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Is Patriotism Dead/Dying?

As it should. You should only be proud of something that you've accomplished.

Being born on this side of an arbitrary border is not an accomplishment.
 
I was about to write something and second guessed it, remembering the NSA may be watching, recording and reading. Could this have something to do with the up or down trend of patriotism?
 
cyclohexane said:
As it should. You should only be proud of something that you've accomplished.

Being born on this side of an arbitrary border is not an accomplishment.
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x1000. Patriotism also keeps you from being objective - getting all teary eyed over a damn flag just means you lack a full perspective and forget that America, as a nation, has done some pretty shitty things too. It's ok to criticize your country, we wouldn't have equal rights if people didn't criticize the status quo. Be proud in what you accomplished, not something you didn't have anything to do with!
 
What I find funny, particularly from people south of the border, not all but a huge majority, say whatever country they are from is awesome and proudly wave that flag but never wave this country's flag or say it's better then the country they risked their lives to leave. As opposed to people I know that left Africa or Europe. Obviously it's skewed living in SoCal as majority of immigrants are from south of the border.
 
No, it isn't, but it should be. America is a shithole. Objectively we are WAY down the list of world countries in important factors like education and quality of life. The way to fix a problem is to admit that there is a problem, but as soon as someone tries to bring up what's wrong with America (and it's a long list) that patriotism gene kicks in and the right wingers start screaming "USA! USA! USA!"

We used to be the greatest country on Earth, now we're not. And patriotism is one of the factors that keeps us from asking "how did we go so horribly wrong and how do we get it back?"
 
There are many types of accomplishment personal, paternal, group and, national. It has become fashionable to discourage, disparage and, ignore national accomplishment. We've now had two generations who have no idea what national accomplishment looks like. Perhaps my father's generation sacrificed too much.
 
GagHalfrunt said:
No, it isn't, but it should be. America is a shithole. Objectively we are WAY down the list of world countries in important factors like education and quality of life. The way to fix a problem is to admit that there is a problem, but as soon as someone tries to bring up what's wrong with America (and it's a long list) that patriotism gene kicks in and the right wingers start screaming "USA! USA! USA!"

We used to be the greatest country on Earth, now we're not. And patriotism is one of the factors that keeps us from asking "how did we go so horribly wrong and how do we get it back?"
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Social issues serve further distraction. My favorite part is at the 1:52 mark. 😀
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDDAa1If-u4
 
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MagnusTheBrewer said:
There are many types of accomplishment personal, paternal, group and, national. It has become fashionable to discourage, disparage and, ignore national accomplishment. We've now had two generations who have no idea what national accomplishment looks like. Perhaps my father's generation sacrificed too much.
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The problem is people are looking at it from rose tinted false historical glasses. A lot of those national accomplishments were pretty fucking horrible things.

oldsmoboat said:
Yes it is. And I think you guys are mixing up patriotism and fanaticism.
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And that's the problem, they're far too often the same thing. Patriotism is easily exploited by fanatics to push their agenda.
 
No, but imo in the big picture Nationalism has been trending down. They are not the same thing at all. A nationalist will see a problem in the country and either refuse to believe it exists, blame some outside group for it, or cover it up. A patriot will see a problem in the country and do what they can to make it right, even if it costs them or stirs shit up for a while.
 
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darkswordsman17 said:
The problem is people are looking at it from rose tinted false historical glasses. A lot of those national accomplishments were pretty fucking horrible.
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There will always be hard decisions and by avoiding them you GUARANTEE you won't like the results. Some were "pretty fucking horrible" almost as bad as the alternative.
 
MagnusTheBrewer said:
There will always be hard decisions and by avoiding them you GUARANTEE you won't like the results. Some were "pretty fucking horrible" almost as bad as the alternative.
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Those are just lies people use to try and placate their guilt. If slavery is a hard decision then sorry but you're just plain fucked. Likewise, literal genocide. American history is literally brimming with awful shit that in no way is justified compared to the alternative. And it continues today.
 
darkswordsman17 said:
Those are just lies people use to try and placate their guilt. If slavery is a hard decision then sorry but you're just plain fucked. Likewise, literal genocide. American history is literally brimming with awful shit that in no way is justified compared to the alternative. And it continues today.
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I thought we were talking about accomplishments rather than greed, power seeking or, corporate behavior?
 
88keys said:
Like religion I think it is bastardized and used as an excuse to be an awful human being.
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Agreed they've had to try to warp it. Patriotism used to mean being proud of your country. Can't really be proud of this country. So yup dead as shit.
 
Looking at the demographics, the US is going to be just another poor, corrupt latin america shithole in another 30-40 years, so I plan on getting while the gettings good. Why should I feel any loyalty to a country that thinks so little of itself that it committed cultural suicide?
 
Yes, gawd-dammit! There's too damned many furriners here nowadays!

We should kick them all out...and build a gee-normous wall around these United States to keep them out!

Damned furriners...coming here with their funny languages and customs...demanding that ever-one kow-tow to them and their furriner ways...😡

'Murica for 'Muricans! :colbert:



:biggrin:

()🙂
 
Joepublic2 said:
Looking at the demographics, the US is going to be just another poor, corrupt latin america shithole in another 30-40 years, so I plan on getting while the gettings good. Why should I feel any loyalty to a country that thinks so little of itself that it committed cultural suicide?
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And that attitude and corporate greed are exactly what caused it. Everyone wants the positive aspects of National pride but, no one wants to pay the price.
 
slackerinabox said:
x1000. Patriotism also keeps you from being objective - getting all teary eyed over a damn flag just means you lack a full perspective and forget that America, as a nation, has done some pretty shitty things too. It's ok to criticize your country, we wouldn't have equal rights if people didn't criticize the status quo. Be proud in what you accomplished, not something you didn't have anything to do with!
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There isn't a single country on the planet that hasn't done shitty things.

Being proud of your tribe has been happening since the beginning of man. There is absolutely nothing wrong with it.
 
MagnusTheBrewer said:
And that attitude and corporate greed are exactly what caused it. Everyone wants the positive aspects of National pride but, no one wants to pay the price.
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Latin America's problems have almost nothing to do with corporate greed or attitude of their people and a lot more to do with poor checks and balances, shitty legal systems not based upon English Common Law (french/spanish), plus societies acceptance of corrupt officials.
 
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