If you were a school police officer, would you confront an active shooter with a AR-15?

[ImpulsE69]

So how will you react to a home invasion? Will you run and hide or will you confront? I’ve lived through a home invasion and I know how I reacted. I was VERY afraid but I confronted the invader with my semi-auto shotgun. Once he saw my weapon, HE fled in fear.

This is a bit different situation right? One is defense, the other is offense. A person that is invading your home is MOST likely looking to burglarize and not looking for confrontation. The situation at the school is someone going into something you are not familiar with and that person is intent on killing, not looking for your jewelry. I'm not saying they were right, but it's hard to hold it against them. It needs to definitely be looked at going forward for police training, hiring selection, but I do not think we need to condemn and concentrate on these officers.

 

[ImpulsE69]

Your argument goes the same way again - it's not things that do anything, it's just people, so why regulate anything. You honestly don't think objects enable or inspire people to do certain things in a certain manner? If not you are a fool. And why doesn't any other 1st world democratic nation have the kind of gun violence we have here? Advanced genetics? Can you answer that?

I can answer that actually, because most of those countries have less gun control than we do. Our country is a bunch of self serving unhappy woah is me cry babies. THAT is why. This should be the happiest country in the world, but look around you. It isn't. Everyone everywhere looking for something to be mad about, the littlest thing. Everyone in everyone elses business. Etc, etc. No, gun control won't solve anything, because the problem IS the population. When your population is like that, then you take the extremes, odds are, these tragedies are going to happen. It's reality. I get the whole 'we don't need AR-15' idea, and honestly...don't care one way or the other...but it isn't going to solve the REAL issue that is making everyone emotional. It's easy to blame guns as the problem, but our real problem when taken in the context of school shootings, is someone somewhere is failing our kids.

Want to ban something? Ban social media. There's been a ton of violence incited by Facebook alone. I mean, you want to ban things, why stop at guns? Ban everything that causes human interaction because it all causes people to be enraged and violent.....oh wait, some people aren't insane and know not to kill people.

 

[MrSquished]

Their violence hasn’t disappeared, it has just taken a different form.

Check the homicide rates per capita in 1st world countries. Sure they have violence, not arguing otherwise. Guns make things more lethal and final. Obviously you don't think we can do better. Fortunately some of us already KNOW we can do better here stateside.

If it's only people that cause violence and not objects that can enable, inspire and motivate, then all items should be legal and unregulated. Amirite?

 

[ImpulsE69]

Check the homicide rates per capita in 1st world countries. Sure they have violence, not arguing otherwise. Guns make things more lethal and final. Obviously you don't think we can do better. Fortunately some of us already KNOW we can do better here stateside.

If it's only people that cause violence and not objects that can enable, inspire and motivate, then all items should be legal and unregulated. Amirite?

You aren't even answering the question. You're just playing the "i'm right you're wrong' card. Give some real info and thoughts.

 

[madoka]

Check the homicide rates per capita in 1st world countries. Sure they have violence, not arguing otherwise. Guns make things more lethal and final. Obviously you don't think we can do better. Fortunately some of us already KNOW we can do better here stateside.

If it's only people that cause violence and not objects that can enable, inspire and motivate, then all items should be legal and unregulated. Amirite?

No, you're creating a straw man argument. It's not an all or nothing situation.

Now ask yourself, how much looting was there in Japan vs. Katrina. It wasn't guns that made people loot; it was people. We have a different culture/people here.

 

[balloonshark]

I think most people would like to say they would play the hero, but the reality is quite different when survival instinct kicks in. Most of us would probably be hiding scared to come out when it really came to it, trained or not. I could not say one way or the other how I would react.

I don't put a whole lot of blame on the officer, but at the same time, I think he needs to find a new career, he isn't suited for the one he's in unless he gets a desk job.

This. I can't give an honest answer as it's tough to judge someone unless you're in their shoes at the time. Also, if he was sitting there listening to gun fire and screams his hands might have been shaking so hitting any target accurately would have been impossible.

I also agree that he needs to find another line of work. Better situational training is also desperately needed.

 

[MrSquished]

No, you're creating a straw man argument. It's not an all or nothing situation.

Now ask yourself, how much looting was there in Japan vs. Katrina. It wasn't guns that made people loot; it was people.

Sure there are cultural differences along with various nuances per event that can make a big difference. I don't think regulating guns is going to create total peace and harmony in the USA.

To all people here who think it is JUST people and culture that create problems, what - IF ANY - inanimate objects should be regulated at ALL? Name three.

 

[ImpulsE69]

Sure there are cultural differences along with various nuances per event that can make a big difference. I don't think regulating guns is going to create total peace and harmony in the USA.

To all people here who think it is JUST people and culture that create problems, what - IF ANY - inanimate objects should be regulated at ALL? Name three.

The only things I think should be banned are toxins that 'we' as consumers were not told about to make a buck, like asbestos or lead, or things that wipe out the world like nuclear weapons. I would say you could ban cigarettes because they really serve no purpose other than being addictive, same with drugs, but if people want to kill themselves slowly with them, who am I to tell them not to? Otherwise I believe people are responsible for their own stupidity. Every object can be abused. That is the point here. It is up to the individual to NOT abuse it. Someone could figure out how to kill a town using a bouncy ball if they had to.

People have been mass killing long before guns, they'll be mass killing when we go to Star Wars laser guns.

It's a culture problem. Why? I don't know, but people piss me off all the time, but I've never went on a killing spree.

 

[lxskllr]

So nothing should be illegal or regulated, amirite?

We should regulate voting. Elected leaders have caused more death than domestic firearm ownership. I'm thinking only the elite class should be able to vote for national government positions. You know, large land owners, military officers, corporate CEOs... Regular people can vote for local positions after taking a civics course, and an intelligence test. They'll also be required to have a photo ID as proof of citizenship of course... That should go a long way towards preventing death.

 

[ImpulsE69]

We should regulate voting. Elected leaders have caused more death than domestic firearm ownership. I'm thinking only the elite class should be able to vote for national government positions. You know, large land owners, military officers, corporate CEOs... Regular people can vote for local positions after taking a civics course, and an intelligence test. They'll also be required to have a photo ID as proof of citizenship of course... That should go a long way towards preventing death.

I'm not really sure I could get behind only 'elite' like corporate CEO's....I mean really? They do NOT have the countries best interest in mind and many don't mind some deaths if it gives them some quick money.

 

[DietDrThunder]

I don’t feel any handgun, shotgun, or rifle, whether it be an AR-15 or AK-47, that I can use in the defense of myself, my family, or others should be regulated or restricted.

 

[BoomerD]

I don’t feel any handgun, shotgun, or rifle, whether it be an AR-15 or AK-47, that I can use in the defense of myself, my family, or others should be regulated or restricted.

OK, here’s one for you...I’m a convicted felon. My last conviction for ANYTHING more than a simple traffic infraction was more than 40 years ago. None were for violent or gun-related charges, yet, even though the State of Washington has restored all my civil rights...INCLUDING my right to own/possess firearms, the feds still say “No guns for you!”

Reasonable or no?

 

[lxskllr]

OK, here’s one for you...I’m a convicted felon. My last conviction for ANYTHING more than a simple traffic infraction was more than 40 years ago. None were for violent or gun-related charges, yet, even though the State of Washington has restored all my civil rights...INCLUDING my right to own/possess firearms, the feds still say “No guns for you!”

Reasonable or no?

No

 

[JEDIYoda]

Was there a reason this couldn't stay in P&N?

Yes -- because then you would have nothing to complain about.....

 

[soulcougher73]

Yes. I'm trained and signed on for it. I'd be scared though.

 

[lxskllr]

Yes -- because then you would have nothing to complain about.....

It's JEDIYoda! Haven't seen you in awhile. Hope everything's been grand :^)

 

[Red Squirrel]

Considering I have ONE JOB, I would at least try. Did not even realize schools had police officers, is that the norm in the states because of how often these happen? That said, it's very hard to tell without being there. Can you see the shooter, does he have your back on you, or are you in an awkward position where you can't line up for a shot? If you have a hand gun and he has an AR or other type of machine gun you stand no chance unless you kill him in one shot. You pretty much need to be able to put yourself in a situation where you can line up for a head shot without him seeing you. So basically you can't just run right into the hall and follow the sound, that would be bad news.

I would try, but I'd call for backup first, since if I can't get a proper shot then I'm probably best waiting. On the other hand, I would be considering the fact that people are actively dying, maybe I'd get some kind of adrenaline rush to just barge out of my hiding spot and try my best. Could at very least try to get a couple chest shots to slow him down before I die.

 

[Red Squirrel]

Do people really think this is going to fix anything? Seriously? Explain to me how if there were zero guns suddenly mass killing by insane, enraged, and/or mentally ill would stop? Please, I want to know what mindset leads to that path. Serious question. Keep in mind there is NO way to get rid of EVERYTHING (even with no guns) and seriously think about it.

It would sure help. If you look at violence stats gun violence is ridiculously high in the states because of how easy it is to get guns. Issue is, banning them now would probably not help, it's too late, they're already out there. If you ban them now the criminals will keep theirs. The states has a violence issue in general though for a 1st world country, not just guns but violence as a whole. May be a cultural thing such as the "survival of fittest" mind set lot of people have.

 

[Thebobo]

Do people really think this is going to fix anything? Seriously? Explain to me how if there were zero guns suddenly mass killing by insane, enraged, and/or mentally ill would stop? Please, I want to know what mindset leads to that path. Serious question. Keep in mind there is NO way to get rid of EVERYTHING (even with no guns) and seriously think about it.

Japan and Australia

 

[madoka]

Check the homicide rates per capita in 1st world countries. Sure they have violence, not arguing otherwise. Guns make things more lethal and final.

France is a 1st world country.

86 killed (434 injured) - A Tunisian/French Muslim man attacks the French public celebrating Bastille Day, he drives a 19 tonne cargo truck through the public on the street thereby killing indiscriminately.

150 killed - The German co-pilot, deliberately crashed the plane on the French Alps, killing all passengers and crew.

Please name me a U.S. mass shooting that killed 86-150 people. No one was stupid enough to blame trucks or planes though.

 

[Scarpozzi]

Take them down myself. In that position, you should be proficient with a weapon and practice on a range at a minimum, weekly. Of course, having said that, I would be using my training and would know where cover was in the school (home-field advantage). The challenge with breaching a school or similarly design building is that there are typically long hallways with little cover. If there's only one shooter, it would be easy to tell location if you could hear the shots.

I would just be hopeful that I could use the element of surprise to catch the shooter offguard somehow.

 

[Rifter]

Assuming i was armed with at least a Pistol i would try and neutralize the threat asap.

 

[Fern]

I think I'd go for it under the circumstances at this school:

1. Only one shooter, not multiple.

2. If you couldn't tell where the shooter was by the sounds of the shots, there were a ton of students there running the other way you could ask.

3. You'd have the benefit of surprise; I believe a huge advantage.

4. You could always wait until he had to reload/change mags

5. I'd stay behind cover as I approached him: peak low around corners and through windows. I'm not jumping out into the middle of a hallway or gymnasium and facing him down ala 'shoot out at the OK corral'.

6. Leave an avenue of safe retreat.

I've seen (video) and heard of shoot outs where I'd just haul azz running the other way. This guy ain't one of those.

Fern

 

[Red Squirrel]

Take them down myself. In that position, you should be proficient with a weapon and practice on a range at a minimum, weekly. Of course, having said that, I would be using my training and would know where cover was in the school (home-field advantage). The challenge with breaching a school or similarly design building is that there are typically long hallways with little cover. If there's only one shooter, it would be easy to tell location if you could hear the shots.

I would just be hopeful that I could use the element of surprise to catch the shooter offguard somehow.

Could also pull some Kevin Vickers badass moves: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4wfzWJ2Hwo

 

[MrSquished]

France is a 1st world country.

86 killed (434 injured) - A Tunisian/French Muslim man attacks the French public celebrating Bastille Day, he drives a 19 tonne cargo truck through the public on the street thereby killing indiscriminately.

150 killed - The German co-pilot, deliberately crashed the plane on the French Alps, killing all passengers and crew.

Please name me a U.S. mass shooting that killed 86-150 people. No one was stupid enough to blame trucks or planes though.

You are trying to compare gun violence with that of a truck or an airplane? That's pretty fucking stupid