry out.
We have lower hanging issues to worry about like always using flash in a disposable vm for safety.

 

[Virgorising]

If someone care enough, we do not need open source, reverse engineering the firmware should not be impossible for people who know how to do it.

Good point. But that such an esoteric endeavor might be necessary....in and of itself is daunting and not to be trivialized, given it reiterates the seriousness of this.

 

[Virgorising]

Its a non issue as this appears to be an attack requiring massive funding to carry out.
We have lower hanging issues to worry about like always using flash in a disposable vm for safety.

Neither Kaspersky, Reuters, nor any of the other formidable, reputable outlets who chose to pick up on this story consider it a non issue.

And the NSA HAS massive funding....and the terror 9-11 engendered has never abated, quite the opposite, and that has created a crescendo of abuse of power and secrecy. And, in the face of such as ISIS, the sky seems to be the limit re entitlement/the end justifies the means, forget the law, forget the Constitution, for the NSA and related agencies here in the U.S.A.

And this, is apparently a fait accompli.... not some hysterical ruminating about what is possible.

Remember, Snowden, deemed a traitor, had to seek aslyum in Russia. Nice they let his girlfriend join him, but it is wut it is. Maybe they do lunch and hang out with the Kaspersky people.:whiste:

 

[Virgorising]

Sorry, gotta add this.

Re the head exploding false parallel meant to trivialize all this re “You’ve heard of wire taps?”

Anyone over the age of 7 and with the IQ of room temp knows about wire taps. In this, it’s entirely moot.

What is NOT moot: in an environment where we are all protected by meticulously evolved laws, rules, checks and balances, agencies had to obtain proper warrants to install wire taps. And, as per precious rules of evidence, nothing obtained via an illegal wiretap would be admissible in any court.

Same deal with illegal searches; same deal with suspects not properly apprised of their rights under Miranda.

So wire taps and THIS = apples and wolverines.

 

[Blain]

That's it...
I'm only buying US Made hardware from now on.

 

[Virgorising]

That's it...
I'm only buying US Made hardware from now on.

This....is adorable. Cept....1) the NSA would have few reservations "waterboarding" domestic Mfgs. cept for possible neo-Snowden whistleblowers....

..and 2) Are ANY drives made here now? Didn't The NAFTA pretty much end that along with too many related things? Positive my Crucial SSD isn't made here.....can't remember a time when any puter hardware said made in America. Old HDDs I tried to destroy (with methods I learned here) before throwing them out, you bet. But newer hardware?

I mean it...I have no clue.

I do encourage everyone to see see Citizen Four. I don't like him personally, appreciate what he did... but the female docu filmmaker who made it is one of my new heros. Talk about character and gonads!!!!

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Edit:

Just did a quick search and found this:

http://www.computersmadeinusa.com/

I applaud the direction all these people are going in, better late than NEVER.....but come on....assembled in the USA, OR, as per Dell now, customer service based here....not at all the same as USA made PARTS.

But again, at this juncture, Made in the USA would hardly guarantee free of what the NSA has felt entitled to install with impunity, under what umbrella I do not know, but The Patriot act needs revisiting BIGTIME.

I would like hard evidence proving this rogue phenomenon has helped preclude any terrorist anything ANYWHERE.

 

[Virgorising]

HOLD THE PRESSES!

Just did another search and found this!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_solid-state_drive_manufacturers
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Just searched Crucial SSDs, came upon this giddy goody re SUCH CLEAN ROOMS, YAY!!!!!

http://www.geek.com/games/how-its-made-crucial-ssds-come-from-very-clean-rooms-1536568/

Course, the rooms in question are in Singapore and China.

 

[Brian Stirling]

What this and the other reports on NSA spying show is that they, the NSA, are using EVERY technique to spy that they can. And, since they can't know which unit is going to terrorists they cover this by spying on everyone. I mean, if they knew a specific HD was going to a terrorist they would also already know where they are and wouldn't need to plant spy software/firmware.

The thing is, even if you were to eliminate government spying on everyone, Google and just about everyone is doing the same thing for commercial reasons. Long ago the government would not have permitted companies to spy on people like they do now, but given the fact that the data collected by Google et al is also available to the NSA and other government agencies, including local police forces, the government has no desire at all to reign in the commercial spying efforts -- in fact, they mandate data retention.

The founding fathers of the USA would be engaged in efforts to begin a second revolution if they were alive today. Sadly, too many here and elsewhere think this is OK.


Brian