Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes Discussion Threads

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Tigerick

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As Hot Chips 34 starting this week, Intel will unveil technical information of upcoming Meteor Lake (MTL) and Arrow Lake (ARL), new generation platform after Raptor Lake. Both MTL and ARL represent new direction which Intel will move to multiple chiplets and combine as one SoC platform.

MTL also represents new compute tile that based on Intel 4 process which is based on EUV lithography, a first from Intel. Intel expects to ship MTL mobile SoC in 2023.

ARL will come after MTL so Intel should be shipping it in 2024, that is what Intel roadmap is telling us. ARL compute tile will be manufactured by Intel 20A process, a first from Intel to use GAA transistors called RibbonFET.



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Intel Core Ultra 100 - Meteor Lake

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As mentioned by Tomshardware, TSMC will manufacture the I/O, SoC, and GPU tiles. That means Intel will manufacture only the CPU and Foveros tiles. (Notably, Intel calls the I/O tile an 'I/O Expander,' hence the IOE moniker.)



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DavidC1

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Strix Point's iGPU begs to differ about being memory bandwidth limited. Despite being twice as large as Kraken's iGPU, it is FAR from being twice as fast.
I stand corrected.

However, except for the eDRAM-less Iris parts way back ago, Intel iGPUs were never limited as AMD GPUs were, unless you are putting single channel memory. Plus, Pantherlake is a new architecture and if @511 is right, it shares the LLC with the CPU. 50% extra is not a huge issue in any terms. PTL also supports faster memory too, no?

@511 Who said Panther Cove has clustered decode?
 

511

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@511 Who said Panther Cove has clustered decode?

Trust Me Bro /jk
Sources and if you look at it they are sharing L2 Cache similar to E core team and cluster decoding cause 8 Wide Core like LNC is too Area heavy and 10 Wide would be nuts so Cluster Decoding like E cores
 

coercitiv

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So are we getting a token/paper launch for Panther Lake at the end of the year? I know availability is set for 2026, but I would expect Intel to pretend their assurances about Panther Lake being a 2025 product were real.

I just want the tech talk, they can launch it whenever :p
 

511

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So are we getting a token/paper launch for Panther Lake at the end of the year? I know availability is set for 2026, but I would expect Intel to pretend their assurances about Panther Lake being a 2025 product were real.

I just want the tech talk, they can launch it whenever :p
Same I wanna see the iGPU Arch and the PnP comparison of Cougar Cove vs LNC and Skymont vs Darkmont.
 
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Yeah, they really should release tech slides way ahead of the launch to generate "excitement".

And they can share only the IPC improvement. Final clocks for both CPU core and memory don't need to be mentioned. I don't see what's the big deal about sitting on the tech information so long unless they are afraid to give their competitor time to prepare an effective response. If that's true, Intel being afraid of AMD is something Intel shouldn't even be hinting. It's a bad look for them.
 

RTX2080

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Jul 2, 2018
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So are we getting a token/paper launch for Panther Lake at the end of the year? I know availability is set for 2026, but I would expect Intel to pretend their assurances about Panther Lake being a 2025 product were real.

I just want the tech talk, they can launch it whenever :p

According to leaker Golden Pig Upgrade, Pantherlake early enablement program(EEP) is postponed to 2026 and very likely the availability for consumers would be 1Q later. So possible paper launch might be during CES.
 
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@511

I just had a genius idea on how to use up the available Arrow Lake desktop CPUs that no one wants.

Intel should introduce the briefcase form factor. It looks JUST like a briefcase. Inside there is a mini-ITX mobo and desktop CPU and a removable battery pack plus a removable display giving users the flexibility to replace the bog standard display with miniLED or OLED or AMOLED if they like. Plus, small compartments for SATA SSDs and NVMe SSDs that you simply plug in vertically. The keyboard and touchpad should also be replaceable for people who want something more expensive. A thin and sturdy tray should come out from the right or left side that can support a mouse pad.

Here's the really genius part. The bottom of the briefcase has the CPU and mobo but the back side of the display has the GPU. Thus it is thermally isolated from the CPU and it will be able to consume up to 250W if needed and that heat will be transferred away from the user.

Without AC power, the CPU will run at 1 GHz or lower and the GPU can also be similarly either downclocked or only the iGPU is available in battery mode. Plug in a power cable and suddenly the whole machine comes alive!

How's that???? File a patent now and name me as your partner. Let's become billionaires! :p
 
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DavidC1

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Trust Me Bro /jk
Sources and if you look at it they are sharing L2 Cache similar to E core team and cluster decoding cause 8 Wide Core like LNC is too Area heavy and 10 Wide would be nuts so Cluster Decoding like E cores
Fatter decoders exist even though significant amount of code can't really do high ILP because it helps during peaks when it can actually reach that high. And it requires a major redesign which is not too realistic in 2027 for something that'll be replaced soon.
 

DavidC1

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Dec 29, 2023
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Yeah, they really should release tech slides way ahead of the launch to generate "excitement".

And they can share only the IPC improvement
. Final clocks for both CPU core and memory don't need to be mentioned. I don't see what's the big deal about sitting on the tech information so long unless they are afraid to give their competitor time to prepare an effective response. If that's true, Intel being afraid of AMD is something Intel shouldn't even be hinting. It's a bad look for them.
0% for P and 3-4% for E?

I'm interested in whether they did improve efficiency for the E cores like that Intel reddit guy claims and what the Celestial architecture brings.
 

511

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Jul 12, 2024
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New MLID "Leak" Panther Lake is being nicknamed "Pathetic Lake" by board partners testing it.

It's MLID he has vendetta against Intel I don't believe anything he says. Only take his core count leak seriously nothing else.

MLID:
If he hypes a Intel product it's bad or is getting cancelled.(Royal Cove/Arrow Lake)
If he doesn't or says negative thing regarding it it's gonna be fine.
 

Josh128

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Oct 14, 2022
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Yeah, they really should release tech slides way ahead of the launch to generate "excitement".

And they can share only the IPC improvement. Final clocks for both CPU core and memory don't need to be mentioned. I don't see what's the big deal about sitting on the tech information so long unless they are afraid to give their competitor time to prepare an effective response. If that's true, Intel being afraid of AMD is something Intel shouldn't even be hinting. It's a bad look for them.
The Osborne effect.
 

dullard

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May 21, 2001
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Yeah, they really should release tech slides way ahead of the launch to generate "excitement".

And they can share only the IPC improvement. Final clocks for both CPU core and memory don't need to be mentioned. I don't see what's the big deal about sitting on the tech information so long unless they are afraid to give their competitor time to prepare an effective response. If that's true, Intel being afraid of AMD is something Intel shouldn't even be hinting. It's a bad look for them.
They have released quite a few slides.

The issue with sharing an IPC improvement is that it is subject to change. As BIOSes are developed, microcode is written, errata are addressed, temperatures are optimized, stability is improved, etc, the final IPC changes slightly. The change is not mind-blowing. Usually it is a percent or two here or there. Sometimes worse, sometimes better. But if one chip is close in performance to another chip, then these last minute tweaks can certainly move one chip from a slight lead to a slight loss. That would lead the whole internet into an uproar that they were "promised" one thing and got another.
 
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