Innocent man apparently executed

[IdaGno]

Originally posted by: Bumrush99
Link

This is why I'm against the death penalty. Granted some scumbags deserve to die, but if cases like this are proven the entire system should be suspended.

One innocent human life is a price too high to pay for "justice". It could happen to any one of us.

The rules of evidence need to be significantly raised in all legal matters, esp criminal maters.

 

[Tab]

Originally posted by: 3chordcharlie

Originally posted by: Tab
Would you rather have your tax dollars used to keep a man alive that is responsible for the deaths of thousands?

What has happen is tragic, but I have no problem with the death penatly.

1. Yes.
2. OBL is a special case.
3. Executions don't save money in a legal system with presumption of innocence and exhaustive appeals to examine due process.

OBL is a special case? In what sense?

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Bumrush99
Link

This is why I'm against the death penalty. Granted some scumbags deserve to die, but if cases like this are proven the entire system should be suspended.

One innocent human life is a price too high to pay for "justice". It could happen to any one of us.

This is my primary reason for not supporting the death penalty anymore. There are too many mistakes made within the system.

I dont know if this case is an innnocent man being executed, but there are plenty of them that are out there.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Bumrush99
Link

This is why I'm against the death penalty. Granted some scumbags deserve to die, but if cases like this are proven the entire system should be suspended.

One innocent human life is a price too high to pay for "justice". It could happen to any one of us.

"Then Bexar County district attorney Sam D. Millsap Jr. says he never should have sought the death penalty based on those circumstances."

Blame both the system and the man above that it allows the one man that was ultimately responsible to make the call.

 

[BDawg]

Originally posted by: Ronstang
This was quite a while ago people. When this guy was executed DNA testing and other forensic methods were in their infancy. Each year as technology grows the chances of this type of thing happening decreases significantly.

Oh, so your excuse is this was okay because we lacked the science to accurately prove this was the man.

One mistake is one too many.

My problem with the death penalty is that it's final. If you put someone in jail and find out that he's innocent, you can let him out.

With the death penaly, I suppose the deceased's mother gets a flower or something?

 

[joshw10]

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: Ronstang
This was quite a while ago people. When this guy was executed DNA testing and other forensic methods were in their infancy. Each year as technology grows the chances of this type of thing happening decreases significantly.

Oh, so your excuse is this was okay because we lacked the science to accurately prove this was the man.

One mistake is one too many.

My problem with the death penalty is that it's final. If you put someone in jail and find out that he's innocent, you can let him out.

With the death penaly, I suppose the deceased's mother gets a flower or something?

IMO in cases if it is later revealed an innocent man is put to death, they should execute the prosecutor in charge of that case as well.

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

Originally posted by: joshw10

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: Ronstang
This was quite a while ago people. When this guy was executed DNA testing and other forensic methods were in their infancy. Each year as technology grows the chances of this type of thing happening decreases significantly.

Oh, so your excuse is this was okay because we lacked the science to accurately prove this was the man.

One mistake is one too many.

My problem with the death penalty is that it's final. If you put someone in jail and find out that he's innocent, you can let him out.

With the death penaly, I suppose the deceased's mother gets a flower or something?

IMO in cases if it is later revealed an innocent man is put to death, they should execute the prosecutor in charge of that case as well.

Why follow one reflexive barbaric act with yet another reflexive barbaric act? Why not just simplify the system and remove the high stakes element imposed by the death penalty? DAs have too much discretion and indigent defendants don't have any.

If you kill someone (intentionally) the default charge is voluntary manslaughter. The default penalty 15 years. Positive (for the defense) mitigating factors (under the influence, killed a spouse, etc) gets a few years knocked off the sentence. Negative mitigating factors (gang related, drug sales/distribution/territory, killing a child) gets a few years added to the sentence.

If you plan and then kill someone, the default charge is murder. The default penalty is 25 years minimum. You are eligible for parole after serving 24 years and 364 days.

I wouldn't abolish the death penalty, although I consider it immoral. Reserve it for particularly egregious crimes (ie kill multiple people, preceding torture, preceding rape, etc) but require a minimum period of 7 years between sentence and punishment. Ample time is allowed to appeal the decision and "political" prosecutions are likely to decrease b/c DAs, governors, etc can no longer brag about their tough on crime credentials based on executions.

In essence, the blood-lusting element that supports the death penalty are still entertained, while the system itself actually administers justice instead of the current crap shoot we call jurisprudence.

 

[dmcanally]

I don?t understand why they used the death penalty in the first place. First and foremost the dude who got shot was an illegal alien. IMO the illegal shouldn?t have any rights whatsoever. Being that he wasn?t a citizen of this country and is already committing a crime (being here illegally) what concern of it is our government?s if he gets shot? The other reason I?m surprised the death penalty was used is because it doesn?t look like the illegal died. If he is around now to testify that Cantu wasn?t the shooter? what was the grounds of justifying the death penalty? I think there is probably more to this case than the article explains.

I completely agree with the death penalty in any case involving a murder that isn?t accidental. I could care less about rehabilitation. I don?t understand how so many people can be forgiving to someone who ended the life of another person. If I walked into a convenience store, pointed my gun at the person behind the counter and blasted him I would ****** hope you people would have enough respect for that innocent persons life to put me to death. I don?t care if I happened to be temporarily insane, on drugs, mentally retarded, desperate, or whatever other crock of ****** excuse I could come up with. If I do something wrong I want a punishment that is appropriate. IMHO I think murdering someone is enough evil to punish someone with death.

 

[3chordcharlie]

Originally posted by: Tab

Originally posted by: 3chordcharlie

Originally posted by: Tab
Would you rather have your tax dollars used to keep a man alive that is responsible for the deaths of thousands?

What has happen is tragic, but I have no problem with the death penatly.

1. Yes.
2. OBL is a special case.
3. Executions don't save money in a legal system with presumption of innocence and exhaustive appeals to examine due process.

OBL is a special case? In what sense?

Because there aren't that many people who are absolutely known to be guilty of orchestrating mass murders.

You'll notice that by 'special case', I didn't mean 'I would support executing him. I wouldn't.

 

[OutHouse]

Originally posted by: 3chordcharlie

Originally posted by: Tab

Originally posted by: 3chordcharlie

Originally posted by: Tab
Would you rather have your tax dollars used to keep a man alive that is responsible for the deaths of thousands?

What has happen is tragic, but I have no problem with the death penatly.

1. Yes.
2. OBL is a special case.
3. Executions don't save money in a legal system with presumption of innocence and exhaustive appeals to examine due process.

OBL is a special case? In what sense?

Because there aren't that many people who are absolutely known to be guilty of orchestrating mass murders.

You'll notice that by 'special case', I didn't mean 'I would support executing him. I wouldn't.

Me either. I would torture him everyday until he died of old age.

 

[zendari]

Someone else on this forum said it best. Just consider the death penalty a late term abortion.

 

[imported_Tango]

Originally posted by: Tab

Would you rather have your tax dollars used to keep a man alive that is responsible for the deaths of thousands?

Yes, because it would be something our society and culture could be proud of: having substituted vengeance an revenge with justice.

 

[Perknose]

Originally posted by: 3chordcharlie
This argument really seems like 'well, we still need to execute someone'.

I don't get it - why?

It's an American/Iranian/Commie Chineese/North Korean thing. In this important and fundamental metric of civilization, those societies come up small.

Of course, only we Americans also have a feverishly huge "no zygote left behind" lobby. They call themselves "pro-life. Many are amongst the staunches political defenders of the death penalty. So we are still unrivaled based on hypocrisy.

 

[Phokus]

A decade after Ruben Cantu was executed for capital murder, the only witness to the crime is recanting and his co-defendant says Cantu, then 17, was not even with him that night.

The victim was shot nine times with a rifle during an attempted robbery before the gunman shot the only witness.

That witness, Juan Moreno, told the Houston Chronicle for its Sunday editions that Cantu was not the killer. Moreno said he identified him at the 1985 trial because he felt pressured and feared authorities.

Cantu, who had maintained his innocence, was executed on Aug. 24, 1993, at age 26. "Texas murdered an innocent person," co-defendant David Garza said.

Sam D. Millsap Jr., the district attorney who handled the case, said he never should have sought the death penalty in a case based on testimony from a witness who identified a suspect only after police showed him a photo three times.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co...rticle/2005/11/21/AR2005112101384.html

And it looks like the guy was set up by the police:

...Ewell, a friend of the officer, said the bar shooting prompted him to reopen the Gomez murder case.

He sent a bilingual homicide detective to show Cantu's photo to Moreno for the second time. Moreno still did not identify Cantu.

The next day, Ewell sent out a different bilingual detective who brought Moreno, who was then an illegal immigrant, back to the police station. Moreno was again shown Cantu's photo along with four others. The officer's report indicates that Moreno picked out Cantu, then signed and dated the back of the photo.

But the photo submitted into evidence at trial was not dated on the back, according to trial transcripts. Moreno said he felt compelled to do what police wanted, even though he knew it was wrong.

"The police were sure it was (Cantu) because he had hurt a police officer," Moreno said in a recent interview. "They told me they were certain it was him, and that's why I testified."

http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/11/20/texas.execution.ap/index.html

Well at least this guy can go free and get back the rest of his life... oh wait. :disgust:

Don't mess with texas, b1tches! :|

 

[effee]

Its happened before..

 

[Proletariat]

Originally posted by: effee
Its happened before..

Still f'ed up.

Texas sucks.

 

[Feldenak]

P&N

 

[Proletariat]

Originally posted by: Feldenak
P&N

:roll:

Everybody should know about this. An innocent man was killed.

 

[PingSpike]

This never would have happened if they'd also executed the witnesses. And the jury.

 

[Leper Messiah]

Originally posted by: Feldenak
P&N

FTW

 

[Maetryx]

He knows it's P&N, but he wants to make sure he educates us over here in OT. He has an agenda. He's a liberal left winger who's proud of himself for registering libertarian. He has a zealous vision of secret truth right before his eyes and he wants the rest of us to see it.

 

[mercanucaribe]

Not surprised. I bet this won't sway the pro-death people though.

Originally posted by: :|Feldenak
P&N

How does this thread being here hurt you? Does learning something cause you enough anguish that you had to post "P&N"? The worst kind of person is the willfully ignorant. :disgust::|:disgust: Too bad there's no death penalty for that.

 

[BriGy86]

its reasons like this that i sway on my ideas about the death penalty

its horrible that something like this happened, but in cases like jeffery dommer (sp?) they found body parts in his freezer, people like that need to be shot

 

[Feldenak]

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe
Not surprised. I bet this won't sway the pro-death people though.

Originally posted by: :|Feldenak
P&N

How does this thread being here hurt you? Does learning something cause you enough anguish that you had to post "P&N"? The worst kind of person is the willfully ignorant. :disgust::|:disgust:

Take your anti-death left-wing elitism over to the local clearinghouse...P&N. I am quite capable of keeping up with current events on my own and do not need your assistance. Not to mention, this thread has "flamefest" written all over it...just a matter of time before the left and right wing idiots start coming over to OT to bash each other some more. Keep it in P&N where it belongs.

 

[mercanucaribe]

Originally posted by: Feldenak

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe
Not surprised. I bet this won't sway the pro-death people though.

Originally posted by: :|Feldenak
P&N

How does this thread being here hurt you? Does learning something cause you enough anguish that you had to post "P&N"? The worst kind of person is the willfully ignorant. :disgust::|:disgust:

Take your anti-death left-wing elitism over to the local clearinghouse...P&N. I am quite capable of keeping up with current events on my own and do not need your assistance. Not to mention, this thread has "flamefest" written all over it...just a matter of time before the left and right wing idiots start coming over to OT to bash each other some more. Keep it in P&N where it belongs.

You're right. Hopefully Anandtech Moderator will free you from this tyranny of having to click this thread and read a supposed flamefest on a topic that you are hostile toward, making room for another turkey thread by moving this to P&N.