Infrastructure week for real?

[pcgeek11]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-agrees-spend-2-trillion-us-infrastructure-democrats-171310353.html

Haha color me skeptical.

Isn't it the houses responsibility to pay for it.

 

[FelixDeCat]

Revoke the tax cuts or shut the fuck up.

pffft....cut spending or shut the fuck up.

 

[JEDIYoda]

this bill will only get done if the president can somehow find a way for the bill to help him get re-elected!
Also I don`t see this bill being passed at all......why?
Because trump might try to strip the funding in order to build his "wall"...….ohhh how suddenly we forget!!

 

[brycejones]

pffft....cut spending or shut the fuck up.

Something the GOP didn’t do in the 2 years they had the power to do exactly that. Instead they passed a tax cut they immediately turned around and financed.

 

[sportage]

Well.... There is a hitch.
Republicans will insist, following an directive from their orange haired leader, that any and all infrastructure improvements must be only for roads and bridges where billionaire CEO's live, work, travel on a daily basis.
In short, the improvements and repairs will benefit only the top 1 percent of America's super rich. Exactly as the Trump republicans have thus far targeted their agenda.

The Trump so called tax reforms only benefit the super rich. And the family of Donald Trump as well, naturally...
And their crackdown on immigration only benefit those same super rich, because they can't have an immigrant in their neighborhood unless that immigrant is working for them. And at two dollars an hour.

And Trump republicans will never collude with Russians unless, that collusion benefits only republican candidates. With beneficiary number one being Donald Trump himself.

So as far as infrastructure goes, don't count those chickens before they're hatched.
If Donald Trump or any republican wants to talk infrastructure, its only because the road in front of some billionaires million dollar mansion has a pothole. And the unevenness of that road is spilling caviar off his cracker while being driven, by an immigrant, into work.

What?
You seriously believed when republicans talk infrastructure they are considerate of your needs?
Where have you been for the last two years?

 

[UberNeuman]

Something the GOP didn’t do in the 2 years they had the power to do exactly that. Instead they passed a tax cut they immediately turned around and financed.

Look, man. There is a CRISIS AT THE BORDER! And we NEED TO BUILD A WALL! Just not in the time they had the power to do so - IT'S AN ISSUE NOW!!!! Since the Democrats took the House.

With more tax cuts for the rich that the middle class will be paying for years.

Republican voters are fearful, easy lead morons.

 

[woolfe9998]

No worries there, this will take years to get in the pipeline. Trump will be enjoying four walls by then.

I hope so. Because it would be a disaster for Trump's people to administer such a program. Can you imagine if they had apportioned say, the stimulus money back in '09? Half of it would have wound up in the pockets of people doing business with Trump.

 

[dawp]

Desperately needed by whom? For what? I see no desperate need for anything. And dont give me the roads and bridges routine, I know better.

you don't know your ass from a hole in the ground

 

[ch33zw1z]

Wishful thinking, Chancy.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Something the GOP didn’t do in the 2 years they had the power to do exactly that. Instead they passed a tax cut they immediately turned around and financed.

Lol, those facts are just too much to bear for fdc's little kitty mind

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Yeah I heard on the radio part of it is funded with a gas tax increase and some other user type tax that I forgot about.

Yeah I've said it in other threads (and as someone that actually knows motor fuel excise tax) that the federal government needs to increase their rate. It hasn't kept up with inflation in the slightest - hence infrastructure crumbling is no surprise.

Though - to be honest - States like California are expensive for gasoline because they implemented high amounts of motor fuel taxes at the state level. With rates that high they shouldn't have any infrastructure issues. Something tells me traffic and roads is not so awesome in CA - but someone from there can comment if they like. Either way, it's going to suck for poor folks since the state already anally rapes people with their rates.


Also part of me thinks our infrastructure is already fucked up - thanks in a large part to states taking things into their own hands and getting a huge hard-on for toll-roads. Now that they have those, they are never going away. It's fucking ridiculous that depending on what your route is to work can dictate if you have to pay some ridiculous fee twice a day.

 

[brycejones]

We need to come up with an alternative to the gas tax as a funding mechanism for transportation infrastructure. Increased fuel economy or shifts electric vehicles will reduce the amount of revenue produced over time even as the rate is increased.

 

[zinfamous]

Get a clue, homestyle. I've long warned about spending and the National Debt. You can pull numbers out of your backside, I dont care. The result is the same. The government is a fat, bloated pig. We spend too much money and nobody cares.

Well, if you truly believe this, then you agree that Trump and Reagan were the worst presidents to ever stink up the White House. You agree, don't you?


lol: Long warned against government spending and the national debt/always votes for Republicans that spend and grow the national debt at record paces. Every single fucking time.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

We need to come up with an alternative to the gas tax as a funding mechanism for transportation infrastructure. Increased fuel economy or shifts electric vehicles will reduce the amount of revenue produced over time even as the rate is increased.

There isn't much avoiding it.

Electric cars are still microscopic - especially because trucks/SUVs are selling like mad right now. For at least another 20 years motor fuel taxes would suffice - they just need to be increased for inflation.

Electric cars can technically already be taxed at the state level - since sales tax is applied to energy bills.

The federal government can implement some kind of per kWh tax when a good amount of people switch to electric (which again, isn't going to be anytime soon).

 

[zinfamous]

There isn't much avoiding it.

Electric cars are still microscopic - especially because trucks/SUVs are selling like mad right now. For at least another 20 years motor fuel taxes would suffice - they just need to be increased for inflation.

Electric cars can technically already be taxed at the state level - since sales tax is applied to energy bills.

The federal government can implement some kind of per kWh tax when a good amount of people switch to electric (which again, isn't going to be anytime soon).

I'm not sure it will go on that long. The first major replacement will be shipping, for which fleets of electric, and then automated trucks are rolling out. That's a lot of vehicles that are on the road the majority of the time that are going to be cutting a big chunk out of the fuel needs. This should happen well before it becomes standard with consumer vehicles.

Also, VW is the largest automaker in the world and they are already set to have a 85-90%, I think, fully electric inventory within 10 years.

 

[K1052]

Though - to be honest - States like California are expensive for gasoline because they implemented high amounts of motor fuel taxes at the state level. With rates that high they shouldn't have any infrastructure issues. Something tells me traffic and roads is not so awesome in CA - but someone from there can comment if they like. Either way, it's going to suck for poor folks since the state already anally rapes people with their rates.

It would take FAR higher taxes than even CA's to actually cover the costs incurred in keeping up with road construction and repair. It's basically impossible (and expensive to try) to build your way out of road congestion also as the new capacity is almost immediately gobbled up by induced demand. The denser places in the country need to give up on more roads and just build transit coupled with zoning reform that lets high density development near transit happen.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

It would take FAR higher taxes than even CA's to actually cover the costs incurred in keeping up with road construction and repair. It's basically impossible (and expensive to try) to build your way out of road congestion also as the new capacity is almost immediately gobbled up by induced demand. The denser places in the country need to give up on more roads and just build transit coupled with zoning reform that lets high density development near transit happen.

Well, do you think toll-roads are the answer? Personally I find it to be an asshole move for people that depend on that ONE particular road.

Honestly the majority of government just needs to trim some fat.

States like CA have:
-Some of the highest property taxes (progressive) mostly due to the highest property values in the nation.
-The highest fuel/excise taxes (regressive) in the nation
-Some of the highest sales taxes (regressive) in the nation
-The highest state income taxes (progressive) in the nation
-AND toll roads

And they STILL can't find a few coins in their purse to pay for infrastructure?

It's no wonder there are so many fucking broke people in CA.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

I'm not sure it will go on that long. The first major replacement will be shipping, for which fleets of electric, and then automated trucks are rolling out. That's a lot of vehicles that are on the road the majority of the time that are going to be cutting a big chunk out of the fuel needs. This should happen well before it becomes standard with consumer vehicles.

Also, VW is the largest automaker in the world and they are already set to have a 85-90%, I think, fully electric inventory within 10 years.

Making electric cars and buying electric cars are 2 very different things.

I'm just saying - When the big companies (Ford, GM, etc...) are closing their auto plants that make fuel efficient sedans and opening new ones to build trucks and SUVs... It's not going away in the next 20 years minimum.

Until they start getting electric SUVs/Trucks that are still big/bulky - but can also get 200-400+ miles, they aren't going away.

That and even if we start producing nothing but electric, a good majority of the nation will still be driving their old car or buying used vehicles.

 

[K1052]

Well, do you think toll-roads are the answer? Personally I find it to be an asshole move for people that depend on that ONE particular road.

Honestly the majority of government just needs to trim some fat.

States like CA have:
-Some of the highest property taxes (progressive) mostly due to the highest property values in the nation.
-The highest fuel/excise taxes (regressive) in the nation
-Some of the highest sales taxes (regressive) in the nation
-The highest state income taxes (progressive) in the nation
-AND toll roads

And they STILL can't find a few coins in their purse to pay for infrastructure?

It's no wonder there are so many fucking broke people in CA.

California has pretty limited toll road mileage compared to most states. Florida, Pennsylvania, New York, Texas, etc all have way more and most are adding to it. Since most of those states are unwilling or unable to expand using tax money you're going to get toll roads (especially TX and FL) as developers sprawl out endlessly. I don't think this is a great pattern.

And yes even in high tax/high service states the monies collected don't approach what would be required to even maintain the current road network in good condition. The highway trust fund money that the feds dole out has dwindled as inflation ate it and would have gone insolvent in 2008 if congress had not regularly started funneling billions in general revenue into it, even that is extremely inadequate for our needs.

 

[Commodus]

Making electric cars and buying electric cars are 2 very different things.

I'm just saying - When the big companies (Ford, GM, etc...) are closing their auto plants that make fuel efficient sedans and opening new ones to build trucks and SUVs... It's not going away in the next 20 years minimum.

Until they start getting electric SUVs/Trucks that are still big/bulky - but can also get 200-400+ miles, they aren't going away.

That and even if we start producing nothing but electric, a good majority of the nation will still be driving their old car or buying used vehicles.

That's closer than you think!

GM's closures are partly due to its shift toward EVs. Ford's electric plans include an SUV, and it recently invested in Rivian (a promising EV startup) to create a brand new vehicle.

On that note, Rivian itself is going to achieve your goals -- its R1T pickup truck will have a peak 400-mile range in late 2020.

It will take a while before most people are buying electric, but I don't think people realize both how far the technology has progressed and just how close we are to a transition to EVs. The market could look very different in a few years.

 

[dank69]

Yeah I've said it in other threads (and as someone that actually knows motor fuel excise tax) that the federal government needs to increase their rate. It hasn't kept up with inflation in the slightest - hence infrastructure crumbling is no surprise.

Though - to be honest - States like California are expensive for gasoline because they implemented high amounts of motor fuel taxes at the state level. With rates that high they shouldn't have any infrastructure issues. Something tells me traffic and roads is not so awesome in CA - but someone from there can comment if they like. Either way, it's going to suck for poor folks since the state already anally rapes people with their rates.


Also part of me thinks our infrastructure is already fucked up - thanks in a large part to states taking things into their own hands and getting a huge hard-on for toll-roads. Now that they have those, they are never going away. It's fucking ridiculous that depending on what your route is to work can dictate if you have to pay some ridiculous fee twice a day.

States that implement toll roads should craft the system so that it does not affect residents unless they are driving commercial vehicles. There are many ways to do this.

 

[nOOky]

DJT pulled the two trillion figure out of his ass as usual. I don't know about most of you, but before I do anything at work, and even some things at home, I have a plan. If I need to build a dog kennel I don't go to Menards and buy a bunch of stuff without a clue, I plan out how big and what's needed beforehand before I spend a dollar. At my employer before I run a series of trials or troubleshoot an issue there's a process that involves some thought to map out the steps and the procedure, than I have an idea of the cost and what actually needs to be done.

This infrastructure plan is just like the wall, which is just like health care, which is just like the tax cut. There's no planning, no assessing the needs and the root solutions, it's just "I need some money to fix shit" and nowhere else in corporate America would you be able to operate like that, only in government. Take the time to do some homework before you go asking for money, then you can speak with data.

I suspect DJT is only thinking about who he can contract to do a bunch of the work to further his interests and relationships post Presidency.

 

[zinfamous]

Making electric cars and buying electric cars are 2 very different things.

I'm just saying - When the big companies (Ford, GM, etc...) are closing their auto plants that make fuel efficient sedans and opening new ones to build trucks and SUVs... It's not going away in the next 20 years minimum.

Until they start getting electric SUVs/Trucks that are still big/bulky - but can also get 200-400+ miles, they aren't going away.

That and even if we start producing nothing but electric, a good majority of the nation will still be driving their old car or buying used vehicles.

....said the city planners terrified of the approaching horse-shit tsumani in NY City, c. 1905

 

[Fanatical Meat]

DJT pulled the two trillion figure out of his ass as usual. I don't know about most of you, but before I do anything at work, and even some things at home, I have a plan. If I need to build a dog kennel I don't go to Menards and buy a bunch of stuff without a clue, I plan out how big and what's needed beforehand before I spend a dollar. At my employer before I run a series of trials or troubleshoot an issue there's a process that involves some thought to map out the steps and the procedure, than I have an idea of the cost and what actually needs to be done.

This infrastructure plan is just like the wall, which is just like health care, which is just like the tax cut. There's no planning, no assessing the needs and the root solutions, it's just "I need some money to fix shit" and nowhere else in corporate America would you be able to operate like that, only in government. Take the time to do some homework before you go asking for money, then you can speak with data.

I suspect DJT is only thinking about who he can contract to do a bunch of the work to further his interests and relationships post Presidency.

Funny part about Trump bitching over the costs was the plan provided came from a Republican representative and a Republican think tank.......
Then the President shits all over it.
I’ll give the President credit on this, if the plan sucked then the plan sucked, go back and make it better.
Just funny how he goes on these tirades that throws people who support him under the bus and that bus drives back & forth under the victims many times.

 

[IronWing]

Isn't it the houses responsibility to pay for it.

True. With Mitch controlling the Senate and refusing to move any Dem sponsored legislation, Pelosi needs the framework to originate with the White House. Having the White House take the first stab at an infrastructure plan is a political move to be sure. If Trump proposes anything like a two trillion dollar bill, Congressional Republicans (and their billionaire backers) will likely go ballistic. If the Dems like the plan, they can move it through the House and help in the Senate. If they don't like the plan, they can sit back and let the Republicans eat each other alive.