I'm frustrated

[FoBoT]

what about the contract you both signed

 

[manlymatt83]

Originally posted by: FoBoT
what about the contract you both signed

There was no contract

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: mjuszczak

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: mjuszczak

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: mjuszczak

Originally posted by: compman25
Remind me to never hire you.

You guys have absolutely no clue how right I am and how wrong this guy is. Many who I have told in person, including well-established business men, think the guy is loony, and they've actually been near me during some or all of my exchanges with this person.

here is what we know.

"We verbally agree to try to get the project done last weekend (the 21st)"

"Last week; however, things were falling apart at work, and I had to cancel on him in a few times"



you agreed to do a job. you even agreed on a rough timline (21st). now you want to bail out?

i have to agree with compman.

i would be pissed if i was your client. you agreed to do a job and now trying to get out of it.

nor very proffesional.

No. You've got it wrong. You need the whole sentence.

"We verbally agree to try to get the project done last weekend (the 21st) but something comes up, mutually understood by both parties. "

The requirements for the project changed. He made me think the project was easier than it was. He even agreed that the project couldn't be finished in one weekend, and we MUTUALLY understood that something had "come up" with the project requiring it to take longer. This had nothing to do with my schedule.

I don't usually work during the week. But I was giving him a major discount, AND offered to do work for him during the week so we didn't have to wait till weekends to do the work. He was happy about that, and then got pissed when my weekday plans were falling through - I was stuck at my full time job, and he fully knew that, and knew that was the reason that I didn't do work during the week.

and you canceled on him a few times

either way if you didn't want to do you should never have accepted it. you fucked up and are now looking for a excuse to cancel.

how much you took for hte job means NOTHING. you agreed to do the job and are not that is what matters.

Its unfortunate that you still don't get it.

He SUGGESTED to pull out, and I offered him the option to cancel if that's what he wished to do. I even told him that I wouldn't even charge him anything for the work I had done.

You guys are all on the wrong page here. I haven't fucked up at all, not in the slightest.

where in the OP do you say HE SUGGESTED to pull out? i see you offering to cancel and you say he gets pissed.

and how nice of you to not charge him since you refuse to do the work you said you would.

as others said. I sure in the hell would not hire you.

 

[manlymatt83]

Originally posted by: Tizyler
What's funny is that this is *your* side of the story, the side that makes you sound as good as possible.

If this is your side, his version must be a nightmare.

I'd be glad to PM you his email(s) to me if you'd like. I think they will support my side of the story. I have no problem sending them to you.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: Tizyler
What's funny is that this is *your* side of the story, the side that makes you sound as good as possible.

If this is your side, his version must be a nightmare.

actually even his side makes him sound bad. he agreed for a job. tried to cancel a few times when he sees it takes more then he thought.


but yeah i would love to hear the other side.

 

[manlymatt83]

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: mjuszczak

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: mjuszczak

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: mjuszczak

Originally posted by: compman25
Remind me to never hire you.

You guys have absolutely no clue how right I am and how wrong this guy is. Many who I have told in person, including well-established business men, think the guy is loony, and they've actually been near me during some or all of my exchanges with this person.

here is what we know.

"We verbally agree to try to get the project done last weekend (the 21st)"

"Last week; however, things were falling apart at work, and I had to cancel on him in a few times"



you agreed to do a job. you even agreed on a rough timline (21st). now you want to bail out?

i have to agree with compman.

i would be pissed if i was your client. you agreed to do a job and now trying to get out of it.

nor very proffesional.

No. You've got it wrong. You need the whole sentence.

"We verbally agree to try to get the project done last weekend (the 21st) but something comes up, mutually understood by both parties. "

The requirements for the project changed. He made me think the project was easier than it was. He even agreed that the project couldn't be finished in one weekend, and we MUTUALLY understood that something had "come up" with the project requiring it to take longer. This had nothing to do with my schedule.

I don't usually work during the week. But I was giving him a major discount, AND offered to do work for him during the week so we didn't have to wait till weekends to do the work. He was happy about that, and then got pissed when my weekday plans were falling through - I was stuck at my full time job, and he fully knew that, and knew that was the reason that I didn't do work during the week.

and you canceled on him a few times

either way if you didn't want to do you should never have accepted it. you fucked up and are now looking for a excuse to cancel.

how much you took for hte job means NOTHING. you agreed to do the job and are not that is what matters.

Its unfortunate that you still don't get it.

He SUGGESTED to pull out, and I offered him the option to cancel if that's what he wished to do. I even told him that I wouldn't even charge him anything for the work I had done.

You guys are all on the wrong page here. I haven't fucked up at all, not in the slightest.

where in the OP do you say HE SUGGESTED to pull out? i see you offering to cancel and you say he gets pissed.

and how nice of you to not charge him since you refuse to do the work you said you would.

as others said. I sure in the hell would not hire you.

Are you crazy? I wouldn't consider WORKING for you. You STILL don't get it.

I have done well over 20 hours of work. The original estimate was 10 hours. The project turned into 40-50 hours, because of HIS FAULT for NOT DISCLOSING how bad things were with the old server.

The project was to take the old server out of commission and move things to the new server. Simple, if he his DESCRIPTION of the OLD SERVER was correct to begin with. It was not, and he admits that.

I feel very bad for your employees if you would still expect them to sit back and accept all of these fallacies. My god. I feel so bad for them.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: mjuszczak
Are you crazy? I wouldn't consider WORKING for you. You STILL don't get it.

I have done well over 20 hours of work. The original estimate was 10 hours. The project turned into 40-50 hours, because of HIS FAULT for NOT DISCLOSING how bad things were with the old server.

The project was to take the old server out of commission and move things to the new server. Simple, if he his DESCRIPTION of the OLD SERVER was correct to begin with. It was not, and he admits that.

I feel very bad for your employees if you would still expect them to sit back and accept all of these fallacies. My god. I feel so bad for them.

YOU AGREED to do something for a price. how bad the server is does not matter.

you should have got and looked at what needed to be done before agreeing to price and the job.

you did not. but you still have a job to do and refuse to do it.

IF one of my employees agreed to do a job without all the facts we would finish said job. why? WE AGREED TO DO IT.

part of your job is to make sure you have all the information. you didn't. bet you next time you will damn well make sure you have all ifnormation though heh.



but since no contract. tell him to fuck off. don't take no money and don't give him any work. He can sue..but doubtfull.

but a very unproffesional situation all around.

 

[manlymatt83]

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: Tizyler
What's funny is that this is *your* side of the story, the side that makes you sound as good as possible.

If this is your side, his version must be a nightmare.

actually even his side makes him sound bad. he agreed for a job. tried to cancel a few times when he sees it takes more then he thought.


but yeah i would love to hear the other side.

OK. I should edit the OP. I didn't really think this one fact was that big of a deal, but obviously it is.

In the OP, you see #1 as "canceling the job". HE ASKED ME FOR OPTIONS, and I gave them to him. This was his original suggestion, so I added it to the list. I thought this was a GOOD THING, which is why I didn't add anymore details.

Surely, he's getting a discounted rate, and the project is taking longer than it should, and he's not happy, and the job was no longer worth it to me, so I offered to finish it, OR I'd be happy to not finish it and not charge him for the work I've already done. HE MADE this suggestion, so if its a "shameful" thing to do, or a "bad idea", he shouldn't have brought it up.

And I have never tried to "cancel" the job. Never have I said I don't want to do the work. And never have I said I would do the work if he paid me more. I agreed to do the job, even though its going to take twice as long, I was ALREADY giving him a discount, and I don't work during the week but agreed that I would TRY to do it anyway.

I have about 15 - 20 side jobs at any given time, and ALL of them would give me EXCELLENT recommendations. I have never had one complaint.

 

[manlymatt83]

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: mjuszczak
Are you crazy? I wouldn't consider WORKING for you. You STILL don't get it.

I have done well over 20 hours of work. The original estimate was 10 hours. The project turned into 40-50 hours, because of HIS FAULT for NOT DISCLOSING how bad things were with the old server.

The project was to take the old server out of commission and move things to the new server. Simple, if he his DESCRIPTION of the OLD SERVER was correct to begin with. It was not, and he admits that.

I feel very bad for your employees if you would still expect them to sit back and accept all of these fallacies. My god. I feel so bad for them.

YOU AGREED to do something for a price. how bad the server is does not matter.

you should have got and looked at what needed to be done before agreeing to price and the job.

you did not. but you still have a job to do and refuse to do it.

IF one of my employees agreed to do a job without all the facts we would finish said job. why? WE AGREED TO DO IT.

part of your job is to make sure you have all the information. you didn't. bet you next time you will damn well make sure you have all ifnormation though heh.



but since no contract. tell him to fuck off. don't take no money and don't give him any work. He can sue..but doubtfull.

but a very unproffesional situation all around.

Oh I did check out the server. Its just that what he wanted moved has changed.

Tell ya what. Quote me for a job in whatever field you do and I'll set the minimal amount of requirements. Then, once we agree to do the job, I'll ask for 10 times more work for the same price. If you do it, then I will bow down to you and admit you were right and I was wrong. Deal? Good. I'm glad.

I'm done arguing. I've got people in real life who have been here since this started supporting me. There's no need for this.

 

[slsmnaz]

Originally posted by: mjuszczak

I'm done arguing. I've got people in real life who have been here since this started supporting me. There's no need for this.

and it always ends this way too. These threads are just too predictable.

 

[MrChad]

Originally posted by: mjuszczak
Tell ya what. Quote me for a job in whatever field you do and I'll set the minimal amount of requirements. Then, once we agree to do the job, I'll ask for 10 times more work for the same price. If you do it, then I will bow down to you and admit you were right and I was wrong. Deal? Good. I'm glad.

:laugh: Sounds like my customers.

Requirements change all the time. That's why it's important to write them down and agree upon what SPECIFICALLY will be done to satisfy the contract. Even if you're working informally, you should have some kind of document outlining the specific tasks you are performing. Sometimes just an email will suffice. Anything above and beyond that requires renegotiation of the terms.

If you did document these requirements, he changed them and you blindly agreed to do the extra work, shame on you.

If you did not document these requirements, shame on you again.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: mjuszczak

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: mjuszczak
Are you crazy? I wouldn't consider WORKING for you. You STILL don't get it.

I have done well over 20 hours of work. The original estimate was 10 hours. The project turned into 40-50 hours, because of HIS FAULT for NOT DISCLOSING how bad things were with the old server.

The project was to take the old server out of commission and move things to the new server. Simple, if he his DESCRIPTION of the OLD SERVER was correct to begin with. It was not, and he admits that.

I feel very bad for your employees if you would still expect them to sit back and accept all of these fallacies. My god. I feel so bad for them.

YOU AGREED to do something for a price. how bad the server is does not matter.

you should have got and looked at what needed to be done before agreeing to price and the job.

you did not. but you still have a job to do and refuse to do it.

IF one of my employees agreed to do a job without all the facts we would finish said job. why? WE AGREED TO DO IT.

part of your job is to make sure you have all the information. you didn't. bet you next time you will damn well make sure you have all ifnormation though heh.



but since no contract. tell him to fuck off. don't take no money and don't give him any work. He can sue..but doubtfull.

but a very unproffesional situation all around.

Oh I did check out the server. Its just that what he wanted moved has changed.

Tell ya what. Quote me for a job in whatever field you do and I'll set the minimal amount of requirements. Then, once we agree to do the job, I'll ask for 10 times more work for the same price. If you do it, then I will bow down to you and admit you were right and I was wrong. Deal? Good. I'm glad.

I'm done arguing. I've got people in real life who have been here since this started supporting me. There's no need for this.

thats why you write down what needs to be done. if they keep adding stuff you either refuse or add on the price. you agreed to do the extra work.

it all comes back to you.

 

[Fullmetal Chocobo]

I'm frustrated too. I haven't slept in two days because when I went to get a refill on my prescription (Ambien CR), I was told I needed prior authorization. The doctors office said that the nurse was the only person that can do the paperwork and she "will get to it when she can".

 

[moshquerade]

Originally posted by: Fullmetal Chocobo
I'm frustrated too. I haven't slept in two days because when I went to get a refill on my prescription (Ambien CR), I was told I needed prior authorization. The doctors office said that the nurse was the only person that can do the paperwork and she "will get to it when she can".

that's just ridiculous. time to find a new doctor.

 

[Fullmetal Chocobo]

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: Fullmetal Chocobo
I'm frustrated too. I haven't slept in two days because when I went to get a refill on my prescription (Ambien CR), I was told I needed prior authorization. The doctors office said that the nurse was the only person that can do the paperwork and she "will get to it when she can".

that's just ridiculous. time to find a new doctor.

I'm tired of civilian medical stuff in general. I already put my paperwork for all of my medical stuff to be done by the VA (Veteran's Affairs). I'll be doing everything through them from this point on. I just don't understand it though. This much work to get a prescription for something that I have disability in.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Why hello thar Frustrated, my name is Jules!

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: mjuszczak

Originally posted by: Turin39789
You made a business obligation. You're a week late. Fin.

But the lateness is not my fault, and we never agreed on an "official" end date. It was a "Lets try to get this done this weekend" thing, which fell through mutually agreed upon by both parties because of problems we ran into.

Well it sure as hell isn't his fault. I'd be majorly pissed at you too if you agreed to do something and then you spend all your time trying to weasel out of it. You agreed to do this so finish it up and be done with it.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: Fullmetal Chocobo

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: Fullmetal Chocobo
I'm frustrated too. I haven't slept in two days because when I went to get a refill on my prescription (Ambien CR), I was told I needed prior authorization. The doctors office said that the nurse was the only person that can do the paperwork and she "will get to it when she can".

that's just ridiculous. time to find a new doctor.

I'm tired of civilian medical stuff in general. I already put my paperwork for all of my medical stuff to be done by the VA (Veteran's Affairs). I'll be doing everything through them from this point on. I just don't understand it though. This much work to get a prescription for something that I have disability in.

from what i have seen from the VA its not much better.


why you are havinga problem is amazing. i have only seen such BS with narcotic pain pills. i would be pissed off myself.

 

[yllus]

You really need to learn a few things about doing contract work.

1) Your e-mail to the guy that you quoted was extremely unprofessional. Your tone should always remain reasonable and professional, and correspondence should certainly not begin with what your "final offer" is. Nor should the first option in a list of options be to drop the project.

2) Being paid less than what you're used to isn't an excuse to be tardy or loose with the definitions of the project. The standard contract I put to prospective clients includes a set-in-stone list of requirements for the project and X number of revisions before I start to charge more money. I hammer my clients over the head with warnings that changes in the requirements mean more time and more money spent.

3) Don't agree to work when you are unsure about the time commitment you can offer. The money is always tempting, but the negatives are a loss of reputation and potential legal proceedings. If you're determined to go ahead anyways, sign off on the number of hours a week you can spend on the project. Get that written in the contract.

4) Clients are always a pain in the ass. It's part of a contractor's job to deal with people who think their money should go further than it actually does, and give you completely different requirements than the ones they actually want. You are supposed to factor this into the quote you give them.

I fully support your right to bitch about a client, but not when so much of it is a result of your lack of foresight.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: yllus
You really need to learn a few things about doing contract work.

1) Your e-mail to the guy that you quoted was extremely unprofessional. Your tone should always remain reasonable and professional, and correspondence should certainly not begin with what your "final offer" is. Nor should the first option in a list of options be to drop the project.

2) Being paid less than what you're used to isn't an excuse to be tardy or loose with the definitions of the project. The standard contract I put to prospective clients includes a set-in-stone list of requirements for the project and X number of revisions before I start to charge more money. I hammer my clients over the head with warnings that changes in the requirements mean more time and more money spent.

3) Don't agree to work when you are unsure about the time commitment you can offer. The money is always tempting, but the negatives are a loss of reputation and potential legal proceedings. If you're determined to go ahead anyways, sign off on the number of hours a week you can spend on the project. Get that written in the contract.

4) Clients are always a pain in the ass. It's part of a contractor's job to deal with people who think their money should go further than it actually does, and give you completely different requirements than the ones they actually want. You are supposed to factor this into the quote you give them.

I fully support your right to bitch about a client, but not when so much of it is a result of your lack of foresight.

QFMFT!!! :thumbsup:

 

[hanoverphist]

Originally posted by: mjuszczak

Originally posted by: FoBoT
what about the contract you both signed

There was no contract

biggest mistake you made is right here. once you quote work and agree on terms, changes to the original design and time extensions are handled well and very clearly. you can change order the extra time and expense, or decide to waive them. but for the love of pizza, draw up a standard contract, if only to protect your ass from people like that.

 

[hanoverphist]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: yllus
You really need to learn a few things about doing contract work.

1) Your e-mail to the guy that you quoted was extremely unprofessional. Your tone should always remain reasonable and professional, and correspondence should certainly not begin with what your "final offer" is. Nor should the first option in a list of options be to drop the project.

2) Being paid less than what you're used to isn't an excuse to be tardy or loose with the definitions of the project. The standard contract I put to prospective clients includes a set-in-stone list of requirements for the project and X number of revisions before I start to charge more money. I hammer my clients over the head with warnings that changes in the requirements mean more time and more money spent.

3) Don't agree to work when you are unsure about the time commitment you can offer. The money is always tempting, but the negatives are a loss of reputation and potential legal proceedings. If you're determined to go ahead anyways, sign off on the number of hours a week you can spend on the project. Get that written in the contract.

4) Clients are always a pain in the ass. It's part of a contractor's job to deal with people who think their money should go further than it actually does, and give you completely different requirements than the ones they actually want. You are supposed to factor this into the quote you give them.

I fully support your right to bitch about a client, but not when so much of it is a result of your lack of foresight.

QFMFT!!! :thumbsup:

w3rd. truthful to the max in there. my fave line when customers ask for changes is "hmmm ill have to check and see if that was in the original scope..." they know its not just like i do, and know they will pay T&M for it. i love T&M.

 

[DarkThinker]

Originally posted by: dreadpiratedoug

Originally posted by: DarkThinker

Originally posted by: MmmSkyscraper

Originally posted by: mjuszczak
I met a guy in Chicago two weeks ago...

I thought this thread was going places when I read that.

Your frustrations are well understood, go here it will go your way, all the way, everyday, always!

Man, I freakin went there at work ... remind me to never hire you.

My deepest apologies, I should have slapped an NSFW on that sucker...it's easy to forget that others neff from their work's connection while Mr Thinker here is neffing at work through his cell's connection unmonitored like WILD MOTHA HUGGA! T-Mobile got NO thang on me!

Besides, why are you looking at it in a bad way? it's good business these days from what I hear, don't ya know? If you were to get fired for it, you could sue their rectums for bajillions and live the good life:

- For appearances sake though you will have to go out to gay bars every now and then,
- But you don't need to have a boyfriend,
- Though you will need to keep leather pants on in the house in addition to some other "peripherals" lying around in your room just in case of a sudden inspection by the court!
-But who cares? Gerbels are loads of fun to have inside.......but sometimes they are hard to get in because it gets too hot and moist in there, that's easily solved by allowing them to go down to the basement when need be, capisca?

Though I am straight but I keep visiting gay pages all the time at work, just in hope that one day God is smiling down on me and someone fires me for it, early retirement here I come!
IMHO it's a much better option than broiling your gentiles with hot piping coffee!

Have a Good One Sir

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: DarkThinker

Originally posted by: dreadpiratedoug

Originally posted by: DarkThinker

Originally posted by: MmmSkyscraper

Originally posted by: mjuszczak
I met a guy in Chicago two weeks ago...

I thought this thread was going places when I read that.

Your frustrations are well understood, go here it will go your way, all the way, everyday, always!

Man, I freakin went there at work ... remind me to never hire you.

My deepest apologies, I should have slapped an NSFW on that sucker...it's easy to forget that others neff from their work's connection while Mr Thinker here is neffing at work through his cell's connection unmonitored like WILD MOTHA HUGGA! T-Mobile got NO thang on me!

Besides, why are you looking at it in a bad way? it's good business these days from what I hear, don't ya know? If you were to get fired for it, you could sue their rectums for bajillions and live the good life:

- For appearances sake though you will have to go out to gay bars every now and then,
- But you don't need to have a boyfriend,
- Though you will need to keep leather pants on in the house in addition to some other "peripherals" lying around in your room just in case of a sudden inspection by the court!
-But who cares? Gerbels are loads of fun to have inside.......but sometimes they are hard to get in because it gets too hot and moist in there, that's easily solved by allowing them to go down to the basement when need be, capisca?

Though I am straight but I keep visiting gay pages all the time at work, just in hope that one day God is smiling down on me and someone fires me for it, early retirement here I come!
IMHO it's a much better option than broiling your gentiles with hot piping coffee!

Have a Good One Sir

wow. this thread has gone sooo off track..

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: DarkThinker

IMHO it's a much better option than broiling your gentiles with hot piping coffee!

I hate it when someone broils my Gentiles.