Intel may report a loss in the first quarter

[Phynaz]

Memo from Paul Otellini says first quarter is "too close to call".

Prepare for another round of staff cuts.

Link

 

[Idontcare]

Intel says it is consolidating its global manufacturing operations as a part of a restructuring bid which will affect up to 6,000 jobs.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/...0-to-apf-14119574.html

 

[Phynaz]

Makes sense that Fab 20 is closing, but why D2?

Dmens?

 

[Duvie]

Oh no.....Not D1B? that is what we called it when we built it. I worked on Ronler Acres from the original survey work when it was called project X and we were not supposed to discuss it with people....I think they were tentatively negotiating use tax incentives from Washington County. In that first phase we Built D1B, a CUB, and RA1.

 

[OCGuy]

I bet this along with no competition for Nehalem pushes Sandy Bridge to 2011. That makes me a sad panda.

 

[imported_Asianman]

If AMD goes bankrupt this year, there'll be no new processors until the next 2015, and so long "Tick-Tock" stratagy

 

[TuxDave]

Originally posted by: Duvie
Oh no.....Not D1B? that is what we called it when we built it. I worked on Ronler Acres from the original survey work when it was called project X and we were not supposed to discuss it with people....I think they were tentatively negotiating use tax incentives from Washington County. In that first phase we Built D1B, a CUB, and RA1.

Fab20 = D1B? I have no idea, I'm sitting in Jones Farm and have no notion of what the hell is over at Ronler Acres.

 

[TuxDave]

Originally posted by: Phynaz
Makes sense that Fab 20 is closing, but why D2?

Dmens?

Teh googles say:

Intel Corp will close its last Silicon Valley-based chip plant later this year as the result of a deal made in June 2006 when it sold its XScale handheld devices chip business for $600 million to Santa Clara, Calif-based Marvell Technology Group Ltd.

Intel spokesman Chuck Mulloy reminded that as part of the deal Intel would continue manufacturing products currently sold by this business until Marvell arranged other manufacturing resources. As such, at the end of Q1, Intel will stop manufacturing for Marvell.

Although the fab, known as ?D2,? will not be manufacturing handheld devices any longer, it will be transitioned into process development work in Q3 for the next manufacturing node in conjunction with Intel?s joint flash venture with STMicroelectronics, Numonyx. That deal for is set to close this quarter, following a delay due to financing.

 

[Phynaz]

That's why I was asking, why the closing of a development fab? As far as I am aware Intel only has two.

 

[Duvie]

Correct they have D1c and D1d remaining....D1a in Aloha, OR was converted to a full fledge fab a decade ago.....

 

[Phynaz]

Okay, now I get it, they will have two after this one closes.

Thanks Duvie.

 

[Idontcare]

Originally posted by: Asianman
If AMD goes bankrupt this year, there'll be no new processors until the next 2015, and so long "Tick-Tock" stratagy

Even without AMD going bankrupt, if there is no competition putting pressure on Intel's gross margins then the decision makers at Intel have less compelling reasons to keep forking shareholder equity into R&D at the pace they have been.

As much as Intel employees like the sense of pride knowing they kicked AMD good, their personal livelihoods depend on AMD being a half-step behind them. Otherwise the full-throttle mentality and cost structure Intel currently has in place (and employees take home paychecks thanks to) will evaporate as the decision makers elect to go for higher gross margins and less cost structure (less employees are needed if tick-tock cadence slows from 1yr/1yr to 2yr/2yr for example). Good for shareholders, bad for employees and bad for consumers.

 

[bryanW1995]

I find it very humorous that a few months ago everyone seemed to be piling on the bad guys, aka intel and nvidia. Now that the economy isn't doing quite so well I think that it's an interesting thought exercise to imagine if intel really DOES lose money next quarter...and the quarter after that...we then won't be worrying about tick tock at all, but whether we'll be using a via c8 deluxe supreme in 8 years or a phenom x4.1 14440. I'll take intel, thank you very much.

 

[Idontcare]

Oh yes we are a fickle crowd to be sure That's the best part about not being a fanboy, we get to turn on a dime and hate today whomever we loved yesterday. It's very fashionable these days. Just wait, Obama will have record low opinion polls in about a week too. Now that he is officially president it is OK to begin the loathing cycle all over again.

 

[Viditor]

Originally posted by: Phynaz
Makes sense that Fab 20 is closing, but why D2?

Dmens?

Dmens, is your job at risk mate?
Thinking good thoughts for you...

 

[pm]

The D2 developmental fab is in the Intel Mission College campus. I used to work right next to it back eons ago when I was a young strapping engineer working on that bleeding edge CPU, the original Pentium. For a fab, it was old even when I was there.

My sympathy, my thoughts, and prayers are with my fellow employees, and with the boys in green across the street from where I work, during this time in which they will have to make some difficult life decisions.

dmens will be fine - this action doesn't affect R&D (yet). I worry more about fellow ATer Wingznut Pez who works in the fab in Oregon.

 

[ViRGE]

Man, Intel losing money on a quarter; I'm not sure what it means when they're at risk of taking the first loss in a generation.:Q

As for the closings, this article says that fab 20 and D2 use the 180nm process. I know Intel runs their old fabs in to the ground to get the most out of them that they can, but I can't believe they still had a 180nm production fab. What on earth were they still producing on such a large process?

 

[Idontcare]

Originally posted by: ViRGE
Man, Intel losing money on a quarter; I'm not sure what it means when they're at risk of taking the first loss in a generation.:Q

As for the closings, this article says that fab 20 and D2 use the 180nm process. I know Intel runs their old fabs in to the ground to get the most out of them that they can, but I can't believe they still had a 180nm production fab. What on earth were they still producing on such a large process?

Intel doesn't just make CPU's. Most MPU manufacturers have multiple digital CMOS products in the background (DSP stuff) ranging from IC's for screens to communication devices to medical industry devices to military/NASA parts.

Key point being all low-volume stuff. And when you have low volume for an IC the cost per part skyrockets if you do a node shrink on the part even though the IC itself will be smaller after the shrink.

So while that 180nm IC that they get maybe 100 chips to a wafer could be shrunk so they could get 1000 or more of them of a modern process node, doing that will incur an up-front cost of ~$500k for the mask set alone plus another $5m or so in people-costs doing the shrink work. Well unless they sell millions of those chips currently fabbed at 180nm tech they will never recoup their up-front costs of the shrink.

You'd be surprised how much production capacity at the foundries is 90nm and larger process tech still. Its way more than 50%.

 

[Wingznut]

Fab20 actually builds chipsets on the 130nm process. And yes, I will be "affected."

Also... Yes Tux, D1B turned into Fab20 when it transitioned from a development fab to a high volume manufacturing facility.

And thanks for the kind words, pm.

 

[Duvie]

Originally posted by: Wingznut
Fab20 actually builds chipsets on the 130nm process. And yes, I will be "affected."

Also... Yes Tux, D1B turned into Fab20 when it transitioned from a development fab to a high volume manufacturing facility.

And thanks for the kind words, pm.

Hey WingZ! Long time.....

This was the birthplace of the northwood p4's....great chip....

YOU are in litho something or other, right?

Hope the company will move you to one of the other buildings...

 

[Idontcare]

Originally posted by: Idontcare

Originally posted by: ViRGE
Man, Intel losing money on a quarter; I'm not sure what it means when they're at risk of taking the first loss in a generation.:Q

As for the closings, this article says that fab 20 and D2 use the 180nm process. I know Intel runs their old fabs in to the ground to get the most out of them that they can, but I can't believe they still had a 180nm production fab. What on earth were they still producing on such a large process?

Intel doesn't just make CPU's. Most MPU manufacturers have multiple digital CMOS products in the background (DSP stuff) ranging from IC's for screens to communication devices to medical industry devices to military/NASA parts.

Key point being all low-volume stuff. And when you have low volume for an IC the cost per part skyrockets if you do a node shrink on the part even though the IC itself will be smaller after the shrink.

So while that 180nm IC that they get maybe 100 chips to a wafer could be shrunk so they could get 1000 or more of them of a modern process node, doing that will incur an up-front cost of ~$500k for the mask set alone plus another $5m or so in people-costs doing the shrink work. Well unless they sell millions of those chips currently fabbed at 180nm tech they will never recoup their up-front costs of the shrink.

You'd be surprised how much production capacity at the foundries is 90nm and larger process tech still. Its way more than 50%.

Since TSMC just published the data, I thought I'd follow-up on this thread and post the link to the graph showing the break-out by node for TSMC just for illustration purposes:

TSMC Revenue breakdown by technology

Source: Company, compiled by Digitimes, January 2009

We see that only 27% of TSMC's revenue comes from making chips on 65nm and smaller (newer) nodes. The rest comes from 90nm and larger (all the way up to 0.5um) tech nodes.

 

[ViRGE]

Originally posted by: Idontcare
The rest comes from 90nm and larger (all the way up to 0.5um) tech nodes.

They still have the gear to make stuff at 500nm!? Holy cow!:Q