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Is the economy screwed?
- Thread starter novon
- Start date
Abomination
Senior member
LOL!!!!!
OMG, that's such a good point NovoN. The economy kicks ass right now and it just keeps going up. Well... it won't anymore
But don't worry, for the next four years we'll get free stand up comedy.
OMG, that's such a good point NovoN. The economy kicks ass right now and it just keeps going up. Well... it won't anymore
But don't worry, for the next four years we'll get free stand up comedy.
<< The economy kicks ass right now and it just keeps going up. >>
What cave are you living in? The economy has been weakening since the beginning of 3rd quarter. Housing starts are down, layoffs are rapidly increasing, retail sales are sluggish, consumer confidence has dipped to the lowest level in five years, and the stock market is in the toilet.
Russ, NCNE
That quote is by Mark Twain for your information 🙂
John Galt,
Greespan is doing the right things. He is trying to slow down the economy's growth so that it won't expand too fast for it's own good. Looking at the Great Depression, one of the main cause was the exact same problem. The economy produced too many products to be able to be consumed in time.
John Galt,
Greespan is doing the right things. He is trying to slow down the economy's growth so that it won't expand too fast for it's own good. Looking at the Great Depression, one of the main cause was the exact same problem. The economy produced too many products to be able to be consumed in time.
The people installed the Good Farmer. The good farmer and the people worked hard to survey the land. They cleared the land with great industry and care. Every point was considered and with Gods help they pressed on.
After years of preparation it was time to plant. With great planning, seed was purchased and sowed. The fields were tended day and night. The work was hard and there was much opposition . Soon the crops started to grow. About this time the people began to tire, not all, but a majority.
As the crops started to come up a majority of people wanted ease and folly, and with out proper consideration a Thief was allowed into the position of leadership. The crops continued to come up because of the preparation of the Good Farmer, and the people benefited.
Many praised the Thief for his great acumen in bringing in the crops, but the Wise knew it was the Good Farmer that should get the credit. Soon the crops were gone, for the Thief had neglected to do what was necessary to have more crops to eat. The people brought in another man, he soon was blamed for the lack of crops. But only by the foolish and the unlearned.
Rejoice, The Good Farmer, the people of like Spirit, and his administration, have returned. Because the Good Farmer is in the power position, the foolish will once again, have to bow.
🙂
After years of preparation it was time to plant. With great planning, seed was purchased and sowed. The fields were tended day and night. The work was hard and there was much opposition . Soon the crops started to grow. About this time the people began to tire, not all, but a majority.
As the crops started to come up a majority of people wanted ease and folly, and with out proper consideration a Thief was allowed into the position of leadership. The crops continued to come up because of the preparation of the Good Farmer, and the people benefited.
Many praised the Thief for his great acumen in bringing in the crops, but the Wise knew it was the Good Farmer that should get the credit. Soon the crops were gone, for the Thief had neglected to do what was necessary to have more crops to eat. The people brought in another man, he soon was blamed for the lack of crops. But only by the foolish and the unlearned.
Rejoice, The Good Farmer, the people of like Spirit, and his administration, have returned. Because the Good Farmer is in the power position, the foolish will once again, have to bow.
🙂
Mr.IncrediblyBored
Lifer
LoL MrPALCO.
A shame we don't have REC's like over at the Motley Fool. I think that post was deserving of one.🙂
A shame we don't have REC's like over at the Motley Fool. I think that post was deserving of one.🙂
Greenspan screwed up, how is he doing the right thing? He screwed up so much that the Fed is more worried about recession than inflation! Instead of controlling the money supply by selling bonds, he decided to reduce it by increasing interest rates. This with rising energy prices decreased consumer purchasing power and thus companies have less profits for capital investment and so less products. If he is suppose to increase the interest rates 5 or 6 times, why is he suddenly hinting that he will cut them in January?
IN addition, this is NOT like the Great Depression, not even close!
There was no FED back then, no FDIC, no SEC, no regulations at all!
It's much more controlled now so when the recession comes, it won't hurt as much.
IN addition, this is NOT like the Great Depression, not even close!
There was no FED back then, no FDIC, no SEC, no regulations at all!
It's much more controlled now so when the recession comes, it won't hurt as much.
C'DaleRider
Guest
Gotta remember, for a Dow that's in the toilet, it's 700 points higher than its low for the year, which was in March at 9800 and change, but is down from its high for the year at 11,700 and a tick.....so we're down about 10%, but certainly not crashing down. Seems more of a correction that's been predicted because of overvalued stocks vs. their earnings, esp. the in the highly overvalued tech stocks.
Housing starts, while down from the breakneck pace of a few months ago, were up 2.2 percent for Nov., which is the largest increase in starts since Feb. this year.
True, consumer spending is off their major increases of the last few years, indicating a cooling off the last few years of major spending growth. But a 2.2% growth rate in spending is NOT a recession, which is defined as negative growth for two consective quarters. Of course, this comes on the Commerce Dept's report of wages rising 0.4% in Nov., matching expectations.
Orders for durable goods, items expected to last at least three years, rose to a seasonally adjusted annual rate of $210.9 billion in November, a 2.3 percent increase over October. That was a slightly stronger performance than many analysts predicted.
Orders for electronic and electrical equipment, including home appliances and semiconductors, went up by 4.5 percent. Industrial machinery, including machine tools and computers, saw orders rise by 1.1 percent, the first gain since July.
Hmmm...sounds dire indeed. While true that the Fed probably increased the interest rates a bit too much and quickly, many of the fundamentals are still in good shape.
If Bush persists on being Chicken Little and sreaming recession, he may get his wish.......the markets do respond to inflammatory remarks like that.
Just an opinion.
Housing starts, while down from the breakneck pace of a few months ago, were up 2.2 percent for Nov., which is the largest increase in starts since Feb. this year.
True, consumer spending is off their major increases of the last few years, indicating a cooling off the last few years of major spending growth. But a 2.2% growth rate in spending is NOT a recession, which is defined as negative growth for two consective quarters. Of course, this comes on the Commerce Dept's report of wages rising 0.4% in Nov., matching expectations.
Orders for durable goods, items expected to last at least three years, rose to a seasonally adjusted annual rate of $210.9 billion in November, a 2.3 percent increase over October. That was a slightly stronger performance than many analysts predicted.
Orders for electronic and electrical equipment, including home appliances and semiconductors, went up by 4.5 percent. Industrial machinery, including machine tools and computers, saw orders rise by 1.1 percent, the first gain since July.
Hmmm...sounds dire indeed. While true that the Fed probably increased the interest rates a bit too much and quickly, many of the fundamentals are still in good shape.
If Bush persists on being Chicken Little and sreaming recession, he may get his wish.......the markets do respond to inflammatory remarks like that.
Just an opinion.
urbantechie
Banned
I have no idea what you guys are talking about but according to Russ's post, doesn't it seem like we are gonna have another depression?? 😕
prontospyder
Diamond Member
Good post C'DaleRider...the economy is still chugging along...at least here in Colorado...
10% of jobs (mostly high-tech) can't be filled because of a labor shortage, people continue to snap up homes in a hurry (one particular new home community we visited had 800 people on the waiting list for about 6 new homes), home values are still shooting up the roof, retail sales continue to rise.
10% of jobs (mostly high-tech) can't be filled because of a labor shortage, people continue to snap up homes in a hurry (one particular new home community we visited had 800 people on the waiting list for about 6 new homes), home values are still shooting up the roof, retail sales continue to rise.
Anyone that paid any attentioned to the Nasdaq in the last eight years KNEW that tech stocks have been way overpriced.
Greenspan is the reason the economy has been as good as it has been and every Politician knows it.
Clinton RAISED taxes in '93. The largest tax increase in history! His Energy Department and the Radical Environmentalist, that Clinton owes big time, have stood in the way of ANY further development of our only viable energy source. OIL!
All of this and many more happenings have influenced our economy.
As a note. For the last 7+ years Clinton has taken advantage of every opportunity to remind us how HIS ploicies are what gave us a roaring economy. Well all you Blind Clinton Followers, the truth is shining in your face.
Greenspan is the reason the economy has been as good as it has been and every Politician knows it.
Clinton RAISED taxes in '93. The largest tax increase in history! His Energy Department and the Radical Environmentalist, that Clinton owes big time, have stood in the way of ANY further development of our only viable energy source. OIL!
All of this and many more happenings have influenced our economy.
As a note. For the last 7+ years Clinton has taken advantage of every opportunity to remind us how HIS ploicies are what gave us a roaring economy. Well all you Blind Clinton Followers, the truth is shining in your face.
This is one of the worst xmas's for retail sales.
Of course your comparing that to the amazing economic boom.
I dont think new technology or the money going it to it will cease anytime soon.
Of course your comparing that to the amazing economic boom.
I dont think new technology or the money going it to it will cease anytime soon.
WoundedWallet
Platinum Member
Well you have to look at both sides.
Yes the economy is about to fall apart, yes we may all lose our jobs, BUT, it looks like we're going to get great deals on post-christmas sales 😉
Yes the economy is about to fall apart, yes we may all lose our jobs, BUT, it looks like we're going to get great deals on post-christmas sales 😉
jacobnero6918
Senior member
Bush just doesn't want what happened to his father happen to him. If there is a problem he wants to address it right away and not pretend that it doesn't exist.
The growth rate was 2.2% instead of 5.2% like it had been. I don't think there will be a BIG recession like some are predicting but the economy may grow slower than it has.
<< The TRUTH is that if it weren't for Reagan and Bush putting this country into HUGE debt by cutting taxes and increasing spending (especially military spending) Clinton would not have had to raise taxes and we would not be looking at a recession next year. >>
Well we did win. The russians fell and we didn't have to launch a single missile. Also reagan wanted a balance budget but the time wasn't right. The democrats in the congress were willing to cut taxes but NOT willing to cut spending. So we ended up with a defecit and and ever increasing debt.
FYI: We only spent about 15% on the military budget, which means that 85% was going toward social security, welfare and other programs.
The growth rate was 2.2% instead of 5.2% like it had been. I don't think there will be a BIG recession like some are predicting but the economy may grow slower than it has.
<< The TRUTH is that if it weren't for Reagan and Bush putting this country into HUGE debt by cutting taxes and increasing spending (especially military spending) Clinton would not have had to raise taxes and we would not be looking at a recession next year. >>
Well we did win. The russians fell and we didn't have to launch a single missile. Also reagan wanted a balance budget but the time wasn't right. The democrats in the congress were willing to cut taxes but NOT willing to cut spending. So we ended up with a defecit and and ever increasing debt.
FYI: We only spent about 15% on the military budget, which means that 85% was going toward social security, welfare and other programs.
JohnGalt,
From what I know, the Fed Board has three or so tools in controlling the money supply. Controlling interests and selling/buying bonds are two of them. Increasing in interest will result in decrease of people spending. Companies then be force to produce less and therefore the growth rate is reduce.
A trip back to US history. In the 1920's one of the major reason that the Great Depression occured was over consumption. People got used to buying on credit and spending money. Companies in response to the increase in consumption, escalate production rate to the point that products are not being able to be consume fast enough and eventually leaving too many products unsold. It costs money to produce these products but no profit was made because they can't be sell. This along with other factors eventually lead to bankruptcy and further fear from the people to spend their money. The chain reaction resulted in what we know as the Great Depression.
From this fact, I believe that Green Span has been doing the right thing by increasing interest rate rather then selling bonds which put more currency into the economy. The economy is thus slow down so it won't hit a complete sudden stop like it did during the Great Depression. Supposedly that Green Span sold bonds as you said, people would have more money to spend and manufacturers would up production to a point where consumers can't simply keep up. Bang!
Well this is just my opinion based on the knowledge from my economics and ap us history classes. If I have made an error, feel free to correct. 🙂
From what I know, the Fed Board has three or so tools in controlling the money supply. Controlling interests and selling/buying bonds are two of them. Increasing in interest will result in decrease of people spending. Companies then be force to produce less and therefore the growth rate is reduce.
A trip back to US history. In the 1920's one of the major reason that the Great Depression occured was over consumption. People got used to buying on credit and spending money. Companies in response to the increase in consumption, escalate production rate to the point that products are not being able to be consume fast enough and eventually leaving too many products unsold. It costs money to produce these products but no profit was made because they can't be sell. This along with other factors eventually lead to bankruptcy and further fear from the people to spend their money. The chain reaction resulted in what we know as the Great Depression.
From this fact, I believe that Green Span has been doing the right thing by increasing interest rate rather then selling bonds which put more currency into the economy. The economy is thus slow down so it won't hit a complete sudden stop like it did during the Great Depression. Supposedly that Green Span sold bonds as you said, people would have more money to spend and manufacturers would up production to a point where consumers can't simply keep up. Bang!
Well this is just my opinion based on the knowledge from my economics and ap us history classes. If I have made an error, feel free to correct. 🙂
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