If the Prescott delay is true, what do you think Intel will do?

[Regs]

I'm waiting for Intel to do something innovative. Ramping up clock speed on a woody doesn't exactly make me gasp with excitement. And making the cpu to be able to handle such high latent clock speeds like the low-k dielectric technology, I wouldn't call revolutionary.

 

[PrinceXizor]

All you O/C'ers who think "If I can do it, why can't Intel" are missing the boat.

First, if 99 out of 100 chips O/C to that level...O/C'ers are overjoyed!

Now, remember, your 100 chip sample is of the GOOD part of the yield. Now...how many boxes does intel stuff go into? Let's use 500,000 CPU's as an example. That's 5,000 RMA's for a chip. Now, factor in that this chip is supposed to work on STOCK cooling, with an underpowered, high transient power supply in the middle of the Sahara at 1 p.m. in the Afternoon. And its supposed to do this for months on end without a glitch. If this microprocessor business is so easy, why is AMD the first company in a long while to give Intel any kind of sustained competition?

P-X

 

[Idontcare]

Originally posted by: Redviffer


Is the stuff TI makes just as complicated as Intel?

Depends on who you ask. (naturally)

Not wanting to turn this into an Intel vs. TI pissing contest, but if you mean process technology wise, I'd say absolutely and maybe even more so but then again who isn't. Intel's process development strong suit is (in my opinion) extending every conceivable ounce of process margin out of well depreciated processes. Examples: Look at technology position on SOI, Cu, and low-k. Admittedly strained Si will be a feather in their cap, but then again despite the press I can't buy a chip stamped INTEL with strained Si in it.

If you mean layout/design wise, then it is a toss-up. TI plays in the high-power GHz market just as much as Intel, AMD and IBM. At the same time, TI plays in the low-power wireless market which INTEL is not a big player for a variety of reasons but Intel wants to change that. TI tends to be more aggressive in design rules when it comes to SRAM cell-size and M2-M4 pitch in my opinion.

Regardless of whether TI's "stuff" is more or less complicated, it is apparently what the customers want at a pricepoint the market supports.

Note: this post was not authored with intent of offending or misleading anyone. These opinions are mine alone and not reflective of my employer (TI).

 

[pm]

I wasn't aware Intel was the first to 90nm. Or that they were shipping 90nm product at all. I must have missed that press release. Oh wait, maybe I found it here Intel delivers 90nm parts...oops, my bad

Even though you corrected yourself, I agree with your initial comment. I guess I should have said "Intel is likely to be first to ship products on the 90nm process node." But what I'm trying to say is that I'll be interested to see how the other microprocessor vendors do at 90nm with regards to power.

At the same time, TI plays in the low-power wireless market which INTEL is not a big player for a variety of reasons but Intel wants to change that.

Which aspect of low-power wireless are you referring to? Cell phones? Handhelds? WLAN? Just curious.

As far as a comparison of TI and Intel's manufacturing and design... I have no comment except to say that I personally have always admired TI's low-power expertise.

 

[Idontcare]

Originally posted by: pm

I wasn't aware Intel was the first to 90nm. Or that they were shipping 90nm product at all. I must have missed that press release. Oh wait, maybe I found it here Intel delivers 90nm parts...oops, my bad

Even though you corrected yourself, I agree with your initial comment. I guess I should have said "Intel is likely to be first to ship products on the 90nm process node." But what I'm trying to say is that I'll be interested to see how the other microprocessor vendors do at 90nm with regards to power.

At the same time, TI plays in the low-power wireless market which INTEL is not a big player for a variety of reasons but Intel wants to change that.

Which aspect of low-power wireless are you referring to? Cell phones? Handhelds? WLAN? Just curious.

As far as a comparison of TI and Intel's manufacturing and design... I have no comment except to say that I personally have always admired TI's low-power expertise.

Low-power wireless -> insofar as I'm aware it is all of the above. It's not a challenge, I'm just not aware of it being any differently. Feel free to educate me if you feel it is worth your while (I do).

 

[MadRat]

Aren't memory manufacturers already at 100nm?

Seems like Intel likes to cut their designs down by 30+% with each generation. Why not be satisfied with 100nm (23% drop) if its already been figured out?

 

[Macro2]

RE:"If the Prescott delay is true, what do you think Intel will do?"


Another paper Emergency Edition and pump up the ad dollars for the OEMs...full speed ahead...

Don't forget some more "made to order" benchies to...

 

[wetcat007]

Originally posted by: Pariah
Intel doesn't have to do anything. If AMD could sell every CPU they made as soon as it was made they still wouldn't be able to catch Intel in market share due to Intel's brand name recognition and overwhelming manufacturing capabilities vs AMD. The A64 isn't going to gain AMD any major market share any time soon if they can't get any OEM's to sell them. Anyone seen any advertised systems from any of the major OEM's yet (Gateway, HP, Compaq, Sony? no Dell obviously)? I haven't, and that's not a real good sign for AMD.

Yeah it's dumb, Dell wont even sell AMD CPU's, when Intel releases a new chip whether it sucks or not, it's name is stamped allover major OEM's, the only thing i saw promoting the Athlon 64 was alienware.com

 

[Macro2]

RE:"Yeah it's dumb, Dell wont even sell AMD CPU's, when Intel releases a new chip whether it sucks or not, it's name is stamped allover major OEM's, the only thing i saw promoting the Athlon 64 was alienware.com "

But do you really know why?

 

[Idontcare]

Originally posted by: MadRat
Aren't memory manufacturers already at 100nm?

Seems like Intel likes to cut their designs down by 30+% with each generation. Why not be satisfied with 100nm (23% drop) if its already been figured out?

There are a lot of differences that go into what a memory manufacturer will call a 100nm tech node versus what a logic manufacturer will call a 90nm tech node. Just as operating GHz of CPU_A is not a well-defined performance metric for comparison to CPU_B. There really is no such thing as "figuring out" 100nm or 90nm.

Aside from the technological differences, there are economic reasons why the memory market is more sensitive to the impact of a company releasing a press notice detailing the "latest mfg capabilities" as it is how a company lets the investment community decide if as manufacturer it is more likely to be more profitable (or lose less money) relative to the competition based on arguments about relative dies size, yields, wafer size, etc. for same product.

So if you take a Micron and a Samsung, both make products which are by definition electrically equivalent, they must do something to distinguish themselves. In their case what they do is "release" a yearly refresh of their latest manufacturable design rules to gain an apparent upper-hand in perceived technological and economic supiorority relative to other memory manufacturers. Regardless, comparing Intel's 90nm node to Micron's 100nm node is really an apples to oranges. Not sure if any of that makes sense, you'll have to let me know.

 

[MDE]

Originally posted by: Macro2
RE:"Yeah it's dumb, Dell wont even sell AMD CPU's, when Intel releases a new chip whether it sucks or not, it's name is stamped allover major OEM's, the only thing i saw promoting the Athlon 64 was alienware.com "

But do you really know why?

Intel gives Dell (and other OEMs) ridiculous discounts to stay Intel-only. All of those magazine ads for Dell, IBM, HP, and Gateway (among others) with Intel logos, probably paid for either in part or whole by Intel. They're one hell of a maketing machine.

 

[pashiamas]

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