I'd like to build My own this time

[Gimmetoys]

Hi,
I play a lot of games and found out that my PC must be getting old as I couldn't play Splinter Cell Pandoras Tomorrow.
In an attempt to build a PC instead of buying from Dell again, I've been lurking in the shadows and gathering as much info from this wonderful board as I can.
So far my shopping list at Newegg is looking like this:

Thermaltake VA3400SWA case with 400W PSU, 2- 120mm fans, 1-90mm side fan
Asus p4c800-e-deluxe
P4 3.0C or 2.8C
Zalman CNPS7000A cooler
1-GB OCZ Enhanced latency PC-4000
2-WD 74GB Raptors
9800-XT video card
Plextor 12x DVD +-RW

I have a few Questions:
found in a Post "IF you get a 30cap 3.0 ( SL6WK ) youll get a good overclock and low temps".
1. What is SL6WK? Does it apply to P2.8C ? Should I make a request for this at newegg when I place my order?
2. Does this PSU have enough guts for what I'm trying to do or should I opt for a 460W?
3. Should I be able to overclock this 20% with this amount of air cooling?
4. Is the 9800-xt good enough til the next generation of video cards or should I opt for the X800 XT?

Scientific guesses, approximations, and opinions appreciated.
Vince

 

[Demo24]

well I would say you need to seriously consider a AMD 64. they are quite a bit faster and will last longer. Also I would NOT get a 9800xt. thats a waste of money now when you can buy the new generation for about that price. look at the 6800 series. unless you want to buy a 500 dollar card Nvidia has it beat.

 

[nick1985]

Originally posted by: Gimmetoys
Hi,
I play a lot of games and found out that my PC must be getting old as I couldn't play Splinter Cell Pandoras Tomorrow.
In an attempt to build a PC instead of buying from Dell again, I've been lurking in the shadows and gathering as much info from this wonderful board as I can.
So far my shopping list at Newegg is looking like this:

Thermaltake VA3400SWA case with 400W PSU, 2- 120mm fans, 1-90mm side fan
Asus p4c800-e-deluxe
P4 3.0C or 2.8C
Zalman CNPS7000A cooler
1-GB OCZ Enhanced latency PC-4000
2-WD 74GB Raptors
9800-XT video card
Plextor 12x DVD +-RW

I have a few Questions:
found in a Post "IF you get a 30cap 3.0 ( SL6WK ) youll get a good overclock and low temps".
1. What is SL6WK? Does it apply to P2.8C ? Should I make a request for this at newegg when I place my order?
2. Does this PSU have enough guts for what I'm trying to do or should I opt for a 460W?
3. Should I be able to overclock this 20% with this amount of air cooling?
4. Is the 9800-xt good enough til the next generation of video cards or should I opt for the X800 XT?

Scientific guesses, approximations, and opinions appreciated.
Vince

1. Athlon 64 PWNS the P4.
2. Get basic ram. timings mean squat.
3. get the 6800 non ultra. its cheaper than the POS 9800XT, and its WAY faster.

 

[Aleksandar]

2. Get basic ram. timings mean squat.

:thumbsdown:
The P4 3.0C is fine
get an antec truepower 430
the 6800NU is not a bad idea it is only a 100$+ and it is a lot better than the 9800

 

[InlineFive]

Originally posted by: Aleksandar

2. Get basic ram. timings mean squat.

:thumbsdown:

They do. Do a Google search for something along the lines of "Memory Timings Benchmarks".

 

[Aleksandar]

PorBleemo am trying to say that they do

 

[Brickster]

Originally posted by: nick1985
2. Get basic ram. timings mean squat.

And where do you get the data for your well-formulated hypothesis?

Try checking the Memory FAQ's

Squat that, beeeyotch!

 

[Gurck]

Originally posted by: DEMO24
well I would say you need to seriously consider a AMD 64. they are quite a bit faster and will last longer. Also I would NOT get a 9800xt. thats a waste of money now when you can buy the new generation for about that price. look at the 6800 series. unless you want to buy a 500 dollar card Nvidia has it beat.

Yep, will add to this that an athlonXP would also be a good (and much less expensive) choice, and that the 9800pro and 6800gt are also good cards to consider.

 

[Stormgiant]

Originally posted by: Gimmetoys

Thermaltake VA3400SWA case with 400W PSU, 2- 120mm fans, 1-90mm side fan
Asus p4c800-e-deluxe
P4 3.0C or 2.8C
Zalman CNPS7000A cooler
1-GB OCZ Enhanced latency PC-4000
2-WD 74GB Raptors
9800-XT video card
Plextor 12x DVD +-RW

I have a few Questions:
found in a Post "IF you get a 30cap 3.0 ( SL6WK ) youll get a good overclock and low temps".
1. What is SL6WK? Does it apply to P2.8C ? Should I make a request for this at newegg when I place my order?
2. Does this PSU have enough guts for what I'm trying to do or should I opt for a 460W?
3. Should I be able to overclock this 20% with this amount of air cooling?
4. Is the 9800-xt good enough til the next generation of video cards or should I opt for the X800 XT?

Scientific guesses, approximations, and opinions appreciated.
Vince

1- Yes, the SL6WK is the "best" to get.
2- It should be enough, just make sure it's a "brand" PSU
3- Problably yes, but no one can be sure before...
4- It's a good card, but outdated in price/performance ratio with the new generation. A 6800NU or even a 6600GT would be better.

Two things :
- Why the "need" of the raid made of raptors ? that a s$$tload of cash...
- Be carefull that the P4C has a high fluctuation on the vcore between idle/full.

Otherwise, it's a nice machine.

 

[mechBgon]

If you need any guidance on the mechanical assembly of the computer, or keeping it from catching worms from your broadband modem when it is first connected, I made a photo guide and the Resources page just got updated to focus more on preventing worm infections while the Windows installation is in a vulnerable state (bottom line: at the very least, don't plug in the network cable until you have a hardware and/or software firewall protecting it).

I also encourage you to consider an Athlon64. They have hardware Data Execution Prevention to prevent buffer-overflow exploits (from known or unknown threats), they perform well, they tend not to put out a lot of heat, and when it's time for 64-bit stuff, you've got that as well.

 

[Mullzy]

I'll add to others comments...

1. Raptors are overkill and way too much cash for the performance/gigabyte; unless you specifically need RAID and the small performance gain.

2. 9800 XT is way too much cash for a card that is outclassed by the 9800NU.

3. Very few P4's ever reach 250FSB, therefore your DDR500 ram will probaby end up running quite a bit underclocked.

4. AMD is owning the gaming world at the moment. The Dollars to Frames per Second ratio is better than Intel currently.

The system you've priced out will perform admirably for sure... but by saving $$ on some areas (Raptors) and spending it on others (better video card) you'll end up with a better gaming experience.

 

[Gimmetoys]

Originally posted by: Stormgiant

Originally posted by: Gimmetoys

Thermaltake VA3400SWA case with 400W PSU, 2- 120mm fans, 1-90mm side fan
Asus p4c800-e-deluxe
P4 3.0C or 2.8C
Zalman CNPS7000A cooler
1-GB OCZ Enhanced latency PC-4000
2-WD 74GB Raptors
9800-XT video card
Plextor 12x DVD +-RW

I have a few Questions:
found in a Post "IF you get a 30cap 3.0 ( SL6WK ) youll get a good overclock and low temps".
1. What is SL6WK? Does it apply to P2.8C ? Should I make a request for this at newegg when I place my order?
2. Does this PSU have enough guts for what I'm trying to do or should I opt for a 460W?
3. Should I be able to overclock this 20% with this amount of air cooling?
4. Is the 9800-xt good enough til the next generation of video cards or should I opt for the X800 XT?

Scientific guesses, approximations, and opinions appreciated.
Vince

1- Yes, the SL6WK is the "best" to get.
2- It should be enough, just make sure it's a "brand" PSU
3- Problably yes, but no one can be sure before...
4- It's a good card, but outdated in price/performance ratio with the new generation. A 6800NU or even a 6600GT would be better.

Two things :
- Why the "need" of the raid made of raptors ? that a s$$tload of cash...
- Be carefull that the P4C has a high fluctuation on the vcore between idle/full.

Otherwise, it's a nice machine.

Stormgiant,

You were the one that posted about the SL6WU that I mentioned.
What does it stand for and should I ask for it when ordering?

The PSU is a thermaltake, but not one you can buy separately from their case.

I probably won't get 2 raptors to raid 0, since I read a report that showed real world raid 0 performance.
Not much better than single drive. I may get one to do video editing and put my games on, and a 7200 sata for all else.

I did more research since nick1985 reply and I'm changing to 6800nu

thanks to everyone for their quick and helpful replies

Vince

 

[nick1985]

Originally posted by: Brickster

Originally posted by: nick1985
2. Get basic ram. timings mean squat.

And where do you get the data for your well-formulated hypothesis?

Try checking the Memory FAQ's

Squat that, beeeyotch!

so your telling me ram timings are evident on the athlon64? do a search of "timings" in the GH forum. 1-2% performance gain is not worth $200 more. n00b. :roll:

 

[Jeff7181]

Originally posted by: nick1985

Originally posted by: Brickster

Originally posted by: nick1985
2. Get basic ram. timings mean squat.

And where do you get the data for your well-formulated hypothesis?

Try checking the Memory FAQ's

Squat that, beeeyotch!

so your telling me ram timings are evident on the athlon64? do a search of "timings" in the GH forum. 1-2% performance gain is not worth $200 more. n00b. :roll:

Woah... $200 more? What kinda RAM are you comparing? My 1 GB of PC3500 CAS2 RAM cost me $225. Are you saying I can get 1 GB of some other kind of RAM for $25??????

 

[Jeff7181]

Originally posted by: Brickster

Originally posted by: nick1985
2. Get basic ram. timings mean squat.

And where do you get the data for your well-formulated hypothesis?

Try checking the Memory FAQ's

Squat that, beeeyotch!

The author of that article lost all credibility when I came across this...

Burn-in can be defined as the process of exercising an integrated circuit (IC) for a period of time at elevated voltage, speed and temperature with the aim of improving performance.

 

[Adn4n]

VIDEO CARD INFORMATION:

The 9800XT you desire can be gotten cheaply. Simply buy the ATI Radeon 9800 Pro 256MB/bit with the r360 core. If you install the drivers for the XT, then your Pro will become an XT. All you need is better cooling like a $15 VGA Silencer.

CPU INFORMATION:

The 2.8C is better than the 3.0C in price to performance ratio. It overclocks easily, but the 2.8E would be a better choice in my humble opinion. It may run slightly hotter, but with a nice Zalman 7000a AlCu or Cu(Consider them) it should be no problem. However, if you're looking for better gaming performance, or better performance overall; you should go the Athlon 64 way. I was personally opting for the 2.8E, when benchmark results and overall reviews on this board steered me the other way. Now I have an AMD Athlon 64 3200+ Clawhammer, which runs just perfectly. My colleague went the Intel way, and his system is nowhere mine. So I suggest the Athlon 64 3200+. It uses the 754 socket, which is not future proned, but the 939 is not a wise choice with DDR2 and PCI Express in the near future. Get the equivalent to your current Asus board, which is the K8N-e Deluxe; it is great and I vouch for it.

 

[o1die]

I recommend the coolmax 500w with single 12cm side fan (about $55 at newegg). Silverstone also sells one, but someone wrote a review saying that it was noisy. I use a sparkle 300w with single 12cm side fan, and can still overclock my 2.8c to 3.64. It's a bargain at $28, and has 18 amps on the 12v rail, which is all most people need. And it's silent; you can't hear it.

 

[Stormgiant]

Originally posted by: Mullzy
3. Very few P4's ever reach 250FSB, therefore your DDR500 ram will probaby end up running quite a bit underclocked.

In what do you base your experience ? The only ones that tend to be difficult to get to 250 are the 3.4 and 3.2 because of the high multiplier.

 

[Stormgiant]

Originally posted by: Gimmetoys

Originally posted by: Stormgiant

1- Yes, the SL6WK is the "best" to get.
2- It should be enough, just make sure it's a "brand" PSU
3- Problably yes, but no one can be sure before...
4- It's a good card, but outdated in price/performance ratio with the new generation. A 6800NU or even a 6600GT would be better.

Two things :
- Why the "need" of the raid made of raptors ? that a s$$tload of cash...
- Be carefull that the P4C has a high fluctuation on the vcore between idle/full.

Otherwise, it's a nice machine.

Stormgiant,

You were the one that posted about the SL6WU that I mentioned.
What does it stand for and should I ask for it when ordering?

Vince

The SL6WK is one of the codes to identify CPU's made by Intel.
It can tell the probability of how much the CPU can overclock, but it's not a sure thing.

In the case of the 3.0C, is the SL6WK ( like mine ).

 

[Stormgiant]

Originally posted by: nick1985

Originally posted by: Brickster

Originally posted by: nick1985
2. Get basic ram. timings mean squat.

And where do you get the data for your well-formulated hypothesis?

Try checking the Memory FAQ's

Squat that, beeeyotch!

so your telling me ram timings are evident on the athlon64? do a search of "timings" in the GH forum. 1-2% performance gain is not worth $200 more. n00b. :roll:

No one here is taking about A64 for now. The buyer is always thinking in a P4, so your comments are at least out of place.
Even then, timming are important, although in some ocasions not as much as in others.

 

[Mullzy]

Originally posted by: Stormgiant

Originally posted by: Mullzy
3. Very few P4's ever reach 250FSB, therefore your DDR500 ram will probaby end up running quite a bit underclocked.

In what do you base your experience ? The only ones that tend to be difficult to get to 250 are the 3.4 and 3.2 because of the high multiplier.

From my own experience and from reading boards such as this. For every person I have seen claiming 250+ FSB on a P4 (anything over 2.8 C) I see 2 or 3 people failing to get that high. I've also seen a lot of people claiming to go through 2 or 3 or 4 CPU's until finally getting one that will do 250+.

With top notch air cooling & strong power on a good OC board my 2.8c will only do 235FSB @ 1.65v (ic7 so really 1.625ish). Maybe 75% of P4's over 2.8c will do 250+, but I'd be more willing to bet on 25%.

I'm talking above average air cooling here too... for most people purchasing and installing a Zalman or some othe large heatsink is as far as they're willing to go.

 

[Brickster]

Originally posted by: nick1985

Originally posted by: Brickster

Originally posted by: nick1985
2. Get basic ram. timings mean squat.

And where do you get the data for your well-formulated hypothesis?

Try checking the Memory FAQ's

Squat that, beeeyotch!

so your telling me ram timings are evident on the athlon64? do a search of "timings" in the GH forum. 1-2% performance gain is not worth $200 more. n00b. :roll:

Hahahah, classic! Nope, that is not what I am telling you. All I am saying is that timings in general cannot be discounted as "squat".

You are right, I am a self-admitted n00b to OCing, but am I reading HERE that timing adjustments can make a large performacne impact?

I know it's early, but dude, go have a :beer: and loosen up brother!

 

[Gimmetoys]

Originally posted by: Stormgiant

Originally posted by: Gimmetoys

Originally posted by: Stormgiant

1- Yes, the SL6WK is the "best" to get.
2- It should be enough, just make sure it's a "brand" PSU
3- Problably yes, but no one can be sure before...
4- It's a good card, but outdated in price/performance ratio with the new generation. A 6800NU or even a 6600GT would be better.

Two things :
- Why the "need" of the raid made of raptors ? that a s$$tload of cash...
- Be carefull that the P4C has a high fluctuation on the vcore between idle/full.

Otherwise, it's a nice machine.

Stormgiant,

You were the one that posted about the SL6WU that I mentioned.
What does it stand for and should I ask for it when ordering?

Vince

The SL6WK is one of the codes to identify CPU's made by Intel.
It can tell the probability of how much the CPU can overclock, but it's not a sure thing.

In the case of the 3.0C, is the SL6WK ( like mine ).

Stormgiant,

Did you specify the SL6WK or is it the luck of the draw?

Vince

 

[Stormgiant]

No, mine was hand-picked...

But, ALL SL6WK that I know of friends and forums reach's 3600 easily...

 

[trexpesto]

I assume you have checked out jpeyton's buyer's guide. It's great.

As far as video cards, they do vary in performance depending on the game but there is a good roundup of D3 performance HERE

They also have more comprehensive comaparisons that put the 6800 Vanilla and 6800GT tops in Price-Performance. I read a post that asserted ATI's new cards are going to be 4x the power of current models, so I am waiting for that, got a 9800 Pro in the meantime. It's great for most current games incl D3 and FarCry, and the 128MB model is $184 at newegg now.
If I to get better absolute perfomance in the near term and still keep a lid on the price, I'd go for the 6800 Vanilla.

One good thing about some of the 9800XT's is IF they come with a coupon for HL2.