Interesting those that own guns here

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: alkemyst
I know a lot of people that own guns, these would be people I'd classify as upper middle class...bringing in low 6 figures without much debt. Most own one gun, some a couple (usually a pistol and shotgun/rifle).

It seems here most not only own $900-1200 pistols and quite a few of them, but also AR15's that are nicely modified and then in other thread bring up .30-06's, mossbergs, etc.

Are you guys just pouring all your money into guns or just subscribe to alot of magazines?

Å

You consider 6 figure incomes 'middle class'??? Holy hell do we have a different world view.

My weapons are inherited, or fairly cheap for the most part. I think the most expensive rifle I own was only about $700.

low 6 figures, combined incomes of $100k-300k is still really just middle class...it's a sad state of affairs our economy.

hahahahah. Only 7-8% of the population has income in the six figures. I've got news for you, that's the textbook definition of upper class. By way of comparison there are 5 people with incomes under 20k for every 1 with income in the six figures.

I got news for you, only the top 1% of the nation is considered 'upper class'.

The median income in the country is something like in the $30k range, possibly a little less.

That doesn't define middle class though.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: tfinch2

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: alkemyst
I know a lot of people that own guns, these would be people I'd classify as upper middle class...bringing in low 6 figures without much debt. Most own one gun, some a couple (usually a pistol and shotgun/rifle).

It seems here most not only own $900-1200 pistols and quite a few of them, but also AR15's that are nicely modified and then in other thread bring up .30-06's, mossbergs, etc.

Are you guys just pouring all your money into guns or just subscribe to alot of magazines?

Å

You consider 6 figure incomes 'middle class'??? Holy hell do we have a different world view.

My weapons are inherited, or fairly cheap for the most part. I think the most expensive rifle I own was only about $700.

low 6 figures, combined incomes of $100k-300k is still really just middle class...it's a sad state of affairs our economy.

$100k is considered middle class in some areas, but $300k is not. You're either dillusional or a troll. Median income + 15-30k is more or less middle class.

I think you are basing this on your own salary somehow...have you looked at what the current definitions are?

 

[SampSon]

Originally posted by: BrunoPuntzJones

Originally posted by: SampSon
Guns are an obsession, much like porn.

Don't get me wrong, I fully support the right to bear arms of just about all levels except nuclear.
I have a rifle or two and a shotgun. They haven't been used in a year or so and I'm not sure when they will be used again.

I understand the 'hobby' aspect, but at what point is it just an obsession with an object of power?
Nebor claims he has $70,000 worth of firearms, which I'm not sure is true based on previous armament lists he has provided. Even so, unless he is an antique gun collector or a Blackwater contractor, what is the deal with that? Seriously $70,000, even for a cop that is quite a bit. But whatever floats your boat.

Hopefully when Iran or China invades us these sole proprietor militias will kick some serious ass.

Owning 100 guns is no more dangerous than owning 1. How many can you shoot at once?

I'm not sure, you could probably tie a string to each finger and toe and fire a bunch at once. I just think that owning a ridiculous amount of guns is creepy. If someone digs it, then go for it. A lot of people have incredible porn collections, which is similar to guns. Both are great masturbatory aids.

I figure if you're an antique collector then it's a different story. There is some sort of quantifiable value and history to antiques. Not so much when it comes to buying a brand spankin new gun every other week.

 

[Pliablemoose]

Also, guns aren't a great investment' unless you buy the really fancy engraved stuff, but they do tend to keep their value, I know a couple of guys with more $ than Nebor in guns and they're planning on selling them during their retirement for extra $. No taxes, etc...

 

[bignateyk]

I have lots of guns, but not really any expensive ones. Ruger P95 (<$400), a hand-me-down mossberg 12ga, 30 30 rifle, and 22 revolver from my dad, and an AK47 that I bought for <$400.

Next summer i'm probably gonna put about $1200 into an AR though.

 

[OS]

i just bought a sig pro for $400

 

[Special K]

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: tfinch2

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: alkemyst
I know a lot of people that own guns, these would be people I'd classify as upper middle class...bringing in low 6 figures without much debt. Most own one gun, some a couple (usually a pistol and shotgun/rifle).

It seems here most not only own $900-1200 pistols and quite a few of them, but also AR15's that are nicely modified and then in other thread bring up .30-06's, mossbergs, etc.

Are you guys just pouring all your money into guns or just subscribe to alot of magazines?

Å

You consider 6 figure incomes 'middle class'??? Holy hell do we have a different world view.

My weapons are inherited, or fairly cheap for the most part. I think the most expensive rifle I own was only about $700.

low 6 figures, combined incomes of $100k-300k is still really just middle class...it's a sad state of affairs our economy.

$100k is considered middle class in some areas, but $300k is not. You're either dillusional or a troll. Median income + 15-30k is more or less middle class.

I think you are basing this on your own salary somehow...have you looked at what the current definitions are?

Where can I find the "official" definition of middle class?

 

[JulesMaximus]

I only own one gun that I paid more than $1k for and it's a Beretta O/U shotgun.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: Special K

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: tfinch2

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: alkemyst
I know a lot of people that own guns, these would be people I'd classify as upper middle class...bringing in low 6 figures without much debt. Most own one gun, some a couple (usually a pistol and shotgun/rifle).

It seems here most not only own $900-1200 pistols and quite a few of them, but also AR15's that are nicely modified and then in other thread bring up .30-06's, mossbergs, etc.

Are you guys just pouring all your money into guns or just subscribe to alot of magazines?

Å

You consider 6 figure incomes 'middle class'??? Holy hell do we have a different world view.

My weapons are inherited, or fairly cheap for the most part. I think the most expensive rifle I own was only about $700.

low 6 figures, combined incomes of $100k-300k is still really just middle class...it's a sad state of affairs our economy.

$100k is considered middle class in some areas, but $300k is not. You're either dillusional or a troll. Median income + 15-30k is more or less middle class.

I think you are basing this on your own salary somehow...have you looked at what the current definitions are?

Where can I find the "official" definition of middle class?

There are a few definitions by economists. You can wiki middle class and go from there if you are lost.

 

[tfinch2]

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: Special K

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: tfinch2

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: alkemyst
I know a lot of people that own guns, these would be people I'd classify as upper middle class...bringing in low 6 figures without much debt. Most own one gun, some a couple (usually a pistol and shotgun/rifle).

It seems here most not only own $900-1200 pistols and quite a few of them, but also AR15's that are nicely modified and then in other thread bring up .30-06's, mossbergs, etc.

Are you guys just pouring all your money into guns or just subscribe to alot of magazines?

Å

You consider 6 figure incomes 'middle class'??? Holy hell do we have a different world view.

My weapons are inherited, or fairly cheap for the most part. I think the most expensive rifle I own was only about $700.

low 6 figures, combined incomes of $100k-300k is still really just middle class...it's a sad state of affairs our economy.

$100k is considered middle class in some areas, but $300k is not. You're either dillusional or a troll. Median income + 15-30k is more or less middle class.

I think you are basing this on your own salary somehow...have you looked at what the current definitions are?

Where can I find the "official" definition of middle class?

There are a few definitions by economists. You can wiki middle class and go from there if you are lost.

I'd recommend that you read it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A..._class#Academic_models

 

[PrinceofWands]

Originally posted by: tfinch2

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: Special K

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: tfinch2

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: alkemyst
I know a lot of people that own guns, these would be people I'd classify as upper middle class...bringing in low 6 figures without much debt. Most own one gun, some a couple (usually a pistol and shotgun/rifle).

It seems here most not only own $900-1200 pistols and quite a few of them, but also AR15's that are nicely modified and then in other thread bring up .30-06's, mossbergs, etc.

Are you guys just pouring all your money into guns or just subscribe to alot of magazines?

Å

You consider 6 figure incomes 'middle class'??? Holy hell do we have a different world view.

My weapons are inherited, or fairly cheap for the most part. I think the most expensive rifle I own was only about $700.

low 6 figures, combined incomes of $100k-300k is still really just middle class...it's a sad state of affairs our economy.

$100k is considered middle class in some areas, but $300k is not. You're either dillusional or a troll. Median income + 15-30k is more or less middle class.

I think you are basing this on your own salary somehow...have you looked at what the current definitions are?

Where can I find the "official" definition of middle class?

There are a few definitions by economists. You can wiki middle class and go from there if you are lost.

I'd recommend that you read it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A..._class#Academic_models

Exactly. According to any model that is used commonly or means anything, there's a big difference between the elite or upper classes, and the middle (even the upper middle).

 

[Jschmuck2]

You can only shoot two guns at the most. Maybe a few of you will figure out how to pull the trigger with your cocks - seems like you're getting closer every day

 

[jlee]

Originally posted by: Jschmuck2
You can only shoot two guns at the most. Maybe a few of you will figure out how to pull the trigger with your cocks - seems like you're getting closer every day

And you can't play more than one video game at once, either..

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: tfinch2
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A..._class#Academic_models

Where am I wrong? I said middle class is about up to $300k. Both of those statistics you linked in that wiki are several years old. Thompson and Hickey's numbers even back in 2005 were pretty generous to the 'upper class' status saying only $140k household income is in that category.

I am sure many of our readers are pulling in just around that combined or solo and don't feel much like upper class today.

I wouldn't be far off even on those numbers save by $50k. Where I live in Palm Beach County it really pushes those boundaries more, our property is insane as are the taxes.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: JLee

Originally posted by: Jschmuck2
You can only shoot two guns at the most. Maybe a few of you will figure out how to pull the trigger with your cocks - seems like you're getting closer every day

And you can't play more than one video game at once, either..

depends on the game...FPS probably not.

 

[Turin39789]

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: tfinch2

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: Special K

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: tfinch2

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: alkemyst
I know a lot of people that own guns, these would be people I'd classify as upper middle class...bringing in low 6 figures without much debt. Most own one gun, some a couple (usually a pistol and shotgun/rifle).

It seems here most not only own $900-1200 pistols and quite a few of them, but also AR15's that are nicely modified and then in other thread bring up .30-06's, mossbergs, etc.

Are you guys just pouring all your money into guns or just subscribe to alot of magazines?

Å

You consider 6 figure incomes 'middle class'??? Holy hell do we have a different world view.

My weapons are inherited, or fairly cheap for the most part. I think the most expensive rifle I own was only about $700.

low 6 figures, combined incomes of $100k-300k is still really just middle class...it's a sad state of affairs our economy.

$100k is considered middle class in some areas, but $300k is not. You're either dillusional or a troll. Median income + 15-30k is more or less middle class.

I think you are basing this on your own salary somehow...have you looked at what the current definitions are?

Where can I find the "official" definition of middle class?

There are a few definitions by economists. You can wiki middle class and go from there if you are lost.

I'd recommend that you read it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A..._class#Academic_models

Exactly. According to any model that is used commonly or means anything, there's a big difference between the elite or upper classes, and the middle (even the upper middle).

yea, many people who grow up middle class(like myself) have a delusional concept of the classes. 50+% of the population makes less than 50k in a two income situation. then there are the people who own hdtvs and aren't making payments on them, then there are the small number of people who make 6 figures, and then there are the people who are drastically above that who are statistically equal to the people you can shoot with a bullet by pointing your gun in the air and having it hit them 6 miles away.

 

[alkemyst]

If many paid attention to the threshold the IRS lets one eFile for free, they shouldn't be that delusional. Even the top 1% of the world is a HUGE range of income. Most people don't understand the real power even a few million gives someone.

 

[PrinceofWands]

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: tfinch2
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A..._class#Academic_models

Where am I wrong? I said middle class is about up to $300k. Both of those statistics you linked in that wiki are several years old. Thompson and Hickey's numbers even back in 2005 were pretty generous to the 'upper class' status saying only $140k household income is in that category.

I am sure many of our readers are pulling in just around that combined or solo and don't feel much like upper class today.

I wouldn't be far off even on those numbers save by $50k. Where I live in Palm Beach County it really pushes those boundaries more, our property is insane as are the taxes.

If you look at the Thompson and Hickey model it allows the top 5% in the upper class. Given that only 7-8% of people have incomes in the six figures that leaves only 2-3% of the middle-upper class qualifying in your statement (while the remaining 12-13% of the people in the upper middle class come in under six figures, a 4:1 or even 6:1 margin). Of course then we're getting into differences between wages and other incomes, individual versus household, etc. What it comes down to is percentage of population versus absolute income. I say the top 5% comprise the class, not a specific amount. You are apparently arguing there is an absolute amount which qualifies you.

I guess what it comes down to is that I have the world view of previous generations in defining income, wealth, and economic class, while you have a very modern view on those things. It creates a situation where the bottom line is simply the inability to agree. It's not that either are right or wrong, because we have different basic definitions. *shrug*

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: tfinch2
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A..._class#Academic_models

Where am I wrong? I said middle class is about up to $300k. Both of those statistics you linked in that wiki are several years old. Thompson and Hickey's numbers even back in 2005 were pretty generous to the 'upper class' status saying only $140k household income is in that category.

I am sure many of our readers are pulling in just around that combined or solo and don't feel much like upper class today.

I wouldn't be far off even on those numbers save by $50k. Where I live in Palm Beach County it really pushes those boundaries more, our property is insane as are the taxes.

If you look at the Thompson and Hickey model it allows the top 5% in the upper class. Given that only 7-8% of people have incomes in the six figures that leaves only 2-3% of the middle-upper class qualifying in your statement (while the remaining 12-13% of the people in the upper middle class come in under six figures, a 4:1 or even 6:1 margin). Of course then we're getting into differences between wages and other incomes, individual versus household, etc. What it comes down to is percentage of population versus absolute income. I say the top 5% comprise the class, not a specific amount. You are apparently arguing there is an absolute amount which qualifies you.

I guess what it comes down to is that I have the world view of previous generations in defining income, wealth, and economic class, while you have a very modern view on those things. It creates a situation where the bottom line is simply the inability to agree. It's not that either are right or wrong, because we have different basic definitions. *shrug*

Dude I am not arguing anything, you and Tfinch2 are.

I stand by my numbers that *most* would consider 100k-300k not upperclass. That *most* is not the forum here who I believe are trying to wish their inclusion to a better economic status for whatever reason.

Those numbers you keep quoting are out of date anyway.

 

[PrinceofWands]

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: tfinch2
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A..._class#Academic_models

Where am I wrong? I said middle class is about up to $300k. Both of those statistics you linked in that wiki are several years old. Thompson and Hickey's numbers even back in 2005 were pretty generous to the 'upper class' status saying only $140k household income is in that category.

I am sure many of our readers are pulling in just around that combined or solo and don't feel much like upper class today.

I wouldn't be far off even on those numbers save by $50k. Where I live in Palm Beach County it really pushes those boundaries more, our property is insane as are the taxes.

If you look at the Thompson and Hickey model it allows the top 5% in the upper class. Given that only 7-8% of people have incomes in the six figures that leaves only 2-3% of the middle-upper class qualifying in your statement (while the remaining 12-13% of the people in the upper middle class come in under six figures, a 4:1 or even 6:1 margin). Of course then we're getting into differences between wages and other incomes, individual versus household, etc. What it comes down to is percentage of population versus absolute income. I say the top 5% comprise the class, not a specific amount. You are apparently arguing there is an absolute amount which qualifies you.

I guess what it comes down to is that I have the world view of previous generations in defining income, wealth, and economic class, while you have a very modern view on those things. It creates a situation where the bottom line is simply the inability to agree. It's not that either are right or wrong, because we have different basic definitions. *shrug*

Dude I am not arguing anything, you and Tfinch2 are.

I stand by my numbers that *most* would consider 100k-300k not upperclass. That *most* is not the forum here who I believe are trying to wish their inclusion to a better economic status for whatever reason.

Those numbers you keep quoting are out of date anyway.

Well it was you who started the whole thing by claiming 300k as middle class (if upper). Ok, that's not fair...you just made a statement of your opinion, I started the argument by objecting to it.

The original numbers I quoted are from 2006...if that's out of date we also disagree on matters of a temporal nature. The numbers from the wiki are from a 2005 text with stats probably within a year or two before that. That means at worst they're 2003. In other words they're as current as reasonably possible. If you disagree then again, we have completely opposite concepts of time.

I don't know ANYONE, as in not 1 person, who thinks 100-300k is anything but upperclass. That includes someone with an income of 20-60k a month. So I would say that no, most people would NOT consider it middle class. Furthermore statistics would support that it's not middle class. Therefore I simply can't agree.

 

[ShotgunSteven]

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: adairusmc
All of my AR's were cheap, because I built them myself.

The only super-expensive firearms that I did not inherit were my M1a national match, my Barrett (got an awesome deal on that used though), and my HK handguns. They arent THAT expensive.

I am always looking for upgrades every single payday for my firearm collection. It is kind of like some of the computer enthusiast's here, with always upgrading their computer rigs.


I am on an AR-15 lower reciver kick right now, I am making it a rule to buy six of them this year just for holding onto.

Well the HK compact and ACP45 you posted for daily carry are around $900 or so I think. Maybe they are cheaper used though. I still don't get the people the claim to have multiples of the same guns...maybe as a collection it makes sense.

I can get H&K Compacts for dealer cost+10% and shipping. I buy through a guy with a Class III, sells from home rather than maintaining a store.

Only on ATOT does a gun thread become a pissing match about income brackets. :beer:

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Well it was you who started the whole thing by claiming 300k as middle class (if upper). Ok, that's not fair...you just made a statement of your opinion, I started the argument by objecting to it.

The original numbers I quoted are from 2006...if that's out of date we also disagree on matters of a temporal nature. The numbers from the wiki are from a 2005 text with stats probably within a year or two before that. That means at worst they're 2003. In other words they're as current as reasonably possible. If you disagree then again, we have completely opposite concepts of time.

I don't know ANYONE, as in not 1 person, who thinks 100-300k is anything but upperclass. That includes someone with an income of 20-60k a month. So I would say that no, most people would NOT consider it middle class. Furthermore statistics would support that it's not middle class. Therefore I simply can't agree.

Well you can disagree all you want then. Like I said most people don't understand this so probably ANYONE you know wouldn't either. People tend to think they are in a higher class than they really are.

I REALLY think you never talked about this with anyone as how did the conversation go down
"Hey Tom, how much do you make a month?"

"oh that's a great question, definitely something you should know...about $60k"

"Really that's pretty good"

"Yeah *stretch* it puts me in the upper class, I may be considered a King in England even."

There are quite a few economic models out there, but if you really think something put together more than a couple years ago is a good indication where anyone stands today is shows how out of the loop one is on this kind of metric.


If someone is living in cow country, they will get a feeling of a lot more disposable income, however; that doesn't change their class status. They may think they have more money than they know what to do with, but in reality they have very little compared to those that really do.