iphone 5 speculation thread 413

[WelshBloke]

Apple has always made battery life a big priority. iPhone 4 & 4S run underclocked to save battery, iPad 3 came with a bigger battery so it can have the same battery life as iPad 2, etc. I'd be pretty surprised if iPhone 5 didn't have similar battery life to 4S.

If it has a bigger screen, a more powerful chip and LTE then the only way to do that is to make the battery physically bigger.

 

[Eug]

if apple releases a larger phone with LTE they will have similar battery issues unless they magic up some new battery

Not really. LTE in a future iPhone would use a lower power chipset manufactured on a smaller process. These lower power LTE chipsets are available in 2012.

It was the same thing when the first iPhone came out. It was only 2G, because 3G chipsets sucked too much power at the time. Apple released the iPhone 3G with a lower power 3G chipset a year later.

 

[WelshBloke]

Not really. LTE in a future iPhone would use a lower power chipset manufactured on a smaller process. These lower power LTE chipsets are available in 2012.

It was the same thing when the first iPhone came out. It was only 2G, because 3G chipsets sucked too much power at the time. Apple released the iPhone 3G with a lower power 3G chipset a year later.

Presumably everyone else will be using those in their high end phones as well so I think his "same boat " comment stands.

 

[Eug]

Presumably everyone else will be using those in their high end phones as well so I think his "same boat " comment stands.

The point was that LTE phones that are already out suffer from battery issues because they use LTE chipsets that have high power requirements.

Apple does not suffer this problem, because they don't have an LTE phone out.

In 2012 Apple and other manufacturers will have access to lower power LTE chipsets, so that battery issues will be less significant in new phones coming out this year, whether they're from Apple or from Samsung or whatever.

So, Apple will not be in the same boat with their first LTE phone as other manufacturers were with their first LTE phones.

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

The point was that LTE phones that are already out suffer from battery issues because they use LTE chipsets that have high power requirements.

Apple does not suffer this problem, because they don't have an LTE phone out.

In 2012 Apple and other manufacturers will have access to lower power LTE chipsets, so that battery issues will be less significant in new phones coming out this year, whether they're from Apple or from Samsung or whatever.

So, Apple will not be in the same boat with their first LTE phone as other manufacturers were with their first LTE phones.

It sounds as if you're making the argument that having less features (lte) is a feature.

I like the iphone its just I don't understand the I hope it has lte, larger screen, etc.. when you can go get a phone with all that today.

 

[gorcorps]

It sounds as if you're making the argument that having less features (lte) is a feature.

I like the iphone its just I don't understand the I hope it has lte, larger screen, etc.. when you can go get a phone with all that today.

Not with the same market. A lot of people spend money on apps, so it'd be silly to throw all that away if it's just a matter of being patient... this "I NEED IT NOW" mindset is just silly. If they were on the same OS with same market then it wouldn't make much sense, but some have to sacrifice a decent amount in order to switch sides like that and it's just not worth it to be so impatient.

 

[WelshBloke]

Not with the same market. A lot of people spend money on apps, so it'd be silly to throw all that away if it's just a matter of being patient... this "I NEED IT NOW" mindset is just silly. If they were on the same OS with same market then it wouldn't make much sense, but some have to sacrifice a decent amount in order to switch sides like that and it's just not worth it to be so impatient.

Thats one of the reasons I prefer Android, if I dont like one handset I can choose a different one but keep my app purchases. With Apple if I dont like their handset I'm fuxxored.

 

[Eug]

It sounds as if you're making the argument that having less features (lte) is a feature.

Didn't say that at all. I just said that Apple usually (but not always) will wait if things like battery life will suffer significantly by adding features like LTE with high power requirements.

I like the iphone its just I don't understand the I hope it has lte, larger screen, etc.. when you can go get a phone with all that today.

Well, I personally don't like Android phones (but would consider an Android 7" tablet). I'd rather have a 3G iPhone than an LTE Android phone of any ilk, but even better would be an LTE iPhone with decent battery life.

So instead of wasting my money on a 4" Android phone I don't want just for one feature (LTE), I'll wait for an iPhone 5 (or maybe even 6, who knows).

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

Loading time does matter, which the iPhone has beaten Android devices on loading times upon a new iPhone release.

I'd actually like to see this. When I get my SGS2 back I'm gonna try loading Opera Mobile on my Nexus S, SGS2, and my friend's iPhone 4 for comparison. Heck I'll even throw in my TouchPad and iPoad Touch 4G for comparison.

I don't think loading time is a huge issue though. I think a 0.5 second loading time versus 2 second loading time is tolerable for most people and they wouldn't complain "omg this is so slow." But here's what people WILL complain about. Give them a lightning fast loading time but when you scroll through Twitter like in Gingerbread it's choppy like a lagfest. THAT they will complain about when scrolling through 3 pages of tweets was a lagfest unless you moved slowly. Same with the browser and everything. People tolerate long load times better than slow UI. There's obviously limits and when MS is saying people are saving 35 seconds in load time thats disturbing...

For the record, Draw Something has the slowest fucking load time in the world yet it's the top app.

 

[WelshBloke]

I'd actually like to see this. When I get my SGS2 back I'm gonna try loading Opera Mobile on my Nexus S, SGS2, and my friend's iPhone 4 for comparison. Heck I'll even throw in my TouchPad and iPoad Touch 4G for comparison.

I don't think loading time is a huge issue though. I think a 0.5 second loading time versus 2 second loading time is tolerable for most people and they wouldn't complain "omg this is so slow." But here's what people WILL complain about. Give them a lightning fast loading time but when you scroll through Twitter like in Gingerbread it's choppy like a lagfest. THAT they will complain about when scrolling through 3 pages of tweets was a lagfest unless you moved slowly. Same with the browser and everything. People tolerate long load times better than slow UI. There's obviously limits and when MS is saying people are saving 35 seconds in load time thats disturbing...

For the record, Draw Something has the slowest fucking load time in the world yet it's the top app.

Opera mobile load pretty much instantaneously for me on my SGS2, I think your going to have trouble timing the differences.

 

[MrX8503]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s0802WkP5Ag&feature=youtube_gdata_player

The 4S edges out the SGS2 slightly. Ignore the last tests because that website had flash. Performance is close, but the iPhone is hardly outdated upon release.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLAizRc2Iuc&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Not a loading test, but shows the lag between Android and iOS. You can especially see it in the final finger test when the user swipes up and down really fast. The 4S has a "stuck on your finger" responsiveness, whereas the other two has a few miliseconds lag.

 

[WelshBloke]

That first test was more of a webpage loading test than an app loading one. They also used different browsers. The results looked, for all practical purposes, the same.

The second video just shows up the different way the OSs scroll. Android looked more kinetic and responsive whereas the iPhone looked more fixed to the finger. Again in practice I don't think there'd be a big difference (the Android phone might scroll a long page quicker with a flick I guess).

 

[VashHT]

Yeah I don't really mind the way android scrolls, it just feels like you're dragging the page around as opposed to iOS where it feels like it's fixed to your finger. It's not like anyone really scrolls up and down that fast anyway, and I just have to laugh at the guy who posted that video, the user experience isn't "atrocious" just because the touch input on the browser lags a little bit.

 

[Bateluer]

http://www.cnn.com/2012/04/19/tech/mobile/liquidmetal-iphone-casing/index.html

Korea IT News reported Wednesday that the iPhone 5 is likely to be housed in Liquidmetal, the commercial name for an alloy of titanium, zirconium, nickel, copper and other metals. It would make the outer surface of the phone "smooth like liquid," according to the report.

"The next iPhone needs to truly stand out from the crowd," Canalys analyst Chris Jones told Wired via email. "A change in materials is a likely way to differentiate its form factor."

Liquidmetal was discovered at the California Institute of Technology in 1992. It's a class of patented amorphous metal alloys (basically metallic glass) with unique properties including high strength, high wear resistance against scratching and denting, and a good strength-to-weight ratio. Apple was granted rights to use it in August of 2010.

 

[Eug]

---

http://www.liquidmetal.com/

Liquidmetal alloys are a revolutionary class of materials that redefine performance, process, and design paradigms. Liquidmetal alloys represent the first enabling materials technology since the creation of thermoplastics and possess characteristics that make them superior in many ways to other popular high performance materials. First, they have an "amorphous" atomic structure, which is unprecedented for bulk structural metals. Second, they include a multi-component chemical compositions, which are optimized for various properties and processes. Finally, our metal alloys are the first commericially available metals with process technologies similar to plastics.

 

[soccerballtux]

Doesn't matter. People will line up to buy it. Period.

I don't believe Apple can ignore the LTE/4G bandwagon for much longer though. Not when everyone is putting up 15MB/s download speeds on their phones and Apple's hitting 1MB/s. Thats pretty noticeable.

New York needs the LTE. Everybody there has iPhone on AT&T, terribly slow network.

 

[Mopetar]

http://www.cnn.com/2012/04/19/tech/mobile/liquidmetal-iphone-casing/index.html

Interesting if true.

If it ends up like this video, it might solve the problem of dropped phones. Just catch it when it bounces back up.

Not sure if I quite understand what is meant by "smooth like liquid" though. Devices are already quite smooth and if it's smooth in a slippery sense I can't see that being a good thing.

 

[ponyo]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s0802WkP5Ag&feature=youtube_gdata_player

The 4S edges out the SGS2 slightly. Ignore the last tests because that website had flash. Performance is close, but the iPhone is hardly outdated upon release.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLAizRc2Iuc&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Not a loading test, but shows the lag between Android and iOS. You can especially see it in the final finger test when the user swipes up and down really fast. The 4S has a "stuck on your finger" responsiveness, whereas the other two has a few miliseconds lag.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lm3dCbxjeqw

Here's old video of iPhone 4S vs Galaxy Nexus browser speed and general browser experience. Date of the video is Nov 26, 2011 so this was right after GNex launched running 4.0.0 or 4.0.1 firmware. GNex is now on 4.0.4 which further improved the speed and smoothness but this gives you general idea. GNex is slightly less smooth but is good enough. What it lacks in total smoothness, it makes up for it in functionality and increased resolution so you see more of the page content. I think iPhone 4S and Galaxy Nexus are good comparison since both are the flagship phones for the respective OS.

 

[MrX8503]

That first test was more of a webpage loading test than an app loading one. They also used different browsers. The results looked, for all practical purposes, the same.

The second video just shows up the different way the OSs scroll. Android looked more kinetic and responsive whereas the iPhone looked more fixed to the finger. Again in practice I don't think there'd be a big difference (the Android phone might scroll a long page quicker with a flick I guess).

They're using stock browsers I think, which is a sound comparison IMO. The point is that the 4S wasn't outdated. It more or less competed well with current phones.

Scroll different? Lol, thats called lag. I want objects stuck on my finger when I drag it, thats responsiveness.

 

[Eug]

Qualcomm will have trouble keeping up with 28 nm LTE chipset demand in 2012

The San Diego-based company not see a significant improvement in supply until the December quarter as it will take a few quarters to get up and running with new suppliers for the cutting edge 28 nanometer chip manufacturing technology along with TSMC (2330.TW), the world's top contract chipmaker.

---

However, since the chips that are in short supply are used for the latest high-speed cellphones based on Long Term Evolution (LTE) technology Bernstein's Rasgon said it could lead to a slowdown in the roll out of the most advanced LTE phones.

For example, analysts widely expect Apple Inc (AAPL.O) to come up with its first LTE phone later this year. Rasgon would not comment on Apple specifically but said the supply shortage could hurt LTE progress in general.

 

[hanoverphist]

Scroll different? Lol, thats called lag. I want objects stuck on my finger when I drag it, thats responsiveness.

sometimes designers think its cool to give different effects for movement animations. having it "rubberband" is a neat effect, and is used in a lot of different applications to some degree. it gives it a feeling of weight and gravity instead of just a static "movehere" robotic feel. i like it.

that said, i have no idea if that was the intention when they designed the browsers for android.

 

[UNCjigga]

Here's my not-so-ridiculous spec list:

- 4" screen (I'm going with the 9:5 aspect ratio rumor)
- 1152 x 640 screen resolution
- Dual-core Apple A6 (competitive with Cortex A15-based designs) -OR- modified version of Apple A5X (not the same speed/GPU as new iPad A5X)
- Qualcomm MDM9615 (Global LTE, HSPA+ 42, WCDMA and legacy TD-SCDMA, WCDMA, GSM/HSPA, EVDO/1x network support)
- Support for HSPA+ 42 AWS bands for T-Mobile USA
- Broadcom WLAN chipset with Dual-band N (and possibly draft 802.11ac support for next gen Airport Extreme/2013 Apple TV?)
- 8MP camera sensor (similar to current iPhone 4S)
- NFC support
- New I/O interface (compatible with legacy 20-pin dock but adds support for interfaces like HDMI 1.4a ThunderBolt and/or eSATA)
- 128GB MLC NAND storage option in addition to standard 32GB/64GB options
- 8mm thin LiquidMetal alloy chassis
- Availability in late Q4 (late October/early November) due to chip shortages.

So what's the killer new feature? I'm hoping that Apple includes some sort of ability to replicate the Apple TV interface and use a Siri-enabled Apple Remote when the new iPhone is docked to a TV (either through HDMI or AirPlay). This would be great for business travelers who want to enjoy iTunes/iCloud video content while traveling. Imagine an Apple Remote with a Siri-enabled microphone that you can use 10 feet away to speak-to-type, run media commands, etc. Even more exciting would be something similar to Motorola's full-screen desktop dock experience for full-screen web browsing etc. using the Siri Remote.

 

[Red Storm]

My latest experience with iOS (iPad 2 and iPad 3) have shown me that lag does in fact exist on iOS, contrary to the opinions of many on this forum. I see random lag while browsing the web, I see it when scrolling through lists, I see it when bringing up the keyboard. These are all instances where I see random lag with my Android phone as well (Nexus). I don't know what people are talking about when they say iOS is "perfectly" smooth, because it isn't.

 

[runawayprisoner]

I also don't get this sentiment with 3:2 screens. I think that there's a 99% chance the new screen will be 1152 x 640 @ 4" because it just makes sense (no scaling for current apps, perfect scaling for expandability, allows for virtual buttons so home button can go with the DODO). As a developer, I would rather see a 4" 1152 x 640 screen than a 4" screen with 3:2 aspect ratio. It makes absolutely no sense to make something that has such an arbitrary scaling ratio (which kills performance), and it also makes no sense that all user interface elements have to be scaled down because the screen is physically bigger.

Also, I think A5X or A6 is quite a stretch at this point. I'd realistically say it'll be an A5 with 32nm, just because there is no need for Apple to scale up their processors even with a new screen factored in, and they'll need the extra power consumption headroom if they want to implement 4G/LTE. But I think 1GB RAM is quite a possibility, and who knows, they may end up calling it an A5X with 2 GPU cores disabled.

I'd also guess that they'll stuff a bigger battery in there even if the enclosure is the same size or thinner. Seems like the 4G/LTE radio will be the monster drainer there, and they must absolutely have the battery capacity to counter that. Especially if they don't want the device to crap out on tethering.

 

[Eug]

My guess is there is a 1/4 chance of a 1152 x 640 screen. 3/4 chance of a 3:2, just because.

And I think removing the home button would be stupid.