Is a Sound Card REALLY helpful?

[HURRIC4NE]

so i've been using my built in RealTek audio chip for all of my sound needs.. i play a lot of games and listen to music like 24/7, and i consider myself sort of an audiophile (owning over 20 headsets and all that) and i was wondering if i should invest in a new sound card like the Xfi Fatality or the Asus Xonar... do they really help? or are they just like the built in Realtek sound on my motherboard ?

 

[richaron]

They're helpful if you want the best.. It will be a better source of sound (read up on thd & snr). Whether you'll notice a difference is doubtful tho, most of the time I think it's a placebo.

There's no point spending big money on a sound card if you're only going to be listening to it through computer grade speakers/headset.

 

[corkyg]

"...There's no point spending big money on a sound card if you're only going to be listening to it through computer grade speakers/headset.

Agree! The most noticeable thing to your ears is a top quality amp and speaker system. After that, a sound card might be noticeable.

 

[thelastjuju]

As somewhat of an audiophile, I cannot stand even a second of onboard sound.. although not all onboard sound is equal.. and its fine for rinky dink sattelite speakers, cheap ear buds, low end gaming headsets and such.. But I'm running studio monitors and there is no better way to get budget audiophile sound like from a mid-higher end sound card.

I've actually found realtek HD onboard sound to be the worst I've heard though. I had an older mobo with nvidia onboard sound that sounded far better.. I'd get a used Creative Audigy 2 ZS for $20-30 on ebay and you'd notice a somewhat significant increase in sound clarity over the Realtek.

You get a sound card to output ANALOG to high quality speakers or headphones, in order to take advantage what high quality DAC's you can find in PC sound cards.

I disagree with the post above.. the amp is only the third most important component.. The speakers are first, but the DAC is the easily the second biggest determinate of sound quality. (the digital analog converter .. but also the DSP, digital sound processor, is quite important) .. Any mid-higher end PC sound card (excluding the X-Fi chipset, which is garbage compared to real cards) is going to have a superior DAC to that of your receiver's, unless you have a $1,000 Marantz or something or start talking external DACs.

What types of headphones and/or speakers are you planning on using?

 

[Marky_R1]

Don't mean to steal your thread Hurric4ne but I have a similar question and didn't see the point of starting a new thread. I already have a Creative X-Fi Elite Pro sound card and I've been really happy with it (barring some annoying driver glitches). It's quite an old card now and I was wondering if there was any benefit in changing it for something new. I have Logitech Z5500 Digital 5.1 505watt speakers.

 

[Piano Man]

If you are an audiophile, you want to get a sound card. Don't get a Creative as I've been burned countless times by their drivers and support (Their supposedly audiophile card which I own won't even let you listen to audio out if something is plugged into the headphone port, who does that?!!)

HT|Omega has some great cards and are known for quality drivers and support. Since you are a headphone addict like myself, I recommend the ones with a swappable OPAMP so you can customize the timbre of sound to your liking.

 

[richaron]

I've actually found realtek HD onboard sound to be the worst I've heard though. I had an older mobo with nvidia onboard sound that sounded far better.. I'd get a used Creative Audigy 2 ZS for $20-30 on ebay and you'd notice a somewhat significant increase in sound clarity over the Realtek.

It would be a mistake to buy an old Audigy card, their driver support is already kinda flakey & components are old. There are plenty of newer budget options like a Xonar DG.

Don't mean to steal your thread Hurric4ne but I have a similar question and didn't see the point of starting a new thread. I already have a Creative X-Fi Elite Pro sound card and I've been really happy with it (barring some annoying driver glitches). It's quite an old card now and I was wondering if there was any benefit in changing it for something new. I have Logitech Z5500 Digital 5.1 505watt speakers.

If you are using the digital connection a new card will not sound any better. As stated above, a new soundcard running analog could provide better quality sound... but you will need a 'mid-high' level card & might not notice it anyway

Edit: Marky I would even try comparing analog vs digital with your current card.

 

[wirednuts]

As somewhat of an audiophile, I cannot stand even a second of onboard sound.. although not all onboard sound is equal.. and its fine for rinky dink sattelite speakers, cheap ear buds, low end gaming headsets and such.. But I'm running studio monitors and there is no better way to get budget audiophile sound like from a mid-higher end sound card.

I've actually found realtek HD onboard sound to be the worst I've heard though. I had an older mobo with nvidia onboard sound that sounded far better.. I'd get a used Creative Audigy 2 ZS for $20-30 on ebay and you'd notice a somewhat significant increase in sound clarity over the Realtek.

You get a sound card to output ANALOG to high quality speakers or headphones, in order to take advantage what high quality DAC's you can find in PC sound cards.

I disagree with the post above.. the amp is only the third most important component.. The speakers are first, but the DAC is the easily the second biggest determinate of sound quality. (the digital analog converter .. but also the DSP, digital sound processor, is quite important) .. Any mid-higher end PC sound card (excluding the X-Fi chipset, which is garbage compared to real cards) is going to have a superior DAC to that of your receiver's, unless you have a $1,000 Marantz or something or start talking external DACs.

What types of headphones and/or speakers are you planning on using?

puke. sorry but your post made me.

you do realize when you install onboard sound it defaults to a low bitrate setting? you have to crank it up in the sound properties to get full clarity (because its software driven, they default to low settings so it doesnt hurt your cpu cycles)

anything like the realtek ALC888 or there abouts will give you THD that is very close to most home theater equipment... and if you can hear the difference between it and say an audigy 2 or xonar card then youre smoking something.

DSP is important? what? if your equipment is right you shouldnt need ANY dsp whatsoever. shouldnt even need an eq, just leave it flat if you have one.

 

[gevorg]

A sound card can improve performance over onboard sound, even though modern motherboards made a long way in improvement in the last few years or so. Creative and Asus cards are "good" upgrades over onboard sound, but they can't hold a candle to pro-audio gear (even budget EMU or M-Audio in some cases). If you're serious about audio, the best way to go is to digitally output the audio from your computer by S/PDIF or optical to some receiver (if you want multichannel) or DAC (if you want stereo, USB works too).

Here is a website that gives decent overview about computer audio, but note that their hardware section lists everything that they know of, including "snakeoil" gear. So as always, do your own research. Some more interesting links:

http://www.benchmarkmedia.com/wiki/index.php/Computer_Audio_Playback_-_Setup_Guide
http://nwavguy.blogspot.com/2012/04/what-we-hear.html

 

[Venomous]

As somewhat of an audiophile, I cannot stand even a second of onboard sound.. although not all onboard sound is equal.. and its fine for rinky dink sattelite speakers, cheap ear buds, low end gaming headsets and such.. But I'm running studio monitors and there is no better way to get budget audiophile sound like from a mid-higher end sound card.

I've actually found realtek HD onboard sound to be the worst I've heard though. I had an older mobo with nvidia onboard sound that sounded far better.. I'd get a used Creative Audigy 2 ZS for $20-30 on ebay and you'd notice a somewhat significant increase in sound clarity over the Realtek.

You get a sound card to output ANALOG to high quality speakers or headphones, in order to take advantage what high quality DAC's you can find in PC sound cards.

I disagree with the post above.. the amp is only the third most important component.. The speakers are first, but the DAC is the easily the second biggest determinate of sound quality. (the digital analog converter .. but also the DSP, digital sound processor, is quite important) .. Any mid-higher end PC sound card (excluding the X-Fi chipset, which is garbage compared to real cards) is going to have a superior DAC to that of your receiver's, unless you have a $1,000 Marantz or something or start talking external DACs.

What types of headphones and/or speakers are you planning on using?

99% of sound cards out there dont even have the quality of the worst onboard dac in a low end av receiver. These types of posts irritate me almost as much as these guys wasting money on $1000 dacs through USB only to send an analog signal back to the avr. Step up the quality of your avr, shoot it out to it digital and let the avr do the converting for you. Albeit you won't hear a damn difference between a $500 avr to a $1000 dac. People claim they do and we call it the placebo effect. Take the $1000 wasted on an external dac and apply it to a real set of speakers. There isn't in dac or amp out there that will make a break a sound system more than Not having quality speakers.

I see it all the time where people will waste money from their budget on dacs and amps instead of putting it where it belongs, in the speakers. As long as you stick to 8ohm and high efficiency rated speaker of 90db or more, you're good to go without separate amps. Even the most basic avr has decent dacs, but avr's like the Denon 4311 or Yamaha aventage 3010 will provide you a nice listening experience.

Take note that both Denon and Onkyo are already removing analog connections. Before long, they are all going to disappear aside from Yamaha.

 

[VirtualLarry]

you do realize when you install onboard sound it defaults to a low bitrate setting? you have to crank it up in the sound properties to get full clarity (because its software driven, they default to low settings so it doesnt hurt your cpu cycles)

Uhm, no.

My RealTek (unsure what chip, but it's one of the higher-end onboard ones) defaulted to 24-bit, 48KHz. I can choose up to 24-bit, 192KHz.

Edit: I have the 892 chip. I previously used a P35-DS3R v1.0 with an ALC889 chip.

 

[nFeF]

I don't regret for one second buying my Xonar DX.

That said, as others said before me, you won't really notice any difference unless you have a way to take advantage of the card. My Xonar + Audio Technica AD700's = audio bliss.

 

[bononos]

so i've been using my built in RealTek audio chip for all of my sound needs.. i play a lot of games and listen to music like 24/7, and i consider myself sort of an audiophile (owning over 20 headsets and all that) and i was wondering if i should invest in a new sound card like the Xfi Fatality or the Asus Xonar... do they really help? or are they just like the built in Realtek sound on my motherboard ?

Normally an add-in card would be wasted on gaming type speakers for many users and the difference might not be felt. But since you listen music on your pc much of the time and have a significant amount of hw invested, it sounds like a good idea. Stay away from Creative since its not worth the hassle. Xonar, M-audio, HT omegas have better prosumer cards.

 

[Chaoticlusts]

People seem to be talking heaps about speakers here when the OP mentioned owning over 20 headsets. One thing I know I benefited tons from for my headphones and cost very very little for the upgrade was a Xonar DG. If you own that many headphones some have got to be high impedance and onboard can't provide very much the DG will help a lot in that regard and has some better features than onboard (at least as far as I can tell)

btw I'm using HD595's for my headphones, I agree with the statements above of making sure your best gear is the headphones/speakers then get other nice bits

There maybe better ones out there nowdays than the DG (I bought mine about 2 years ago) but worth looking into since you can easily waste 200+ on creative ones with no real extra benefit

 

[GrumpyMan]

I have an Asus Z-68 Deluxe mobo with Realtec onboard sound. And I decided to get some really nice cans and monitors for sound. I don't care what anybody says, placebo, low bit rate......I say bullcrap. The sound that now comes out of my Asus Xonar Essence ST sound card is MUCH MUCH better in all aspects no question about it, and I am not an audiophile. Placebo my ass.

 

[Revolution 11]

My first (and only) sound card was a Creative Audigy 2 and I definitely noticed a improvement over the crappy integrated sound back then. Recently, I have noticed a lot of dislike for Creative for various reasons. But the non-Creative cards tend to lack EAX support.

So is EAX now the new clockspeed, moar cores, trend of old? Would I miss the lack of EAX support in recent games? How about older games? And are there any alternatives or successors to EAX?

 

[mnewsham]

I have an Asus Z-68 Deluxe mobo with Realtec onboard sound. And I decided to get some really nice cans and monitors for sound. I don't care what anybody says, placebo, low bit rate......I say bullcrap. The sound that now comes out of my Asus Xonar Essence ST sound card is MUCH MUCH better in all aspects no question about it, and I am not an audiophile. Placebo my ass.

Depends on the cans, if you are using sub 100 dollar cans then yeah it probably is placebo effect, if you are using high impedance cans than yeah, you should notice some difference as you are actually giving your cans the power they need to run correctly.

 

[mnewsham]

My first (and only) sound card was a Creative Audigy 2 and I definitely noticed a improvement over the crappy integrated sound back then. Recently, I have noticed a lot of dislike for Creative for various reasons. But the non-Creative cards tend to lack EAX support.

So is EAX now the new clockspeed, moar cores, trend of old? Would I miss the lack of EAX support in recent games? How about older games? And are there any alternatives or successors to EAX?

Do games even use EAX anymore? D: As far as I know most games don't, I think most modern games use their own...?

Honestly if you have speakers or headphones that need a sound card you should probably want an AMP/DAC that will keep your sound as pure as possible.

 

[tigersty1e]

like night and day.

a $100 sound card is the best investment you can make. they last through several builds. i was using an older pci x-fi xtremegamer since back in 2006.

i just updated to a newer pci-e sound card and this sound card i have is going to last for at least the next several new builds.

 

[tigersty1e]

Do games even use EAX anymore? D: As far as I know most games don't, I think most modern games use their own...?

Honestly if you have speakers or headphones that need a sound card you should probably want an AMP/DAC that will keep your sound as pure as possible.

eax was the gold standard of fps sound.

i hate how they moved away from it. any older game that supports eax is like using a wall hack.

 

[entfy]

Unless your willing to invest another 10k minimum on the parts you need to actually achieve the performance and quality of sound you (think) you are talking about onboard sound with a digital out is more than enough.

For sound to be a benefit you need 200k+ Hz that's theater quality or better. And without a good set of speakers amp and bass, you won't get close for under $10k. Yea a good set of cans can help but they are truly limited to stereo sound and that limits as well. Cans limit in their number of speakers per side. One a piece. That is in the HD595's and up. Even then your starting to look at $500+ for a true set of cans.

That said, turn up your audio bit rates and pass through to a receiver with optical.

Don't listen to what these fools tell you about it making a difference. Might as well get some Dre. Beats if you do...lol

 

[entfy]

My first (and only) sound card was a Creative Audigy 2 and I definitely noticed a improvement over the crappy integrated sound back then. Recently, I have noticed a lot of dislike for Creative for various reasons. But the non-Creative cards tend to lack EAX support.

So is EAX now the new clockspeed, moar cores, trend of old? Would I miss the lack of EAX support in recent games? How about older games? And are there any alternatives or successors to EAX?

That was back when on board audio was rubbish.

 

[evident]

If you are an audiophile, you want to get a sound card. Don't get a Creative as I've been burned countless times by their drivers and support (Their supposedly audiophile card which I own won't even let you listen to audio out if something is plugged into the headphone port, who does that?!!)

HT|Omega has some great cards and are known for quality drivers and support. Since you are a headphone addict like myself, I recommend the ones with a swappable OPAMP so you can customize the timbre of sound to your liking.

agreed. screw creative.

They bought out emu and stopped supporting my EMU 0404 USB which has windows 7 BETA drivers still. It's a perfectly awesome sound card, but the drivers are flaky, and they won't support it in the future. what a bunch of jackasses.

 

[Topweasel]

agreed. screw creative.

They bought out emu and stopped supporting my EMU 0404 USB which has windows 7 BETA drivers still. It's a perfectly awesome sound card, but the drivers are flaky, and they won't support it in the future. what a bunch of jackasses.

Or the product was EOL'd. They bought E-mu long before USB was even developed.

 

[evident]

Or the product was EOL'd. They bought E-mu long before USB was even developed.

you're right, makes me hate them even worse for EOLing a perfectly fine "professional grade" sound card released in 2006, while still supporting their xfi line released a few years before that.