Is the Pope actually mentioned in the Bible?

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: CaptainGoodnight
[Matt. 16:18?19]

The Lord said to Peter, ?On this rock I will build my Church, I have given you the keys of the kingdom of heaven and whatever you shall have bound or loosed on earth will be bound or loosed in heaven?

This is from the bible btw: This is what Catholics use as justification for the Pope. Many disagree however. There has been much spilled ink in the pass 400 years over this passage.

I was about ready to cite this passage.

Think of this way. What good is ANY organization without a leader? The US is supposed to be a democracy, ruled by the people, but we elect a President. A corporation is supposed to run by its stockholders, but it elects a CEO. Nobody questions these do they?

And they all talk to God too, right?

 

[kage69]

Dont cry for me whimp. I was just slapping absurdity with absurdity. Having fun, thats all.

The only thing you were slapping was your pudknocker. If you're ever in Baltimore, PM me so you can call me a whimp to my face and receive a free attitude adjustment. It'd be fun, that's all. 🙂

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: shrumpage

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Americans think of Bush like a Pope. Very evident here.

really? I did not know that.....

that would explain the communin wafers i got at my last republican brain washing meeting...

Oh, you went to Church last Sunday.

 

[CycloWizard]

Originally posted by: rickn
yes, I'm sure you're a bible expert :roll:. There is a few things I learned, Peter's denial, and the fact that at Jesus' crucifixion John was the only one there. See, you can learn a lot from watching a movie.

I'm far from a Biblical scholar. However, I'm well aware of the passage that someone already quoted in this thread, where Jesus says 'You are Peter (Rock), and on this rock I build my church." I'm also aware of what transpired directly before that line - where Peter stood up and said that Jesus was the son of God, the Messiah, and so on.

Originally posted by: cquark
However, there is no leader for Christianity as plenty of people question the leadership of the Pope. The Great Schism arose when the European church split itself into the Orthodox and Catholic churches, with the Bishops of Rome and Constantinople excommunicating each other. A few centuries later, Martin Luther broke away from the Catholic branch of the church with the Reformation, and of course, the Asian and African churches have never accepted Roman dominance.

However, now all but one sect of Lutherans have reconciled with the Catholic Church, as the RCCC has pretty much accepted Luther's theses. Yet another one of PJP2's greatest accomplishments that doesn't make headlines.

 

[surreal1221]

Originally posted by: conjur
Uhhhh



NO.



Purely man-made.

I like it. . . lol

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: cquark

Originally posted by: Vic
Think of this way. What good is ANY organization without a leader? The US is supposed to be a democracy, ruled by the people, but we elect a President. A corporation is supposed to run by its stockholders, but it elects a CEO. Nobody questions these do they?

However, there is no leader for Christianity as plenty of people question the leadership of the Pope. The Great Schism arose when the European church split itself into the Orthodox and Catholic churches, with the Bishops of Rome and Constantinople excommunicating each other. A few centuries later, Martin Luther broke away from the Catholic branch of the church with the Reformation, and of course, the Asian and African churches have never accepted Roman dominance.

Who was referring to Christianity as a whole? I was referring to the organization of the Catholic church, which requires a leader just like any other organization. The Catholic church claims the authority of that leadership from the Bible, that is sufficient enough for them, and they do not require my permission or yours to do so. Thinking so (if you'll pardon me) is patently idiotic and arrogant.
I am not Catholic, and neither I suspect are you.

 

[MCWAR]

Originally posted by: kage69

Dont cry for me whimp. I was just slapping absurdity with absurdity. Having fun, thats all.

The only thing you were slapping was your pudknocker. If you're ever in Baltimore, PM me so you can call me a whimp to my face and receive a free attitude adjustment. It'd be fun, that's all. 🙂

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sounds more like the only thing I slapped was a geeks ego.
Even though I know your not serious, ( as you dont have a pm available) Why dont you go ahead and post your name address and phone number so I can look you up when Im in your neck of the woods.
And rememner, big girls don't cry.:brokenheart:

 

[piasabird]

No Pope is in the bible. In fact I sometimes wonder why Rome Italy ever became some center for christian believers. The Romans killed most of the Christian leaders. It is strange how things like this work out. Paul did stay in Rome a long time.

This reminds me of the movie titled "The Robe"

 

[cquark]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: cquark

Originally posted by: Vic
Think of this way. What good is ANY organization without a leader? The US is supposed to be a democracy, ruled by the people, but we elect a President. A corporation is supposed to run by its stockholders, but it elects a CEO. Nobody questions these do they?

However, there is no leader for Christianity as plenty of people question the leadership of the Pope. The Great Schism arose when the European church split itself into the Orthodox and Catholic churches, with the Bishops of Rome and Constantinople excommunicating each other. A few centuries later, Martin Luther broke away from the Catholic branch of the church with the Reformation, and of course, the Asian and African churches have never accepted Roman dominance.

Who was referring to Christianity as a whole?

That quote from Matthew refers to Christianity as a whole.

 

[cquark]

Originally posted by: piasabird
No Pope is in the bible. In fact I sometimes wonder why Rome Italy ever became some center for christian believers.

Rome became important largely because of the fall of the Western Roman Empire to German tribes who they later Christianized. It was a center for culture and knowledge.

The other Patriarchates, which were more important in the days of the Roman Empire, all eventually fell to Islam and none are in Christian control to this day, so their leadership of the church waned, while the power of Rome grew as Western Europe grew powerful after 1500.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: cquark
That quote from Matthew refers to Christianity as a whole.

"Christianity" did not exist when Christ said those words. Christ was a Jew.

Regardless, you're clouding the issue. Even if I were Christian, I would not accept the Pope as my spiritual leader. Because I'm not Catholic, fancy that. But that does not in any way shape or form prevent the Catholics from having their pope or claiming that passage for the foundation of his leadership.

If the South had successfully seceeded from the North in the Civil War, would the North no longer be able to have a President per the Constitution? That is, in essense, the argument you are making.

 

[cquark]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: cquark
That quote from Matthew refers to Christianity as a whole.

"Christianity" did not exist when Christ said those words. Christ was a Jew.

To the church, then, if you dislike the term Christianity.

Regardless, you're clouding the issue.

Are you so sure you're not missing the beam in your own eye and missing my point?

Even if I were Christian, I would not accept the Pope as my spiritual leader. Because I'm not Catholic, fancy that. But that does not in any way shape or form prevent the Catholics from having their pope or claiming that passage for the foundation of his leadership.

I'm pointing out that their claim is quite a bit broader than that. The Pope is the leader of all Christians, not just the Catholics.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: MCWAR
dmcowen674
Quote:
I have seen a ship and have documented proof of at least two minutes of missing time.

Cool, I made sig material :thumbsup:

Now if they would just beam me out of this hell hole would be very 😎

 

[Riprorin]

Originally posted by: CaptainGoodnight
[Matt. 16:18?19]

The Lord said to Peter, ?On this rock I will build my Church, I have given you the keys of the kingdom of heaven and whatever you shall have bound or loosed on earth will be bound or loosed in heaven?

This is from the bible btw: This is what Catholics use as justification for the Pope. Many disagree however. There has been much spilled ink in the pass 400 years over this passage.

The rock that the the church is built on is Jesus.

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: Riprorin

Originally posted by: CaptainGoodnight
[Matt. 16:18?19]

The Lord said to Peter, ?On this rock I will build my Church, I have given you the keys of the kingdom of heaven and whatever you shall have bound or loosed on earth will be bound or loosed in heaven?

This is from the bible btw: This is what Catholics use as justification for the Pope. Many disagree however. There has been much spilled ink in the pass 400 years over this passage.

The rock that the the church is built on is Jesus.

Unless your not Christian. The problem with any organized religion is that they all claim to be the "true" religion. Doesn't that defeat the purpose of everyone believing in one God?

The Muslims beleive in Mohamed as the true prophet, The Mormans have their own prophet, the Christians beleive in Christ but can't get their details straight between the various factions, and the Jews are still waiting for their their Messiah. What a mess.

 

[Riprorin]

I like the fact that I can chose a denomination whose views mostly closely match my own interpretation of Scripture.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: cquark
I'm pointing out that their claim is quite a bit broader than that. The Pope is the leader of all Christians, not just the Catholics.

That is scarcely atypical. The Mormons believe that their prophet is the leader of the "One True Church" but their belief to that effect doesn't necessarily make it so, now does it? I would say that the thing applies to the Catholics.

As your beam comment, I find that honestly (truthfully) amusing. IMO if 2 people are arguing about anything, that means that the "beam" of emotion is in both their eyes.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Riprorin
I like the fact that I can chose a denomination whose views mostly closely match my own interpretation of Scripture.

I bet you chose your views of the Scripture to match the views of the denomination that you belong too.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Riprorin
I like the fact that I can chose a denomination whose views mostly closely match my own interpretation of Scripture.

I bet you chose your views of the Scripture to match the views of the denomination that you belong too.

Well, of course he does. The same way you choose your own evidence to define your own worldview. Is it possible that it could be any other way?

 

[Riprorin]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Riprorin
I like the fact that I can chose a denomination whose views mostly closely match my own interpretation of Scripture.

I bet you chose your views of the Scripture to match the views of the denomination that you belong too.

Nope. I have some problems with some of the doctrinal views of the church I attend now (Lutheran Missouri Synod), but I go there because they have good childrens' programs and I like there music ministry.

I should change churches.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Riprorin
I like the fact that I can chose a denomination whose views mostly closely match my own interpretation of Scripture.

I bet you chose your views of the Scripture to match the views of the denomination that you belong too.

Well, of course he does. The same way you choose your own evidence to define your own worldview. Is it possible that it could be any other way?

I can go with that however he (Rip) doesn't agree with you

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Riprorin

The rock that the the church is built on is Jesus.

Unless your not Christian. The problem with any organized religion is that they all claim to be the "true" religion. Doesn't that defeat the purpose of everyone believing in one God?

The Muslims beleive in Mohamed as the true prophet, The Mormans have their own prophet, the Christians beleive in Christ but can't get their details straight between the various factions, and the Jews are still waiting for their their Messiah. What a mess.

Amen :thumbsup:

 

[cquark]

Originally posted by: Vic
As your beam comment, I find that honestly (truthfully) amusing. IMO if 2 people are arguing about anything, that means that the "beam" of emotion is in both their eyes.

It was meant to be amusing, though with an element of truth, as I often find your replies orthogonal to my meaning, as in our P vs NP discussion.

 

[impeachbush]

I'm pointing out that their claim is quite a bit broader than that. The Pope is the leader of all Christians, not just the Catholics.

and I am leader of earth...

 

[aidanjm]

Originally posted by: rickn

Originally posted by: litesgod

Originally posted by: beach2nd1
With all of the news about the pope and the selection of a new pope recently I started to think about the whole situation. Is the title/position of Pope ever actually mentioned in the Bible (new or old testament) or is this a man-made position? If it is man-made how is it justified that someone besides God could be called the "holy father"?

Roman Catholics believe that Jesus created the position of 'head of the church' when he called Peter "the rock on which I will build my church." Hence the Roman Catholic tradition that Peter was the first bishop of rome and all popes have theologically descended from him.

Most protestant churchs don't believe in the position of 'head of the church', and instead believe it was a prophetic statement of Peter's role in the early church.

Obviously the actual term Pope is never used, nor the term Pontiff as these are both latin in orgin.

why they ever picked Peter, we'll never know

I would have thought that was obvious, Peter was Jesus' gay lover.