is the future set?

[Cosmic_Horror]

from the post on nostradamus....


do you belive that things are destine to occur?
or do we 'create' the future by our own actions?
does chance effect our lives or are some things decided by fate?

 

[Jugernot]

Nope, I guarantee if you went right now and pissed on a cop's leg, you're future wouldn't be see the same as it would have been yesterday! Urine seems to mess with the space time continuum sometimes? Feces seems to have the same effect!?!?!

 

[yakko]

Jugernot,

WOW! Such a mind blowing statement. I will now have to rethink my outlook on life.

 

[Azraele]

I have heard all the philosophical arguments on the subjects, but the question seems to beg for an opinion over an argument so I will give you mine. I believe that certain events are set and cannot be altered, but that for the most part, the decisions we make in life are our own.

 

[DataFly]

Think of it this way: at the time of the Big Bang when all the particles in the universe were set in motion, their paths were predetermined. You could have predicted where they would be at any given time if you knew the state of each and every one because the forces they exerted would have been predictable. In other words, the future is already set.

When you bring religion and God (or Gods) into the mix, though, this doesn't apply because an all-powerful being could change the nature of the particles and thus change their paths.



I hope that made sense.

 

[hpkeeper]

I believe we create our future by our own actions... but I also believe that our fate changes by what we do in our actions that create the future...

for example:

You are on god's 86 list for the day of dying late in the day of a heart attack, you are driving around and racing with your friends and you splatter yourself all over a tree you crash into...

You where destined to die of a heart attack, but you acctually beat yourself to that destination in another form...

Did that sound right?

 

[LordMaul]

There is no fate than what we make for ourselves....errrr....

 

[MajesticMoose]

My opinion is no, but are you purposefully trying to start a flame session. There have been to many of these topics lately

hmm.... y the |-|ell do i keep replying to them then? good question.

 

[SirCampsALot]

LordMaul, nice Terminator 2 reference (line said by Sarah Connor)

 

[Mday]

anything that can happen does happen.

any future that is probable happens. but will "you" notice? probably not.

 

[Cosmic_Horror]

MajesticMoose

no i wasn't trying to state a flame session here...

just from the other post was curious what people believed in.
Many believe that prophets exist, and thus if they can predict the future, then the future (at least to some degree) is set and unchangeable.

DataFly

Interesting thoughts... basically from what you are saying is that the laws of the universe are set and everything is governed by those phyiscal laws, then everything prepetuating from the big bang is predictable provided we know all the laws, variables, conditions etc etc.

But does chance come in to play at all? we now that for simple reactions of basic molecules that there 3 conditions need to be met before areaction must occur
1- the molecule must collide
2- they must have a certain energy threshold must be overcome
3- the molecules must collide with a certain orientation

 

[JoeKing]

Depends on your point of view

From the state of the present looking into the past where the present was the furture of the past then yes the future is set, since the future is the present in respect to the past and the future is determined.

Then you can say from the point of view of the future in respect to the present how can you say it's set or not when the future cannot be experianced until it has come to past becoming the present.

hehehe follow me

Then you look at the past present future and realize that its all relavent.

 

[DataFly]

I'm not sure exactly what you mean by your last point. Could you restated it?



<< Interesting thoughts... basically from what you are saying is that the laws of the universe are set and everything is governed by those phyiscal laws, then everything prepetuating from the big bang is predictable provided we know all the laws, variables, conditions etc etc. >>


Well, yes, but when you put a supreme being like God in there, you can no longer predict anything.

 

[Cosmic_Horror]

DataFly

basically that if you know all the equations and variables etc (basically all the physics) then you could predict everything about these particles from the big bang and everything that occurs thereafter.



i didn't wish to introduce religion into this thread as then it could become a flame war!


Joeyman

i agree, hoever imagine a total sealed box with a cat inside. you can not know what is in the box, however that doesn't change the fact that there is something in it...

 

[JoeKing]

but how can you know there is a cat in it if you cannot prove there is a cat? What if the actual act of looking at the random particles in the box makes it become a cat, and when you close the box again the cat becomes undone?

 

[DataFly]

To predict the future you'd have to know EVERYTHING, including each aspect of every particle's state. This is impossible, however, since you cannot measure both the speed and direction of an object simultaneously. What if a dog started chasing the cat?

 

[nullshark]

No, I don't believe that the future is set.

And all probabilities are 50%
Either a thing will happen or it won't

 

[kami]

I don't believe the future is set, but how the hell are we to know anyway? There's no way to prove it either way, it's all a matter of opinion.

It's interesting how you say everything could have been set after the big bang...very interesting and thought provoking But if it's true then life is meaningless. That's why I'd like to believe that we set our own future

 

[DataFly]

I agree kami on the matter of life being meaningless then, so I try not to believe it myself.:Q

 

[Moonbeam]

Life IS meaningless. That's not a problem when you realize that meaninglessness is meaningless.

 

[Daedalus]

From this side of the time line, no it is not set. But it will happen only one way.

 

[Cosmic_Horror]

so if life was destine to occur then it is meaningless?
but if it occurs as a freak of nature then it has meaning?

life should have meaning regardless of how we got here...

 

[kami]

I meant like MY life...the decisions I make, the people I meet, etc....if this was all set, how could my life have any meaning? I don't mean LIFE literally.

 

[Cosmic_Horror]

oh i see...

sorry misunderstood what you meant...

yes i agree...

 

[Moonbeam]

What I am saying, kami, is that your question arises, in my opinion, out of the unexamined assumption that your life should or must have meaning, well, to be meaningful. I'm saying that not only is life meaningless, but that the need for meaning is not necessary (is meaningless) and that therin lies the door to freedom. The quest for meaning is a blind alley, an intellectual search for fulfillment, contentment, peace etc. that arises in the minds of some seekers out of an inner disatisfaction. unease or sense of incompleteness. What makes life meaningless is the inability to feel. Why do we not feel? Because we have repressed memory of pain that we don't want to reexperience. The antidote for meaninglessness isn't meaning, it's the joy of BEING (that can follow the release of pain).