IRS Scandal explodes. "no evidence that would support a criminal prosecution."

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Cozarkian

Golden Member
Feb 2, 2012
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You have a vivid imagination. Sadly, the actual facts in the IRS case are not even remotely so clear and dramatic, no matter how many times Issa, Fox, and company cry otherwise. As I've decried again and again, you guys seem completely incapable of distinguishing supposition and innuendo from actual facts. Your posts above are just another example of this.

You have to follow the entire conversation. Otherwise, you end up taking a quote completely out of context. You quoted post #1154. Scroll up to post I quoted (it's right above - #1153). See the sentence that ivwshane emphasized? That sentence is irrefutable by anyone with an elementary understanding of English.

That sentence does not say the the entire IRS case is that clear and dramatic. It doesn't even say the Lois Lerner email is clearly related to this specific case. Heck, it doesn't even say that Lois Lerner was clearly expressing there was information she wanted to hide from the IRS.
 

Bowfinger

Lifer
Nov 17, 2002
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You have to follow the entire conversation. Otherwise, you end up taking a quote completely out of context. You quoted post #1154. Scroll up to post I quoted (it's right above - #1153). See the sentence that ivwshane emphasized? That sentence is irrefutable by anyone with an elementary understanding of English.

That sentence does not say the the entire IRS case is that clear and dramatic. It doesn't even say the Lois Lerner email is clearly related to this specific case. Heck, it doesn't even say that Lois Lerner was clearly expressing there was information she wanted to hide from the IRS.
I followed the conversation just fine, thank you. Your assertion about what Lerner admits is inaccurate. Your are again substituting innuendo for fact, specifically the word "information". "Darrell Issa is a lying assclown." doesn't really contain any information, but most federal employees wouldn't want it released to Congress. That's the point you guys keep dodging: cautioning your staff to be professional and smart in their email isn't necessarily telling them to conceal anything. It's just good advice. I'm not saying Lerner is innocent, but that the right continues to fall short in producing factual evidence of her guilt.
 

Cozarkian

Golden Member
Feb 2, 2012
1,352
95
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I followed the conversation just fine, thank you.

You took a very limited point and attempted to refute it by overstating the scope of discussion. So you either didn't follow the conversation just fine, or you deliberately misrepresented my argument. I was giving you the benefit of the doubt.

Your assertion about what Lerner admits is inaccurate. Your are again substituting innuendo for fact, specifically the word "information". "Darrell Issa is a lying assclown." doesn't really contain any information, but most federal employees wouldn't want it released to Congress.

Why the qualifier? Could it possibly be because that hypothetical email contains information, so you can't honestly claim it doesn't?

That's the point you guys keep dodging: cautioning your staff to be professional and smart in their email isn't necessarily telling them to conceal anything.

It absolutely is necessary she was telling them to conceal anything they didn't want Congress to see. For example, their opinion that "Darrell Issa is a lying assclown" is information, according to Lerner, they shouldn't put in an email if they don't want Congress to potentially find out.
 
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Bowfinger

Lifer
Nov 17, 2002
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You took a very limited point and attempted to refute it by overstating the scope of discussion. So you either didn't follow the conversation just fine, or you deliberately misrepresented my argument. I was giving you the benefit of the doubt.
Yawn. I was mocking your ludicrous analogy. You're desperately trying to divert attention from this. My reply stands on its own. The prior comments that led you to concoct that analogy are irrelevant to my comment.


Why the qualifier? Could it possibly be because that hypothetical email contains information, so you can't honestly claim it doesn't?

It absolutely is necessary she was telling them to conceal anything they didn't want Congress to see. For example, their opinion that "Darrell Issa is a lying assclown" is information, according to Lerner, they shouldn't put in an email if they don't want Congress to potentially find out.
When you must stoop to such ridiculous semantics games, it's clear you've lost. The only "information" that sentence contains is the writer's contempt for Issa. While that is indeed information in the technical sense of the word, it is totally immaterial to any investigations. Only a partisan shill would suggest that suppressing such contempt is equivalent to concealing information from investigators.

To help prevent future semantics distractions, however, please assume that any such statements I make are qualified with the word "material". For example, in this case you may safely assume I said, "'Darrell Issa is a lying assclown.' doesn't really contain any [material] information, but most federal employees wouldn't want it released to Congress." You're welcome.
 

Cozarkian

Golden Member
Feb 2, 2012
1,352
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When you must stoop to such ridiculous semantics games, it's clear you've lost.

Great, so can we agree that by stooping to a ridiculous semantic game after I pointed out you vastly overstated the purpose of my hypothetical, that you were admitting you lost?
 

Bowfinger

Lifer
Nov 17, 2002
15,776
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Great, so can we agree that by stooping to a ridiculous semantic game after I pointed out you vastly overstated the purpose of my hypothetical, that you were admitting you lost?
"Yawn. I was mocking your ludicrous analogy. You're desperately trying to divert attention from this. My reply stands on its own. The prior comments that led you to concoct that analogy are irrelevant to my comment."
 

Cozarkian

Golden Member
Feb 2, 2012
1,352
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Another case of political malfeasance by an IRS employee:

https://www.osc.gov/News/pr14_13.pdf said:
In June 2014, OSC entered into a settlement agreement with an Internal Revenue Service (IRS) employee who agreed to a 100-day unpaid suspension for violating the Hatch Act. The agreement resolves a formal Hatch Act complaint that OSC filed with the Board in April 2014. OSC’s complaint alleged that, when fielding taxpayers’ questions on an IRS customer service help line, the employee repeatedly urged taxpayers to reelect President Obama in 2012 by delivering a chant based on the spelling of the employee’s last name. In the settlement agreement resolving the complaint, the IRS employee acknowledged that he had used his authority and influence as an IRS customer service representative for a political purpose and did so while at work.
 

Bowfinger

Lifer
Nov 17, 2002
15,776
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Did you have a point or was this just more fuel for you IRS conspiracy theory?
Duh. Clearly Lerner's lost emails will prove that she personally ordered this employee to stump for Obama. Why can't you make logical deductions?
 
Nov 30, 2006
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Duh. Clearly Lerner's lost emails will prove that she personally ordered this employee to stump for Obama. Why can't you make logical deductions?
Yep...that must be it. It couldn't be that he felt it was tangentially related to the topic of IRS political abuse.
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
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Yep...that must be it. It couldn't be that he felt it was tangentially related to the topic of IRS political abuse.

Yeh, the IRS is just one big conspiracy, right down to the guys who answer the phones.

Or maybe the guy just let his personal feelings affect his work.

Apply Occam's razor, or the principles of conspiracy theory, take your pick.
 
Nov 30, 2006
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Yeh, the IRS is just one big conspiracy, right down to the guys who answer the phones.

Or maybe the guy just let his personal feelings affect his work.

Apply Occam's razor, or the principles of conspiracy theory, take your pick.
I never said or implied that this guy was part of a conspiracy. Wow.
 

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
33,773
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http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?p=36341327

Here's one, there are others. In this thread. I can't find them on Tapatalk due to the broken plugin here.

Sorry I don't see it. One might infer that he supports it but it looks like a little quip rather than an admission of support. His other posts also don't indicate he supports targeted scrutiny. He does support scrutiny though but that's not the same thing.
 

TerryMathews

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
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Sorry I don't see it. One might infer that he supports it but it looks like a little quip rather than an admission of support. His other posts also don't indicate he supports targeted scrutiny. He does support scrutiny though but that's not the same thing.
Like I said, that's the first post I came across not the only post. I know there are others.

You have to be blind or willfully ignorant to not read what he wrote in plain English.
 

piasabird

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
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In Illinois they make state employees take a class about the illegality of using public resources and public funds (Paycheck) and company time to work on politics. It is strictly forbidden. This is even more so in an organization like the IRS which in theory is suppose to be insulated from political pressure.
 

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
33,773
17,419
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Like I said, that's the first post I came across not the only post. I know there are others.

You have to be blind or willfully ignorant to not read what he wrote in plain English.

Forgive me if, in a thread full of bullshit, innuendo, and supposition, that I don't buy your claim when you do the same thing to a poster in this thread.
 

TerryMathews

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
11,464
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It's not about quantity, it's about quality. Let's see a post that's not based on interpretation.

Relevant posts from the first 20 pages follow. Let me know when you're ready to concede defeat.
Given Teaparty antitaxation rhetoric, who cares? Audit looks for discrepancies. Or sometimes not, got called in once by IRS for no reason anyone could explain.
Government is not nor ever will be entirely sane or perfect, people are not built that way.
Think about various bosses and coworkers, think of them in charge, omg.

I'm shocked, shocked, that the organization responsible for collecting taxes would look more intensely at those who had donated to groups that were outspoken in their opposition to taxation. Profiling is wrong, but are we really surprised when it happens? Stereotypes are a real time-saver.

Well I suppose the way to clear that up would be to audit those who oppose higher taxation and see if they were lying on their tax returns.