Iraq army gifts more goods to Daesh

[blastingcap]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...e2da12-fc92-11e4-805c-c3f407e5a9e9_story.html

Do these people not understand that you at least set on fire whatever you have to ditch? Or mangle them with grenades.

The part that is most hilarious is how allegedly half of the abandoned vehicles were reinforcements. You KNOW those had fuel in them, why not freaking drive them out?

Screw Iraq, they are ALREADY an Iranian satellite state anyway. Give whatever you were going to give the Iraqis to the Kurds instead and tell them to not help any further, just defend.

Continue air strikes though so people can't accuse the US of abandoning them altogether.

Sooner or later Baghdad will be threatened, at which point I hope Iran gets the hint and sends its regular army over. No more US blood spilled in that hellhole.

 

[Jaskalas]

The Bush legacy haunts the Middle East, even the world, to this day.
How many generations from now will the slaughter that we started - continue?

 

[Genx87]

Are we rushed in more equipment last week to the Iraqi govt. Wonder how long it will take for that to end up in ISIS hands?

 

[rudeguy]

The Bush legacy haunts the Middle East, even the world, to this day.
How many generations from now will the slaughter that we started - continue?

We have proven multiple times that Iraq is Britain's fault, not Bush.

 

[finglobes]

The Bush legacy haunts the Middle East, even the world, to this day.
How many generations from now will the slaughter that we started - continue?

Bush was a dope to start Iraq war. He destablized Iran's natural enemy. That said, the war was won and Obama pulled the rug out (Obama didn't want a SoFA). Obama not only flushed the win down the toilet he's ACTIVELY helping Iran. He uses US air to support Iranian forces in Iraq. He want their sanctions removed and wants then to have nukes - thus creating a nuke arms race in ME and provoking Israel to turn parts of ME into glass. Bush was a dope but Obama is a psycho who is staging greatest betrayal in history (you have to include Obama's broken borders with his help of foreign enemies) right in peoples faces

 

[GarfieldtheCat]

Bush was a dope to start Iraq war. He destablized Iran's natural enemy. That said, the war was won and Obama pulled the rug out (Obama didn't want a SoFA). Obama not only flushed the win down the toilet he's ACTIVELY helping Iran. He uses US air to support Iranian forces in Iraq. He want their sanctions removed and wants then to have nukes - thus creating a nuke arms race in ME and provoking Israel to turn parts of ME into glass. Bush was a dope but Obama is a psycho who is staging greatest betrayal in history (you have to include Obama's broken borders with his help of foreign enemies) right in peoples faces

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

That is some grade-A infowars-level fantasy right there. Seek professional help.

 

[mindmajick]

We have proven multiple times that Iraq is Britain's fault, not Bush.

I started to do the research to argue with you.. then I realized you were right.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/globalconnections/mideast/timeline/text/time2.html

July 1915-March 1916: Britain gains the support of Arabs in World War I after promising independence for Arab states.


While the Ottoman Empire enters the war on Germany's side, the Arabs (led by Sherif Hussein of Mecca) agree to side with the Allies (Britain, France, and Russia). They do so because of an agreement known as the Hussein-McMahon Correspondence in which Britain promises independence to what is now Syria, Palestine (Israel), Jordan, Iraq, and the Arabian Peninsula should the Allies win the war. Unbeknownst to the Arabs, however, Britain also signs the Sykes-Picot Agreement with France later in 1916. This pact, which directly contradicts Hussein-McMahon, details a plan to split up most of the Middle East region between Britain and France should they defeat the Axis powers. Britain makes a third conflicting agreement, the Balfour Declaration. After ousting the Ottomans from both Jerusalem and Baghdad, they promise to support the establishment of a national home for the Jewish people in Palestine.

 

[JSt0rm]

Let's retreat and leave behind armored humves perfecting for retreating in.

 

[Jhhnn]

We have proven multiple times that Iraq is Britain's fault, not Bush.

Bush was a dope to start Iraq war. He destablized Iran's natural enemy. That said, the war was won and Obama pulled the rug out (Obama didn't want a SoFA). Obama not only flushed the win down the toilet he's ACTIVELY helping Iran. He uses US air to support Iranian forces in Iraq. He want their sanctions removed and wants then to have nukes - thus creating a nuke arms race in ME and provoking Israel to turn parts of ME into glass. Bush was a dope but Obama is a psycho who is staging greatest betrayal in history (you have to include Obama's broken borders with his help of foreign enemies) right in peoples faces

Astounding denial & misdirection. It's the British! It's Obama! Oh, God! Evil Iranians!

Anybody but the true perps, The Neocons & their Israeli comrades, not to mention some help from the gulf sheikdoms.

It's all crocodile tears. They've accomplished what they wanted- the fracturing & balkanization of the ME, the destruction of any existential threats to the states of Israel & KSA.

 

[rudeguy]

I started to do the research to argue with you.. then I realized you were right.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/globalconnections/mideast/timeline/text/time2.html

July 1915-March 1916: Britain gains the support of Arabs in World War I after promising independence for Arab states.


While the Ottoman Empire enters the war on Germany's side, the Arabs (led by Sherif Hussein of Mecca) agree to side with the Allies (Britain, France, and Russia). They do so because of an agreement known as the Hussein-McMahon Correspondence in which Britain promises independence to what is now Syria, Palestine (Israel), Jordan, Iraq, and the Arabian Peninsula should the Allies win the war. Unbeknownst to the Arabs, however, Britain also signs the Sykes-Picot Agreement with France later in 1916. This pact, which directly contradicts Hussein-McMahon, details a plan to split up most of the Middle East region between Britain and France should they defeat the Axis powers. Britain makes a third conflicting agreement, the Balfour Declaration. After ousting the Ottomans from both Jerusalem and Baghdad, they promise to support the establishment of a national home for the Jewish people in Palestine.

Yep. I joke about it a lot, but it really is true.

 

[rudeguy]

Astounding denial & misdirection. It's the British! It's Obama! Oh, God! Evil Iranians!

Anybody but the true perps, The Neocons & their Israeli comrades, not to mention some help from the gulf sheikdoms.

It's all crocodile tears. They've accomplished what they wanted- the fracturing & balkanization of the ME, the destruction of any existential threats to the states of Israel & KSA.

The difference between us and you is we can provide historical evidence while your argument is full of tin foil hat fear mongering.

 

[finglobes]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

That is some grade-A infowars-level fantasy right there. Seek professional help.

Like many, the basic facts of Obama's treachery have eluded you. Of course they haven't escaped Saudi Arabia, Israel, Egypt, Yemen, Jordan etc. That's why most ME leaders stayed away from Obama's stupid "Arab summit" at Camp David. They know Obama is buggering them and helping their enemies while US media focuses on trash.


"U.S. Backs Iran With Airstrikes Against ISIS"

Iran and the U.S. say they’ve been fighting parallel wars in Iraq but now they've become one in Tikrit.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...o-back-iran-with-airstrikes-against-isis.html


"Iran's Militias Are Taking Over Iraq's Army"
http://www.bloombergview.com/articl...e-iran-s-militias-are-taking-over-iraq-s-army

"Betrayal, Obama style"
http://english.alarabiya.net/en/views/news/middle-east/2015/01/24/Betrayal-Obama-style.html


"Our Arab Allies Are Watching in Horror as Obama Allies with Iran"

http://www.nationalreview.com/corne...atching-horror-obama-allies-iran-mario-loyola

"Obama’s rapprochement with Iran is so wrong at so many levels it’s hard to know where to begin. But to put it in historical perspective, it’s as if, in 1989, the U.S. has led a massive assistance package and diplomatic effort to extend the life of Soviet Communism, and its subjugation of Eastern Europe, for another 30 years...We are witnessing one of the most spectacular implosions in the history of American foreign policy, with lasting damage to the whole U.S. position in the Middle East and to our whole system of regional alliances. The next president will have no choice but to climb out of this disastrous hole somehow, and yet Obama is digging it as fast as he can."

 

[Jhhnn]

The difference between us and you is we can provide historical evidence while your argument is full of tin foil hat fear mongering.

You mean revisionist history in search of vindication of Neocon policy, right?

Fractured & fighting among themselves, the rest of the ME poses no threat to Israel or KSA & the Neocons strive mightily to make it so.

Might want to read up on the ideology & the lies supporting it, like the notion that democracy can be spread at gunpoint-

http://www.alternet.org/story/15860/who_is_michael_ledeen

Not that you're capable of recognizing even obvious lies when they're what you want to hear in the first place.

 

[blastingcap]

The difference between us and you is we can provide historical evidence while your argument is full of tin foil hat fear mongering.

UK and France had the good sense to leave. Bush was dumb enough to go back in, against the advice of his regional partners who worried about the inevitable power vacuum. And even Bush's US generals asked for like 10x more troops than they actually sent in, prolonging US direct involvement. So yes part of the blame goes to the UK, but in more recent times Bush made it worse, and Obama made that worsened situation even worse than that.

As for how much blame should be apportioned between the UK, France, and various US politicians, and anyone else who had a part in the current mess in Iraq (Iran, Saudi Arabia, Turkey (via its open encouragement of jihadis in Syria which allowed AQI to regrow in Syria), etc.), I leave that as an exercise for the reader.

 

[rudeguy]

You mean revisionist history in search of vindication of Neocon policy, right?

Fractured & fighting among themselves, the rest of the ME poses no threat to Israel or KSA & the Neocons strive mightily to make it so.

Might want to read up on the ideology & the lies supporting it, like the notion that democracy can be spread at gunpoint-

http://www.alternet.org/story/15860/who_is_michael_ledeen

Not that you're capable of recognizing even obvious lies when they're what you want to hear in the first place.

Again. .I'll take history over your insane rambling

 

[twinrider1]

Sec of State Baker in an interview I saw years back, sometime after the 2nd Gulf War and the aftermath was becoming a bit of a quagmire.

Not a direct quote, but the general gist was...
After Bush 41 invaded Iraq, people kept asking me why we didn't drive all the way to Baghdad. Guess what, people don't ask me that anymore.

 

[Orignal Earl]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...e2da12-fc92-11e4-805c-c3f407e5a9e9_story.html

Do these people not understand that you at least set on fire whatever you have to ditch? Or mangle them with grenades.

Something something stealth helicopters

 

[Omar F1]

You should read about how the Iraqi army retreaded from al Mosul in the first time when ISIS took over it in the last year.

As one Iraqi officer told a German news agency back then: it was one hell of a systematic withdrawal he had ever seen.

But that also remind me of similar event in Iraq as well; the Marines withdrawal from their first battle in Fallujah mid-2004, when their commander said they were too close to complete the job and crush the insurgency there, up until they received the unjustified order to cease the operation and retreat back.


Again and again, everybody have the right to choose the story that would make him sleep well, but the fact stays that ISIS is not a normal event at all.

 

[rudeguy]

You should read about how the Iraqi army retreaded from al Mosul in the first time when ISIS took over it in the last year.

As one Iraqi officer told a German news agency back then: it was one hell of a systematic withdrawal he had ever seen.

But that also remind me of similar event in Iraq as well; the Marines withdrawal from their first battle in Fallujah mid-2004, when their commander said they were too close to complete the job and crush the insurgency there, up until they received the unjustified order to cease the operation and retreat back.


Again and again, everybody have the right to choose the story that would make him sleep well, but the fact stays that ISIS is not a normal event at all.

Do you mind me asking where you are from?

A big problem is we only know what the news tells us. An even bigger problem is that no one in America has had to deal with the things the people of Iraq have had to deal with: multiple wars, tyranny, death, genocide. ..those are all things we read about and then armchair quarterback about how to fix them.

 

[waggy]

I am always amazed that people just blame bush for it. sure he got us into this. but you can't ignore that Obama continued to send people and equipment over.

also people need to realize its not a question of what party. neither one cares. The war is profitable for those that back the leaders of those parties.

 

[michal1980]

JV team is ISIS.

Nothing but a JV team.

 

[nickqt]

jv team is isis.

Nothing but a jv team.

impeach now!

 

[rudeguy]

I am always amazed that people just blame bush for it. sure he got us into this. but you can't ignore that Obama continued to send people and equipment over.

also people need to realize its not a question of what party. neither one cares. The war is profitable for those that back the leaders of those parties.

The middle east and Iraq in particular have been in a state of war for as long as there has been water in the ocean. Most of the world was like that for a long time but that ended with WW2. The middle east didn't get the benefit of all the treaties and peace keeping the rest of the world did. WW1 marked the end of the Ottoman Empire there and ended with the leaders being lied to and stabbed in the back. WW2 ended with their territories being spilt up and being forced to give holy land to the Jews. That was the match that lit the powder keg.

Since then the whole region has been used as a pawn in the cold war, the war on terror, as the world's gas station and most recently a bombing range.

The problems in Iraq are ancient. ISIS is a whole new level of midevil that us noobs aren't used to.

 

[Omar F1]

Do you mind me asking where you are from?

A big problem is we only know what the news tells us. An even bigger problem is that no one in America has had to deal with the things the people of Iraq have had to deal with: multiple wars, tyranny, death, genocide. ..those are all things we read about and then armchair quarterback about how to fix them.

Never been personally in Iraq, but I'm living nearby in the Gulf region or in Jordan.

Well, trust me we're in the same guilt of watching over Palestine, Iraq, Syria, Egypt, and Libya.
Personally, I always say the Iraq occupation never been the US fault rather than us, the Arabs, for not sending the armies to oppose the war and protect the Iraqi people.

Some day, the tides could probably turn to us here, in that moment we will remember each and every Arabic nation that we have let down and watched them suffer while we slept deep and ate well in our safe nearby homes.


Anyway, for what it's worth, here is the Arabic article from the Deutsche Welle site:
www.dw.de/ضاب&#15...#1604;موصل/a-17807796
Sorry, I couldn't find an English version.

 

[Orignal Earl]

The middle east and Iraq in particular have been in a state of war for as long as there has been water in the ocean. Most of the world was like that for a long time but that ended with WW2. The middle east didn't get the benefit of all the treaties and peace keeping the rest of the world did. WW1 marked the end of the Ottoman Empire there and ended with the leaders being lied to and stabbed in the back. WW2 ended with their territories being spilt up and being forced to give holy land to the Jews. That was the match that lit the powder keg.

Since then the whole region has been used as a pawn in the cold war, the war on terror, as the world's gas station and most recently a bombing range.

The problems in Iraq are ancient. ISIS is a whole new level of midevil that us noobs aren't used to.

This was a very good post by someone over at reddit

This was already posted, but in a thread so long it is buried, and I think it relates to your idea. Though I don't argue it is good news for military contractors. After a long conversation with someone who has been dealing with the leaders in many countries over there, advising the US military and government, for decades, these are my thoughts on the matter.
As the middle east collapses further it is going to get worse. As water tables dry up, as oil from their countries is not needed millions of people will be left in desperation with hugely wealthy organizations ready to pay them 100x what is available in their newly destitute countries to fight for them. Not to mention Islam follows similar beliefs of Judaism that the suffering of the people is due to their failure in their "God's" eyes which will lead to increased power for those preaching taking teaching literally.
As things spiral out of control violent leaders will gain power and be able to fashion the direction of the religion as they will.
This is why we are fighting. This is why we are pouring billions of dollars into placing military, governments, and ideologies. We are looking at, within the next 20 years, a 2 million man army with billion dollar organizations backing them, push their violent agendas, accepted through necessity. It is only a religious war by guise used as a tool.
It's not about oil, it's not about money off of military sales, it's not about nuclear, it's not about Israel, it's about dozens of countries and dozens of millions of people on the brink of collapse, and extremist leaders ready to scoop them up. The world is primed for a new Hilter or Stalin, but in the middle east. How this plays out, will affect the next 50-100 years of humanity. Our best bet would be to pour as much money as possible into infrastructure, education, and stability. It would have to be a world effort and we aren't even beginning to do anything that needs to be done to stop this from coming to fruition.
When the world doesn't need Saudi oil any more, their Regime will flee to Sweden or France, their progress will collapse, and they will join the Yemen, Afganie, and Iraqi in desperation, not to mention the dozen other countries. Currently, only the UAE has placed themself beyond the need for oil to support their country. These collapses and shifts of power are well predicted and legitimately terrifying. ISIS is a joke compared to what is VERY LIKELY to come.
Again, it's not religion, it's socioeconomic power exploited by religious zealots that is the threat.
Edit: Took out, Islam is not a violent religion because JESUS guys, I can't respond to that any more, when it was such a minute and arguable point and while I am not an expert on this field and just relating a very interesting discussion with someone in the know, I would like to try to answer you, but I expected maybe 5 people to read this, not 50+ responses.

http://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/360gc5/isis_leader_baghdadi_says_islam_was_never_a/