Immigration, Explained with Gumballs

[Chiropteran]

That was exactly my thought upon viewing the video. I had never heard of this argument that allowing immigration reduces global poverty. Then I googled it.

https://openborders.info/end-of-poverty/

I think it's a pretty unusual position, given that there are only a few scattered examples. It's more accurate to say that he going to a lot of trouble to argue against a fringe position.

Fringe, lol. It was Hillary's position.

 

[woolfe9998]

Fringe, lol. It was Hillary's position.

Link to Hilary claiming that open borders will decrease global poverty please.

 

[Meghan54]

Link to Hilary claiming that open borders will decrease global poverty please.

She didn't and chippy will be glad to provide evidence of same, just as soon as Brietbart/Infowars supplies him with the "proper" talking points designed to obfuscate and divert.

 

[woolfe9998]

She didn't and chippy will be glad to provide evidence of same, just as soon as Brietbart/Infowars supplies him with the "proper" talking points designed to obfuscate and divert.

Oh I know she didn't, because I know what he's actually referring to. It's an excerpt from a speech to a Brazilian bank (which comes from the hacked Podesta e-mails) in which she mentioned "open borders" in a context that sounds a lot like she was referring to trade.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...ive-been-proven-right-about-clinton-wanting-/

It's become a favorite right wing anti-Clinton talking point.

But that is irrelevant because even if she really did advocate open borders for immigration, it isn't what I was referring to as a "fringe" position. What I was referring to was the argument that liberalizing immigration policy will reduce global poverty. I referred to it as fringe because it's hard to find anyone making the argument. And it is, after all, the argument that his video is trying to debunk. Obviously it is not something Clinton has ever said.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

The vast amount of immigrants coming in are actually better educated than the general U.S. population, so it's not a humanitarian argument to start with, as the U.S. doesn't take that many refugees. Most people come in either for work or via family reunification. You could argue high immigration levels is depressing wage levels, particularly in STEM fields, but the rules of the game in America is whoever has money gets to lobby Congress over immigration. So better start saving those pennies and start your own PAC!

Immigration = cheap labor = good fucking luck lobbying against cheap labor. Liberal or republican, you won't be able to lobby against those kinds of dollars. Because regardless of political party, if you're rich you're in favor of cheap labor.

 

[greatnoob]

Immigration = cheap labor = good fucking luck lobbying against cheap labor. Liberal or republican, you won't be able to lobby against those kinds of dollars. Because regardless of political party, if you're rich you're in favor of cheap labor.

Lol simpleton logic.

Educated folk from Syria are the ones growing your economy. The increasing amount of lazy fucks in the States are not doing any good for your economy. So as far as any employer is concerned any unskilled migrant is just a substitute for a domestic lazy worker. Don't want to be paid less? Be more productive at work or shut the fuck up.

 

[MrSquished]

So we shouldn't try to to work with any part of the world's problems cause it's just too big.

It's not a logical argument. It makes no fucking sense.

Of course try to help people at their point of origin. Doesn't mean we shouldn't try other things.

This thread has the same IQ as a bowl of gumballs.

 

[brycejones]

Is the op's video what passes for intellectual discourse in conservative circles today?

No wonder we have the glorious cheeto as president.

 

[IronWing]

OP still has not offered any commentary on the video he posted.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

So we shouldn't try to to work with any part of the world's problems cause it's just too big.

It's not a logical argument. It makes no fucking sense.

Of course try to help people at their point of origin. Doesn't mean we shouldn't try other things.

This thread has the same IQ as a bowl of gumballs.

You clearly missed the point of the video. I'm not saying I agree with the OP video, but at least understand it...

His thoughts are instead of trying to help out an insignificant number of people by bringing them to the US - and often times these are the smart ones from those countries because let's be honest we don't want dirty poor stupid people lolol. So effectively what we are doing is taking away the poor countries chances of being a real civilized society, which could in fact save many more lives from the likes of starvation than simply taking their educated class and leaving the rest to rot.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

 

[thraashman]

I'm pretty sure if we just ignore Chiropteran he'll slither back into his feces filled hole from which he congealed.

 

[Blue_Max]

Thanks for the summary. Now I don't have to give this moran an extra view.

You should watch the video, the speaker is not a moron with an agenda. He wants to help people. Isn't that right up your alley?

 

[1prophet]

The vast amount of immigrants coming in are actually better educated than the general U.S. population, so it's not a humanitarian argument to start with, as the U.S. doesn't take that many refugees. Most people come in either for work or via family reunification. You could argue high immigration levels is depressing wage levels, particularly in STEM fields, but the rules of the game in America is whoever has money gets to lobby Congress over immigration. So better start saving those pennies and start your own PAC!

Then don't complain when big business, corporations,special interests, etc. use those same rules to lobby congress to remove environmental rules, women's right to choose, free trade agreements, diminish labor and safety laws, etc.,after all they are just following the rules of the game.

and if you don't like it start saving your pennies and start your own PAC.

But if we had congressmen and senators with spines they wouldn't need lobbyists money to prop up their jellyfish like bodies while padding their bank accounts, perhaps then they would do what is best for the country and not just their wallets.

 

[hal2kilo]

Fringe, lol. It was Hillary's position.

Troll, troll, troll your boat........

 

[Moonbeam]

Troll, troll, troll your boat........

I think he may have abandoned this thread after exposing thinking so absurd that even he began to see it, I don't think he wanted to be around when somebody points out after saying to Amused:

"Sorry dude, the guy who made the video doesn't read this forum, your message was posted in the wrong place."

Even a two year old would have known that Amused wasn't trying to tell the guy in the video he was engaging in a 'straw man', that he was telling the C man he had fallen for a straw man argument and put his comment right where it belonged. I think our poor man at sea knew just how stupid you'd have to be not to C that. The ejaculations of our dear C man appear to be semen that aren't very fecund.

 

[zinfamous]

I wanna know who keeps stocking lake ATP&N with all of these trout.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

This is a perfect example of a textbook strawman argument.

He pretends that there are people arguing that poverty can be solved by having all the poor people come to the U.S. Absolutely no one is making that argument.

It's actually quite pathetic in how intellectually dishonest it is.

I like pizza and the best I have had is from a coal fired oven. Pizza is the bigliest food as we all know and so the perfection of The Food of the Gods includes securing the future of coal.

Therefore Trump supports coal to get delicious tomato pie goodness. Everyone know this.

Don't believe me? Let me get my pepperoni slices out and I'll make a YT video.

 

[Moonbeam]

You should watch the video, the speaker is not a moron with an agenda. He wants to help people. Isn't that right up your alley?

You can't say he did not have an agenda. He claimed that his purpose was good but he used a totally deceptive argument to make his case at a time in our history as a nation immigration has become a hot political issue and the conservative right is trying to leverage the increasing insecurity of the American people over their economic future to gin up internal division and mistrust for political purposes, creating a other, the immigrant as the proper focus of their hate rather than on the wealthy who are the ones destroying the country for their personal benefit. Furthermore, if we were to accept his argument then all of the people who are American citizens except Native Americans should go back home where they can help their own people get ahead. Conservative so easily divide themselves off as special people different than the other, they forget they are the other. I know as a person interested in the good that you would not want to be like that.

 

[Blue_Max]

You clearly missed the point of the video. I'm not saying I agree with the OP video, but at least understand it...

His thoughts are instead of trying to help out an insignificant number of people by bringing them to the US - and often times these are the smart ones from those countries because let's be honest we don't want dirty poor stupid people lolol. So effectively what we are doing is taking away the poor countries chances of being a real civilized society, which could in fact save many more lives from the likes of starvation than simply taking their educated class and leaving the rest to rot.

AND that our money is 100x more effective in helping them WHERE THEY ARE, rather than bringing them here.
The negatives of bringing people over instead of helping them at home have already been mentioned around here, I shouldn't need to repeat them.

 

[Moonbeam]

I like pizza and the best I have had is from a coal fired oven. Pizza is the bigliest food as we all know and so the perfection of The Food of the Gods includes securing the future of coal.

Therefore Trump supports coal to get delicious tomato pie goodness. Everyone know this.

Don't believe me? Let me get my pepperoni slices out and I'll make a YT video.

Please don't. You'll cause a coal fired revolution and half the nation will be singing,'When the moon hits your eye like a big pizza pie it's amore.......... ' Let the liberals lick their lips and keep their wood fired bricks, 'cause a real man's hardened dick comes from coal fired.

 

[Amused]

AND that our money is 100x more effective in helping them WHERE THEY ARE, rather than bringing them here.
The negatives of bringing people over instead of helping them at home have already been mentioned around here, I shouldn't need to repeat them.

Beside the fact that he's making a strawman argument, his logic is unsound. Were it sound the entirety of Europe would be a third world nation as the great migrations west into the Americas took with them Europe's most innovative and productive. And yet, Europe survived, nay, thrived.

Contrived argument debunked.

Meanwhile, Roy Beck is an anti-immigration activist who leads a think tank specializing in stopping nasty brown people from coming into the US. He's anti-immigration in a nation literally populated with immigrants. (irony meter explodes) His org "NumbersUSA", and co founder John Tanton (who has direct ties with white nationalists and Nazi groups) has been listed as a hate group. He's the new "kinder gentler" generation of racists dressing up their racism and xenophobia with pseudoscience and pseudo-intellectual drivel leaving out the blatant racist overtones of his predecessors.

FAIR, CIS and NumbersUSA are all part of a network of restrictionist organizations conceived and created by John Tanton, the “puppeteer” of the nativist movement and a man with deep racist roots. As the first article in this report shows, Tanton has for decades been at the heart of the white nationalist scene. He has met with leading white supremacists and associated closely with the leaders of a eugenicist foundation once described by a leading newspaper as a “neo-Nazi organization.” He has made a series of racist statements about Latinos and worried that they were outbreeding whites. At one point, he wrote candidly that to maintain American culture, “a European-American majority” is required.​

Learn when to see bias.

 

[soulcougher73]

All i saw from that video was a lot of potential untapped Soylent Green....

 

[Blue_Max]

Beside the fact that he's making a strawman argument, his logic is unsound. Were it sound the entirety of Europe would be a third world nation as the great migrations west into the Americas took with them Europe's most innovative and productive. And yet, Europe survived, nay, thrived.

Contrived argument debunked.

You call that short hypothetical a debunking?!? *sigh* moving on...

Learn when to see bias.

Good advice!

nasty brown people
white nationalists
Nazi groups
hate group
racists dressing up their racism and xenophobia with pseudoscience and pseudo-intellectual drivel

Bias found!

 

[zinfamous]

But people are Skittles, my friend.

 

[Amused]

You call that short hypothetical a debunking?!? *sigh* moving on...



Good advice!



Bias found!

Um, in case you missed it, I didn't make that up. That's what this org NumbersUSA and FAIR are associated with.

Facts are not bias. Denying facts is bias.

And posting an anti-immigration video from known white nationalist racists is bias.

Pointing out the fact that they are, in fact, white nationalist racists? Not bias.

Nice try. But turning the argument around on me is not only a most basic logical fallacy, it's a classic Trump/Right-wing media move. You couldn't sound any more brainwashed than you do right now.

John Tanton, the Founder of NumbersUSA and FAIR is, by any definition, a racist.

In His Own Words
"I've come to the point of view that for European-American society and culture to persist requires a European-American majority, and a clear one at that."
– Dec. 10, 1993, letter to the late Garrett Hardin, a controversial ecology professor.

"I have no doubt that individual minority persons can assimilate to the culture necessary to run an advanced society but if through mass migration, the culture of the homeland is transplanted from Latin America to California, then my guess is we will see the same degree of success with governmental and social institutions that we have seen in Latin America."
– Jan. 26, 1996, letter to Roy Beck, executive director of NumbersUSA (and then an employee of Tanton's foundation U.S. Inc.).

"Do we leave it to individuals to decide that they are the intelligent ones who should have more kids? And more troublesome, what about the less intelligent, who logically should have less? Who is going to break the bad news [to less intelligent individuals], and how will it be implemented?"
– Sept. 18, 1996, letter to now-deceased California multimillionaire and eugenicist Robert K. Graham.

"I write to encourage keeping track of those on our same side of the issue, but who are nonetheless our competitors for dollars and members."
– April 20, 1998, correspondence asking several FAIR employees to ensure they receive mailings from American Renaissance, a racist, pseudo-scientific magazine focusing on race, intelligence and eugenics. (The underlining was in Tanton's original letter).

https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/extremist-files/individual/john-tanton