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Is homosexuality by choice or by birth?
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MercenaryForHire
Lifer
Come do it yourself, or would you miss the Dashboard Confessional tour? :roll:
My first comment was in regard to your well-known sweet tooth for that class of honey. NOT Chelsea. STOP TWISTING EVERYTHING ANYONE SAYS INTO A VERBAL ATTACK AGAINST YOU.
- M4H
I googled for a references to my first point above:
Differences in Gay Brain Structure Announced
Tuesday, July 18th 2000
AUSTIN, Tx. -- Researchers from the University of Texas announced on Friday that there are quantifiable differences in the brains of heterosexuals and homosexuals, lending more weight to a growing body of evidence that suggests sexual orientation is hard-wired in individuals from birth.
The Austin American-Statesman reports a series of tests have revealed that brain structures of gay men and lesbians are somehow "hyper-masculinized" during development and respond differently to auditory stimuli than do the brains of heterosexual men and women.
Contrary to the cultural stereotypes that portray gay men as less masculine, the study suggests that gay males actually appear to be more masculine and better endowed physically than their heterosexual counterparts. Researchers said that this was "most likely due to increased male hormones circulating in their brains during development."
"A good way to describe the data from the homosexual males is that they appeared to be hyper-masculinized," said Craig Champlin, an associate professor and co author of the study.
Dennis McFadden, the other author of the study, told the American-Statesman, "Our research reveals that it isn't just parts of the body that are hyper masculinized in homosexual males, but the brain as well."
"Logic suggests that the degree of exposure to androgen -- the male sex hormone - is somehow involved in the production of homosexuality," McFadden said, "and our auditory results are generally in accord with that idea."
"Gay males appear...hyper-masculinized."
Overview of this issue
> Gay Origins
Other Data Lounge stories
> Texas
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McFadden and Champlin said they and their team measured otacoustic emissions, or sounds made by the inner ear, of heterosexuals and gay males and lesbians and that the results found "marked differences between the sexes," the female response being much more acute.
Generally, said McFadden, women have more and stronger inner ear emissions, but the auditory potentials of gay and bisexual women "were shifted in the male direction," he said. "The implication is that some brain structures were masculinized at some time during development."
The paper, published in the current issue of the Journal of the Association for Research in Otolaryngology (ear, nose and throat), said the answer may be found in different "magnitudes and/or timing" of androgen (male sex hormone) exposure in different areas of the brain.
"It is also possible that the amounts available are the same in heterosexual and non-heterosexual subjects, but that -- for whatever reason -- some subjects or some brain sites, are hypersensitive to the androgen (testosterone) levels present during some stage(s) in early development," the American-Statesman quotes the research paper.
Friday's results were a follow up to similar findings McFadden and Champlin published in March 1998. Prior research by the team found differences in the inner ears of lesbians and bisexuals, again noting that this aspect of their hearing had been masculinized. Another physical difference the authors documented had to do with finger length.
"Physiological differences of this sort are highly unlikely to be caused by differences in experience or upbringing," said McFadden.
-- C. Barillas, Editor
Stojakapimp
Platinum Member
so it was the fact that I said "if one's gay, the other's gay?" Your data was that if one id twin is gay, then there's a 31.6% chance the other is. Is that number high or low to you? I'm guessing most people think that they would both be gay because they are identical twins, but that number is pretty low in that case
Stojakapimp
Platinum Member
hahaha...i said i didn't read the article, not that it had big words. And sorry, I haven't been following every post that you've made, so i didn't realize you were a proponent of both
NikPreviousAcct
No Lifer
I know you, you fvck. You and I have plotted and schemed many-a-time over IM as to what to post in certain threads. I know how you think. I guess I should half expect someone so ruthless to turn on "friends" just to satisfy their lust for blood.
Okay, I'm going to spell this out for you.
Q: What has been my assertion on this subject throughout the thread.
A: That being gay is a combination of genetic and environmental factors. Neither is an absolute determinant.
Q: What does the twin study I linked state?
A: That there is a correlation for both identical and non-identical twins, but that this correlation is not absolute.
Q: What can we conclude from this?
A: That being gay is a combination of genetic and environmental factors.
Is that too much to understand? It's both. It always has been. All the available data supports this.
Stojakapimp
Platinum Member
I think this thread title should be changed to "choice, birth, or socially developed tendency"
MercenaryForHire
Lifer
Whatever. You're obviously hung over and not stoned, so I won't bother trying to reason with you. And if you really "knew how I thought" you'd know that if I was targeting you for a record-setting flaming, it wouldn't have been something that simple.
- M4H
NikPreviousAcct
No Lifer
The subconscious makes decisions for us every day.
Stojakapimp
Platinum Member
First off, I never knew what your stance was, so I got confused as to what your point was after you posted that link. Secondly, that's quite a conclusion to be making just from that one article. Yes, it is interesting, but back to my original point that there are just too many factors that come into play. You even stated that some of these studies are completely flawed in methodology, but I don't think we can draw definite conclusions from this argument. But regardless, it is interesting, and who knows, perhaps it's 100% correct
MercenaryForHire
Lifer
😕
/reads rbloedow's sig
😕😕
/head explodes
- M4H
Ryan
Lifer
You're right, it is a decision - But it is not a choice - when you say that a person chooses to become straight or gay, you're implying that the mind has a clear choice out of a group of certain selections. If anything, the subconscious makes decisions, and decisions and choices are not one in the same.
MercenaryForHire
Lifer
/taps the keg
:beer:😀
- M4H
MercenaryForHire
Lifer
Precisely.
My brain is hardwired to like women ... women with big tits that I want to smash my face between and shake my head vigorously.
Bible-banging, shock therapy, and threats on my life might change the outward manifestation of that.
But deep inside my mind, there will always be that little voice.
"Motorboat."
"MOTORBOAT."
"MOTORBOAT!"
- M4H
Bonkrowave
Banned
You guys are idiots if you think it is by birth.
We are products of our environment
pfff .... asshats
We are products of our environment
pfff .... asshats
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