If you don't like it then leave

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: KarenMarie

Originally posted by: 3chordcharlie
Where are the people who make this sort of statement living?
[ snipped ]
If you live in a free country and don't accept THAT, then it is possible you are living in the wrong country, because that's what democracies and free speech are founded on; the right of the people to hold any opinion they wish, and express it without fear.

We are NOT a democracy. We are a Republic. We have ALWAYS been a Republic and we WILL ALWAYS be a Republic. And it seems that the right of the people to have an opinion and express it worked out, no?

And please, try not to lecture us on how to be Americans.

Thanks!

Well, 48% of the country might disagree with you over the next 4 years about how well their opinions are being listened to. Time will tell and all that, I hope Bush, as any good leader should, will listen to Kerry supporters over the next 4 years. Because even if they "lost", they still represent nearly half the country.

 

[BAMAVOO]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: BAMAVOO

Originally posted by: jpeyton
I dunno, they seem to flock to wherever I am.

Tiles2Tech, exdeath, and a couple of other forgettables.

I find their logic funny too; it was the same "why don't you move to France" mentality before the war that got debunked once we found out France was right about WMDs.

Why don't you just get the FLOCK out of here. Your attitude sucks, period. If you are this upset about the election you truly have issues. The right man won the election. Just go out and find a better candidate for the next election. You must not be doing too bad in this economy, if you can sit and type on ATPN all day long.

I'm doing damn fine in this economy; my opposition is because of the war in Iraq.

That war in Iraq is keeping you safe, where you can continue to do damn fine. Believe it or not, Iraq was the center of terrorism. We gave them opportunities to not have a war brought to them. Would we have been better off the continue to do nothing? You would have gone to war as well knowing what President Bush and John Kerry saw in the documents presented to them. It was not just our FBI or CIA that had evidence of WMD's.

 

[imported_tss4]

Originally posted by: cKGunslinger

Originally posted by: tss4

Originally posted by: Mwilding

Originally posted by: jpeyton
I dunno, they seem to flock to wherever I am.

Tiles2Tech, exdeath, and a couple of other forgettables.

I find their logic funny too; it was the same "why don't you move to France" mentality before the war that got debunked once we found out France was right about WMDs.

What you don't recognize is that you don't add anything to the equation. You claim to be a Kerry supporter, but when Bush wins you now proclaim with joy that the country will now go to hell in a handbasket and that you are looking forward with glee to see it happen.

Being an American Citizen brings with it the responsibility to participate in the selection of your leaders and the debate the issues of the day along the way. You may have accomplished part one, but your hate mongering, finger pointing and absurd rhetoric are a pathetic cop-out of an attempt at part 2.

Wow, exactly where was he hate mongoring? You sound a little more hateful in my opinion. Take a moment relax and breath out slowly. Just because he doesn't agree with the president, doesn't mean he needs to move to another country. And it doesn't make him a hate mongorer.

Its also absurd when CKGunslinger starts reffering to people lying and cheating and that's when they'er going too far. CKG, do you think the liberals are lygin cheating? If not then why are you preaching about it. I'm sure there are liberals that do that sort of thing, but there also conservatives that do too. Yet, you seem to be implying that this a problem primarily with liberals which is just silly.

Debate and questiong of the leadership is good for this country. Sure lying and half truths are not, but both parties are doing this, so lets not point fingers and lets just fix the problem.

Umm.. no. I didn't mention the word liberal at all in my post, now did I? Maybe you haven't read all the posts in this board over the last 12 hours, but I have read some that make me cringe. Some of them were locked, some were not. Some of them were against Bush, some of them were for. I'll not call out names, but they are there.

Politics doesn't play into how I feel about America. Even though I didn't like him, I supported Clinton's good deeds and denounced his bad ones. I never threatened to leave the country or hoped that we'd get attacked to "prove" that Clinton was not a good president. It has nothing to do with "liberals" or "conservatives." Please take your Label Maker 3000 elsewhere, I'm not using it here.

Then perhaps you should have responded with that post to THOSE people and not the person that you did. His point was completely valid and you posted a response based on what others had done. That doesn't make his point any less true.

Quote: "Please take your Label Maker 3000 elsewhere, I'm not using it here".
Let's raise the level of discourse here, if we can, and leave the one liners at home.

 

[GasX]

Originally posted by: BAMAVOO

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: BAMAVOO

Originally posted by: jpeyton
I dunno, they seem to flock to wherever I am.

Tiles2Tech, exdeath, and a couple of other forgettables.

I find their logic funny too; it was the same "why don't you move to France" mentality before the war that got debunked once we found out France was right about WMDs.

Why don't you just get the FLOCK out of here. Your attitude sucks, period. If you are this upset about the election you truly have issues. The right man won the election. Just go out and find a better candidate for the next election. You must not be doing too bad in this economy, if you can sit and type on ATPN all day long.

I'm doing damn fine in this economy; my opposition is because of the war in Iraq.

That war in Iraq is keeping you safe, where you can continue to do damn fine. Believe it or not, Iraq was the center of terrorism. We gave them opportunities to not have a war brought to them. Would we have been better off the continue to do nothing? You would have gone to war as well knowing what President Bush and John Kerry saw in the documents presented to them. It was not just our FBI or CIA that had evidence of WMD's.

I'd just like to state that BAMAVOO doesn't speak for all of us...

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: AlricTheMad

Originally posted by: LunarRay
He has a mandate to continue the policy of the last four years. No doubt about that either!

How do you get 'mandate' with just over 1/2 of the vote?

A mandate would be a large (like mabybe 75-85%) of the voters on his side.

He won the election, he did not win over America

I agree, the democratic candidate did have what it took to get people on his side. Neither candidate in my opinion would have had any 'mandate' except from their own party.

I do hope that whoever runs for office next time both Rep & Dem are real worthy candidates that don't have to resort to spewing half truths and defending against the same to get people behind them.

Pat

His Mandate to operate is given by the majority of the voters. He don't need 80 percent of the vote to claim a mandate... 50 percent plus one of the voting public is a mandate as I see it. I do not agree with his policy at all so I can't support his mandate. However, I'd have claimed the same mandate for Kerry had the vote been reversed and been able to support it.

 

[cKGunslinger]

Originally posted by: tss4

Originally posted by: cKGunslinger

Originally posted by: tss4

Originally posted by: Mwilding

Originally posted by: jpeyton
I dunno, they seem to flock to wherever I am.

Tiles2Tech, exdeath, and a couple of other forgettables.

I find their logic funny too; it was the same "why don't you move to France" mentality before the war that got debunked once we found out France was right about WMDs.

What you don't recognize is that you don't add anything to the equation. You claim to be a Kerry supporter, but when Bush wins you now proclaim with joy that the country will now go to hell in a handbasket and that you are looking forward with glee to see it happen.

Being an American Citizen brings with it the responsibility to participate in the selection of your leaders and the debate the issues of the day along the way. You may have accomplished part one, but your hate mongering, finger pointing and absurd rhetoric are a pathetic cop-out of an attempt at part 2.

Wow, exactly where was he hate mongoring? You sound a little more hateful in my opinion. Take a moment relax and breath out slowly. Just because he doesn't agree with the president, doesn't mean he needs to move to another country. And it doesn't make him a hate mongorer.

Its also absurd when CKGunslinger starts reffering to people lying and cheating and that's when they'er going too far. CKG, do you think the liberals are lygin cheating? If not then why are you preaching about it. I'm sure there are liberals that do that sort of thing, but there also conservatives that do too. Yet, you seem to be implying that this a problem primarily with liberals which is just silly.

Debate and questiong of the leadership is good for this country. Sure lying and half truths are not, but both parties are doing this, so lets not point fingers and lets just fix the problem.

Umm.. no. I didn't mention the word liberal at all in my post, now did I? Maybe you haven't read all the posts in this board over the last 12 hours, but I have read some that make me cringe. Some of them were locked, some were not. Some of them were against Bush, some of them were for. I'll not call out names, but they are there.

Politics doesn't play into how I feel about America. Even though I didn't like him, I supported Clinton's good deeds and denounced his bad ones. I never threatened to leave the country or hoped that we'd get attacked to "prove" that Clinton was not a good president. It has nothing to do with "liberals" or "conservatives." Please take your Label Maker 3000 elsewhere, I'm not using it here.

Then perhaps you should have responded with that post to THOSE people and not the person that you did. His point was completely valid and you posted a response based on what others had done. That doesn't make his point any less true.

Quote: "Please take your Label Maker 3000 elsewhere, I'm not using it here".
Let's raise the level of discourse here, if we can, and leave the one liners at home.

Well, you've completely lost me here. This thread was about how it seemed to be "un-American" to suggest that people who profess to hate the country and/or the administration leave and go elsewhere. I responded directly to that and said it was just as American to tell them to leave as it is to naysay the President/Administration/Country/Citizens. That's it.

I don't know why you think my post was off topic and should have been placed elsewhere. I don't know why you made some odd assumptions that I was only referring to those of a particular political ideal, when I was doing no such thing. I don't know why you invoked my post when replying to someone elses. I don't even know what "we" are supposed to be discussing anymore. I'm talking about freedoms and what *I* think it means to be an American, and you seem to be accusing me of partisanship attacks against forum members. Either you misread or miscomprehended my post, you have confused another poster with me, or you have some other agenda that does not really belong in this thread.

 

[Busithoth]

I just hope Bush stokes the xenophobia by severing all debts to foreign nations, in order to boost the US economy.

 

[daveshel]

Originally posted by: CanOWorms
A real American (or whatever) would want to change the country instead of leave.

There ya go. And we should be ashamed that the OP, a Canadian, has a clearer vision of what it means to be an American than the victors in this thread.

Add that to the shame I feel today that we chose security over freedom.

 

[BAMAVOO]

Originally posted by: Mwilding

Originally posted by: BAMAVOO

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: BAMAVOO

Originally posted by: jpeyton
I dunno, they seem to flock to wherever I am.

Tiles2Tech, exdeath, and a couple of other forgettables.

I find their logic funny too; it was the same "why don't you move to France" mentality before the war that got debunked once we found out France was right about WMDs.

Why don't you just get the FLOCK out of here. Your attitude sucks, period. If you are this upset about the election you truly have issues. The right man won the election. Just go out and find a better candidate for the next election. You must not be doing too bad in this economy, if you can sit and type on ATPN all day long.

I'm doing damn fine in this economy; my opposition is because of the war in Iraq.

So, how do you feel then? Do you think we went to war for nothing or the wrong reason?

That war in Iraq is keeping you safe, where you can continue to do damn fine. Believe it or not, Iraq was the center of terrorism. We gave them opportunities to not have a war brought to them. Would we have been better off the continue to do nothing? You would have gone to war as well knowing what President Bush and John Kerry saw in the documents presented to them. It was not just our FBI or CIA that had evidence of WMD's.

I'd just like to state that BAMAVOO doesn't speak for all of us...

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: Mwilding

Originally posted by: BAMAVOO

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: BAMAVOO

Originally posted by: jpeyton
I dunno, they seem to flock to wherever I am.

Tiles2Tech, exdeath, and a couple of other forgettables.

I find their logic funny too; it was the same "why don't you move to France" mentality before the war that got debunked once we found out France was right about WMDs.

Why don't you just get the FLOCK out of here. Your attitude sucks, period. If you are this upset about the election you truly have issues. The right man won the election. Just go out and find a better candidate for the next election. You must not be doing too bad in this economy, if you can sit and type on ATPN all day long.

I'm doing damn fine in this economy; my opposition is because of the war in Iraq.

That war in Iraq is keeping you safe, where you can continue to do damn fine. Believe it or not, Iraq was the center of terrorism. We gave them opportunities to not have a war brought to them. Would we have been better off the continue to do nothing? You would have gone to war as well knowing what President Bush and John Kerry saw in the documents presented to them. It was not just our FBI or CIA that had evidence of WMD's.

I'd just like to state that BAMAVOO doesn't speak for all of us...

BAMAVOO doesn't speak the truth, plain and simple. There are enough holes in his statement to make even the diehard neocons slowly back away.

 

[wirelessenabled]

Originally posted by: cKGunslinger

Originally posted by: 3chordcharlie
......But when you start lying, cheating, smearing, and such, and those efforts actually degrade our standards of living and our values as a country, or hurt innocent Americans, then you have taken a step too far.....

There you have hit the crux of my problem with Bush:thumbsup:

 

[nutxo]

Originally posted by: wirelessenabled

Originally posted by: cKGunslinger

Originally posted by: 3chordcharlie
......But when you start lying, cheating, smearing, and such, and those efforts actually degrade our standards of living and our values as a country, or hurt innocent Americans, then you have taken a step too far.....

There you have hit the crux of my problem with Bush:thumbsup:

Fortunately you are in the MINORITY that feel that way.

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: nutxo

Originally posted by: wirelessenabled

Originally posted by: cKGunslinger

Originally posted by: 3chordcharlie
......But when you start lying, cheating, smearing, and such, and those efforts actually degrade our standards of living and our values as a country, or hurt innocent Americans, then you have taken a step too far.....

There you have hit the crux of my problem with Bush:thumbsup:

Fortunately you are in the MINORITY that feel that way.

Yes, the minority which includes 50+ million of our electorate. :roll:

When the sample size is 115m, 3m isn't a decisive victory as much as a divisive one.

 

[3chordcharlie]

Originally posted by: 3chordcharlie
......But when you start lying, cheating, smearing, and such, and those efforts actually degrade our standards of living and our values as a country, or hurt innocent Americans, then you have taken a step too far.....

Just like to point out that while I don't disagree with the above statement, it isn't mine, but rather the result of some quote-editing mishap

 

[jjzelinski]

Originally posted by: BAMAVOO

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: BAMAVOO

Originally posted by: jpeyton
I dunno, they seem to flock to wherever I am.

Tiles2Tech, exdeath, and a couple of other forgettables.

I find their logic funny too; it was the same "why don't you move to France" mentality before the war that got debunked once we found out France was right about WMDs.

Why don't you just get the FLOCK out of here. Your attitude sucks, period. If you are this upset about the election you truly have issues. The right man won the election. Just go out and find a better candidate for the next election. You must not be doing too bad in this economy, if you can sit and type on ATPN all day long.

I'm doing damn fine in this economy; my opposition is because of the war in Iraq.

That war in Iraq is keeping you safe, where you can continue to do damn fine. Believe it or not, Iraq was the center of terrorism. We gave them opportunities to not have a war brought to them. Would we have been better off the continue to do nothing? You would have gone to war as well knowing what President Bush and John Kerry saw in the documents presented to them. It was not just our FBI or CIA that had evidence of WMD's.

The only possible way the war in Iraq, having absolutly NOTHING TO DO WITH THE WAR ON TERROR, would keep us safe is by using American soldiers to draw the attention and the fire of the terrorists.

This is just confounding that people still accept that you can attack a nebulous, dynamic, lossley networked CRININAL ORGANIZATION with an army. That's like santitizing your kitchen sink with a shotgun!

You know what Iraq is besides an a attempt to reconstruct the geopolitical landscape of the ME in our likeness? It is an enormous diversion from the fact that 9/11 ALREADY OCCURED. And who was on watch when it happened, and what was he doing 75% of the 8 months in office before it occured? There is no excuse, so save your breath.

And as for the pathetic excuse that everyone else thought Saddam had these WMD's, exactly what did EVERYBODY ELSE do with that assumption? They sure as hell didn't invade Iraq and live to regret it 2 years, hundreds of billions of dollars, and thousands upon thousands of deaths later now did they? Perhaps there's a reason why there was even a precident of pre-emptivism to set before Bush Inc. recklessly adopted it? YA THINK?!