Is there a point to building desktops for people anymore?

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Morbus

Senior member
Apr 10, 2009
998
0
0
7 inch tablets don't kill arms. 10 inchers do, and maybe some 8 inchers.
7inch tablets are phones, pretty much... They're like a tenth of my screen size, you can't "do anything" on them.

Laptops burn your thighs, not your balls, unless you have some strange fetish with the warm bottom of the laptop.
Lol. I don't use laptops, but everyone I know that does, either do it at their desk, or they do it while laying down, or sitting in a sofa in a severely non-orthopedic way. At least in their case, their crotch is very close to the vents...

Of course mileage may vary.

Geeks would never have been able to support PCs on their own. It has always been enterprise/professionals and the affluent with deep pockets to afford the higher end, especially back in the 90s. And who's to say they still aren't using a desktop.
I'm sorry, what are those if not geeks?! An professional that uses a computer, I'm sorry, and specially in the 90s, those are GEEKS! Those are pure bred, original real slim shady geeks! With tortoise glasses and all.

Either that or I didn't read you right.
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,587
10,225
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I'm not meaning to be an elitist. I am simply saying that there's no point in going with full size desktop PC unless you are putting something higher end than is typically found in laptops.

Why spend on a nice case and power supply when you only need a tiny little case and a 100W power supply...

I didn't mean to say that you have to spend $1000. I meant that a $300 build is generally not worth the time/energy since an all in one or laptop in the $300 price range will generally be "as good."

The benefit of going with a desktop vs a laptop is that you have more more room and generally more power. Those benefits really are only benefits if you make use of them.

Now I see what you're saying. Thanks for clarifying, and sorry if I seemed brusque.

I kind of agree. For "budget" desktops, I try to build people something small, and more importantly, inexpensive. Basically, (I started a thread in C&C about this), I'm looking for the cheapest way to build an ITX net-top. It seems though, that the smaller your form-factor, the more expensive the cases and PSUs get, which is counter-intuitive in a way.
 

Doppel

Lifer
Feb 5, 2011
13,306
3
0
Home-built computers stopped being cheaper than pre-built a very long time ago for most users. Pre-built come with an OS and obviously a very low OEM price for the manufacturer, too. I think the average joe really should only build a desktop if they really feel the need/want to, not because they should. I'm about to build my first in almost a decade because on a whim I decided to read about what I was getting into, and as always custom-built does allow the easiest path to upgrading. Since I already have an OS I get something for the same price as buying premade but without the proprietary stuff.
 

Torn Mind

Lifer
Nov 25, 2012
12,078
2,772
136
7inch tablets are phones, pretty much... They're like a tenth of my screen size, you can't "do anything" on them.
7 inch tablets are too big to be phones. The ergonomics are terrible for that particular use case, never mind the lack of out-of-the-box support for phone service. They can be e-readers, maps that point out points of interest, such as the cheapest gas station, email checker, online banking tool, or even something to administer a computer remotely via SSH or RDP if absolutely necessary. Anything that requires typing or screen space, they fail miserably in. But to say you can't "do anything" with them is hyperbole. Arguably limited? Yes. Not suitable for everything? Yes. No useful purpose? No.

Lol. I don't use laptops, but everyone I know that does, either do it at their desk, or they do it while laying down, or sitting in a sofa in a severely non-orthopedic way. At least in their case, their crotch is very close to the vents...
CPU fans vent out to the side. The "hot spots" are on perhaps near the qwerty and asdf rows on the laptop keyboard and maybe the hard drive could get hot. I know because the old PIII Dell CSx certainly left my thighs red. But to put the CPU hot spot of the laptop on the crotch, and close enough to the balls, is a difficult task to do.

Of course mileage may vary.

I'm sorry, what are those if not geeks?! An professional that uses a computer, I'm sorry, and specially in the 90s, those are GEEKS! Those are pure bred, original real slim shady geeks! With tortoise glasses and all.

Either that or I didn't read you right.

Geeks are, in essence, intellectuals or someone who is rather is "deep" in learning of a particular subject. Yes, there are also assumptions of social awkwardness and thinking about "atypical" topics. A computer user is hardly geeky, even if they can manage the command line in DOS like a pro or set up an ISA card. Someone who used Photoshop then could hardly be considered a "geek" in the sense of wanting to know how computers work or learning the finer theory behind electronics. A self-purported "geek" must be able to back it up by displaying his deep knowledge in those subjects he is madly interested in. Or, show that he is passionate about acquiring new information he can about the subject. Those who cannot, simply cannot be a geek for that particular subject.

You might not believe it, but I suspect that most professionals that use computers but are non-techies only consider them to be boxes that do things. The finer nuances of an OS are unknown to them, an electronic component bulges their eyes out, and opening up the case is something they've never done in their lives. Lawyers who use computers in the office can hardly be considered "geeks" unless you mean law geeks, which also imply being logic geeks.An economics professor who regression analysis for their research hardly requires deep knowledge of the Windows OS or hardware. The graphic designers at a studio such as Dreamworks, likewise, do not need to be a computer geek. Nor do those stock traders at Wall Street. But it seems these people are beneath you because using a desktop somehow makes you an intellectual.
 
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Torn Mind

Lifer
Nov 25, 2012
12,078
2,772
136
Now I see what you're saying. Thanks for clarifying, and sorry if I seemed brusque.

I kind of agree. For "budget" desktops, I try to build people something small, and more importantly, inexpensive. Basically, (I started a thread in C&C about this), I'm looking for the cheapest way to build an ITX net-top. It seems though, that the smaller your form-factor, the more expensive the cases and PSUs get, which is counter-intuitive in a way.
I can think of three potential reasons.

Custom engineering plus a more unique method required to assemble the case is probably part of the reason. Plus, demand is weaker than for more cost effective parts, so they charge more to rake in a decent profit.
 

denis280

Diamond Member
Jan 16, 2011
3,434
9
81
Laptop and tablet are getting kids out of the house. But a good desktop and big screen will always be good for gamers.and old timer like me.and also i like to customize my tower.it looks great
 

piasabird

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
17,168
60
91
I hate to say something socialist like this, but I will do it anyway. If the government or IRS offered a special green energy rebate to computer makers/citizens who built a computer using Mini-ITX and smaller computers, maybe the industry would make computers significantly smaller. I figure a lot of the old computer cases are headed for a landfill somewhere.

Of course the government could also require all case and retail computer manufacturers pay to get rid of their old cases/computers. Make them pay a disposal cost based on the components and the weight and size of the overall system up front. Of course that would just mean retail purchasers would pay more. The idea is to give them an incentive to build smaller computers.

I think Intel had a good idea when they designed the NUC. However, most people need even occasionally to use an optical drive. I think they made a mistake not adding enough space for a slim optical drive.
 
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Remobz

Platinum Member
Jun 9, 2005
2,564
37
91
It depends on their intended use. I like setting at a desk even when I'm cruising the web... I'll always have a desktop, I have no interest in a tablet of any sort. I'm not even that much of a laptop guy anymore, when I can use my iPhone for all basic functions when I'm away.

But if you want to set out on the patio, slurp your morning coffee and flip through the latest fashions at JCPenney or update FB, a tablet is pretty hard to beat.

As far as a SFF, there are inherent limitations on something like what you listed... lack of storage, still need a monitor/keyboard/mouse, typical slow CPU.

Well, I ONLY had desktop computers since 1997 with a range of monitors from 15 inches to 23 inches. Been using 23 inch IPS panels for over 2 years now and I love surfing the net and playing games at 1080p.

However, I just bought my FIRST laptop a year ago and although its a 14 inch laptop I find myself using it more and more. Its really nice having a laptop that be used anywhere in the house and in bed when relaxing. Basically, my desktop is collecting dust these days and my poor IPS 23 inch panel is barely used these days as well:(

Personally, I hate watching videos or browsing the internet on anything smaller than a 14
inch laptop. Yes, small tablets are convenient but I hate using them if I had a choice.

In a nutshell, I was always using desktops with nice size monitors until a year ago when I bought a laptop (mostly use that now). I despise using anything smaller than a 14 inch screen to surf the net and complete other tasks.
 

DominionSeraph

Diamond Member
Jul 22, 2009
8,386
32
91
I hate to say something socialist like this, but I will do it anyway. If the government or IRS offered a special green energy rebate to computer makers/citizens who built a computer using Mini-ITX and smaller computers, maybe the industry would make computers significantly smaller. I figure a lot of the old computer cases are headed for a landfill somewhere.

It's a good thing you're not in charge of socializing industries because you're horrible at recognizing where it's needed.
There's money in scrap. Recycling computers is taken care of by private industry. And steel is only ~16 cents a pound, with there being maybe 7lbs in a cheap mid-tower. The difference in energy from ore to your door between a mid-tower and mini-ITX is negligible, the total cost is negligible compared to the cost of operating the computer (which is independent of form factor), and the cost of operating a computer is negligible compared to the major energy expenditures of heating, lighting, and transportation. Any incentive to buy new PCs would just be a hand-out to Intel and Microsoft and do practically nothing for the consumer but give them the luxury of a faster machine.
 

Torn Mind

Lifer
Nov 25, 2012
12,078
2,772
136
I hate to say something socialist like this, but I will do it anyway. If the government or IRS offered a special green energy rebate to computer makers/citizens who built a computer using Mini-ITX and smaller computers, maybe the industry would make computers significantly smaller. I figure a lot of the old computer cases are headed for a landfill somewhere.

Of course the government could also require all case and retail computer manufacturers pay to get rid of their old cases/computers. Make them pay a disposal cost based on the components and the weight and size of the overall system up front. Of course that would just mean retail purchasers would pay more. The idea is to give them an incentive to build smaller computers.

I think Intel had a good idea when they designed the NUC. However, most people need even occasionally to use an optical drive. I think they made a mistake not adding enough space for a slim optical drive.

It's a good thing you're not in charge of socializing industries because you're horrible at recognizing where it's needed.
There's money in scrap. Recycling computers is taken care of by private industry. And steel is only ~16 cents a pound, with there being maybe 7lbs in a cheap mid-tower. The difference in energy from ore to your door between a mid-tower and mini-ITX is negligible, the total cost is negligible compared to the cost of operating the computer (which is independent of form factor), and the cost of operating a computer is negligible compared to the major energy expenditures of heating, lighting, and transportation. Any incentive to buy new PCs would just be a hand-out to Intel and Microsoft and do practically nothing for the consumer but give them the luxury of a faster machine.
Yes, DominionSeraph has the right idea. The main thing is educating the public into being aware scrap metal companies exist.

The real enviro-killer is that the solder on old circuit boards often contains lead, and people unaware of that fact will just throw away their computer rather than salvage the circuit boards, just like they toss CFLs away like incandescent bulbs. Older hardware could be viable for gold extraction, which is also scrapping.
 

IGBT

Lifer
Jul 16, 2001
17,976
141
106
you have to decide if you want a entertainment novelty gadget or something more serious that may have greater utility. (laptop / desktop).
 

Cerb

Elite Member
Aug 26, 2000
17,484
33
86
It's a good thing you're not in charge of socializing industries because you're horrible at recognizing where it's needed.
There's money in scrap. Recycling computers is taken care of by private industry.
There may be money in scrap, but there is a cost to pick up the PCs, disassemble them, separate out components that are complicated/impossible to recycle, and turn the rest into scrap, before selling the scrap. Enough so that they generally want to be paid to be able to do it. PC recyclers want to be paid money to take the PCs away, while the waste management companies are already being paid for it.

I think it would be a great idea, but businesses will not pay extra for that option, unless they have no other choice. In my area, I don't know of any companies that will take PCs and scrap them for free, but there are a couple that will do it for a fee.
 

videogames101

Diamond Member
Aug 24, 2005
6,783
27
91
and then they visit a flash heavy site, watch the tablet slow to a crawl, and say their tablet is broken and they buy a new one