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Discussion Intel current and future Lakes & Rapids thread

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lobz

Golden Member
Feb 10, 2017
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What if the lead in this particular instance is this large? Is it automatic rigging for you, too?
literally wth...

I meant: no matter how ridiculous the rather specifically selected 16C/24T nature of the new version of the benchmark is, a ~35-40% jump compared to last gen is so substantial, that the whole argument loses its meaning, at least in relation to the actual performance increase.

In simpler words, even IF AotS is a vast outlier (which it may or may not be), ADL seems to finally be a REALLY big step forward, which Intel has totally lacked in the past years.

So may I please ask, what on Earth are you on about?
 
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Joe NYC

Senior member
Jun 26, 2021
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What if the lead in this particular instance is this large? Is it automatic rigging for you, too?
For any other company, you would not make that assumption.

But Intel has been found in violation of Fair Competition laws across number of countries and continents.

The default assumption for Intel is that if it looks like anticompetitive behavior it probably is.
 

Ajay

Diamond Member
Jan 8, 2001
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literally wth...

I meant: no matter how ridiculous the rather specifically selected 16C/24T nature of the new version of the benchmark is, a ~35-40% jump compared to last gen is so substantial, that the whole argument loses its meaning, at least in relation to the actual performance increase.

In simpler words, even IF AotS is a vast outlier (which it may or may not be), ADL seems to finally be a REALLY big step forward, which Intel has totally lacked in the past years.

So may I please ask, what on Earth are you on about?
Excellent point. This is why, at this point, I can't wait till ADL is released. There is conflicting data, though the trend appears to be that of a significant performance uplift, and there are conflicting opinions on what a given benchmark means. And then we go down a rabbit hole of pure misery of speculating on motives and accuracy and the meaning of each and every benchmark leak. :rolleyes:. I really should ignore this thread till reviewers had silicon in hand.
 
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Zucker2k

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Feb 15, 2006
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In simpler words, even IF AotS is a vast outlier (which it may or may not be), ADL seems to finally be a REALLY big step forward, which Intel has totally lacked in the past years.
Sorry for the misinterpretation, dude. Cheers!
 
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jj109

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Dec 17, 2013
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About as funny as the AMD fanbase accusing a AMD sponsored dev of taking bribes from Intel. If Alder Lake destroys Zen 3 by 40% in a AMD sponsored gaming benchmark, it would be hilarious and I would expect Intel to put it on their presentation.
 
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lyonwonder

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Dec 29, 2018
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6th to 9th gen is all based on the initial Skylake architecture, even though DDR3 was pretty much dead starting with the Kabylake refresh. Raptor Lake isn't Golden Cove apparently.
If Raptor Lake removes DDR4 support it would make it incompatible with most 600-series motherboards except for the high end Z690 with DDR5 even though it's supposed to use the same socket as Alder Lake.
 
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coercitiv

Diamond Member
Jan 24, 2014
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If Alder Lake destroys Zen 3 by 40% in a AMD sponsored gaming benchmark
What happened to striving to be the former?
A reasonable person would say that AotS benchmark is extremely branchy and has an unusually high dependency on memory performance and so should not be taken too seriously as a pre-release release leak.
A less reasonable person comes to the forums and posts conspiracy theories that can be sanity checked by looking at a few benchmarks.
Strive to the be former.
 

lobz

Golden Member
Feb 10, 2017
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About as funny as the AMD fanbase accusing a AMD sponsored dev of taking bribes from Intel. If Alder Lake destroys Zen 3 by 40% in a AMD sponsored gaming benchmark, it would be hilarious and I would expect Intel to put it on their presentation.
In all fairness, it was sponsored to show the heavier use case of asynchronous compute in GPUs. 360 years ago. Then later the game itself came out a full year before even the first Ryzen was released. Now, the company is in a partnership with AMD for developing cloud GPU computing. If you honestly lack any doubt after seeing such an arbitrary numerical change, that is your choice - but can you quit insulting people's intellect just because you fail to make a connection? I also don't think that those devs would have been bribed ( :tearsofjoy: :tearsofjoy: ) by Intel, I think they just simply like their CPUs :D
 
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lobz

Golden Member
Feb 10, 2017
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Excellent point. This is why, at this point, I can't wait till ADL is released. There is conflicting data, though the trend appears to be that of a significant performance uplift, and there are conflicting opinions on what a given benchmark means. And then we go down a rabbit hole of pure misery of speculating on motives and accuracy and the meaning of each and every benchmark leak. :rolleyes:. I really should ignore this thread till reviewers had silicon in hand.
we all love a good misery, don't we? :tearsofjoy:
 

JoeRambo

Golden Member
Jun 13, 2013
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its a multi-core test and score, but the utilization chart shows only 1 core was utilized
Could be that last 60s were spent opening CPU-Z and task manager ? It seems to be perfectly legit CB23 score to me, right on where i expect it to be. CB23 does not care about memory latency or bw and as long as it fits L2 with some L3 spills, it will run just fine.
 

Abwx

Diamond Member
Apr 2, 2011
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Could be that last 60s were spent opening CPU-Z and task manager ? It seems to be perfectly legit CB23 score to me, right on where i expect it to be. CB23 does not care about memory latency or bw and as long as it fits L2 with some L3 spills, it will run just fine.
One minute to open CPU Z and a task manager..?.
Also he could had let core, thread count and frequency on the CB pic without having the CPU disclosed...
 

JoeRambo

Golden Member
Jun 13, 2013
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One minute to open CPU Z and a task manager..?.
On my PC CPU-Z opens in ~7s, since he has 3 open, that is already ~30s if we give some time to open the tabs, return to explorer or desktop to launch next one etc.
if we turn into retarded area51 investigator mode, in fact spikes of CPU load in that graph start and end consistently with starting those 4 apps and they do start well into that minute.

The fact remains, CB23 score is consistent with previuos leaks and right where i expect it to score. How it will score where memory subsystem will matter - remains to be seen both stock and OC.
 

Abwx

Diamond Member
Apr 2, 2011
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On my PC CPU-Z opens in ~7s, since he has 3 open, that is already ~30s if we give some time to open the tabs, return to explorer or desktop to launch next one etc.
if we turn into retarded area51 investigator mode, in fact spikes of CPU load in that graph start and end consistently with starting those 4 apps and they do start well into that minute.

The fact remains, CB23 score is consistent with previuos leaks and right where i expect it to score. How it will score where memory subsystem will matter - remains to be seen both stock and OC.
The thing is that we dont know at wich frequency this CPU run during the bench, here it display 5.3 despite the cores being idling, so this could had been benched at 5.3 as well.

Assuming that the small core contribution to the score is 33% then the 8 PC should be around 20 000 pts at whetever frequency, FTR a 5800X is around 15800@4.5GHz.
 

JoeRambo

Golden Member
Jun 13, 2013
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The thing is that we dont know at wich frequency this CPU run during the bench, here it display 5.3 despite the cores being idling, so this could had been benched at 5.3 as well.
Clocks and idling are an open question, Intel might be ramping up clock speeds faster, or Windows power profile prohibits downclocking at idle ? 5.3 is stock clocks domain for big cores, and even if it was 5.3 + unknown overclocked small cores clock run, it is just 6% difference for big cores + unknown difference for small cores versus stock?
For all we know Intel might have ABT set to 5.3 for big cores and it's enabled and still "STOCK" even if power is already ballistic.
 

eek2121

Golden Member
Aug 2, 2005
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The thing is that we dont know at wich frequency this CPU run during the bench, here it display 5.3 despite the cores being idling, so this could had been benched at 5.3 as well.

Assuming that the small core contribution to the score is 33% then the 8 PC should be around 20 000 pts at whetever frequency, FTR a 5800X is around 15800@4.5GHz.
Doubt it was doing all-core 5.3. The bit of load you see in the task manager would cause that boost.

The memory section of CPU-Z says “quad” channel. Interesting they are framing it that way.

The chip looks to be quite competitive so far.
 

Det0x

Senior member
Sep 11, 2014
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Cant really say i'm impressed with either Alderlake or Intel "7nm" IF it took PL2 255w to achieve those 30.5k points in Cinebench r23..

This is my everyday 1 year old 5950x

165w @ 1.1vcore get -> 4550/4400mhz = 30008 points
165w.png

181w @ 1.138 vcore get -> 4600/4500mhz = 30538 points
181w.png

If i let my 5950x use above 250w freely i can score up to and above 32k in cinebench r23

*edit*
Bone stock memory + 5950x load-optimized-defaults in bios:

125w = 26182 points
bone stock 125w.png
 
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lobz

Golden Member
Feb 10, 2017
1,811
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Cant really say i'm impressed with either Alderlake or Intel "7nm" considering this took PL2 255w to achieve..

This is my everyday 1 year old 5950x

165w @ 1.1vcore get -> 4550/4400mhz = 30008 points
View attachment 50539

181w @ 1.138 vcore get -> 4600/4500mhz = 30538 points
View attachment 50540
Not sure how wise it is to start comparing these scores without taking into account, how much fine tuning can mean. You also can't know the 12900K's actual power consumption during this test, let alone every other significant detail...
 

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