Initial Trump mass deportation plan: 3 million

[glenn1]

Finally we have someone who won't treat immigration as a sick joke to be played against both ends. There is no middle ground in this; either you (A) support open borders, (B) think 3MM deportations is a 'good start', or (C) you like the status quo because it allows you to have your cheap vegetables and housekeeper while holding their legal status over their head to keep them in line. Deporting 3 million is far, far, far more ethical than what we're doing now.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/donald-trump-deport-3-million_us_5828ad2be4b0c4b63b0d22f1

<snip>

President-elect Donald Trump plans to deport or imprison somewhere between 2 million and 3 million undocumented immigrants as soon as he takes office.

In an interview with CBS News that will air Sunday night, Trump said he would launch what could be the largest mass deportation effort in modern history, vowing to immediately deport a number of people comparable to the record-setting figure that President Barack Obama carried out over two terms in office.

“What we are going to do is get the people that are criminal and have criminal records, gang members, drug dealers, where a lot of these people, probably 2 million, it could be even 3 million, we are getting them out of our country or we are going to incarcerate,” Trump said in the interview. “But we’re getting them out of our country, they’re here illegally.”

In saying that 2 million to 3 million undocumented immigrants with criminal records live in the U.S., Trump was repeating a claim he’d made earlier in the campaign that The Washington Post fact-checked and determined was inaccurate.

The Migration Policy Institute, a nonpartisan think tank, estimates that around 820,000 undocumented immigrants have criminal records ― a figure that includes many people whose only conviction is crossing the border illegally. Under prosecutorial discretion guidelines in place since 2011, undocumented migrants with minor crimes are in some cases able to avoid deportation.

</snip>

 

[fskimospy]

Well this sounds impressively horrible already. This guy is already setting himself up for some amazing backlash.

And by the way of course there's a middle ground, which is tightening border security while implementing guest worker programs and a path to citizenship for those already here. You might have heard of this middle ground as the Senate passed a bill about it.

 

[Chiropteran]

And by the way of course there's a middle ground, which is tightening border security while implementing guest worker programs and a path to citizenship for those already here. You might have heard of this middle ground as the Senate passed a bill about it.

3 million people broke the law, middle ground would be ENFORCING THE LAW, not ignoring it until the senate can change the law.

 

[Blackjack200]

Well this sounds impressively horrible already. This guy is already setting himself up for some amazing backlash.

And by the way of course there's a middle ground, which is tightening border security while implementing guest worker programs and a path to citizenship for those already here. You might have heard of this middle ground as the Senate passed a bill about it.

Either you support total legalization of all banned substances or you support squads of brown shirts going door to door checking to make sure no one has a bag of weed on their turntable. There's no middle ground.

 

[Starbuck1975]

We've been tip toeing around immigration for far too long. Corporations love the cheap undocumented labor, which I think has contributed to the demise of the middle class and strong trade jobs. Suburbanites just love their cheap vegetables, gardeners, landscapers and housecleaners, because it helps them forget the 1% keeps screwing them over. The Democrats pander because they need the votes as part of their coalition.

It will be painful but I would rather we reduce the flow in, get rid of the ones that are not contributing and provide a path to citizenship for the ones that want to contribute, as prior immigration waves did that did not have the convenience of simply crossing a border.

 

[fskimospy]

3 million people broke the law, middle ground would be ENFORCING THE LAW, not ignoring it until the senate can change the law.

So you don't believe in prosecutorial discretion? We better hire a lot more cops and build a lot more jails then.

 

[glenn1]

Well this sounds impressively horrible already. This guy is already setting himself up for some amazing backlash.

And by the way of course there's a middle ground, which is tightening border security while implementing guest worker programs and a path to citizenship for those already here. You might have heard of this middle ground as the Senate passed a bill about it.

No path to citizenship, ever. That would be the one absolute bottom line for me even if we eventually move to open borders. You don't reward someone for breaking our laws by making them a citizen to vote on other laws.

 

[IronWing]

So he's going to continue the Obama policy but call it something new? Because the Obama policy is to deport aliens who've committed other crimes.

 

[fskimospy]

No path to citizenship, ever. That would be the one absolute bottom line for me even if we eventually move to open borders. You don't reward someone for breaking our laws by making them a citizen to vote on other laws.

If you don't want to support a path to citizenship ever for anyone that's certainly your business but surely you understand that's an extreme position. When you say there's no middle ground maybe there isn't to YOU, but to most everyone else there is.

 

[MooseNSquirrel]

Finally we have someone who won't treat immigration as a sick joke to be played against both ends. There is no middle ground in this; either you (A) support open borders, (B) think 3MM deportations is a 'good start', or (C) you like the status quo because it allows you to have your cheap vegetables and housekeeper while holding their legal status over their head to keep them in line. Deporting 3 million is far, far, far more ethical than what we're doing now...

The Migration Policy Institute, a nonpartisan think tank, estimates that around 820,000 undocumented immigrants have criminal records ― a figure that includes many people whose only conviction is crossing the border illegally. Under prosecutorial discretion guidelines in place since 2011, undocumented migrants with minor crimes are in some cases able to avoid deportation.

Bolded for giggles.

 

[Yakk]

It's a big problem to fix. In addition to the increased crime, it will hurt people who depend on ultra cheap labor for their profits. By extension it will also temporarily hurt the middle class because some markets depend on near slavery wages. Getting fair compensation for work done will cost more, very similar to an internal Fair Trade setup.

Backlash? Yes for sure, but it is a huge problem which needs fixing, not looking the other way.

 

[fskimospy]

It's a big problem to fix. In addition to the increased crime, it will hurt people who depend on ultra cheap labor for their profits. By extension it will also temporarily hurt the middle class because some markets depend on near slavery wages. Getting fair compensation for work done will cost more, very similar to an internal Fair Trade setup.

Backlash? Yes for sure, but it is a huge problem which needs fixing, not looking the other way.

There's no evidence that immigrants (including illegal immigrants) commit crimes at a higher rate than natural born citizens.

People have been working for years to solve this problem with guest worker systems but conservatives have consistently blocked immigration reform.

 

[PlanetJosh]

It's proposals like this that will make for very interesting reading on the forums for years. Laughably interesting, but still interesting.

 

[glenn1]

If you don't want to support a path to citizenship ever for anyone that's certainly your business but surely you understand that's an extreme position. When you say there's no middle ground maybe there isn't to YOU, but to most everyone else there is.

For 3 million plus people there isn't going to be any middle ground either. Unless you mean the ground between wherever they're from and the United States.

 

[Chiropteran]

So you don't believe in prosecutorial discretion? We better hire a lot more cops and build a lot more jails then.

Not in the case of illegal immigration.

 

[Chiropteran]

There's no evidence that immigrants (including illegal immigrants) commit crimes at a higher rate than natural born citizens.

\
Are you illiterate? The 3 million figure isn't all illegal immigrants, it's " the people that are criminal and have criminal records, gang members, drug dealers"

 

[glenn1]

So you don't believe in prosecutorial discretion? We better hire a lot more cops and build a lot more jails then.

Actually I want a lot more employers prosecuted. Including a whole shitload of urban progressives who have been screwing over illegals to be their nannies and housekeepers for years. I'd build a lot more jails to put some SF and NYC shitlords to go along with red state farmers, etc.

 

[fskimospy]

Not in the case of illegal immigration.

Why is that special?

 

[brycejones]

\
Are you illiterate? The 3 million figure isn't all illegal immigrants, it's " the people that are criminal and have criminal records, gang members, drug dealers"

Some guy who had a DUI 15 years ago and no problems since.

 

[K1052]

\
Are you illiterate? The 3 million figure isn't all illegal immigrants, it's " the people that are criminal and have criminal records, gang members, drug dealers"

Then why is it three times higher than the number of illegals with criminal records?

 

[fskimospy]

Actually I want a lot more employers prosecuted. Including a whole shitload of urban progressives who have been screwing over illegals to be their nannies and housekeepers for years. I'd build a lot more jails to put some SF and NYC shitlords in jail.

lol, of course you would. Your public policy is based on attacking your imagined enemies. Guess what? The people in SF and NYC that you hate so much don't care about you in the slightest. All the rage and jealousy you spit towards them isn't just ignored, they genuinely have no idea you're even doing it.

I genuinely have no idea what has made you such a hateful and spiteful person but in the end that's going to hurt you way more than it hurts anyone else.

 

[K1052]

Actually I want a lot more employers prosecuted. Including a whole shitload of urban progressives who have been screwing over illegals to be their nannies and housekeepers for years. I'd build a lot more jails to put some SF and NYC shitlords to go along with red state farmers, etc.

I'm confused. You're saying that Trump should be in jail?

 

[Chiropteran]

Then why is it three times higher than the number of illegals with criminal records?

Not all "criminals, gang members, drug dealers" have criminal records.

 

[glenn1]

lol, of course you would. Your public policy is based on attacking your imagined enemies. Guess what? The people in SF and NYC that you hate so much don't care about you in the slightest. All the rage and jealousy you spit towards them isn't just ignored, they genuinely have no idea you're even doing it.

I genuinely have no idea what has made you such a hateful and spiteful person but in the end that's going to hurt you way more than it hurts anyone else.

LOL, the old "it will hurt you more" line. What will you break out next, "if you sit too close to the TV then you'll go cross-eyed"?

Hopefully you haven't participated in the exploitation of an illegal yourself fskimospy, because I hope you'd have better morals than that and I don't think you'd do very well in jail.

 

[Chiropteran]

Why is that special?

Who said it was special? You are asking irrelevant questions. Go away.