Inspector: One who is appointed or employed to inspect something

[HeroOfPellinor]

"One who is appointed or employed to inspect something." That's the dictionary definition of the word "inspector".

"A person, usually a member of a police force, who investigates crimes and obtains evidence or information." That's the definition of the word "detective".

In order for weapons "inspectors" to be able to be "inspectors" they need to be given something to "inspect". That is the purpose of weapons "inspectors" in Iraq and is why we call them weapons "inspectors". Iraq, for the past twelve years including the last couple months has given "inspectors" nothing to "inspect". Can somebody get Iraq and the UN a dictionary?

We didn't send weapons "detectives" to Iraq. Why not? 1) Because we don't want to play hide-and-seek with Saddam indefinitly and 2) because we already know, for a fact, that he possessed weapons of mass destruction. Blixy even says so. The "inspectors" are there to give Saddam the chance to explain where all WMD went. That was what was supposed to be in the declaration. If Saddam hasn't given the "inspectors", through his declaration or a subsequent one, something to "inspect" to corroborate his story that he no longer has them, then he is in breach.

What are we giving "inspectors" more time to do? "Inspect" nothing? These scientists may stumble upon peripheral evidence like the empty chemical warheads and long range missiles while they "inspect" random places, but they aren't "detectives" and shouldn't be trying to act like them and are not obligated to be. The incomplete declaration gave the "inspectors" nothing to "inspect" and was immediate unequivical grounds for forceful disarmament. Why are we stalling and giving "inspectors" more time to "inspect" nothing? I can only assume, aside from certain countries' oil deals with Iraq, that it's because nobody wants a war. They don't want a war so bad that they are willing to not enforce UN resolutions and put the entire world in potentially much much graver danger.

Biological and chemical weapons of mass destruction aren't like grass clippings that you can just burn or bury. There are specific procedures for their disposal and there will be ample evidence of this disposal. It should have taken Iraq about five minutes to explain how they allegedly disposed of them and "inspectors" for the past two months could have been corroborating their story. Instead, Iraq thinks that by simply not hindering these "inspectors" as they tour the country "inspecting" nothing but what their myopic scientific minds can guess might contain evidence that they'll be able to look compliant because everybody will forget the meaning of the word "inspector". Some forget out of convenience and some out of ignorance or stupidity.

You question Bush's intelligence, but he seems like one of the only people in the world right now who can actually read.

 

[WalMart1564]

man can we talk about somthing esle ?

 

[HeroOfPellinor]

Originally posted by: WalMart1564
man can we talk about somthing esle ?

I bet that's what the UN is thinking too.

 

[HeroOfPellinor]

It's funny how people say that "inspections" are working...can we get dictionaries distributed to the UN any time soon?

 

[Loralon]

Regarding the inspections process, the logic is running in circles at the U.N. Security Council. Saddam is still playing the same old game masterfully. Everytime the political pressure heats up on him, he'll just throw the inspectors a bone, and then Blix can go back to the security council to report that "some progess is being made and so we believe more progress can be made if inspections should continue." Naturally, everytime an UNMOVIC report comes back like that, it just gives ammunition to French camp. The French will say, "as long as the inspectors think they're making progress, why shouldn't they be allowed to continue?" If we really follow the French plan and allow inspections with an indeterminate timeframe, then the result is rather predictable. Inspections will continue for years without anything substantial happening with regards to disarmament. The political will behind the inpections regime will slowly wither away as the world becomes distracted by other pressing issues (North Korea, Isreal-Palistine, etc...) and eventually Saddam will throw the inspectors out when the time is right and the world is looking the other way. That is of course assuming nothing nasty happens with respect to Iraq's WMD as this containment strategy plays itself out.

 

[dexvx]

Originally posted by: Loralon
Regarding the inspections process, the logic is running in circles at the U.N. Security Council. Saddam is still playing the same old game masterfully. Everytime the political pressure heats up on him, he'll just throw the inspectors a bone, and then Blix can go back to the security council to report that "some progess is being made and so we believe more progress can be made if inspections should continue." Naturally, everytime an UNMOVIC report comes back like that, it just gives ammunition to French camp. The French will say, "as long as the inspectors think they're making progress, why shouldn't they be allowed to continue?" If we really follow the French plan and allow inspections with an indeterminate timeframe, then the result is rather predictable. Inspections will continue for years without anything substantial happening with regards to disarmament. The political will behind the inpections regime will slowly wither away as the world becomes distracted by other pressing issues (North Korea, Isreal-Palistine, etc...) and eventually Saddam will throw the inspectors out when the time is right and the world is looking the other way. That is of course assuming nothing nasty happens with respect to Iraq's WMD as this containment strategy plays itself out.

Crushing 50 ICBM's is pretty good for disarnament, dont you think?

I seriously do not get what ppl mean when they say "dis-arm." Destroying weapons is not good enough, because you can just claim the other guy is hiding some more "somewhere". There cant be anything more vague than to "dis-arm". Its an ever ending loop. Some of them conspiracy theorists say that Bush is waiting for Saddam to destroy enough of his ICBM's and other weapons in time for an easier invasion.

And wtf do you guys mean by "declare" WMD? Saddam can declare he has 10, destroy 10, and Bush can counter saying he has 100, and Saddam only destroyed 10% of his stock. The vagueness of "declaring" and "dis-arming" is radically disturbing. Also note that any kind of documentation can be easily forged. If the inspectors were given a batch of 10 to look at in the first place on site, they cannot make sure that it is all of the WMD or just a fraction of it. I doubt Saddam will put Chemical Warhead #1 of 1000 painted on the warhead itself.

 

[HeroOfPellinor]

Originally posted by: Loralon
Regarding the inspections process, the logic is running in circles at the U.N. Security Council. Saddam is still playing the same old game masterfully. Everytime the political pressure heats up on him, he'll just throw the inspectors a bone, and then Blix can go back to the security council to report that "some progess is being made and so we believe more progress can be made if inspections should continue." Naturally, everytime an UNMOVIC report comes back like that, it just gives ammunition to French camp. The French will say, "as long as the inspectors think they're making progress, why shouldn't they be allowed to continue?" If we really follow the French plan and allow inspections with an indeterminate timeframe, then the result is rather predictable. Inspections will continue for years without anything substantial happening with regards to disarmament. The political will behind the inpections regime will slowly wither away as the world becomes distracted by other pressing issues (North Korea, Isreal-Palistine, etc...) and eventually Saddam will throw the inspectors out when the time is right and the world is looking the other way. That is of course assuming nothing nasty happens with respect to Iraq's WMD as this containment strategy plays itself out.

Right, but my point is that they shouldn't be looking FOR anything in the first place...they're there to look AT something. Most of the world is stupid enough to think that inspections are working. Just because the inspectors happened to incidentally stumble across banned weapons is irrelevent...they aren't there to look for them in the first place and whether or not they'll stumble across any more is also irrelevant. Iraq was given a final chance to DECLARE any weapons it possessed in violation of the ban imposed upon it, and the inspectors were supposed to INSPECT the evidence provided to substantiate the declaration.

 

[HeroOfPellinor]

Originally posted by: dexvx

Originally posted by: Loralon
Regarding the inspections process, the logic is running in circles at the U.N. Security Council. Saddam is still playing the same old game masterfully. Everytime the political pressure heats up on him, he'll just throw the inspectors a bone, and then Blix can go back to the security council to report that "some progess is being made and so we believe more progress can be made if inspections should continue." Naturally, everytime an UNMOVIC report comes back like that, it just gives ammunition to French camp. The French will say, "as long as the inspectors think they're making progress, why shouldn't they be allowed to continue?" If we really follow the French plan and allow inspections with an indeterminate timeframe, then the result is rather predictable. Inspections will continue for years without anything substantial happening with regards to disarmament. The political will behind the inpections regime will slowly wither away as the world becomes distracted by other pressing issues (North Korea, Isreal-Palistine, etc...) and eventually Saddam will throw the inspectors out when the time is right and the world is looking the other way. That is of course assuming nothing nasty happens with respect to Iraq's WMD as this containment strategy plays itself out.

Crushing 50 ICBM's is pretty good for disarnament, dont you think?

They weren't ICBMs...they were barely able to get past their own border. The UN resolution gave Iraq a chance to come clean and they haven't. Destroying undeclared banned weapons when you've got a gun to your head isn't exactly a noble gesture. Inspections aren't working. None of this stuff was declared. If inspectors are stumbling across stuff like this, think about what else they will or won't stumble across. Partial disarmament or disarmament when you get caught is unsatisfactory.

 

[HeroOfPellinor]

Originally posted by: dexvx

Originally posted by: Loralon
Regarding the inspections process, the logic is running in circles at the U.N. Security Council. Saddam is still playing the same old game masterfully. Everytime the political pressure heats up on him, he'll just throw the inspectors a bone, and then Blix can go back to the security council to report that "some progess is being made and so we believe more progress can be made if inspections should continue." Naturally, everytime an UNMOVIC report comes back like that, it just gives ammunition to French camp. The French will say, "as long as the inspectors think they're making progress, why shouldn't they be allowed to continue?" If we really follow the French plan and allow inspections with an indeterminate timeframe, then the result is rather predictable. Inspections will continue for years without anything substantial happening with regards to disarmament. The political will behind the inpections regime will slowly wither away as the world becomes distracted by other pressing issues (North Korea, Isreal-Palistine, etc...) and eventually Saddam will throw the inspectors out when the time is right and the world is looking the other way. That is of course assuming nothing nasty happens with respect to Iraq's WMD as this containment strategy plays itself out.

And wtf do you guys mean by "declare" WMD? Saddam can declare he has 10, destroy 10, and Bush can counter saying he has 100, and Saddam only destroyed 10% of his stock. The vagueness of "declaring" and "dis-arming" is radically disturbing.

That's the point! He DIDN'T declare 10 and he had 10. What else didn't he declare? Get it yet?

 

[dexvx]

Originally posted by: HeroOfPellinor

Originally posted by: dexvx

Originally posted by: Loralon
Regarding the inspections process, the logic is running in circles at the U.N. Security Council. Saddam is still playing the same old game masterfully. Everytime the political pressure heats up on him, he'll just throw the inspectors a bone, and then Blix can go back to the security council to report that "some progess is being made and so we believe more progress can be made if inspections should continue." Naturally, everytime an UNMOVIC report comes back like that, it just gives ammunition to French camp. The French will say, "as long as the inspectors think they're making progress, why shouldn't they be allowed to continue?" If we really follow the French plan and allow inspections with an indeterminate timeframe, then the result is rather predictable. Inspections will continue for years without anything substantial happening with regards to disarmament. The political will behind the inpections regime will slowly wither away as the world becomes distracted by other pressing issues (North Korea, Isreal-Palistine, etc...) and eventually Saddam will throw the inspectors out when the time is right and the world is looking the other way. That is of course assuming nothing nasty happens with respect to Iraq's WMD as this containment strategy plays itself out.

Crushing 50 ICBM's is pretty good for disarnament, dont you think?

They weren't ICBMs...they were barely able to get past their own border. The UN resolution gave Iraq a chance to come clean and they haven't. Destroying undeclared banned weapons when you've got a gun to your head isn't exactly a noble gesture. Inspections aren't working. None of this stuff was declared. If inspectors are stumbling across stuff like this, think about what else they will or won't stumble across. Partial disarmament or disarmament when you get caught is unsatisfactory.

Actually therer were medium ranged ballistas missiles, with a decent range. Iraq admitted they were a little beyond the range of the specified miltary limitations. And no, go read the news reports, Iraq did declare these missiles, it was the inspectors that estimated that their ranged exceeded the alotted limit, and Iraq said yea, they do slightly, thus they are crushing them up.

This all goes back to the premise of how you can declare your military inventory. Anything that Saddamn declares, anyone can claim that Saddam is hiding more than hes declaring, buried somewhere in the vast desert of Iraq. Declaring the entire Iraqi military inventory is neither reliable nor can be easily "proven" or "disproven" as documentation can be easily forged. It is simply not practical.

 

[dexvx]

Originally posted by: HeroOfPellinor

Originally posted by: dexvx

Originally posted by: Loralon
Regarding the inspections process, the logic is running in circles at the U.N. Security Council. Saddam is still playing the same old game masterfully. Everytime the political pressure heats up on him, he'll just throw the inspectors a bone, and then Blix can go back to the security council to report that "some progess is being made and so we believe more progress can be made if inspections should continue." Naturally, everytime an UNMOVIC report comes back like that, it just gives ammunition to French camp. The French will say, "as long as the inspectors think they're making progress, why shouldn't they be allowed to continue?" If we really follow the French plan and allow inspections with an indeterminate timeframe, then the result is rather predictable. Inspections will continue for years without anything substantial happening with regards to disarmament. The political will behind the inpections regime will slowly wither away as the world becomes distracted by other pressing issues (North Korea, Isreal-Palistine, etc...) and eventually Saddam will throw the inspectors out when the time is right and the world is looking the other way. That is of course assuming nothing nasty happens with respect to Iraq's WMD as this containment strategy plays itself out.

And wtf do you guys mean by "declare" WMD? Saddam can declare he has 10, destroy 10, and Bush can counter saying he has 100, and Saddam only destroyed 10% of his stock. The vagueness of "declaring" and "dis-arming" is radically disturbing.

That's the point! He DIDN'T declare 10 and he had 10. What else didn't he declare? Get it yet?

No, if you follow up on the news reports, Saddam "declared" all his WMD and WMD research in a massive documentation several thousand pages long. About a week after that the Bush Admininstration said, no, thats not complete. Declaration is simply not feasible because there is no way to verify it.

 

[Trezza]

Originally posted by: dexvx

Originally posted by: HeroOfPellinor

Originally posted by: dexvx

Originally posted by: Loralon
Regarding the inspections process, the logic is running in circles at the U.N. Security Council. Saddam is still playing the same old game masterfully. Everytime the political pressure heats up on him, he'll just throw the inspectors a bone, and then Blix can go back to the security council to report that "some progess is being made and so we believe more progress can be made if inspections should continue." Naturally, everytime an UNMOVIC report comes back like that, it just gives ammunition to French camp. The French will say, "as long as the inspectors think they're making progress, why shouldn't they be allowed to continue?" If we really follow the French plan and allow inspections with an indeterminate timeframe, then the result is rather predictable. Inspections will continue for years without anything substantial happening with regards to disarmament. The political will behind the inpections regime will slowly wither away as the world becomes distracted by other pressing issues (North Korea, Isreal-Palistine, etc...) and eventually Saddam will throw the inspectors out when the time is right and the world is looking the other way. That is of course assuming nothing nasty happens with respect to Iraq's WMD as this containment strategy plays itself out.

And wtf do you guys mean by "declare" WMD? Saddam can declare he has 10, destroy 10, and Bush can counter saying he has 100, and Saddam only destroyed 10% of his stock. The vagueness of "declaring" and "dis-arming" is radically disturbing.

That's the point! He DIDN'T declare 10 and he had 10. What else didn't he declare? Get it yet?

No, if you follow up on the news reports, Saddam "declared" all his WMD and WMD research in a massive documentation several thousand pages long. About a week after that the Bush Admininstration said, no, thats not complete. Declaration is simply not feasible because there is no way to verify it.

I wonder if the recently discovered drone plane and the chem/bio cluster bombs were on there.

 

[dexvx]

Originally posted by: Trezza

Originally posted by: dexvx

Originally posted by: HeroOfPellinor

Originally posted by: dexvx

Originally posted by: Loralon
Regarding the inspections process, the logic is running in circles at the U.N. Security Council. Saddam is still playing the same old game masterfully. Everytime the political pressure heats up on him, he'll just throw the inspectors a bone, and then Blix can go back to the security council to report that "some progess is being made and so we believe more progress can be made if inspections should continue." Naturally, everytime an UNMOVIC report comes back like that, it just gives ammunition to French camp. The French will say, "as long as the inspectors think they're making progress, why shouldn't they be allowed to continue?" If we really follow the French plan and allow inspections with an indeterminate timeframe, then the result is rather predictable. Inspections will continue for years without anything substantial happening with regards to disarmament. The political will behind the inpections regime will slowly wither away as the world becomes distracted by other pressing issues (North Korea, Isreal-Palistine, etc...) and eventually Saddam will throw the inspectors out when the time is right and the world is looking the other way. That is of course assuming nothing nasty happens with respect to Iraq's WMD as this containment strategy plays itself out.

And wtf do you guys mean by "declare" WMD? Saddam can declare he has 10, destroy 10, and Bush can counter saying he has 100, and Saddam only destroyed 10% of his stock. The vagueness of "declaring" and "dis-arming" is radically disturbing.

That's the point! He DIDN'T declare 10 and he had 10. What else didn't he declare? Get it yet?

No, if you follow up on the news reports, Saddam "declared" all his WMD and WMD research in a massive documentation several thousand pages long. About a week after that the Bush Admininstration said, no, thats not complete. Declaration is simply not feasible because there is no way to verify it.

I wonder if the recently discovered drone plane and the chem/bio cluster bombs were on there.

That drone plane is up for debate (since it is undeclared). Bush administration claims that it can be modified to outfit chemical or biological weapons. But then again, most anything can be used as a weapon (if a postal letter can be used to spread antrax) if you really wanted to modify it. While I think that plane was designed with dispersing chemical or biological weapons in mind, its still a pretty pathetic piece of evidence, if you have something similar to a crop duster as your main means of WMD delivery. If it were used to disperse WMD, it'd be probably be more of a local thing, because I highly doubt those things have a decent range.

The chem/bio cluster bombs were declared in that huge docementation, I believe thats why the Bush administration isnt making that big of a deal over it, compared to the unmanned drone plane. Although I may be wrong, havent had the times to keep up with the latest round of news since its finals week.

 

[HeroOfPellinor]

Originally posted by: dexvx

Originally posted by: HeroOfPellinor

Originally posted by: dexvx

Originally posted by: Loralon
Regarding the inspections process, the logic is running in circles at the U.N. Security Council. Saddam is still playing the same old game masterfully. Everytime the political pressure heats up on him, he'll just throw the inspectors a bone, and then Blix can go back to the security council to report that "some progess is being made and so we believe more progress can be made if inspections should continue." Naturally, everytime an UNMOVIC report comes back like that, it just gives ammunition to French camp. The French will say, "as long as the inspectors think they're making progress, why shouldn't they be allowed to continue?" If we really follow the French plan and allow inspections with an indeterminate timeframe, then the result is rather predictable. Inspections will continue for years without anything substantial happening with regards to disarmament. The political will behind the inpections regime will slowly wither away as the world becomes distracted by other pressing issues (North Korea, Isreal-Palistine, etc...) and eventually Saddam will throw the inspectors out when the time is right and the world is looking the other way. That is of course assuming nothing nasty happens with respect to Iraq's WMD as this containment strategy plays itself out.

Crushing 50 ICBM's is pretty good for disarnament, dont you think?

They weren't ICBMs...they were barely able to get past their own border. The UN resolution gave Iraq a chance to come clean and they haven't. Destroying undeclared banned weapons when you've got a gun to your head isn't exactly a noble gesture. Inspections aren't working. None of this stuff was declared. If inspectors are stumbling across stuff like this, think about what else they will or won't stumble across. Partial disarmament or disarmament when you get caught is unsatisfactory.

Actually therer were medium ranged ballistas missiles, with a decent range. Iraq admitted they were a little beyond the range of the specified miltary limitations. And no, go read the news reports, Iraq did declare these missiles, it was the inspectors that estimated that their ranged exceeded the alotted limit, and Iraq said yea, they do slightly, thus they are crushing them up.

This all goes back to the premise of how you can declare your military inventory. Anything that Saddamn declares, anyone can claim that Saddam is hiding more than hes declaring, buried somewhere in the vast desert of Iraq. Declaring the entire Iraqi military inventory is neither reliable nor can be easily "proven" or "disproven" as documentation can be easily forged. It is simply not practical.

Medium range missile? It barely went past 93 miles and you consider that medium range?

"Recent inspections have also revealed the existence of a drone with a wingspan of 7.45 meters (24 1/2 feet) that has not been declared by Iraq. Officials at the inspection site stated that the drone had been test flown,"

Hans Blix said that...but I guess that doesn't count, right?

"The United Nations said it discovered empty chemical warheads in an ammunition depot south of Baghdad Thursday and that the weapons had not been reported by Iraq. An Iraqi official said the weapons were old ordnance listed in its December declaration. The inspectors said they found 11 empty chemical warheads in ``excellent'' condition at an ammunition storage area where they were inspecting bunkers built in the late 1990s, a U.N. spokesman reported. They had not previously been declared by Iraq, the spokesman said." Source

Seems to contradict your linkless argument, doesn't it? I also haven't yet heard from a UN representative that they are satisfied with Iraq explanation of how it disposed of the chemical and biological weapons the UN KNOWS they had.