If you are using onboard audio, Im going to go to your house and....

[bunnyfubbles]

My on-board audio is much better than the Audigy sound card I had. Most on-board are made within the post few years on par with an Audigy 2 on any decent motherboard. Also you need to have the proper equipment to even notice the difference and chances are since you're making a post like that you don't because people who spend a lot on audio equipment don't feel the need to post crap like that.

I have 3 different sub-$90 headsets and all of them sound like garbage over onboard relative to a proper soundcard. Music and movies are passable, but games are almost unbearably bad, the sound is just so shallow and impotent and at least an order of magnitude worse for positional audio. (and this is on supposedly high end motherboards that specifically state they have high quality onboard audio)

Its true that my $300+ headsets make the difference even more pronounced, but its utter fallacy that you need expensive equipment to make a difference.

But seeing as how humans are so thoroughly visually oriented its really not too surprising that audio falls to the wayside. Heck, and when we consider how most people are blind to how terrible their visual experience is with their force-fed 60Hz TN panels, its truly no wonder so many are completely ignorant to their inferior audio fidelity.

 

[Ichinisan]

I have 3 different sub-$90 headsets and all of them sound like garbage over onboard relative to a proper soundcard. Music and movies are passable, but games are almost unbearably bad, the sound is just so shallow and impotent and at least an order of magnitude worse for positional audio. (and this is on supposedly high end motherboards that specifically state they have high quality onboard audio)

Its true that my $300+ headsets make the difference even more pronounced, but its utter fallacy that you need expensive equipment to make a difference.

But seeing as how humans are so thoroughly visually oriented its really not too surprising that audio falls to the wayside. Heck, and when we consider how most people are blind to how terrible their visual experience is with their force-fed 60Hz TN panels, its truly no wonder so many are completely ignorant to their inferior audio fidelity.

-In most scenarios, the audio is identical; RIGHT UP TO THE DAC.

A DAC is a simple and ubiquitous component in almost any electronic device these days.

Even *if* such a SIMPLE component as a DAC is somehow "vastly inferior" ...

-Many people these days use a digital set-up (S/PDIF, HDMI, etc) and DON'T USE THE DAC IN THE PC ANYWAY.

I don't have any room for speakers on my PC right now and I'm using the horrible speakers that are integrated in my LCD monitor. The digital audio is carried over the DVI-HDMI cable.

 

[bunnyfubbles]

LOL, you gotta love "audiophiles" complaining about onboard while using Creative instead of a proper USB DAC.

and how are you any better lording what you believe to be the superior solution when the truth is that USB DACs don't quite readily supply technologies such as Dolby Headphone or CMSS-3D, making them rather inept for games or movies?

Sure, they'll destroy expensive sound cards for crystal clear music because of their ability to avoid EMI but that doesn't make them some sort of be-all-end-all of PC audio solutions, not yet at least.

granted, Creative is already heading in that direction with efforts like their X-Fi HD USB

 

[FelixDeCat]

Good to see the OP apparently got better since he had big health issues that had limited his trolling for a while there.

Probably because minor trolling is somewhat tolerated here, but this shit won't fly in the tech forums.

:awe:

are you trolling in a nerdly direction today?

Yes, but you know I love you guys. ()🙂

Thanks to ZAP and others for helping to enligten me on all things audio tonight. Have a great weekend.


ps. Considering Ive only started walking again 5 days ago w/o crutches I doubt I could smack any of you and get away with it. 😀

I am tapering off the pain meds & managed to walk 3 miles the other day while praying. It hurt at the end but it felt great to be amongst random people again greeting everyone I came accross. Im going to enjoy life again and I thank you all for your support with a little loving troll tonight.

 

[Tsavo]

I'm deaf in one eye and can't hear out of the other, so I use onboard audio.

People that use CL products should be taken out and beaten with a photograph of Rosie O'Donnell.

 

[Ichinisan]

...

People that use CL products should be taken out and beaten with a phonograph.

FTFY

caps

 

[darkswordsman17]

You could always sell the STX and get a subwoofer 😉
Or sell both and get some floorstanders and a receiver.

I recently got an old set of JBL floorstanders... the L5 which are decently acclaimed. The soundstage is so much wider and open than my Swan M200. It truly upgraded the listening experience to a whole nother level.

I recently also upgraded from my Intel HD Audio to an Auzentech Prelude 7.1. It did just about nothing to the sound. I'm thinking about selling it and getting a good amp for my Etymotic ER4P.

Are you sure the soundstage isn't due to placement? That alone can account for large differences in sound. Volume/loudness too.

Speakers can be pretty difficult to tell minor differences, and often small details get lost in the overall sound. Especially on average to poor recordings.

 

[AyashiKaibutsu]

I use onboard audio

 

[Lifted]

Is creative still in existence? I wasn't aware that there was still a market for consumer sound cards.

 

[bunnyfubbles]

-In most scenarios, the audio is identical; RIGHT UP TO THE DAC.

A DAC is a simple and ubiquitous component in almost any electronic device these days.

Even *if* such a SIMPLE component as a DAC is somehow "vastly inferior" ...

-Many people these days use a digital set-up (S/PDIF, HDMI, etc) and DON'T USE THE DAC IN THE PC ANYWAY.

I don't have any room for speakers on my PC right now and I'm using the horrible speakers that are integrated in my LCD monitor. The digital audio is carried over the DVI-HDMI cable.

There we go. That's the kicker isn't it. Many is just too subjective. Sure, anyone digitally passing audio out of the computer to be processed elsewhere should be perfect without a sound card. But I'm willing to bet that the vast majority still use analog speakers and/or headphones that directly connect to the PC's sound system.

Throw in secret sauces like HRTFs and its a hands-down argument in favor of discrete audio.

I'm home visiting my parents for the 4th and playing games on their computer (a rig built from my old yet still very capable parts) I honestly feel handicapped with their onboard audio relative to my Auzentech X-Fi.

 

[zerogear]

Who in the world would use onboard audio? Thats messed up if you ax me. Ive been using Creative cards faithfully and reliably since 1993 and have NEVER looked back.

Sure I tried onboard audio once, I even have it on my laptop. It is and always will be flat, one dimensional, crap. Lacking clear highs and defined lows it sounds like just a bunch of midrange noise.

Dont even try to defend your onboard audio. You cant.

edit: Ive tempered the post. Thank you for setting me straight guys. 🙂

For laptop, get a high quality Portable USB DAC/Amp, Look up Pico Amp/DAC or RSA Predator, it makes all the difference in the world. As for PC. Just get a DAC and Amp. Though Essence STX is pretty nice.

 

[disappoint]

How can you stand to use those craptastic onboard cpus when you can hire a trillion monkeys with a trillion abaci to do your calculations for you?

 

[darkswordsman17]

and how are you any better lording what you believe to be the superior solution when the truth is that USB DACs don't quite readily supply technologies such as Dolby Headphone or CMSS-3D, making them rather inept for games or movies?

Sure, they'll destroy expensive sound cards for crystal clear music because of their ability to avoid EMI but that doesn't make them some sort of be-all-end-all of PC audio solutions, not yet at least.

granted, Creative is already heading in that direction with efforts like their X-Fi HD USB

Its a solid product, has good features (it actually has a phono input for vinyl which I think is pretty cool even if its probably marginal in quality), and decent sound quality for the price, but its nothing special and you can get most of the extra other ways.

With most media players you can either buy a version (for DVD/Blu-Ray) that supports simulated surround (Dolby Headphone or DTS Surround Sensation), or they have plugins or other options. There's a lot of people using a Dolby Headphone wrapper with Foobar.

Its not really a gaming card either.

I'm deaf in one eye and can't hear out of the other, so I use onboard audio.

People that use CL products should be taken out and beaten with a photograph of Rosie O'Donnell.

Eh, some of Creative's products are decent. The Titanium HD is actually quite good. The Titanium and HD USB are both ok, and the Platinum Pro was ok. The E-MU products are generally solid.

They deserve all they got though, as they ripped off Aureal and then bankrupted them then bought and subsequently did nothing with the tech until the X-Fi (which was like 4-5 years later). They've also been a patent troll (Doom 3 mess), and all the other issues (ignoring fidelity, forced resampling, driver and general software problems).

They do actually manage OpenAL though, which is funny, as that means Creative still owns your PC audio experience.

The truth is, other companies aren't really any better. ASUS has had their share of problems, as has Auzentech. Neither one's cards are perfect hardware wise either.

Oh, and in case anyone didn't know it, Creative actually has a new audio processor, I believe its a multi-core SIMD design that is ~4x as powerful as X-Fi. I wonder how difficult it would be to port the software from it to run on GPUs, and if they could make it so it just uses a few processing units, it could be good as then AMD and Nvidia could license with Creative and suddenly people have stronger audio setups.

 

[yhelothar]

Are you sure the soundstage isn't due to placement? That alone can account for large differences in sound. Volume/loudness too.

Speakers can be pretty difficult to tell minor differences, and often small details get lost in the overall sound. Especially on average to poor recordings.

I'm not entirely ready to discount speaker placement in the difference.

But I have experimented quite a bit with my M200 speaker placement. I recently rearranged my room so I can get the speakers out away from the corner and more towards the center of the room. I have them placed in an equilateral triangle 2 ft away from each other and from me.
The speakers are 1.5ft away from the rear wall.

The floorstanding speakers, I'm currently using them with a 4ft equilateral triangle setup. However, before I moved them, they were in a 2ft equilateral triangle position as well, and they still sounded much wider and spacious than the Swan M200.

If you know how to get my Swan M200 to sound like the JBLs... I'll love you forever.
My neighbor is an audiophile and he tells me that monitors should sound every bit as good as floorstanders. So I'm guessing the JBLs sound better because they're just better speakers and not because they're floorstanders.

 

[alkemyst]

Wait guys....if you are using a motherboard built more than 3-5 years ago then perhaps plugging in some ISA card for sound does make sense.

Some people out there are poor and need to hear the email alert when their welfare money hits their totally free checking account.

Meanwhile they overlook they are plugging in a $30 set of speakers/headphones.

 

[BoomerD]

Self-proclaimed audiophiles are hipster faggots. This is an incontrovertible truth.

You never get tired of being banned, do you?

 

[Wanescotting]

Um, I stopped using soundcards ages ago.......driver issues.
And since I have kids, it makes no sense for me to have "teh uber eleet sexor" sound, hell I am lucky if I can HEAR my game over wonderpets or whatever................

 

[SphinxnihpS]

Who in the world would use onboard audio? Thats messed up if you ax me. Ive been using Creative cards faithfully and reliably since 1993 and have NEVER looked back.

Sure I tried onboard audio once, I even have it on my laptop. It is and always will be flat, one dimensional, crap. Lacking clear highs and defined lows it sounds like just a bunch of midrange noise.

Dont even try to defend your onboard audio. You cant.

edit: Ive tempered the post. Thank you for setting me straight guys. 🙂

You were on fire yesterday.

For 7.1 sound I'll take Realtek any day of the week over Creative.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Who in the world would use onboard audio? Thats messed up if you ax me. Ive been using Creative cards faithfully and reliably since 1993 and have NEVER looked back.

Sure I tried onboard audio once, I even have it on my laptop. It is and always will be flat, one dimensional, crap. Lacking clear highs and defined lows it sounds like just a bunch of midrange noise.

Dont even try to defend your onboard audio. You cant.

edit: Ive tempered the post. Thank you for setting me straight guys. 🙂

edit: late as ususal I am.. 😛

 

[arcenite]

I stopped using sound cards several years ago as well. There was a time when I could tell the difference in game & music performance but that gap has closed significantly enough as to not waste my time with potential driver issues (XFI used to have a lot of static before it gave up the ghost) and to not waste the extra cash or lose a slot or hinder cooling for my video cards. When that card gave up, I plugged into my motherboard sound and everything sounded great.

 

[Zap]

I am tapering off the pain meds

PSA he's going off his meds. 😱

Is creative still in existence? I wasn't aware that there was still a market for consumer sound cards.

Yeah, they're kept afloat by their speaker department and hipster f people who were burned by onboard audio eight years ago with AC97 and vowed to never go onboard again.

 

[dawp]

last sound card I had was a Hercules Digifire 7.1 which wasn't a bad card at the time. Think I spent something like $100 on it. Hercules stopped supporting it tho and there are no drivers for it past XP.

 

[WaTaGuMp]

Is this some kind of intrawebz stalker thread? Some random guy saying he is coming to peoples houses.

 

[zinfamous]

you guys don't know what you're talking about.

hipsters use macbooks, and they sure as shit wouldn't know anything about onboard vs peripheral audio (unless the solution were available, unnamed and--non-descriptive--from Saint Jobs for a secondary charge), let alone know anything about Creative Labs or third party companies.

 

[Minerva]

Haven't used onboard audio since they started putting that crap on motherboards. Waste of space.

Even on the laptops everything is Mark Of The Unicorn!

http://www.motu.com/audio