Intel Yonah Pricing

jlbenedict

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Jul 10, 2005
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I think the single core, P4, 661 (3.6Ghz , 2mb L2, 65nm process) looks attractive at a pinch over $400 and the 651 series at under $300 is an attractive option as well..
 

DrMrLordX

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Apr 27, 2000
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Interseting that the 2.16 ghz Yonah dual-core proc is the same price as the 3.4 ghz Presler(Pentium D 950). I'd rather have the Yonah in a desktop than the Presler. Why even offer Presler for sale? I guess it's better at encoding, but . . .
 

Cooler

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Mar 31, 2005
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Originally posted by: DrMrLordX
Interseting that the 2.16 ghz Yonah dual-core proc is the same price as the 3.4 ghz Presler(Pentium D 950). I'd rather have the Yonah in a desktop than the Presler. Why even offer Presler for sale? I guess it's better at encoding, but . . .

In april 3.6 Ghz Presler is coming out so geting a presler now would be a joke as in april major price cuts are near.
 

DrMrLordX

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Apr 27, 2000
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3.6 ghz Presler? Interesting. I had heard that Presler wouldn't go any higher than 3.4 ghz before Merom and Conroe launched. Guess I heard wrong *)
 

dmens

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Mar 18, 2005
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Perhaps yonah would not be a wise choice for a desktop platform... it retains some of the architectural glass jaws that afflict previous P-M designs, and they tend to directly affect desktop/server workloads. AT's perf review is on the spot.

Personally I wouldn't get a presler since the X2 will last me a while, but presler is supremely overclockable from what I've seen. Also, merom addresses most of yonah's uarch shortcomings, so conroe is also a good choice once it is out.
 

Viditor

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Oct 25, 1999
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Originally posted by: hurtstotalktoyou
Ooo, I like the looks of that Pentium D 920 for $241! I hope they solve the heat problem with 65nm.

Not solved exactly, but about 10% better than it was at 90nm...still not really competitive with the X2 though. Even THG has capitulated to AMD's superiority for the bulk of this year.

Looking at the dual core sector, the Pentium D 900 is able to mix things up a little bit, but it is not capable of surpassing the Athlon 64 X2's performance at all...As far as power consumption goes, a Pentium D 950 actually manages to reduce overall power requirements over the Pentium D 840 by approximately 10%. However, a system that runs an Athlon 64 X2 and the same components requires another 20-25% less energy! To make things worse, Intel had to delay support for C1E, Thermal Monitoring 2 and Enhanced SpeedStep until the second quarter of this year, which we find really disappointing. If we had done the power measurements with AMD's Cool & Quiet enabled, it would have left Intel behind even more

THG 900 article
 

Viditor

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Oct 25, 1999
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Originally posted by: dmens
Perhaps yonah would not be a wise choice for a desktop platform... it retains some of the architectural glass jaws that afflict previous P-M designs, and they tend to directly affect desktop/server workloads. AT's perf review is on the spot.

Personally I wouldn't get a presler since the X2 will last me a while, but presler is supremely overclockable from what I've seen. Also, merom addresses most of yonah's uarch shortcomings, so conroe is also a good choice once it is out.

I agree with you on the Yonah...
Also (for the OP), the Yonah is still only 32bit, Presler will be 64 bit.

It will be interesting to see where both companies are at by the end of this year...Intel will have the Conroe and Merom, and AMD should be able to get much higher clockspeeds with the new SiGe process. I noticed in another thread that AMD have just released another stepping...I wonder what they've done?
 

dmens

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Mar 18, 2005
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Much higher? When i read "40% improvement", my engineering sense screams "FUD". But kudos to IBM (hehe) if it is true.

Also, where did you get 10% improvement? Compare Dothan and Yonah power levels and consider the fact that yonah is two cores and bigger cache.
 

dexvx

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Feb 2, 2000
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Originally posted by: dmens
Much higher? When i read "40% improvement", my engineering sense screams "FUD". But kudos to IBM (hehe) if it is true.

Also, where did you get 10% improvement? Compare Dothan and Yonah power levels and consider the fact that yonah is two cores and bigger cache.

The cache is the same on Dothan and Yonah. Dothan to Yonah is about a 40% improvement in terms of power usage, if you count the fact that Yonah is 2 cores.
 

Viditor

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Oct 25, 1999
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Guys, read the post again...I was comparing Presler to Smithfield (65nm to 90nm). I got the 10% figure straight from the article (though I don't blame you about being dubious with a THG article...)
Pentium D 950 actually manages to reduce overall power requirements over the Pentium D 840 by approximately 10%.
 

coldpower27

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Jul 18, 2004
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Yeh something to the affect of Presler 3.4GHZ = Smithfield 2.8 GHZ in heat output, it's an improvement, but still quite a bit of heat.
 

Viditor

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Originally posted by: coldpower27
Yeh something to the affect of Presler 3.4GHZ = Smithfield 2.8 GHZ in heat output, it's an improvement, but still quite a bit of heat.

I think THG's numbers show that (under 100% load) the 3.2 GHz Presler (65nm) uses ~12% less power than a 3.2 GHz Smithfield (90nm). But you're right...it's still a lot of heat!
Even when the Presler is at idle, it's much higher than the all of the AMD line under 100% load (when CnQ is turned on).
 

Viditor

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Oct 25, 1999
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Originally posted by: dmens
Much higher? When i read "40% improvement", my engineering sense screams "FUD". But kudos to IBM (hehe) if it is true.

I understand your dubiousness...:)
Intel has also made changes (which is why Yonah has such an improvement...)
For the gory details...
"AMD and IBM last year used a dual-stress-liner approach for their 90-nm transistors, putting differently configured nitride capping layers on top of the NMOS and PMOS transistors. At the 65-nm node, the partners added an embedded SiGe layer similar to what Intel used at the 90-nm node. Wei said ?a big boost came when we added the embedded SiGe? at the source and drain regions of the PMOS transistor.

The PMOS devices now run almost as fast as the NMOS transistors. Wei said the new process will allow design engineers to better balance the size of the N- and PMOS transistors to achieve performance improvements at the product level that he said could approach 50 percent"

"Intel did not add a compressive nitrde capping over the PMOS transistor, as AMD and IBM do. Intel decided to keep its process as simple as possible in order to keep costs under control, he said, adding that ?we achieved our performance goals with this approach.? "

"Andy Wei, a member of the technical staff based at AMD Dresden, described a new process that AMD will first retrofit into its 90-nm microprocessors, and then use in its 65-nm designs going into production in the second half of next year at AMD?s new 300-mm fab in Dresden"

EETimes article
 

coldpower27

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Jul 18, 2004
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Originally posted by: Viditor
Originally posted by: coldpower27
Yeh something to the affect of Presler 3.4GHZ = Smithfield 2.8 GHZ in heat output, it's an improvement, but still quite a bit of heat.

I think THG's numbers show that (under 100% load) the 3.2 GHz Presler (65nm) uses ~12% less power than a 3.2 GHz Smithfield (90nm). But you're right...it's still a lot of heat!
Even when the Presler is at idle, it's much higher than the all of the AMD line under 100% load (when CnQ is turned on).

Just to clarifty they show a Presler based system consumes 12% less power then a Smithfield based one.
 

TraumaRN

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Jun 5, 2005
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Originally posted by: Viditor
Originally posted by: dmens
Much higher? When i read "40% improvement", my engineering sense screams "FUD". But kudos to IBM (hehe) if it is true.

I understand your dubiousness...:)
Intel has also made changes (which is why Yonah has such an improvement...)
For the gory details...
"AMD and IBM last year used a dual-stress-liner approach for their 90-nm transistors, putting differently configured nitride capping layers on top of the NMOS and PMOS transistors. At the 65-nm node, the partners added an embedded SiGe layer similar to what Intel used at the 90-nm node. Wei said ?a big boost came when we added the embedded SiGe? at the source and drain regions of the PMOS transistor.

The PMOS devices now run almost as fast as the NMOS transistors. Wei said the new process will allow design engineers to better balance the size of the N- and PMOS transistors to achieve performance improvements at the product level that he said could approach 50 percent"

"Intel did not add a compressive nitrde capping over the PMOS transistor, as AMD and IBM do. Intel decided to keep its process as simple as possible in order to keep costs under control, he said, adding that ?we achieved our performance goals with this approach.? "

"Andy Wei, a member of the technical staff based at AMD Dresden, described a new process that AMD will first retrofit into its 90-nm microprocessors, and then use in its 65-nm designs going into production in the second half of next year at AMD?s new 300-mm fab in Dresden"

EETimes article

Just reading that article you can literally see the different philosophies of the companies, Intel, cheap, simple crank it out, AMD slower more involved research aimed at specific goals then they crank it out....Dare I say Soviet style to American style :laugh:
 

dmens

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Mar 18, 2005
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My advice is not to listen to PR of any company (which is what the EETimes article reads like). Well, you'll see when merom comes out, but intel's 65nm is neither simple nor slow... but if it's cheap, all the better.
 

coldpower27

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Jul 18, 2004
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Originally posted by: dmens
My advice is not to listen to PR of any company (which is what the EETimes article reads like). Well, you'll see when merom comes out, but intel's 65nm is neither simple nor slow... but if it's cheap, all the better.

Well it's definitely cheaper as AMD is implementing SilconGermainum into their 65nm process, in addition to the existing Dual Stress Liner Strained Silicon and Silicon on Insulator.

Intel doesn't have to worry about SOI.

Intel will be much more competitive on desktop though with Conroe, and further reinforce their mobile line with Merom.
 

Viditor

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Oct 25, 1999
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Originally posted by: dmens
My advice is not to listen to PR of any company (which is what the EETimes article reads like). Well, you'll see when merom comes out, but intel's 65nm is neither simple nor slow... but if it's cheap, all the better.

It didn't really seem like a PR to me, mainly because they were reporting the strengths of both companies...
The part where they talked about the improved Intel transistors used in Yonah was quite interesting!
With all that we've read about Conroe and Merom, it's good to see that there will be some significant AMD improvements around that time as well...something that we've not had much information on.
 

stratman

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Oct 19, 2004
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Originally posted by: dmens
Perhaps yonah would not be a wise choice for a desktop platform... it retains some of the architectural glass jaws that afflict previous P-M designs, and they tend to directly affect desktop/server workloads. AT's perf review is on the spot.

Personally I wouldn't get a presler since the X2 will last me a while, but presler is supremely overclockable from what I've seen. Also, merom addresses most of yonah's uarch shortcomings, so conroe is also a good choice once it is out.

:eek:
You own an X2? Even though you work for intel? :p


I was a little dissapointed by Yonah's performance in Anand's first Yonah performance preview, because the performance gain wasn't enough to offset what I figured must be higher power consumption due to the 2 cores (n.b. I <3 battery life more than performance, I undervolt my Dothan significantly).
However, the most recent Yonah article, where power consumption is actually measured, blew me away. Lower power consumption with twice the cores?

Intel must be letting the engineers run the show again, they pwned it up with Yonah.
 

DrMrLordX

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Apr 27, 2000
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I agree stratman, that was very impressive. I'd like to see how well Yonah overclocks.