is it possible to read an ntfs disk from win98?

[AndyWelch]

the hard drive that win2000 is one has gone kaput
i dual booted with win98, so can i get to the ntfs hard drive? The data should be reasonably ok on the knackered hd, sods law that its affect the system files!!

 

[Gibo]

simple answer no... If you can somehow get 2k back and up on that drive you can share the info and then copy it off, but any win9x will not read NTFS.

 

[AndyWelch]

ive dual booted with win98, how would i go about creating a boot disk that would enable access to the win2k hd so i could repair the installation?
All i get soon after the dual boot menu is "blah........nt----.exe is corrupted, please restore this file"
no safe mode boot, dont think theres an option for command prompt
i can hear the ibm hd making weird noises even now! not long before the end i think!
( its one of those "deathstars" ie ibm deskstar 75gxp, loads have failed apparantly, this is my second now as the previous one failed and had to be replaced)

 

[dbwillis]

You can get read only help from here, Ive used it to read fat32 from NT4

http://www.sysinternals.com/ntw2k/freeware/ntfswin98.shtml

 

[KGB]

Andy,

Try booting to your Win2K disk and selecting the "Repair Installation" option.
This should at least get you access to your NTFS partition so you can reach your data (BACK IT UP) because your 75GXP will detonate shortly.

 

[AndyWelch]

windows 2000 can do that from stock
will look to see if it can help........

 

[AndyWelch]

dont think i can get far enough to get to a repair installation option

I get to the win2k dual boot window;
Windows 2000
Microsoft Mindows


Press F8 for advanced win2000 booting options

after that i get <windows 2000 root>\system32\ntoskrnl.exe missing/corrupted

any other ideas? I can remember if i had the option of creating a boot disk, is there one for win2k that would get me past this?

 

[AndyWelch]

only way i can see at the moment is install win2k on another hd and set active, but thats very long winded!

 

[Gibo]

Another shot maybe too create the 2000 boot disk off of the CDROM, then either access your data from that point or to copy off the CDROM the NT file that is corrupted onto your disk, thats assuming that the drive itself is still ok.

You can accomplish the same thing too if you have another Hardisk and install w2k on it.. set it to master and set your failing one to slave, the use the W2k you just installed to read the info on the 2nd disk.

 

[Slikkster]

Yes, installing Win2K in another folder/partition will let him see the files. But why not work on the error message, instead. Now that we know what it is, the fix might be software related.

Ntoskrnl.exe missing/corrupted often means a problem with your boot.ini file. That file is on your C: drive, no matter what other operating system you have.
Your boot.ini file might have gotten hosed somehow or is missing in action. Look in your C:\ folder for boot.ini. With a dual-boot OS, your C: drive would have to be fat32 (fat based, anyway) because Win98 needs to boot from C: and can't read NTFS. So, my point is, we know your C: drive is a FAT drive. So, boot.ini should be visible to you.

Look in that file and make sure it's pointing to the proper location. It can be cryptic, if you don't know what you're looking for.

Why don't you do this? Copy/paste the contents of your boot.ini file here in a reply. Then, be specific in telling us exactly what hard drives/partitions are on your system, so it can be checked against your boot.ini file.

Here's my Boot.ini. It's set for dual-booting Windows 98SE and Windows XP Professional. Win98SE is the default Operating System to boot to, and the countdown timer is set for 5 Seconds:

[boot loader]
timeout=5
default=C:\
[operating systems]
C:\="Microsoft Windows 98SE"
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(1)partition(1)\WINXP="Microsoft Windows XP Professional" /fastdetect

I have 2 hard disks, C: and D:. Windows 98 is on C:; Windows XP is on D:. 2 Hard Disks and a total of 2 partitions.

To me, if you're confident that you can get to the files because you think some "system" files are corrupt, then fixing this issue should deal with your current bootup problem.

See this page from Microsoft for more info:


Ntoskrnl.exe missing --MS info

 

[AndyWelch]

sorry for the delay, went out for a bit
My current hard drive set up is:
Win98se on IDE1 Master
storage hd (fat32) on Promise controller IDE2
Win2k on Promise controller IDE1 (ntfs)
each operating system is on the full hard drive ie no partitioning other than main

The contents of the boot.ini file is as follows:
[boot loader]
timeout=30
default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(2)partition(1)\WINNT
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(2)partition(1)\WINNT="Microsoft Windows 2000 Professional" /fastdetect
C:\="Microsoft Windows"
#


the promise card could cause headaches as i dont think it has dos support, but i could probably move things around and edit this boot file.
At least im learning something!

 

[AndyWelch]

dammit, just read the windows help
The one time i dont make boot disks, they're essential!
Think the windows help says that if on an error it edits the boot.ini and puts a default value in?
Not sure, the entry in mine is not the same as the supposed default listed by MS.
Can you tell me what it should be?

 

[AndyWelch]

made some progress
i went through the process of installing win2k, chose to repair an installation, specified the ibm drive but without a "system repair disk" it wont fix it, so i went into the repair console.
Ran a chkdsk on the ibm drive, it found some errors but it enabled me to browse the contents in a dos like fashion.
Next problem is, when i try to access folders it says access denied!!
How do i get round this one chaps?
Im going to call it a night, although its now early morning, i'll check by later
cheers for the help so far

 

[Slikkster]

I see a possible answer to your problems. However, this assumes you've typed out your information correctly. The problem (if everything you've said is correct) lies with the settings in your boot.ini file. Here's what I mean:

You can see those lines in boot.ini that begin with "multi(0) blah blah blah"

What stands out to me is the value of your "rdisk(2)" section. "rdisk" refers to the physical disk in your system that your Win2K installation resides on.

The key is that rdisk is numbered beginning with "0", so "rdisk(0)" would refer to the first drive you have (Drive C: on your IDE Master Controller).

rdisk(1) would refer to the first drive on your Promise Controller (your Win2K drive).

rdisk(2), which your boot.ini file is now reflecting, refers to the second drive on your Promise Controller, which is your storage drive.


Do you see the problem? Your boot.ini file is looking for Win2K on your storage drive "rdisk(2)" vs the first drive on your Promise Controller. Obviously, it can't find it there, so it's giving you the message about missing/corrupt files.

Something tells me you may have moved the drives around on the Promise controller, no? Even if you haven't, somehow boot.ini got changed to reflect that it has.

The easiest way to check to see if this is really the problem without doing anything else, is switch the two drives on your Promise Controller. Put the Storage Drive on the Promise IDE1 Master and the Win2K drive on Promise IDE2 Master. Then, try to boot into Windows 2000. If it works, you know you have your answer.

Try that and get back to us.

Note: This should just be a test to see if it boots okay. You have to tell us what drive letter Windows 2000 originally had (Drive D: or Drive E: ?) Because while changing positions on your Promise controller may help you boot, it might not reflect where your installed programs are. For example, if you had installed programs on Windows 2000 to "D:\Program Files\myprogram.exe" and you've now switched the position on the Promise Controller to the second position, that's fine for boot.ini, but Windows 2000 will now be on Drive E:, and won't be able to find any installed programs because they're all in the registry as Drive D:. Comprendo?

So, switch positions on the Promise Controller for your Windows 2000 drive and your Storage Drive. Then, try to boot up in Windows 2000. Additionally, tell us what drive letter Windows 2000 normally is, D: or E:. If it's supposed to be Drive D:, then you'll have to later edit boot.ini and switch the drives back on the controller. If you originally installed to Drive E: as far as Win2k was concerned, then just switching the drives on the Promise controller may be enough to fix it for ya.

 

[AndyWelch]

slight error in my hd arrangement
thought i had the ibm drive on a seperate ide channel, turns out i plugged it onto the same channel as the storage drive, probably just intended to torture test the drive and get another replacement from ibm!!
Anyway, that probably changes things. Also, I think the deathstars on its last breath, its started blocking the storage drive so the promise ide card doesnt find it.
Now trying to remember what i stand to lose by giving up!
When everything was working ok, the drive letter assignments were:
C: Windows 98se
D: storage drive
E: Win2k
F & G cd drives

Back to the repair console thing i mentioned, why does it say access denied when i try to browse folders? I tried copying a .log file over that was in root to the win98se drive and it worked, so if i can access these folders problem solved!

 

[AndyHui]

You get access denied in the Recovery Console because of this:

FAQ: How can I use the Recovery Console to access all my files?

The only problem is that you need a running Win2K/WinXP to do it....

 

[AndyWelch]

haha, this is a joke!!
I have the hard drive in front of me with the data on, but i'm not allowed to access it without win2k, and its win2k thats nackered!!
It'd be funnier if it were someone elses tho

 

[Slikkster]

This was alluded to in a separate post, although the comments he made were not too clear.

Sysinternals.com has had a utility that will see your NTFS drive and allow you to do read-only operations on it.

It's called NTFSDos (free version). Get it here. Read the text file that comes with it. You can use it to view files on your ntfs-partitioned drive.

NTFSDos info and download

There's a full-featured read/write version available, too. In addition, there's NTFSForWin98, but they suggest Disk Commander to get files from a corrupted installation.

 

[AndyWelch]

excellent, sounds like thats the solution

Have had one idea, found a version of linux that boots from a floppy, thought maybe linux could read an ntfs partition? I know it can read fat32
anyway, the windows route is much preferable!

 

[AndyWelch]

ive used the ntfsdos program and it worked, ive managed to back up some files
Not sure whether a lot is gone or if im looking in the wrong place though
Probably a stupid question, but does win2k put the program files folder on X:\Program Files or somewhere else?
if so then its gone!
I unplugged my storage drive as mentioned before, and i edited that boot.ini file to reflect that and now it finds ntoskrnl.exe, just stops again a few seconds later saying it cant find a .sys file!
Might be getting closer to being able to restore system files though
Ive tried the system restore function, but it doesnt find a windows2000 installation, and i didnt make an emergancy repair disk (doh)
Any ideas for a possible next step?
Also, I ran ibm's drive fitness utility to get the error code and an rma number, but of course it doesnt find an error!!! :|

 

[Slikkster]

Since you are using a "dos" disk, it can't read long filenames...so your x:\program files folder will be "x:\progra~1" So, try that and you should see your Program Files folder after that. Remember, dos can only see 8.3 filenames. eight letters/numbers followed by a dot followed by a three character extension.

To see how your folders look in dos, do a "dir /p" It will show you how the folder names have been shortened to fit the 8.3 format. You can also use wildcards, like the "*" key and the "?" key to find folders that have been shortened. If you're looking for the Program Files folder, you can do "dir pro*" and it should show you any folders/files that start with that letter combination. Of course, you should do that from the root directory to see all the folders you need.

What "sys" file is missing now? Please give exact word for word descriptions of error messages. Quote them exactly. It's much easier to investigate then.

 

[AndyWelch]

i'll get the accurate error message in a mo, but it seems that the drivers folder is missing
ie x:\winnt\system32\drivers

Im trying the win98 version of the ntfs browser, it requires a few system files to get started:
NTFS.SYS: this file is located at <winnt>\system32\drivers\ntfs.sys
NTOSKRNL.EXE: this file is located at <winnt>\system32\ntoskrnl.exe
AUTOCHK.EXE: this file is located at <winnt>\system32\autochk.exe
NTDLL.DLL: this file is located at <winnt>\system32\ntdll.dll
C_437.NLS: this file is located at <winnt>\system32\c_437.nls
C_1252.NLS: this file is located at <winnt>\system32\c_1252.nls
L_INTL.NLS: this file is located at <winnt>\system32\l_intl.nls

I cant find the drivers folder, so i copied some of the files from the win2k and service pack 2 cd's, but it wont accept the ntfs.dll file. I think this might be the file that is missing, but i'll double check in a minute#
As for the truncated programs folder, there isnt a progr~1 anywhere, there is a documents and settings folder but browsed to the end of that and found nothing.
Looks like ive lost all of programs files then, this reeks of a virus but it cant be as the hard drive has been making weird whirring/clicking noises.
That reminds me, the first indication of a problem was a lot of "failed to write..." boxes appearing, in my wisdom i rebooted rather than backup up as quick as possible!!

 

[Slikkster]

what you're saying is you're trying to use NTFS for Win98. Why don't you try NTFSDos to get the files that NTFSfor Win98 needs. Then, put them in their own folder. Point NTFS for Win98 to that folder once you've used NTFSDos to copy the files from your Windows 2000 partition.

Additionally, at some point I think you might want to get the Win2K partition OFF the Promise Controller, in case that has something to do with your problems.

You could make it a slave on your IDE Controller on the motherboard, and just edit the 2 instances you see of rdisk to read "rdisk(1). See if it boots from there.

Gotta try all options. Remember, boot.ini is a read-only file, so you have to uncheck that attribute before you can modify it.

 

[AndyWelch]

I think ive retrieved all i can get from the hard drive, there seem to be a fair few folders missing.
I think i'll just format and get my computer back to normal again, and torture test that ibm drive till it fails!!
loads of thanks to all that have helped!!