Is a P4 that much better at video ripping/encoding then an AMD?

[Markfw]

Originally posted by: DAPUNISHER
I backed up Gladiator on my A64 rig with deep analysis and it took 19min 40sec and about the same time to burn it on my 4x burner, HTH 🙂

Ditto with my a64 rig. And that is NOT using my SCSI array either.

 

[DaNorthface]

Originally posted by: Markfw900

Originally posted by: DAPUNISHER
I backed up Gladiator on my A64 rig with deep analysis and it took 19min 40sec and about the same time to burn it on my 4x burner, HTH 🙂

Ditto with my a64 rig. And that is NOT using my SCSI array either.

is that with the analysing time? Also, shouldn't it burn in 12 minutes at 4x?

 

[imported_earthslash]

It usually takes upwards of 20 minutes, sometimes a tiny bit less, for 4x burning. I don't know how long it takes for others at 4x, but I'm pretty sure its close to 20.

- Steve

 

[Markfw]

It takes about 1-2 minutes to anaylze I think (haven't gotten out the stopwatch). And I burn on 4x media at 2x to ENSURE a good burn. Why backup my DVD's and not get the best quality backup ? In my experience, a slower burn on CD's and DVD's seem to last longer, and read read easier. Burning as a physical change, and the slower you allow it to happen, the better quality you end up with I think. I don;t have any proof of that, but as I said, I generally burn at 1/2 to 1/4 of the rated media speed and I have found they seem to work better.

 

[Zebo]

Nice post alex. I've been trying to tell these guys this stuff for months but your post shines new light on the parity that exists between the two and I will cut and past it often while the ignorance abounds.😀

 

[FrustratedUser]

Originally posted by: Civic2oo1x
Here is the setup of both.

Rig 1
P4 3.0ghz w/800 fsb HT
1 GB Kingston HyperX PC4000
Intel 865 chipset

Rig 2
AMD 2500 XP+
512MB Corsair XMS PC2700
Nforce 2 chipset

Now I know that the P4 has a better overall rig, but is a P4 that much better overall in video work then an AMD?

Here's what I'm doing. I'm using DVDShrink to backup the DVDs that I purchase (I buy 4-5 DVDs a week and have a small niece and nephew to worry about).

Analysis Speed
P4 - 6,500 KB/s and 290 frames/sec
AMD- 2,500 KB/s and 110 frames/sec

For encoding I get
P4 - 7,800 KB/s and 53MB buffered
AMD- 2,600 KB/s and 49MB buffered

So basically I can analyze, encode, and burn a entire DVD with the P4 in the time it takes the AMD to just analyze. Does this seem right?

Yes this is correct. I have done comparisons myself. My P4 2.8c at work blows away my XP 2500+ (oc'ed to 195 fsb).

 

[eno]

-

 

[DaNorthface]

Originally posted by: FrustratedUser

Originally posted by: Civic2oo1x
Here is the setup of both.

Rig 1
P4 3.0ghz w/800 fsb HT
1 GB Kingston HyperX PC4000
Intel 865 chipset

Rig 2
AMD 2500 XP+
512MB Corsair XMS PC2700
Nforce 2 chipset

Now I know that the P4 has a better overall rig, but is a P4 that much better overall in video work then an AMD?

Here's what I'm doing. I'm using DVDShrink to backup the DVDs that I purchase (I buy 4-5 DVDs a week and have a small niece and nephew to worry about).

Analysis Speed
P4 - 6,500 KB/s and 290 frames/sec
AMD- 2,500 KB/s and 110 frames/sec

For encoding I get
P4 - 7,800 KB/s and 53MB buffered
AMD- 2,600 KB/s and 49MB buffered

So basically I can analyze, encode, and burn a entire DVD with the P4 in the time it takes the AMD to just analyze. Does this seem right?

Yes this is correct. I have done comparisons myself. My P4 2.8c at work blows away my XP 2500+ (oc'ed to 195 fsb).

so how long does it take on your work machine to encode and rip?? Something is really wrong with your AMD system if it rips at 2500 kb/sec.. it should at least do 5000-6000 kb/sec if you have a good hard drive and dvdrom drive..

I think the people who are saying their P4 systems are faster have an AMD system that is at a disadvantage in some way. And everytime i asked those people how fast it encodes with DVDshrink on their P4, they never give an answer. I doubt it's under the 20 minutes 23 sec that it takes me to encode a 2 hour movie with menus and everything (58% compression)..

 

[Markfw]

OK, Maybe I picked a bad example, but I just analyzed Joe soebody, and it analyzed in 38 seconds, and ripped in 5 minutes 28 seconds. Thruput was about 12k/sec (I think that the right /sec, it was 12k something)

Andybody with a P4 using DVD Shrink got a good bench with a 3.0c ? Then I will bench again if I have the movie.

 

[jose]

I got 3.0c running win2ksp4 & dvd shrink 3.1 . Analyzed Gladiator in 2 min 6 secs.(1,600 KB/s) Re-encoded complete dvd w/ menus (2685 KB/s) 49min no compression.
The analyzation was using a plextor 708a, I have a scsi toshiba dvd drive also, but not in my current machine. I don't know why my rip is so slow. maybe because of the ide dvd drive.

Regards,
Jose

 

[Markfw]

Originally posted by: jose
I got 3.0c running win2ksp4 & dvd shrink 3.1 . Analyzed Gladiator in 2 min 6 secs.(1,600 KB/s) Re-encoded complete dvd w/ menus (2685 KB/s) 49min no compression.
The analyzation was using a plextor 708a, I have a scsi toshiba dvd drive also, but not in my current machine. I don't know why my rip is so slow. maybe because of the ide dvd drive.

Regards,
Jose

Sorry I don;t own Gladiator. How about Die Another Day (Bond) ??? Or the Original Lord of the Rings ??

 

[jose]

Did Die Another Day, got 4min 5sec to rip, (1738 KB/s, 64fps) . To re-encode takes 38min (2692 KB/s) encoded just the movie, no menus. Also I have hyper-threading disabled, I didn't like XP 😛 .

Regards,
Jose

 

[Markfw]

OK, using dvdshrink ? 4 min 5 sec to rip ???? Re-encode 38 minutes ??? I just analyze, then backup. I will post my number WITH menus. I will update when done.

1 min 30 sec (about) to analyze 165 frames/sec. Backing up ......
Its running now at 5,900 something k/sec and looks like about 20 min to finish... will update then.

OK, about 16 minutes at 8k/sec (closed the window rats.....) I am re-running to be sure of my numbers.

 

[DaNorthface]

Originally posted by: Markfw900
OK, Maybe I picked a bad example, but I just analyzed Joe soebody, and it analyzed in 38 seconds, and ripped in 5 minutes 28 seconds. Thruput was about 12k/sec (I think that the right /sec, it was 12k something)

Andybody with a P4 using DVD Shrink got a good bench with a 3.0c ? Then I will bench again if I have the movie.

man that's even a worse movie to use.. are you using a single layer dvd to read from?? dual layer dvds read at 8x max i believe, and at 8x (which the rest of use are testing with) you can't rip the entire movie in 5 min.. you must be using a single layer disc and reading at 16x... also if you're using a single layer disc, you're not really encoding anything. The cpu has nothing to encode and it'll already fit on the dvdr disc

 

[Markfw]

OK, here it is, DVDshrink software. Analyze in 1 min 32 sec. Encode to ISO in 17 minutes 47 seconds using movie "Die another day" at 70.4% quality. burn time at 2x I will see..... Standard 4.7 gig full disk, probably about 20 minutes.

 

[DaNorthface]

Originally posted by: jose
Did Die Another Day, got 4min 5sec to rip, (1738 KB/s, 64fps) . To re-encode takes 38min (2692 KB/s) encoded just the movie, no menus. Also I have hyper-threading disabled, I didn't like XP 😛 .

Regards,
Jose

i think your 4 min is for analyizing the disc.. the 38 min is for encoding and ripping. it sounds like your dvd rom drive isn't very good.. also, it really encourage you to fix the HT problem since the p4 isn't much without it. i'm sure it's just a few settings in the bios that can fix your problems.. otherwise, i would just get another motherboard or rma..

 

[FrustratedUser]

Originally posted by: DaNorthface

Originally posted by: FrustratedUser

Originally posted by: Civic2oo1x
Here is the setup of both.

Rig 1
P4 3.0ghz w/800 fsb HT
1 GB Kingston HyperX PC4000
Intel 865 chipset

Rig 2
AMD 2500 XP+
512MB Corsair XMS PC2700
Nforce 2 chipset

Now I know that the P4 has a better overall rig, but is a P4 that much better overall in video work then an AMD?

Here's what I'm doing. I'm using DVDShrink to backup the DVDs that I purchase (I buy 4-5 DVDs a week and have a small niece and nephew to worry about).

Analysis Speed
P4 - 6,500 KB/s and 290 frames/sec
AMD- 2,500 KB/s and 110 frames/sec

For encoding I get
P4 - 7,800 KB/s and 53MB buffered
AMD- 2,600 KB/s and 49MB buffered

So basically I can analyze, encode, and burn a entire DVD with the P4 in the time it takes the AMD to just analyze. Does this seem right?

Yes this is correct. I have done comparisons myself. My P4 2.8c at work blows away my XP 2500+ (oc'ed to 195 fsb).

so how long does it take on your work machine to encode and rip?? Something is really wrong with your AMD system if it rips at 2500 kb/sec.. it should at least do 5000-6000 kb/sec if you have a good hard drive and dvdrom drive..

I think the people who are saying their P4 systems are faster have an AMD system that is at a disadvantage in some way. And everytime i asked those people how fast it encodes with DVDshrink on their P4, they never give an answer. I doubt it's under the 20 minutes 23 sec that it takes me to encode a 2 hour movie with menus and everything (58% compression)..

I don't know the speeds exactly but I will do some tests.
I do know that the P4 is around 30-40% faster in analysing. Ripping speed is dependant on your DVD drive. Mine only rips at x2 and there is nothing I can do about it.

Let me get back to this thread. I need to do comparisons.

 

[jose]

I have a Plextor 708a dvd writer, what could be wrong w/ it being so slow ? In my bios P4C800e mobo I have autodect & in the device manager I have "Use DMA if available".

I don't use ide much, so I'm un-familiar w/ it for the most part, but I do remember my scsi toshiba dvd drive at being faster at installing the os & apps. As far hyper-threading I can't use it because I'm running win2K.. I think I need dual Xeons w/ 64 bit pci 😉

Regards,
Jose

 

[Markfw]

PLEASE !! Will somebody with a P4 3.0c at 3.0-3.2 do the folllowing benchmark on the SAME movie with the SAME software:

OK, here it is, DVDshrink software. Analyze in 1 min 32 sec(about, hard to tell without a stopwatch, and it doesn;t tell you). Encode to ISO in 17 minutes 47 seconds using movie "Die another day" at 70.4% quality(english titles only).

burn time at 2x I will see..... Standard 4.7 gig full disk, probably about 20 minutes.

 

[alexruiz]

Originally posted by: Zebo
Nice post alex. I've been trying to tell these guys this stuff for months but your post shines new light on the parity that exists between the two and I will cut and past it often while the ignorance abounds.😀

Thanks man! I am going to feel so 😎

Let's not forget that the tools used by most of the websites are the favorites for the P4, keep it in perspective. FlaskMPEG and its derivates became popular when THG showed it as one of the first rip-transcode tool. You should even remember that after the P4 willamette launch someone from Intel Europe optimized flaskmpeg for SSE2 and gave it to THG for review...... XMPEG just follows that line, and the flask derivatives became popular because THG used it first (sheep effect) This is not about showing that a CPU is the ultimate, but rather to prove that some applications like one more than the other. This is also to clear myths that video doesn't run well in AMD hardware. If you have a rig, try to pick an application that likes your setup..... If you have an application in mind and want to get a new rig, make one that is liked by your application. That is all!

Let's not forget also that new applications not always are well optimized for SSE2/ HT, as developers have to meet a deadline to market. Take your pick, you are the developer, and between marketing "Very well SSE2/HT optimized" or "NEW! picture in picture video available" Which one would you focus on? Easy choice if you ask me, and easy choice to assign resources to.

Also, in some cases applications with only a humble MMX/SSE optimization will kick the cr@p out of a SSE2/SSE3/HT one (Take CCE over TMPGEnc as example). Even in WMV9, using the .ASF container the results are not the same than encoding using the .AVI container, and both use WM9 codec.....

Let the truth surface!


Alex

 

[AWhackWhiteBoy]

i vote for a sticky thread!

 

[FrustratedUser]

I've got the results from my XP2500+ rig:

AMD Athlon XP 2500+ OC'ed to 2.145GHz.
512Mb of PC3200 RAM (1 stick)
NF7-S mobo
NEC 1300A DVD-burner
60GB 7200 rpm WD HD
Win2K SP4
DVD Shrink 3.1.7

Movie: Gone in 60 seconds.
Automatic compression to fit on single DVD-R: 55.5%
Initial analysis: 1 min 52 sec. (~2150 kB/s)
Deep analysis: 29 min 46 sec. (2150 kB/s, 96 fps @ start, 3830 kB/s, 145.3 fps @ end)
Encoding: 38 min 7 sec
Total time: 69 mins 45 sec.



I'll get back tomorrow with the results for the P4 2.8c at work.

Edit: I forgot to say that I did not burn the DVD, so the test ends at encoding.

 

[Zebo]

If someone tells me what they want see, what apps, what encoder and what movie or music CD I can test on barton 2700Mhz.🙂

Frankly I don't do encoding..see no reason for it but I have about 500 DVD's to choose from so it may help in comparisons.

 

[splice]

Me also.. I can test using my dual Athlon 2600+. Just tell me what apps and what video (hopefully I have it)

 

[oldfart]

Frankly I don't do encoding..see no reason for it but I have about 500 DVD's to choose from so it may help in comparisons.

Am I the only one that encodes for other reasons than "backing up" DVD movies?

My main encoding application is to make DVD disks from my DV camcorder movies. I also encode to WMV (small fie size) to email short clips to family members.