I'm so confused....

[deadken]

I am on vacation this week and I finally got a PCI-e Mobo to use with my S754 3000+ (@ 2.4 Ghz) and 2X 1GB OCZ 2,3,2,5. The motherboard is currently running in my sons rig with a 16MB PCI card. I am slightly concerned since I can't run my sons Sempron 3100+ @ 2250 mhz like it was before (before it was at Vcore + %3.1, now Vcore is at + %5) so I can't say that I will actually be running at 2.4Ghz. I am using a 20.1" Samsung LCD (204B) so 1600 X 1200 is a possibility (I am gaming at 1024x768 for the meanwhile).

Whew... I have been trying to catch up on the latest video cards, but one can only do so much. From what I have read, the X1950 XTX core is the same as the X1900 XTX core. It is supposed to be a 90nm core and NOT the 80nm most people seem to have expected. I have noted where the inquirer states the performance difference as %7 (how they would know that I don't know, no details were given). I don't plan on waiting for a DX10 card since my games and video card upgrades are few and far between. Typically I use a video card for about 2 years. I plan on keeping my CPU and mobo until a 64bit Windows OS is readily available (2nd Q '07?).

Got all of that? So, should I try and wait a few more weeks for the 1950? Or just get the 1900 and be happy now (it is truly an 'instant gratification' world we live in ). I should mention that the fan noise from my 6800GT is the loudest part of my system. Within two months the A/C's of the house will be turned off, and I will start hearing it again. How noisy is a X 1900XTX compared to a 6800 GT? I have seen the new cooler design on the 1950 and it is supposed to be improved, but no word on noise yet.

-Thanks in advance for any help and insight you guys can give, Ken.

1) I know my system is 'lacking' but, X1900 XTX now or X1950 XTX in the future?
2) How noisy are either of those? (I am using a 6800GT as a reference and it is loud to me).
3) Any suggestions on a quality aftermarket cooler? I have used plenty of Arctic Silencers in the past, but is the Zalman line better?

If the 1950 was available today, I wouldn't ask these questions. But, since I have the time to 'tinker' with my systems this week (I'm on vacation), I'd like to get going soon. I also assume that a X 1900XTX is leaps and bounds above my 6800GT (which never seemed to run BF2 that well).

 

[sodcha0s]

Wait and get the 1950..... better performance, better cooler, less noise.

 

[deadken]

Originally posted by: sodcha0s
Wait and get the 1950..... better performance, better cooler, less noise.

That sounds great, but any idea when? I can't find any definate answers. It seems that there is a paper launch and then a real launch with many people skeptical as to when the card will actually become readily available. Available to me means that I can drive to my local CompUSA and buy it right there. No pre-orders, no 'we'll call when we get it in', etc...

Any idea as to what the power requirements for the 1950 are? The X1900 XTX specs say in a typical system it needs a PS with 30A on the 12V rail. I have 32A (16A + 16A) and would like to know if I need to get a stronger PS before I get this card.

 

[ShadowOfMyself]

September 14

 

[Wreckage]

Originally posted by: deadken
Available to me means that I can drive to my local CompUSA and buy it right there.

That may be more up to CompUSA than ATI. If there are cards available for sale on Sept 14th, that does not mean that CompUSA will have them as they don't have a big selection to begin with and don't have the kind of high end stock that an online seller has.

If ATI paper launches on August 23rd, print out the announcement and take it to CompUSA they may already know when and if they are getting some in.

 

[Zstream]

Well you will be CPU limited IMO, this is what I would do and have done. I recently moved from a 3200+ @ 2.4ghz to a 3800+X2 @ 2.5ghz. The problem is that I cannot leave my CPU at the O/C specs because it gets to hot here in the summer and room temp is very warm.

That being said at 3200+ my x850XT was performing very well, the problem is that I recently purchased a 20 inch WS LCD. The 850 was barely performing up to part at 1680*1050. So I had to upgrade to something, I now have a 1900XT flashed to XTX speeds with an accelero II on it. This was three months ago.

So what I would do if I was going to upgrade now is to wait for the 1950 series to come out, hold off for a few and buy a 1900XT at 200$ dollar range, purchase a 20$ cooler and be happy as a birdy.

 

[deadken]

Originally posted by: WreckageIf ATI paper launches on August 23rd, print out the announcement and take it to CompUSA they may already know when and if they are getting some in.

Well put. Thanks for the suggestion. I already have a call in to the 'Front End Manager' of my local CompUSA and she is checking on it (I had called about a rebate that was denied and I asked since I had her on the phone and she has to call me back anyway).

Originally posted by: Zstream.......So what I would do if I was going to upgrade now is to wait for the 1950 series to come out, hold off for a few and buy a 1900XT at 200$ dollar range, purchase a 20$ cooler and be happy as a birdy.

Dude, you have a PM... You have confused me. You were CPU limited, so you bought a new CPU, but... The old 3200+ was with your X850XT and couldn't keep up with the new monitor, so you bought a 1900XT @ XTX speeds. So when did you get the 3800+X2?

The fact that you say "what I would do if I was going to upgrade now is to wait..." is a little less then sensible. Besides.. I have already stated that I am ready to go right now. I don't have issues with spending ~$400 now on a X1900XTX or $400 later on a X1950XTX.

When I had my Socket A Barton @ 2.3ghz I was told that my 6800GT was 'CPU limited', well I upgraded to this A64 @ 2.4ghz and it benchmarks CPU wise MUCH BETTER, but it doesn't seem to do 3D much better at all. I am hoping that with the NF4 PCI-e board I just got that I can get to 2.5 ghz (not to promising given how the Semp 3100+ doesn't do that good on this board). Most likely after first quarter of 2007 I will buy M$ Vista and get a S939 or AM2 then. I am not looking for the latest and greatest, just something better then what I have and the 6800GT in my system in over 2 years old. I am figuring that even if I 'only' get the X 1900 XTX, it will be a big jump from my 6800GT. If the 1950 is 'only' %7 faster, I wouldn't miss it.

 

[Zstream]

Originally posted by: deadken

Originally posted by: WreckageIf ATI paper launches on August 23rd, print out the announcement and take it to CompUSA they may already know when and if they are getting some in.

Well put. Thanks for the suggestion. I already have a call in to the 'Front End Manager' of my local CompUSA and she is checking on it (I had called about a rebate that was denied and I asked since I had her on the phone and she has to call me back anyway).

Originally posted by: Zstream.......So what I would do if I was going to upgrade now is to wait for the 1950 series to come out, hold off for a few and buy a 1900XT at 200$ dollar range, purchase a 20$ cooler and be happy as a birdy.

Dude, you have a PM... You have confused me. You were CPU limited, so you bought a new CPU, but... The old 3200+ was with your X850XT and couldn't keep up with the new monitor, so you bought a 1900XT @ XTX speeds. So when did you get the 3800+X2?

The fact that you say "what I would do if I was going to upgrade now is to wait..." is a little less then sensible. Besides.. I have already stated that I am ready to go right now. I don't have issues with spending ~$400 now on a X1900XTX or $400 later on a X1950XTX.

When I had my Socket A Barton @ 2.3ghz I was told that my 6800GT was 'CPU limited', well I upgraded to this A64 @ 2.4ghz and it benchmarks CPU wise MUCH BETTER, but it doesn't seem to do 3D much better at all. I am hoping that with the NF4 PCI-e board I just got that I can get to 2.5 ghz (not to promising given how the Semp 3100+ doesn't do that good on this board). Most likely after first quarter of 2007 I will buy M$ Vista and get a S939 or AM2 then. I am not looking for the latest and greatest, just something better then what I have and the 6800GT in my system in over 2 years old. I am figuring that even if I 'only' get the X 1900 XTX, it will be a big jump from my 6800GT. If the 1950 is 'only' %7 faster, I wouldn't miss it.

To make it clearer, I had a 19 inch 1280*1024 LCD with my 3200+ and my x850XT. I then purchased a 20.1 inch WS LCD and a 3800+X2 at the same time, the monitor came first. I tried running 1680*1050 with my x850XT and my 3200+ at the resolution and it performed on par with what I was expecting. No AA involved and was at 4x AF, it was dipping to 20fps with the average around 30 in most of the games I played. I then received my X2 and it increased my games by atleast 5FPS on the max and 3-4 FPS on the min. That told me I was CPU limited and now GPU limited, so I purchased a 1900XT. To see if I should have purchased the X2 I swapped the 3200+ in and the difference is huge. I receive atleast 10 more FPS with AA and AF put to 8x with the 3800+ then I did with the 3200+. So I imagine I am still CPU limited when the X2 is not overclocked.

FYI I bet you will be waiting atleast 4-5 weeks before the 1950 series arrive.

 

[deadken]

Ahhh.. Thank you. I understood much better that time.

I am kinda figuring that more then likely I will not be one of the 'lucky ones' who gets a 1950 on Sept. 14th. Even if I did that would be over 3 weeks from now. I think you are probably pretty close with 4-5 weeks.

I figure that I will get a X1900 XTX today (yes, right at CompUSA) and just use it for the next 18-24 months. In a few days or weeks (depending how much it bothers me) I will order a better cooler. If there were major differences in the core then I would hold off. I would love a 80nm core that uses less power (and generates less heat) but that isn't in the cards for now.

Thank you guys for all of your help. I will still be checking back before I go to buy the card, so feel free to update the thread. I will post back after I get the card and let you know how I made out.

 

[sodcha0s]

Just a quick note.... since your monitor has 16x12 native rez, just forget about your CPU being a bottleneck. It may be a lacking a bit, but with the 1900 or 1950 you'll easily be able to run at native rez. Also I believe the 1950's MSRP is $399 and if it's released in large quantities you may be able to find it cheaper online. I know waiting can be tough, but it looks like it might be worth it this time.

 

[santz]

and i say "hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm, interesting", and then you say "interesting what?"

 

[deadken]

Originally posted by: sodcha0s
Just a quick note.... since your monitor has 16x12 native rez, just forget about your CPU being a bottleneck. It may be a lacking a bit, but with the 1900 or 1950 you'll easily be able to run at native rez. Also I believe the 1950's MSRP is $399 and if it's released in large quantities you may be able to find it cheaper online. I know waiting can be tough, but it looks like it might be worth it this time.

I haven't heard any 'solid' info that the 1950 is that much faster then the 1900. Anyway... I went ahead and did it. I bought myself a ATI X1900 XTX and have just got it set up (problems with my new PCI-e Mobo). I just stopped in because I wanted to know which ATI software to install and what not to. IIRC, I saw someone say not to install any of the other ATI software other then the CCC, but I can't remember...

Any ATI Software suggestions? I don't need any garbage, just the ability to control fan speed etc...

BTW: Santz.... I'm not biting... Say what you want or don't but please don't thread crap.

 

[Kromis]

Later gator!

 

[deadken]

I have bought the ATI X1900 XTX and am VERY happy with it. I don't mind that the 1950 will be better, I am having a GREAT time right now.

People had said that I would be/might be CPU limited, but I have to say that with most of my settings high (including 6x AA) I am getting about 90FPS in BF2 (with a 70+ minimum according to the 'ATI Tray Tools' graph) and my CPU is back at a stock 2.0GHz. I have to admit that wasn't @ 16x12, I think it is 12x9. My CPU was @ 2.4ghz with the AGP card. When things settle down I will start O/C'ing and stress testing again to see how far I can get with this NF4 based mobo.

 

[tuteja1986]

arr sorry to tell you deadken but i think ATI X1950XTX will be listed on newegg in less than 48hrs at newegg thats rumor

 

[deadken]

Thanks, but that wouldn't have helped me anyway. First off, I am a firm believer in reality. Until I see it, I am skeptical (sometimes I am even skeptical after I see it!). Also, I had a $400 credit that could only be used at CompUSA. Since I wanted a new Video Card, that was just as good of a place as anywhere for now (I am sure some will discount it soon, but I doubt too soon...).

Thanks for the info. I am not upset. Quite the contrary... I am gonna fire up some BF2 right now and 'blow away' some stress.

BTW: For some reason, the first time that I set the AA @ 6x it didn't take. I reset it and it seems to be working fine now.

 

[jiffylube1024]

Honestly, I'd save myself a bit of dough and get the regular X1900XT 512MB. Barely slower than the X1900XTX, and you don't pay the premium. Save the rest of the money for a motherboard and CPU upgrade in the next 12 months. Then, when the time is right (it could be now), sell your CPU/mobo combo and spring for a good combo, like a DFI Socket 939 board and a cheap X2, like the 3800+.

No need to buy the absolute best of the best -- with a whole system upgrade and value-minded components, you can have your cake and eat it too (especially with some easy CPU overclocking ).

 

[Munky]

I would also rather get the x1900xt 512mb. It's priced very competitively, and not much slower than the x1900xtx or even the x1950xtx.

 

[deadken]

Thanks for the suggestions. I agree with you, but the CompUSA's in my area didn't have any X1900 XT's around. I actually had to drive to a CompUSA about a half hour away to get an X1900 XTX, no other local stores had them. If I could have spent less money on an X1900 XTX and kept a portion of the store credit I would have. There is always something to spend it on there! Right now, going from a 6800GT (@Ultra speeds) with a CPU @ 2.4ghz to a X1900 XTX with the CPU @ 2.0 ghz (stock) has been a night-and-day experience.

 

[Vesper8]

get a x1900xtx

you can have it by the end of the week with express shipping.. and the noise/cooling factor is easily fixed with a 20$ purchase (accelero x2)

with the accelero my x1900xtx runs VERY cool at all times with the fan always running at 100%. It idles at 44 degrees and the highest i've seen it go up to under stress is 68 degrees !!! that's like 20 degrees less than stock cooler

and it's 100% silent.. i swear no exageration whatsoever.. you can't detect it at all at 100% speed

the ati brand one is incredibly cheap at the moment.. almost makes me weep that i spent 650$ CDN 3 months ago and now the ati brand one is retailing for 470$ ! (CDN again)

 

[jm20]

Originally posted by: Vesper8
the ati brand one is incredibly cheap at the moment.. almost makes me weep that i spent 650$ CDN 3 months ago and now the ati brand one is retailing for 470$ ! (CDN again)

BBA x1900XTX Retail $440

 

[Pabster]

Bah, if you're going high-end and all-out, may as well spring for the X1950XTX. The improved (and spiffy looking) cooling solution is worth the extra $50 alone, IMHO. There will be little point in going with the X1900XTX unless the price drops SIGNIFICANTLY, which isn't likely to happen in the short term. (And then you have to factor in the cost of aftermarket cooling for it.)

 

[sodcha0s]

(And then you have to factor in the cost of aftermarket cooling for it.)

Completely untrue. Seems everybody here is brainwashed into believing the stock cooler is insuffecient. The stock cooling, while maybe not the best design-wise, does an acceptable job cooling the card, and contrary to popular belief isn't that loud, below 60-70% speed anyway. My cooler NEVER spins that high.

 

[Pabster]

Originally posted by: sodcha0s
Completely untrue. Seems everybody here is brainwashed into believing the stock cooler is insuffecient. The stock cooling, while maybe not the best design-wise, does an acceptable job cooling the card, and contrary to popular belief isn't that loud, below 60-70% speed anyway. My cooler NEVER spins that high.

Baloney. I've had a pair of X1900XTX and THEY ARE LOUD. Ridiculous loud. It's an absolute necessity to mount an aftermarket solution, unless you like the sound of a 747 by your side.

It looks like X1950XTX has addressed the problem. We'll find out.

 

[RussianSensation]

I know you want to keep your card for 2 years.

But I will always recommend something like X1900XT 256mb for $279 on sept 14, and then another $250-300 card in 1 year. Buying a barely faster X1950XTX for $449 compared to a 60% cheaper card with very similar performance doesn't sound like good value.

Look at X850XT right now and it costs about $120 (2 year old top of the line ati card). The performance for X800xt, x850xt and x850xt pe is about the same. In 2 years your top of the line X1950XTX card will cost $120 as well. So you'll lose $300+ on it. If you get X1900xt 256 for example you'll get 80% of the performance for 60% less and you can prob sell it 1 year for say $140. So your total cost of ownership will be:

Scenario 1:

X1900xt 256mb = buy for $280 sell for $140 in 2007 = lost $140
R600 or G80 in 2007 until 2008 = lost $280
Sell G80/R600 for $140 at end of 2008 = gained $140
total cost: $280

Scenario 2:
buy X1950XTX in 2006 = lose $440
sell for $120 in 2008 = gain $120
total cost: $320

The prices are all approximations (say even if they are the same), for 1 full year (2nd year) you'll be getting 2x the performance of X1950XTX. While X1950xtx and X1900xt 256mb will both be comparably slow just like 9800pro and xt, x850xt and x800xt and 6800gt and ultra become slow over time (all blend in and produce 20-25 framerates making no difference because they are simply become "equally" slow at games 2 years after introduction)

Repeat with G80, etc. Top of the line probably only makes sense if you can afford it.

my 2 cents.