Intel Vs. AMD

RuNic

Junior Member
Nov 14, 2004
6
0
0
I'm fairly new at this tech stuff and ive been doing a lot of reading lately at this site and others, but one major question still remains for me.

What are the major differences between these two processors, and what makes the AMD chips better for gaming? (which is what ive heard)

Also recomendations for the processor for my gaming cpu that i want to build are welcome as well.
 

RuNic

Junior Member
Nov 14, 2004
6
0
0
I've noticed that the intel chips usually have the Ghz speed in their title, and the AMD chips do not. So i often cant tell which is better at a glance. Assuming more Ghz always means better.

Also what is nm? as in 90 nm.
 

DAPUNISHER

Super Moderator CPU Forum Mod and Elite Member
Super Moderator
Aug 22, 2001
32,482
33,552
146
Originally posted by: RuNic
I've noticed that the intel chips usually have the Ghz speed in their title, and the AMD chips do not. So i often cant tell which is better at a glance. Assuming more Ghz always means better.

Also what is nm? as in 90 nm.
You poor bastage :p Seriously, all you need to know is the mhz wars are over for now and performance in actual games and apps is what is important.
 

Gamingphreek

Lifer
Mar 31, 2003
11,679
0
81
Nm is nanometer refferring to the core size of the processor.

As for GHZ... that is clock frequency. More doesn't always mean better. That is how fast the computer can compute data, however in AMD's case they can do more in one clock cycle than Intel can. Like a 5 Lane highway at 55mph and a 2 lane at 75mph. Using this analogy you can only raise the speed so much before it tops out, in AMD's case they have more lanes so dont need to raise the speed to keep traffic flowing.

Weird analogy but eh it works.

I would change your title also to something like "The Basics of a Processor" the title right now only sparks trolls and what not.

-Kevin
 

RuNic

Junior Member
Nov 14, 2004
6
0
0
lol.

Thanks for the help guys, i am super new but i think i may have found my new hobby. :)
 

Gamingphreek

Lifer
Mar 31, 2003
11,679
0
81
Well read up on stuff first instead of just posting here. We have plenty of threads asking the exact same question, just search a little.

-Kevin
 

DaveSimmons

Elite Member
Aug 12, 2001
40,730
670
126
Also try clicking the "CPU/Chipsets" tab at the top of the page and skimming an artcile or two. Pages and pages of comparison charts, plus nice summaries if you don't want the details.
 

Appledrop

Platinum Member
Aug 25, 2004
2,340
0
0
i prefer this analogy: :p

Running: to go fast you can either take big steps less frequently (amd) or small steps very quickly (intel) to achieve similar speed
 

DAPUNISHER

Super Moderator CPU Forum Mod and Elite Member
Super Moderator
Aug 22, 2001
32,482
33,552
146
Originally posted by: RuNic
lol.

Thanks for the help guys, i am super new but i think i may have found my new hobby. :)
Save yourself before its too late! Seriously, this will consume you and your bank acct. without hesitation! ;)

 

gobucks

Golden Member
Oct 22, 2004
1,166
0
0
Among similar chips, more GHz is usually better. For example, a 3.0GHz P4 is usually slower than a 3.4GHz P4. Similarly, the 2.0GHz 3200+ is slower than the 2.2GHz 3500+. However, a 2.2GHz 3500+ is faster than a 3.2GHz P4, so you can't compare dissimilar architectures. It's like comparing cars to planes or boats using only horsepower. The fact is, AMD's architecture is much more efficient and well-rounded than Intel's netburst architecture (the basis of the P4). Without going into too much detail, suffice it to say that Intel took the path of creating a CPU with a long series of very small steps, which allows for a much higher top speed. However, this architecture is vulnerable to sudden changes that frequently occur in processing, causing the entire process to stop and start over. Also, it needs high-bandwidth access to things like memory in order to keep the machine fed. AMD, on the other hand, has chosen a shorter series of steps, and each step does more work. If something gets disrupted, you don't have to backtrack as much. Access to things like memory and the rest of the system is speedy and convenient. All this means that Intel has the theoretical advantage in terms of maximum work that can be done, but AMD is much more likely to perform near its maximum all the time, and that is why it is faster than Intel all around. Think of it like this: Intel is a ferrari, while AMD is a Hummer. On straight road, with no obstacles or speed limit, the ferrari will win. This is why Intel wins in media encoding benchmarks. As long as both machines have a steady stream of inputs, and there are no wrenches thrown into the operation, the one with more raw power will win. However, in general use, this is not the case. Imagine driving through the mountains in a storm. The ferrari is too busy adjusting to take advantage of its speed advantage, and the constant twists and turns keep it from running at a steady speed. The hummer has no problem adjusting, and can make its way through the course at a good pace while staying in control. This is why AMD wins in games and in general usage. Games are complicated, balancing AI, Textures, Physics, etc, all of which occur in various amounts at different times.

As for comparing, AMD's Performance Rating system provides a rough comparison to a P4 of the same grade. The A64 3000+ competes mainly with the 3.0GHz P4, while the 3400+ competes with the 3.4Ghz P4, etc. Just remember these tips:
1) AMD's ratings are conservative at the low end, i.e. 3500+ or below, while being a bit liberal at the high end, i.e. 3800+ or 4000+.
2) AMD adds points for things like Dual channel memory, higher clockspeed, and larger cache. This means that sometimes different CPUs have the same rating. In general, dual channel memory matters slightly more than an extra 200MHz, while the extra 200MHz matters more than larger cache. For example, there are 3 3200+ processors. The fastest is the 2.0GHz dual channel version with 512KB L2 cache (socket 939). The next fastest is the 2.2GHz single channel with 512KB L2 (socket 754). The slowest is the 2.0Ghz single channel with 1MB L2 cache (socket 754). This is the same for other models, as well.
3)AMD is usually substantially faster in games, and moderately faster in general usage. In fact, an A64 2800+ can beat a 3.0Ghz P4 in many games, and even the 3.2GHz P4 in a few cases.
4) Intel is generally faster in media encoding. However, this lead is much more pronounced against the socket 754 single channel versions of the A64. The socket 939 dual channel version is much closer to comparable P4 performance.
5)the nm (i.e. 90 or 130) represents the length of a single transistor in the CPU. As technology increases, the size of transistors can shrink, allowing more complex CPUs to be built from in the same size. 90nm (for nanometers) is currently the smallest process used for chips. When looking for an Intel CPU, remember that 130nm chips run much cooler and slightly faster than their 90nm siblings. However, 130nm chips top off at 3.4Ghz, while the 90nm ones go to 3.8 and overclock better (although with much more heat.) Also, the new 90nm parts are on a newer platform, which supports PCI-express and DDRII, which are future technologies, although DDRII is pretty marginal right now. For AMD, their 90nm parts perform better, run cooler, and overclock better than their 130nm cousins, so if you can, try to get one of those.

Hopefully this cleared some things up for you
 

RuNic

Junior Member
Nov 14, 2004
6
0
0
Excellent post GOBUCKS. That really cleared some things up for me.

As an OSU student i have to agree with your name as well. :D
 

dullard

Elite Member
May 21, 2001
26,200
4,871
126
Originally posted by: Azzy64
i prefer this analogy: :p

Running: to go fast you can either take big steps less frequently (amd) or small steps very quickly (intel) to achieve similar speed
I've used that analogy when looking at little kids walking with their parents. Same velocity, but one has a high frequency but does little per step.

My personal question is this: What is bigger 3*5 or 5*3?

Frequency * work per clock is all that matters. One number is meaningless, but both together are real. AMD fans brag that their second number is bigger, Intel fans brag that their first number is bigger. In the end, there isn't much difference.

As for nm, think of it as a measure of how much it costs the company to produce the chip. That is all you'll need to know to start (lower nm means cheaper to make).
 

batmanuel

Platinum Member
Jan 15, 2003
2,144
0
0
Originally posted by: Azzy64
i prefer this analogy: :p

Running: to go fast you can either take big steps less frequently (amd) or small steps very quickly (intel) to achieve similar speed

Wasn't the first Willamette core P4 nicknamed "short-legged Willie" by some folks?

 

Zinn2b

Banned
Jan 9, 2004
361
0
0
KNOW way is 2.2 Ghz AMD faster than a 3.2 GHZ Intel a few of the people who do benchies 4 a living said so . but $ changed hands!!! If you want to compare go to futuremark orb and compare you be surprized at what you find Grow up Amd FANS. AMD is now on the same playing field as intel thats all.ALSO the new ASUS NCCH_DL dual cpu nacona's @3.6 GHz 800FSB are blazing fast faster than desktops its about time and they O/C like crazy THATS my next rig AGP no SLI I play games online. 2 VPU won't mean a thing just good test scores. now if you go to lan parties than you need that speed GoBucks dida fare job of explaining things but he missed the boat . It really comes down to the memory controller Intels is Chipset and AMD"S is built into the processor itself. both have good and bad points. I do like the on CPU controller better.IF the MOBO is of good quality and laid out properly Intels are very fast. As far as Chipsets go ATI is coming and there going to shake it up.
 

Boonesmi

Lifer
Feb 19, 2001
14,448
1
81
Originally posted by: Zinn2b
KNOW way is 2.2 Ghz AMD faster than a 3.2 GHZ Intel a few of the people who do benchies 4 a living said so . but $ changed hands!!! If you want to compare go to futuremark orb and compare you be surprized at what you find Grow up Amd FANS. AMD is now on the same playing field as intel thats all.ALSO the new ASUS NCCH_DL dual cpu nacona's @3.6 GHz 800FSB are blazing fast faster than desktops its about time and they O/C like crazy THATS my next rig AGP no SLI I play games online 2 VPU won't mean a thing just good test scores. now if you go to lan paties than you need that speed.

noob :)

in real life, you will find the 2.2ghz athlon64 to be faster in most things then a 3.2ghz p4

if you read the anandtech main page once in awhile you might see stuff like this
link
 

AnotherGuy

Senior member
Dec 9, 2003
678
0
71
Originally posted by: Boonesmi
Originally posted by: Zinn2b
KNOW way is 2.2 Ghz AMD faster than a 3.2 GHZ Intel a few of the people who do benchies 4 a living said so . but $ changed hands!!! If you want to compare go to futuremark orb and compare you be surprized at what you find Grow up Amd FANS. AMD is now on the same playing field as intel thats all.ALSO the new ASUS NCCH_DL dual cpu nacona's @3.6 GHz 800FSB are blazing fast faster than desktops its about time and they O/C like crazy THATS my next rig AGP no SLI I play games online 2 VPU won't mean a thing just good test scores. now if you go to lan paties than you need that speed.

noob :)

noob down!
 

t3hmuffinman

Senior member
Sep 10, 2004
536
0
0
it's funny cause he started his sentence by confusing "no" and "know"...

also, a question/comment: it seems to me that Intel's tend to benchmark faster in 3dMark (though performance, hands down AMD is better for gaming). My brother got a Dell 3.2 ghz, x800 xt, 1 GB DDR2 RAM (so it has the slightly cheapo RAM/mobo probably cause it's Dell), but he scores about 5,700 in 3DMark05 (all stock speeds, how are you going to OC a Dell :p), which rivals what other people with FX-55's get. sorta weird.
 

dug777

Lifer
Oct 13, 2004
24,778
4
0
nice to see the fanboys coming out of the woodwork at the first sign of a thread with 'amd', 'intel', and 'vs' in :D

 

Zinn2b

Banned
Jan 9, 2004
361
0
0
I read everthing this site puts up some of it is good stuff but much of it is bios and twisted > a good example is the last artical on motherboards The fidelity abit board Anadtech decided to not use the default setting because they didn't want to compare apples to grapes . give me a break people that buy this board, Well run it at default or faster not slower So the numbers. and the benches were scewed by anandtech. and what could have been a nice review was ruined by stupidity . I also Have an AMD 64 FX 55and in the real world my p4 is better , its smoother in all things except gaming there i see no differance at all.IF i want to play games only i would use X-box . but for real world use give me a P4 anytime. you like AMD so much I well sell you mine for $3200AND these real world results your talking about . I have read a lot of post here that many people that have these AMD 64's are not getting anywhere near the numbers that Anandtech posted in there reviews .Also most all other sites that do reviews post better results for P4'S than what are posted here why is that ? ANANDTECH >AMD cpu's AND OCS memory LOL.
know you don't no anything a twist here a jab there . historions don't change written documents. What is done is the acadimic crowd takes and changes the meaning of a few words in that way the meaning of the documents are lost for all time!!!!!!!!!! YOU make wine with grapes so it fits better!
I read the review the numbers and the benches were given at below default levels . If the O/C benches and default benchies were given in all test run please except my apolagy.
Why is it that AMD crowd always starts name calling when there feathers get fluffed?
($3200 gets you the whole pc FX55 AMD- X800XT Platinum Edition- Crucial Ballistic PC3200-Lian LI case-Double layerDVD+-)
I would have never bought this system if it wasn't for the hype I tried it And I just don't see any differance in gaming. The benches might say there's a differance but i can't see it or feel it. P4 is much smoother in other apps.AND multi tasking hugh differance (so if you don't have A high powered P4 you haven't a clue as to what I am saying(benches say there's a differance but can you actually see and feel the differance I can't not in gaming anyway) Also you AMD closed mind types you must be a lonely bunch because you don't play online gaming ';If you did you would no that there is no differance at all because your connection speed limits the game play yada yada yada (for the record I do agree with some My $220 Intel cpu performs close to or better than the overpriced AMD$800 FX)
 

Gamingphreek

Lifer
Mar 31, 2003
11,679
0
81
Originally posted by: Zinn2b
I read everthing this site puts up some of it is good stuff but much of it is bios and twisted > a good example is the last artical on motherboards The fidelity abit board Anadtech decided to not use the default setting because they didn't want to compare apples to grapes . give me a break people that buy this board, Well run it at default or faster not slower So the numbers. and the benches were scewed by anandtech. and what could have been a nice review was ruined by stupidity . I also Have an AMD 64 FX 55and in the real world my p4 is better , its smoother in all things except gaming there i see no differance at all.IF i want to play games only i would use X-box . but for real world use give me a P4 anytime. you like AMD so much I well sell you mine 4 $3200AND these real world results your talking about . I have read a lot of post here that many people that have these AMD 64's are not getting anywhere near the numbers that Anandtech posted in there reviews .Also most all other sites that do reviews post better results for P4'S than what are posted here why is that ? ANANDTECH >AMD cpu's AND OCS memory LOL.
know you don't no anything a twist here a jab there . historions don't change written documents. What is done is the acadimic crowd takes and changes the meaning of a few words in that way the meaning of the documents are lost for all time!!!!!!!!!!

This just gets better and better.

Does anyone have reviews on that Fidelity Abit board, i mean sh!t i have only heard of the Fatal1ty, this fidelity must be an AMD crusher.

Apples to Grapes comparison, it works i suppose but isn't Apples to Oranges. :confused:

As for not running at Default settings i dont know whatyou are talking about. The OCed the Fatality as high as it would go and benched as well as at Default settings.

3200 dollars for 4 AMD chips 800 dollars a chip what do you have 4 FX55. Everyone is getting near the numbers in anands revies.

WTF was with that last sentence!??!?

-Kevin
 

PingSpike

Lifer
Feb 25, 2004
21,766
615
126
I still can't believe anyone would have such blind loyalty to an overpriced CPU company that they would stick their fingers in their ears whenever bad news for them comes out yelling that its all propaganda. I mean, is Intel's CEO this guys dad or something?

I love AMD, but I'd be the first to admit their shortcomings...and if they started to fall short on the price/performance ratio I wouldn't hesitate to look elsewhere.