In fat war, doctors have few weapons

Geekbabe

Moderator Emeritus<br>Elite Member
Oct 16, 1999
32,234
2,554
126
www.theshoppinqueen.com
In fat war, doctors have few weapons, Boston Globe,
By Scott Allen

4/1/2004 -- Though obesity is now the second-leading cause of preventable deaths in the United States, doctors face a surprising problem in fighting the battle of the bulge: To most patients, they don't have much to offer beyond advice about diet and exercise.

The only two drugs approved by the US Food and Drug Administration for long-term weight loss typically help patients trim 15 pounds or less, and one, orlistat, can cause severe indigestion.

The problem, say researchers, is that decades of seeing obesity as an aesthetic problem instead of a health crisis have left basic scientific questions unanswered about the process of getting and staying thin. As a result, the quest for a potent diet pill has been scattershot and sometimes tragic, from the addictive amphetamines prescribed in the 1930s to the popular fen-phen pills of the 1990s that caused heart problems.

"Not to disparage anyone, but this has been a backwater of science for many years," said Dr. Allen Spiegel, cochairman of the Obesity Research Task Force at the National Institutes of Health, which will spend 12 times more on studies of cancer than obesity this year.

But, with 64 percent of Americans considered overweight and 400,000 dying annually from obesity-related causes such as heart failure, the spotlight is starting to shine on the science of obesity.

"We're just too darned fat," declared Health and Human Services Secretary Tommy G. Thompson last month in calling on Americans to lose weight. To aid in the campaign, Spiegel's group is developing a research agenda for better understanding obesity while the Bush administration is seeking a 10 percent boost in NIH obesity research funding, to $440.3 million in 2005.

The research pace already has quickened from a decade ago, when very few researchers were dedicated to obesity studies, according to Russell Ellison, chief medical officer at the French pharmaceutical firm, Sanofi-Synthelabo. Today, at least 10 antiobesity treatments are being tested on humans, including Sanofi's drug rimonabant, which could help patients both lose weight and quit smoking by blocking the same molecular system that gives marijuana smokers "the munchies."

Most overweight Americans do not see a doctor about weight-loss strategies, turning instead to methods many doctors frown on, such as untested over-the-counter pills or controversial diets. A recent Harris Interactive survey found that 32 million Americans say they are on a low-carbohydrate diet, such as Atkins or South Beach, which many nutritionists say may be effective, at least in the short term, but may not be healthy.

The other method of weight loss gaining in popularity, stomach-reducing surgery, is generally reserved for people at least 100 pounds overweight, because the procedure carries a serious risk of death or complications. Yet the number of morbidly obese patients undergoing the procedure has tripled since 2000 to 103,200 last year, according to the American Society for Bariatric Surgery.

Prescription weight-loss drugs remain largely an afterthought, with sales dropping more than 30 percent since their peak year, 2001, according to statistics compiled by IMS Health, a health care consulting firm in Pennsylvania. They were outsold, 4 to 1, by over-the-counter diet pills last year. Doctors say the current prescription drugs have a limited role as part of a broader weight-loss program, but some say they are not worth the trouble. "People who take them can lose weight, but the losses are modest -- 5 to 10 pounds -- and we know if they stop taking the drug that they gain the weight back," said Dr. Mitch Gitkind, director of the Weight Center at UMass Memorial Medical Center in Worcester.

The lack of good medical options, say obesity specialists, reflects the fact that many medical professionals continue to view obesity as stemming from a lack of willpower rather than as a medical condition that leads to diseases the way high blood pressure and cholesterol do.

Even today, insurance companies are so reluctant to cover drugs strictly for weight loss that companies testing them tend to emphasize obesity-related conditions rather than weight loss. For instance, Ortho-McNeil's antiepilepsy drug Topamax appears to also help people lose weight, but the company says it is testing it only to help treat binge-eating disorder, a psychiatric condition that afflicts a minority of obese people.

Dr. George Blackburn, associate director of the Division of Nutrition at Harvard Medical School, argues that regulators subject weight-loss drugs to tougher safety standards than other drugs because they do not regard obesity as a true disease. For example, the FDA issued a warning about the safety of the two-pill combination fen-phen in 1997 after 43 women on the drug developed heart valve problems. Blackburn appealed for a chance to test the combination at a lower dose, but the FDA instead banned fenfluramine, the "fen" in fen-phen.

"If Tylenol were a weight-loss drug, no way would it be on the market with the number of deaths and liver diseases it had. You get into weight loss and you'd better be [as virtuous as] Caesar's wife because there's some major bias," said Blackburn.

Dr. David G. Orloff, director of the FDA's metabolic and endocrine drug products division, says that diet drugs face the same standards as other drugs, but his agency is very strict about the safety of products that will be taken over long periods. Almost any weight-loss drug would fall into that category, he said.

In recent years, moreover, the bigger issue has been the lack of weight-loss drugs coming to market at all. Though the pharmaceutical industry reports 10 or more drugs in some stage of human testing, none has come before FDA's commissioners for final approval since 1999.

"The FDA isn't holding anything up, and we haven't turned anything down," said Orloff.

At least one drug could come up for approval in the next year or two, with Sanofi-Synthelabo's rimonabant now in phase 3 human trials, the last stage before the company can seek approval to market the pill. People who took rimonabant for a year in an earlier study lost an average of 18.9 pounds.

But there have been so many disappointments in the search for an effective weight-loss drug that many researchers prefer not to focus on one prospect, instead stressing that the field has come a long way in a short time. They date the modern era to 1995, when Dr. Jeffrey Friedman at Rockefeller University isolated the gene for leptin, a protein that appears to prevent fat cells from being stored.

"The importance of leptin is not that it's going to be a treatment, but that it has opened up the field because it has proven that the fat cells are trying to send a message to the brain about how much fat is stored," said Dr. Louis J. Aronne, director of the Comprehensive Weight Loss Center at Weill Medical College of Cornell University in New York. In obese people, researchers have learned, these chemical messages lose their effectiveness, making it easier to gain weight than to lose it.

Since leptin's discovery, researchers have found many intriguing clues to the way metabolism works, including a protein called adiponectin, whose concentration tends to be low in overweight children. Understanding how these and other parts of human metabolism work together is key to developing drugs.

The other major frontier is the role of genes in shaping our bodies, said Dr. Osama Hamdy, an internist at the Joslin Diabetes Center. "Eating behavior and the response to eating is actually a very, very complex situation," said Hamdy. "The genetics still need to be discovered."


64% of the adults in this country are overweight? :Q
 

Chaotic42

Lifer
Jun 15, 2001
35,204
2,353
126
See, what we need is extreme global warming to turn the planet into a sauna.

Problem solved.
 

NogginBoink

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2002
5,322
0
0
When I worked in healthcare I had an idea that I think would work.

Draw a tube of blood.

Spin it down in a centrifuge.

Show the person how cloudy (lipemic) the serum is from all those fats in it.

Ick! Ick! Ick!

I think that would have a dramatic effect on me. (Thankfully, my serum has no such lipemia.)
 

Geekbabe

Moderator Emeritus<br>Elite Member
Oct 16, 1999
32,234
2,554
126
www.theshoppinqueen.com
Originally posted by: NogginBoink
When I worked in healthcare I had an idea that I think would work.

Draw a tube of blood.

Spin it down in a centrifuge.

Show the person how cloudy (lipemic) the serum is from all those fats in it.

Ick! Ick! Ick!

I think that would have a dramatic effect on me. (Thankfully, my serum has no such lipemia.)


one would think their disappearing waistlines would have a dramatic effect!
 

Kadarin

Lifer
Nov 23, 2001
44,296
16
81
Originally posted by: NogginBoink
When I worked in healthcare I had an idea that I think would work.

Draw a tube of blood.

Spin it down in a centrifuge.

Show the person how cloudy (lipemic) the serum is from all those fats in it.

Ick! Ick! Ick!

I think that would have a dramatic effect on me. (Thankfully, my serum has no such lipemia.)

So do a dialysis kind of thing where blood continuously gets drawn from you, run through a centrifuge to remove said fats, and put back into you through a second tube...
 

Geekbabe

Moderator Emeritus<br>Elite Member
Oct 16, 1999
32,234
2,554
126
www.theshoppinqueen.com
I'll tell you I'd rather look good than eat a ton of crappy food every day.I'll also say a lot of the food I eat regularly taste way better than the junk stuff.

Spinach with mushrooms and onions and egglant sauteed with other veggies and cheese was dinner tonight at work:p
 

Chaotic42

Lifer
Jun 15, 2001
35,204
2,353
126
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Just install mirrored door on all Restaruants and Public Buildings.
With me they'd all crack and I'd have 10^459 years of bad luck.

 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
62,484
8,345
126
1) Allow flex plans to cover health club & exercise equipment purchases
2) Reduce the health care premiums *CONSIDERABLY* of those people within healthy range


They are a start anyway.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,529
3
0
Originally posted by: vi_edit
1) Allow flex plans to cover health club & exercise equipment purchases
2) Reduce the health care premiums *CONSIDERABLY* of those people within healthy range


They are a start anyway.
With 30% of America's Population being Obese the HMO's would rack up the bucks charging them more!
 

Chaotic42

Lifer
Jun 15, 2001
35,204
2,353
126
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: DaWhim
I am overweight too! :(
5'8 and about 150lbs now!
You might be out of shape but I wouldn't say you were overwieght.
I'm 6'2" and the military says I should be 185 pounds. I'm 225. Everyone says I don't look it, but then again they have also always said I was dense. :p
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
62,484
8,345
126
I'm 6'2" and the military says I should be 185 pounds

And that guideline was probably wrote up by fatass tubs of lard that haven't done a PT test in 20 years.
 

Adul

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
32,999
44
91
danny.tangtam.com
Originally posted by: Geekbabe
I'll tell you I'd rather look good than eat a ton of crappy food every day.I'll also say a lot of the food I eat regularly taste way better than the junk stuff.

Spinach with mushrooms and onions and egglant sauteed with other veggies and cheese was dinner tonight at work:p

sounds yummy
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,422
14,337
136
Why is everyone always looking for the quick-fix pill? :disgust: Such things do not exist. It takes years of hard work to get obese and it'll take similar hard work to get rid of it.
 

tcsenter

Lifer
Sep 7, 2001
18,949
575
126
Weight means nothing in and of itself. I don't understand why people fixate on weight alone. Body mass index, body fat ratio or percentage, and one's overall physical health should be considered together. Someone who is 5' 10" and weighs 220lbs with 10% body fat is not "overweight". The "over" part must come significantly or disproportionately from fat, not muscle.

This is a real problem that shows no indication of getting anything but worse. The consequences of obesity, high fat and high sugar (high fructose corn syrup) consumption, and sedentary lifestyles are going to end-up costing every tax-payer a bundle, which inevitably begin to cut-in to other expenditures significantly. The trend is already here.

And why wouldn't doctors have 'few weapons'? This is not a medical problem! At least in the vast majority of cases it is not a medical problem, although it will certainly result in medical consequences.

This is a social and cultural problem. People are bombarded from childhood with sound health advice, which most simply choose to ignore or defy. Obesity is by definition non-compliance with health and medical advice. Why would we try to "treat" anyone who willfully defies health and medical advice?
 

AEnigmaWI

Senior member
Jan 21, 2004
427
0
0
Originally posted by: tcsenter

And why wouldn't doctors have 'few weapons'? This is not a medical problem! At least in the vast majority of cases it is not a medical problem, although it will certainly result in medical consequences.

This is a social and cultural problem. People are bombarded from childhood with sound health advice, which most simply choose to ignore or defy. Obesity is by definition non-compliance with health and medical advice. Why would we try to "treat" anyone who willfully defies health and medical advice?

Agreed... For some who are 80, 100 pounds overweight, it can become a medical problem.

<rant>

IMO, Most people don't want to deal with the realities of being an animal. You can't stuff your face whenever you feel like it and not have some kind of consequence. Overeating is just like any other self-gratification behavior. Some aren't harmful (ye old rub and squirt for instance) but most are. Sure some people are naturally thin, but no one is healthy that eats poorly all the time.

Also, I think almost everyone needs more exercise. It's not a matter of finding time, it's a matter of making time. People are animals, not some kind of machine. We have bodies, even if we don't care to use them except as a vessel for our brains.

Until we can extract our brains and live in a jar or some kind of machine body, I think we're gonna have to figure out how to keep ourselves healthy. It may not be fun but it's necessary.

</rant>
 

Wuffsunie

Platinum Member
May 4, 2002
2,808
0
0
I'm still waiting for the new fad diet of getting a tape worm implanted to come around. Definetly an effective way of going about it, though not the most healthy. Then again, that can be said for all other forms of extreme dieting.
 

AEnigmaWI

Senior member
Jan 21, 2004
427
0
0
Originally posted by: Wuffsunie
I'm still waiting for the new fad diet of getting a tape worm implanted to come around. Definetly an effective way of going about it, though not the most healthy. Then again, that can be said for all other forms of extreme dieting.

It has totally happened already! Back in the day you could buy it in a drugstore, at least so someone told me once. (might be urban legend) Also, ya know it might actually work and not harm you if you took enough vitamin supplements. Of course there is that 3 foot long worm in your intestine... better than round worms tho.
Those are just shnasty.
 

virtuamike

Diamond Member
Oct 13, 2000
7,845
13
81
Originally posted by: Chaotic42
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Just install mirrored door on all Restaruants and Public Buildings.
With me they'd all crack and I'd have 10^459 years of bad luck.

Do it like Leno. Mirror on your fridge, so you can see how fat you are when you get the munchies.
 

skace

Lifer
Jan 23, 2001
14,488
7
81
I agree 120% that doctors should consider obesity a disease. A doctor shouldn't see a fatman and think of it as cosmetics. He should be generally concerned with your well being. I don't agree with the approach of getting pills and more pills to treat it. That is completely wrong. How about the FDA revise their retarded pyramid and work on the health information on foods.